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Subject: strategy thread
Posted by: smallwhirled
- Donor [17152614] Fri, Feb 14, 2003, 23:35
Here are some initial thoughts for ya'll...(most are obvious)
1) Roster Value - If your handle does not say JKaye, build it. People that think RV does not matter will not win.
2) Forced Trade - In building roster value, you need to be aggressive, yet find a way to not get yourself into too many situations where a player has a "trade me" sign on him. Example: during the season you have an OF to trade. You can comfortably spend 4 million. It may be advantageous to buy a player without an ownership bearing. Everyone has traded into a guy with a huge ownership number, only to see the losses continue to mount after you thought the players price has leveled off....
3) End of the week roster value building. Less trades, more concentration, etc. The meat of your roster value building needs to occur here, you don't want to be tradeless and have to take leakage hits.
4) Being careless with PTs. Just don't do it. I found it tough to be right on a can't miss type matchup, except for the big 3.
5) Forced Trade Part 2 - The draft...Ever draft a guy with a large ownership, and get out of him to avoid further losses...only to miss the development of the next train because you were two days early? I'd rather draft a guy who is probably going to score less SWP, than a heavily owned guy just to have that flexability.
I did not BUTT some of the other threads that have excellent ideas. They're still there, take a look. Almost any thread by Madman is worth a read.
Anybody who did not play last year needs to look at the 5 day repricing for pitchers threads for sure.
Good luck! Maybe some banter will get going....
smallwhirled |
| 1 | Slackjawed Yokel
Sustainer
ID: 50242216
Sun, Feb 16, 2003, 15:29
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Just the other day, I was thinking through some potential strategies for the upcoming season. Normally, I use my moves for points first and money second - I tend to use the same strategy for each team with varying success. I never tend to have more than a week's worth of trades stored up.
With the thought that starting pitchers go longer into the game later in the year, and that they are sharper when in 'mid-season form', for one team this year, I'd like to stockpile some pitcher trades to use in the second half of the season. I know that you did this with one of your squads last year, smallwhirled. I don't really want to do this at the expense of my roster value, though. So, I'm wondering what the best approach would be to drafting pitchers that I can keep long-term. I haven't studied the initial pricings yet, but I'm thinking of starting with 3-4 relievers and maybe one high-priced guy. My thinking here is that relievers probably have the same amount of opportunities in the beginning of the season as they do in the end.
As far as your points, the second one may not be so obvious. It's often difficult to pass up a sure short-term money maker for a person under everyone's radar. Last year, I held Olderud for a long time - the majority of the time I was the only one in the top 100 holding him. I never made any money off of him, but he was never in gravity, either. I was happy with his consistent production, and really liked not having to use my HT on first basemen.
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| 2 | cancermoon
ID: 6002620
Sun, Feb 16, 2003, 20:29
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So for example this season, Zito is likely to go twice as just one day later than all other #1 pitchers have gone once. You'd think that is a great value, but he may be very highly owned and then sold after his first start aswell, big money loss. So what to do? the other thing is if a trade was used to move out of him after his first start, that would be a value for the trade far higher than can be gained in the normal season, taking for granted he pitches well, in theory that's good value, but a stupid move considering he could just be held for even better value and an efficient trade after his second start. Good points advantage for the trade, or great points advantage but possible money losses because lemmings will insist on this. Is 100 bonus points worth all the trouble? considering over the period of a season a trade would average out at only about 65 points each usually.
I remember last season after Tim Salmon played badly in the opening game, i came here asking if i should trade out of him immediately as he would be highly owned. I got chastised for being ridiculous, no way should i waste a trade on that. As I learned later the hitting trade was not as rare as it was suggested and I majorly regretted holding Salmon, I lost money and points, and had heaps of spare hitting trades that i didn't even need. He should have been dumped immediately.
So my point is trades are not so precious, infact for pitching only worth about 65 points each, so if you need to get out of a player, or use them early on, I think it is well worth while, worth probably far more than you'll gain at 65 points a pop later.
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| 3 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Sun, Feb 16, 2003, 21:23
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Exactly.
I haven't studied the initial pricings yet, but I'm thinking of starting with 3-4 relievers and maybe one high-priced guy.
Before last year I stumbled upon that idea out of the blue. I took ideas from the 5 closer thread, and combined them with the early thoughts of the 5 day repricing plan. It turned out to be a winner, by complete luck.
It ties in with the forced trade idea (closers). If you draft guys without an ownership tag, you can trade them whenever you want. Straight pitcher trades into closers during the year usually don't gurantee you the point/trade in return...at least I think. I'd rather use my trades for starters. But, drafting some closers is free because it's not costing you a trade. You can sit on them as long as you would like, too. Last year, I traded my closers into the pitcher money trains, but I sapped every $$ out of the train by getting on first (I didn't have to wait for a next start, for example).
It is the same idea as drafting some unowned hitters. Since baseball is not really a schedule dependent game with an actual sell-date already predetermined, I'd rather have the opportunity to be aggressive. Unowned closers and unowned cheapie fielders allow you to gain RV and probably bank more trades all at the same time, if you select the right guys.
cancermoon,
I agree that points for pitchers work the same at anytime. I have no problem with the idea of being a trade-a-holic. That's not the problem, the problem is not having extra trades in the bank for injuries/money swings/etc. I'd rather not have manage to manage on a "week." If you got em' use em, but losing late week RV is what will hurt your team against teams that do have trades. So, I'd say bank a few...and keep them safe, then use em'.
smallwhirled
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| 4 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Sun, Feb 16, 2003, 21:30
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As far as that early Oakland series goes....I have no idea yet. I would agree that he will be heavily drafted and then traded. The pitcher repricings for the first week or two are going to be screwed up because there are no "buys" in the bank for a player. Last year, Schilling saw the great boost from number 1's being sold, that's all I remember.
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| 5 | Chestergreat
Sustainer
ID: 282581017
Sat, Mar 15, 2003, 16:17
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I recall the same thing regarding Schilling last year. Everyone who used "RANDRO"ing successfully in prior years got out of RJ & Pedro after day 1 and went to Schilling.
The Japan start has put some question marks into the opening strategy for me.
How many managers will ignore the opening 2 game series in Japan and not set their teams until Mar 30? Are the moves they make to initially set up their teams considered 'buys' in the pricing formula?
This year you get 3 new Pitching trades on Tues Apr 1. That seems earlier than usual. That means you have 6 Pitching trades in your bank (less any you have used) only 2 days into the season (for all teams except Oak & Sea). A lot of managers are eager at the start of the season, and with lots of trades to use, may just go out and use them. I think that will result in more trading of opening day Pitchers than usual. With lots of sells on their record, and no buys and the 5 day pricing in effect, they could bleed a little $$$ for a few days after their first start. Therefore I'm not planning on going with more than 1 Opening day starter.
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| 6 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Sat, Mar 15, 2003, 22:18
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As always, this is a good read.
RE: Zito. I have him initially on a team. There are two roster freezes before his second start. If people are stupid and ignorant (as we know they are - many people burned all trades after opening day last year) they may sell after the first start. However, even the silly need to look at it and know they get 2 starts out of a great pitcher when many haven't even pitched yet. Am I overestimating the ability of the lemmings? It could cost me 200K, or I could just ride him out till he shows a profit...
RE: Trades. When I had at least 2 trades in the bank I was making solid money EVERY day. In mid May I was in the top 8 in Gurupie standings for money. AT that point I panicked and went for some points and took some chances. Ledt myself tradeless and started the plummet that ended my season in the top 300, not top 50. I ended up in the middle of the pack money wise. I will Never, ever, use up all my trades... (I have to keep on repeating this to myself...)
RE: closers
4 closers and 1 spot for the next pitcher train is one strategy that I am using, especially with Mantei being so cheap- I figure 1 pitcher trade every two weeks until I build a major bank and I will still make decent cake.
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| 7 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Sat, Mar 15, 2003, 23:39
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As I look at it Zito to Lowe after the 2nd start looks promising.
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| 8 | albo222
Donor
ID: 1018246
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 05:07
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On one team I'm thinking about going with 4 relievers and 1 starter, probably
Schilling
Percival
Sasaki
Williamson
Mantei
Especially for the beginning of the season, I'll use trades to rotate the starter with other top starters who should make money for a few days. Then as various hot starting pitchers emerge, trade into them from the relievers.
With this strategy the pitching staff is fairly inexpensive and I can spend a little more on hitters.
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| 9 | kentucky indians
ID: 221146148
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 08:03
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I'm thinking Zito to Colon. Look at Bartolo's schedule!!
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| 10 | Ender
ID: 13443221
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 09:54
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Who are you guys' bargain basement hitters that are allowing you to spend so much on pitching?
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| 11 | Ender
ID: 13443221
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 09:56
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Sorry, posted too quick. I have been able to find plenty of $3 mill hitters, but am hard pressed to find a good risk below that at this point.
I am seriously thinking about skipping the big three for at least 1 start. When the super cheap hitter (or two) emerge I can shift funds and upgrade pitching.
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| 12 | Gangman
Leader
ID: 4310591222
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 10:47
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I going to use Zito as a "bank". After his 2nd start, I'll
trade down to give me more $$ for hitter trains.
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| 13 | Species
Sustainer
ID: 7724916
Sun, Mar 16, 2003, 12:45
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Good thought, Gangman.....that's precisely what I am doing and already have the cheaper starter picked out, who of course pitches AFTER Zito's 2 starts.
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| 15 | penngray
Donor
ID: 453492921
Tue, Mar 18, 2003, 21:15
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and now there is no zito strategy ;)
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| 17 | IBP2
ID: 92521717
Tue, Mar 18, 2003, 21:25
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Is Pedro starting opening day? If so he has TB on the 31st and then Baltimore on the 5th. Those starts sound better than Zito vs. Seattle especially with the 3/25 game being cancelled
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| 18 | Grey Dawg
ID: 52213198
Wed, Mar 19, 2003, 09:33
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I have been playing TSN/Smallworld for several years, and every year I consider not picking up any players until after the 1st day or two of the season, and then I talk myself out of it.
The reason I consider doing it is you can pick the trains you want to jump on for larger money gains earlier, and you do not have to waste trades to get on the trains. Of course the down side is you are starting 2 days behind in points.
Is the extra money and saved trades worth the number of points behind I would be?
I was just wanting some opinions on this. Has anyone tried this, and how did it work?
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| 19 | Gangman
Leader
ID: 36155210
Wed, Mar 19, 2003, 13:29
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Ref: Day Late J
This strategy has been used with some
success, particularly by J here on the boards.
But you'd better be on top of your game....
skipping Opening day starters can put you in a
big hole that can prove daunting.
I never can get up the nerve, particularly if I'm
fielding only one team (as is the case this
year). But if you have several teams, try it on
one and see if you're up to the challenge.
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| 20 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Wed, Mar 19, 2003, 13:37
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Yep, it can be worked to perfection
Day Later J was like 20 last year.
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| 21 | DC Expos
ID: 43251918
Wed, Mar 19, 2003, 19:39
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The 4 closers paired with a single starter was an idea I
toyed with at the beginning of last season. But then I
thought what happens if one (or two) of the teams those
closers are on come out of the gate in a funk and start
racking up a pile of loses? Makes it hard for the closer
to get any save chances, thus negating his value. So
instead I started off with one closer and four middle
class starters (forgoing Randro/Schilling until late April),
such as Wood and Oswalt. Worked pretty well, but I
noticed not having one of the big three was the
difference between me and the top dogs early on.
So this season I'm going Pedro (nice opening
schedule) three mid-classers and Williamson.
As far as hitters, last year I had a mix of potential
sleeper vets and hyped-up rookies. This year I'm
thinking of starting off with all cheapies, banking some
cash and then sit back and wait for the trains. I figure
that way if a higher-priced train gets rolling, ala Griffey
or Dye, I'll have the cap room to move into them without
having to burn a trade at another position to free up
some cash.
Is anyone else thinking this strat?
(BTW, I'm still looking for a division (preferably a
competitive one, so if you're in one that needs more
teams ...)
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| 22 | Jesse
Donor
ID: 152472014
Thu, Mar 20, 2003, 15:58
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Hello All, haven't been out here in a while. This year looks scant in offering wildly nice looking values at any position. Yet there are some i think.
I truly believe Lilly and Prior are great values.
Anyone been watching Adam Eaton? He could come back strong this year, wondering if anyone has been able to see his pitches?
Same is true for Loaiza, anyone see him this spring?
The reason i put this in strategy- and not a thread on players, is if there can be a strong cheaply drafted pitching core- My strategy- then some will be defacto trains. I had Padilla and Fogg on my roster to start the season last year. It's of course very hard to get that lucky- again, but it wasn't luck that caused me to select them. So my point.... if you can select cheap pitchers, you can get a strong lineup and bank some trades early... and trade in the light trade pockets (when others are out of their trades)
anyway... i'm open to discussion, i tend to go cheaper on pitching than hitting- although i put my $ in of usually.
jesse
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| 23 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Mon, Mar 24, 2003, 23:03
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As far as % of dollars in which piece, I'll go at least 50% in the pitcher side, and I probably won't be afraid to get near 30 million for those 5 slots. Naturally, I'd like to leave a few in the bank. I also take into effect my moving of my drafted pitchers into the cheap starter trains which is why I don't mind stacking my pitchers. Pitching wins in this game.
For the people who did not play hoops and don't know how the position flexability works, here's a quick example....
Your team has Pujols @ 3B and Sweeney @ 1B, and Chavez and you want to pick him up. Now you have the leeway to use 1 trade, shift Pujols to 1B and buy Chavez by selling Sweeney.
This really comes in handy when making RV. Now, if you have flexability, it may not cost you two trades to get on to a train that you think has a lot of potential. It'll make RV gains a little easier to come by, so if TSN doesn't change the formula, the top guys should be right around 100 mil at the end of the year (Slightly better than last year...using hoops TRV's from this year compared to last year at the same point in the season).
smallwhirled
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| 24 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Mon, Mar 24, 2003, 23:36
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To continue...
With position flexability, the DH looks like a slot to rotate and use to flip flop some train players.
Without going too aggressive in some slots and getting stuck with too many trains at once, it seems like a steady stream of RV from the hitters won't be that hard to achieve.
I'm considering something like a "slider" strategy. There are a number of player who are eligible for at least two infield positions and some up to 4. There are also a handful of OFers that also qualify as a corner infielder. Thus, with a few of these type of players one would never have to double swap for a hitter money train. It seems like a good idea...
smallwhirled
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| 25 | PWB
ID: 452482011
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 11:34
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I don't agree that pitching wins, but I do agree that pitching trades win. I mean, if you're in mid-August with 30 pitcher trades and 30 hitter trades in the bank, those pitcher trades are very valuable. You can use them all effectively before the end of the season. Typically, at that point in the season, the hitter trades have become virtually useless if you have been riding the right trains and bulding RV. Sure, you can use some of them to ride a hot hitter here and there (and swap out injured players, obviously), but you should have each hitter position fairly-well stocked at that point. At that point in the season, the relative merits of each set of trades seem to become disparate--earlier on, their value in relation to each other is more even as people try to build RV.
What does this mean? Well, I haven't statistically fleshed it out, but wouldn't it indicate that hitting points are far more difficult to make up than pitching points? If you develop your roster with cheap starters/closers, a cheap catcher, a cheap outfielder or two, and importantly a cheap DH, then you can be on the lookout for the right trains to build RV in those popular spots. The DH is important because you can stick any hitter train in there; catcher is also important because of the dearth of quality points at the position. No one is a safe option at that position right now. It also seemed to me that the pitcher trains lasted longer and generated more money than hitter trains, building RV more quickly.
So, while you jump on a few hitter trains and a 3-4 pitcher trains, in the meantime, with strong hitters in the rest of your positions, you are gaining point value that you would otherwise have no way to recoup later in the season. With pitcher trades, you can recoup some percentage of the point value you lost early on, but not all of it, obviously (since missed points are missed points); with hitters, this doesn't work out. (Obviously, this precludes you from starting the season with anyone like Randy or Bonds on your roster, which is something I'd never do, period)
I could be totally missing something obvious, since this is only my second season playing, but I'd be interested to hear feedback on this.
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| 26 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 11:51
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I disagree.
I feel that you can make up a minimal SWP loss with your hitters and not your pitchers. The hardest thing to overcome is negatives from your pitchers, IMHO. Also, the hitter trains come cheap, anyways. So it seems like a disadvantage to have a 5 mil IFer (for example) locked in there early in the year.
Also, 3-4 pitcher trains all going at once will not let you bank trade at all. Sure you're gaining RV, but scrambling from all the negatives that you will get. It's important to get on some of them, but if you get on every one, you'll definitely be out of pitcher trades.
Take a guy like Chavez at an IF position. Is he going to be that much better than a 2-3 million unowned sleeper that you drafted?
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| 27 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 12:39
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I agree with smallwhirled. Negative outings are the killer. Also, wasting PT on crappy pitchers. I am starting the season with Randy AND Pedro. planning on going to Schill then Lowe, then hold thru coors, along with one sleeper and 2/3 cheap closers. This allows me to have one/two pitcher spots for trains and hopefully bank some trades for VERY FAVORABLE matchups (i.e. anyone against the rays lol). I only have one proven hitter (one of the three OF spots) and the rest are huge ?? Hopefully a couple turn into early trains, but if they don't, I have plenty of RV to climb aboard.
Last year I skipped too many of the big three's starts and it killed me. Randy and his 100 or Radke and his -50, big swing there. Thats 10 days of AROD.
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| 28 | Rogue Nine
ID: 26259244
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 12:54
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Starting with two of the big 3 must be seriously hurting your roster elsewhere. I tried to do it, but found myself with all cheapies and not alot of spare cash to move into mid-priced trains. (I want to be able to buy a 3-4 mil OF too... not all trains are of the super-cheap variety.)
At P I've gone with Pedro and 4 good closers. (Smoltz, Wagner, Foulke, Benitez.) My other for-sure player is Griffey. Everyone else so far is up in the air, and like Smallwhirled I won't be buying any heavily-owned or over-hyped players to start. I'll be banking PT's early, (we all have 6 by the 2nd day of the season) and will only move a closer for a P train I like. (I can afford any pitcher I want, given Smoltz' 6 mil tag, and I also have 3 mil in the bank.) Pedro I'll hold for his 1st three starts (TB/Tor/TB), then I'll likely have enough PT's to start my first guru-rotation.
Bandos, it'll be interesting to see if going 2HM allows you to afford anything other then 2 mil bums at first. You have to weigh the gains of 2HM against its drawbacks, and the start of the year is your lowest roster value point in the season to be doing that. (40% of your roster in two pitchers is ALOT.)
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| 29 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 16:43
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I got alot of 2 mil bums! right now it looks like:
Pedro(hold)
RJ -> CS -> D. Lowe for 2 starts (skip Coors)
Lilly - the best #4 not a yankee, pitching against alot of crappy American league 3,4,5 starters.
Mantei
Williamson
Bard OR Gil/Huckaby - one will hit a dong in the first coupla games and be the C train
Pena - hopefully lying under the radar screen of most
Rivas - Is this the year he becomes good or is relegated to utility infielder forever.
Polanco - should score some runs
Cuddyer - good upside, but he may drafted really heavily
Manny -he will be worth 9 mil by end of season - triple crown type numbers -maybe im getting a little happy
Chavez, Rowand DH Glanville - all cheap and expendable for first OF trains
The only guys I see as decent are Pena, Rivas and Polanco, and Manny of course. This leaves me with 2 mil, + the 3+ mil i pick up from trading CS -> DLowe
Those are the bums as of today. The key will be to keep 2 ht in the bank at all times.
My other otion was skipping RJ+CS for first 2 starts, taking prior and upgrading a bit.
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| 30 | DC Expos
ID: 44255412
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 17:16
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Bandos: I got Polanco, too. I like his versatility - can move him around between three or four positions and he hits at the top of the order.
I like your idea of having a solid OF you can carry and not worry about. I dumped M.Byrd who is projected to bat ninth for J.Dye, only a mill and half more. He had a solid second half which suggest he is back to regular form after the broken leg bit.
You got a lot of money tied up in having Pedro and Randro. I'm opting to skip Randro for their first two starts (LA and @CO) until I raise some more cash from some hitting trains to afford them and still field a decent hitting line-up. So instead I split the cost of one Randro between two solid starters, Ortiz and Colon, who could put up similar numbers because of their nice opening schedules.
Don't know what to do about 2B. Got Rivas, too, but he is batting ninth and strikes out too much. Anyone else seeing a better option at 2B that I'm not?
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| 31 | grEEr
ID: 190511015
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 18:34
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Why do you have to get 2/3 of the big guns?
I see it like this have one of them and then use a second top 10 pitcher, and switch between who ever has a 2 start week. I'll start with this
Pedro (for his 2 start week - TB and BAl)
Morris (start against MIL) >>> Lowe (For his two start week)
***The rest of my rotation will be made up of closers, as I wait for the trains to leave the station.
Basicly what i'm staying is (Bandos) while you have Randy (vs LA)and a cheap fielder like Rowand
I'll have Morris (vs MIL) and a Mid pirce fielder like K.Garica and extra cash in the bank.
Bandos why are you so high on Rivas? he will be hitting 9th. Why not take a better sleeper like Harriston or Ellis, at least they leadoff!
Just a side note ...DAMN...everyone is now picking up Glanville, I was probably the first guy to notice him and though he would be a nice find, he better not have high ownership to start the season. just joking
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| 32 | beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 29145419
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 18:56
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Price changes occur daily and trades accumulate so what is so great about a 2 start week?
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| 33 | rockfish
ID: 43105722
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:15
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A two start week also could begin anyday of the week. With so many early pitcher trades there is no way I'd hold Pedro for the first week,you will lose money everyday. Actually I'm skipping Pedro in the beginning because I can see him having some 5 inning starts and out,he'll be pampered if they get ahead. Under most circumstances never miss a RJ start.
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| 34 | grEEr
ID: 190511015
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:22
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If you trade in and out of pitchers with 2 start weeks you maximize starts realitive to saving trades. One trade can get you two starts.
eg. RJ --->CS--->RJ
or
Morris --->Lowe (who has two starts)---> to the next two start pitcher.
Basicaly if you hold the pitchers that start twice in a relative short time span you get get the most possible starts while saving trades.
Do you get it now? Mabey someone else can help out.
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| 35 | Rogue Nine
ID: 26259244
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:34
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Ok, so trading into a SP who's team has no breaks in the next 6 days (pretty easy to do) garantees that you get 2 starts in 6 days from said SP. I don't see the significance though, since you don't have enough PT's to make sure that efficiency level continues indefinitely. Ex:
You use your last PT to go into Morris, who's team plays the next 8 days. So you get 2 starts in 6 days.
I use my last PT to go into Oswalt, who's team has a day off in 3 days. So I get 2 starts in 7 days.
Since we're both our of PT's, at the end of 6 days you have 2 starts, I have 1. At the end of 7 days, we both have 2 starts. So what difference does it make?
Rockfish brings up a good point about Pedro... He is pitching in TB, but I can see them only letting him throw 6 IP. (I can see them doing that alot this year, since they have a very stacked and quality bullpen.)
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| 36 | rockfish
ID: 43105722
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:35
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greer,yea I get it now. Thanks for setting me straight. :)
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| 37 | rockafellerskank
Leader
ID: 461124288
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:40
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grEEr: Trust me when I say that the game is not played "week to week" but rather April to September. I completely disregard the TSN artificially created "trading week" I understand what you are gettng at, but looking at in those terms is like viewing a baseball game through binoculars. Sure you see some great plays, but you miss the hot chick sitting next to you!
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| 38 | Rendle
Donor
ID: 189102723
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 19:42
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grEEr, as long as you trade out of a pitcher after he pitches and into pitcher pitching the next day, there is no advantage in 2 start weeks or whatever. Example:
Johnson 31st - Schilling 1st - someone pitching on the 2nd, 7th
Morris 31st - Lowe 1st, 6th - someone pitching on the 7th
In your example, the 2nd trading sequence is better because you're not wasting days with your trades. If you go RJ-Schilling-RJ, you lose 3 days in there. To maximize starts, all you need to do is trade out of a pitcher the day he pitches and into someone pitching the next day.
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| 39 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 20:11
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Greer
Im not attached to Rivas in the least. I thought that Ellis might be a possible money drain and hairston play on the crappy O's. Im always looking for something better :)
For those of you thinking about Lowe - he is the #3 starter as of now "Originally slated as the fourth starter, Burkett learned before the game that he will follow Pedro Martinez, Tim Wakefield, Derek Lowe, and Casey Fossum in the rotation" The Boston Globe. Little announced it. Makes Lowe even more attractive as he will be pitching against #3 starters. Thus I am using two trades to eventually get who I want(Lowe for his easy early schedule) and I get a solid tier two pitcher for 6.7 mil vs. morris at 5.8. Any trade used to get RJ or CS is worth it. I will have to make a decision after COL for RJ and CS.
Also, I had Garcia originally but he also will be heavily owned, I believe after last year.
Re: Pedro and his price. I don't care as long as doesn't miss a start, I am planning on holding. Thus, I wont lose the money b/c I wont sell him :)
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| 40 | grEEr
ID: 190511015
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 21:30
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Rockafeller and rendle, thanks.
This is intresting news on Lowe and the Boston lineup. I signed up for the smallworld fantasy source and the damn pitching chart isant up to date...rrrrrr.
Here is my staff, looking for comments and suggestions.
My Staff: (subject to change)
Pedro (CS ---> Prdro)
Morris (Lowe)
Wagner
Willimson
Mantie
$2,780,000 in the bank
or
Randy (CS --> Lowe)
Pedro (Hold)
Willimson
Mantie
Someone cheap (Villafeute, lilly, radkey, r.hernadez, Kline)
or
Randy (CS --> Pedro)
Morris (Lowe)
Wagner
Willimson
Mantie
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| 41 | kentucky indians
ID: 221146148
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 22:09
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My original roster had Mantie and Williamson as well. I'm concerned about Williamson!!!!!!
He has not pitched well this spring and while I think Cinti needs him and the Cinti. closer will get save opportunities. I'm not sure Williamson is the man right now!!!!!!!1
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| 42 | cancermoon
ID: 291562817
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 22:22
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I agree about the weekly trading cycle, as long as you trade to a pitcher the next day, over the course of the season it makes no difference if he pitches twice this week or not.
I would like to disagree about pitching over hitting though, for example guys like Bonds vs SDG and MIL in his first 9 games, or Manny vs Tam, Bal, and Tor in his first 10 games will make more points advantage than the differnce between Randy or Pedro and and a lower middle pitcher like Prior or Schmidt, Williamson, etc etc. This is based on all players playing to their potential , it is also possible any of those studs could start cold.
For this reason due to the fact SS has 4 good players and then crap, and Hernandez has a horror first 2 weeks for a schedule, i will go with Garciaparra for his great matchups to start the season, he is worth the extra few million at this stage.
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| 43 | grEEr
ID: 44292522
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 23:15
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Guys I'm still looking for feedback on my possible pitching rotations!
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| 44 | Bandos
ID: 39112921
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 23:18
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Greer, they are all good, if those guys pitch well. They look to be similar in approach - at this point its just your best hunch!
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| 45 | smallwhirled
Donor
ID: 17152614
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 23:29
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I'm looking at pouring more money into the closers that I do try becuase it seems like everyone kinda likes Mantei and Williamson on the SW boards, hence ownership.
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| 46 | cancermoon
ID: 291562817
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 23:31
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grEER I think the one going Pedro-SChilling-Lowe is the best if Lowe does go #3. The one where you trade back into Pedro from Schilling is very inefficient and basically you will lose about 40% of Pedros next score in simple ineficiency. Due to the fact Schilling would have pitched the next day anyway without using a trade.
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| 47 | cancermoon
ID: 291562817
Tue, Mar 25, 2003, 23:36
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I like Villafuerte the best, he is a damn good pitcher, and even though it is SD, it never stopped Hoffman getting saves.
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| 48 | MNG@college
ID: 14157117
Wed, Mar 26, 2003, 01:44
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I don't see why everyone is so concerned with the RJ/CS Coors starts, they still do pretty well there and you'll eventually have to pick them up again, so why not save the trade(s)?
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| 49 | cancermoon
ID: 291562817
Wed, Mar 26, 2003, 03:44
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Well that is a lot of money tied up for starts that may offer the same returns as other pitchers on the same day, also if so many people draft RJ he may lose a whack of money from all those selling him, and you'd still be losing money on the 5 day cycle at their third start aswell.
Lastly, In the past pitching at Coors was bad enough, but now Colorado have a far better hitting line up, with Hernandez and Wilson slotted around Payton, Walker and Helton. Scary stuff when your breaking ball doesn't break.
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