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Subject: 2018 Political Baseball Rules Change Vote
Posted by: Nerveclinic
- [53715255] Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 12:53
Here are a few proposals to vote on.
1) Change from BA to OBP
2) Change from Wins to QS
3) SV+HD instead of just SV.
4) Increase the number of prospects from 5 to 8 and at start of next year you can keep 5 of the 8. Just floating this version, if someone has a better idea jump in. This year still can only keep 3.
Is there anything I am missing?
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1 | Nerveclinic
ID: 53715255 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 12:54
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My Vote
1) OBP
2) QS
3) Saves only
4) Yes to 8 prospects keeping 5
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2 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 13:05
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My Vote
1) OBP 2) QS 3) SV+HD 4) No to 8 prospects
The most urgent vote is how to handle Otani. If we move to ESPN, he will be one player. I think staying at Yahoo forces him to be two players. Once we decide which platform, then we can continue to refine what else we'll do. I like Yahoo, for continuity and the ability to place a "K" next to our prospects in player pool. However, ESPN is a more elegant solution to the Otani problem. Though I like you Barilko, I see the Keeper stealing as a bigger issue than Otani, so I would vote Yahoo. (BTW I found that Meatwads had picked up Blake Snell, ArtofMonk's prospect on the last day of the season and used him. It did not affect the standings, so no asterisk is necessary).
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3 | DHamm
ID: 5715219 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 13:07
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1. BA
2. Wins
3. Saves Only
4. Increase to 8 and keep 5.
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4 | Bobo
ID: 71432111 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 14:20
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My vote
1. OBP 2. Wins 3. Saves Only 4. Increase to 8 prospects, keeping 5
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5 | barilko6
ID: 852443-4 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 14:21
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1. BA 2. Abstain - I am ok with both 3. Saves 4. Increase to 8 and Keep 5
Just so things don't get messy, I posted my thoughts on Ohtani in the our regular thread.
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6 | C1-NRB
ID: 501152115 Wed, Feb 21, 2018, 16:15
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1. OBP
2. QS
3. SV only
4. Keep at 5
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7 | Meatwads
ID: 852443-4 Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 06:52
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1. OBP 2. QS 3. SV+HD 4. Increase to 8, Keep as many as 5
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8 | WG Donor
ID: 35338278 Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 07:26
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1. AVG 2. W 3. S 4. Keep at 5
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9 | Taxman SuperDude
ID: 029463114 Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 08:30
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1 OBP 2 QS 3 Saves+holds 4 Keep current system (5 keep 3)
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10 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 14:42
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1. OBP 2. Wins 3. Saves only 4. Increase to 8 prospects, keeping 5
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11 | artofmonk
ID: 491532215 Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 16:53
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1. OBP 2. QS 3. Saves + Holds 4. Increase to 8 keep 5
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12 | GoatLocker
ID: 4211359 Sat, Feb 24, 2018, 13:17
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My Vote
1) OBP 2) QS 3) SV+HD 4) Keep current system (5 keep 3)
Addressed Ohtani in other thread.
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13 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Sat, Mar 03, 2018, 20:16
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Nerve can we rap this up please? I assume those who haven't voted don't care.
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14 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Sat, Mar 03, 2018, 21:12
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Two managers have yet to vote, PermDude and biliruben. They have 24 hours from this post to vote.
I researched our rule set for voting and found this quote in a prospect rule change thread:
The majority of votes made at that time will determine the rule change positive or negative.
Ties end in status quo is how I will interpret tie votes.
If I have tallied it correctly, the votes stand as follows:
1) Average 3 votes OBP 9 votes Category will change to OBP
2) Wins 5 votes Quality Starts 7 votes Category will change to QS unless both bili and PD vote against.
3) Saves 7 votes Saves + Holds 5 votes Category will remain Saves
4) 5 prospects (3 keepers) 5 votes 8 prospects (5 keepers) 7 votes We will now allow 8 prospects and 5 prospect keepers, unless both bili and PD vote against the increase.
I will alter the categories tomorrow to reflect the voting. This should help you in reassessing your players with the revised rules.
I will also be starting a keeper thread tomorrow that will reflect the vote on prospects. You will be able to change your keepers all the way up to the deadline, so I urge you to put a place holder keeper list down, even if you are not done trading.
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15 | Tree
ID: 217372011 Sun, Mar 04, 2018, 09:15
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Wait?
These rule changes take affect for this season?
I'm out.
No time, patience, or interest in researching an obscure stat (QS) that is rarely used in any of the numerous sources I use for research, nor is a metric in any other league in which I play.
Sorry for the late notice. I must have missed the part about these changes being made immediately.
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16 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Sun, Mar 04, 2018, 12:43
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I think you are right Tree, I guess in my zeal to get this thing moving, I was rushing its implementation.
It is not normal to make substantive changes effective for the upcoming season. Rather, most keeper leagues would vote for them one year and implement them the following year, giving owners a season to make moves anticipating the changes.
There is a thread started in AUG 2016 that created a prospect rule change that took effect for the 2017 season. The discussion of 1400 IP limit started in SEP 2016 and was implemented in 2017. There were a number of changes that were voted on just before the 2013 season, that didn't take effect until the 2014 season as well. I went through old threads, back to 2014, to see if I could find other examples of delaying rule changes for a year. I didn't find any.
Anyway, barring objection, I will not alter the Constitution until the end of this season, based on precedence. I will, however, make a note in the Constitution reflecting our voted on changes for next year.
The stat categories and the keepers will remain the same this year as they were last year. The agreed on changes will take effect in the 2019 season. Objections?
Thanks again Tree for keeping me straight on this.
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17 | GoatLocker
ID: 361242417 Sun, Mar 04, 2018, 16:09
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No objection here. Works fine for me.
GL
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18 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 07:59
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and my apologies for possibly over reacting, at least prematurely.
i've been contemplating leaving this league for a couple years now - i'm in too many leagues for real life, at this point in my life.
last year, Donny convinced me to stay. this year, seeing most of my friends return early was a factor.
but this will be my last year. i'll play it out, and play it out like i always do, with the intent of winning.
it would be nice to retire as champion.
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19 | Taxman SuperDude
ID: 029463114 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 10:44
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And I would like you to stay next year as well
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20 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 12:35
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lol. i appreciate it Donny, but if i've only got one league using "QS" as a stat, i'm not staying in that league.
it's not something regularly used in any of the print or online research sites i use, except for the occasional article that crops up every couple years, always named "why QS is a better measurement than wins."
and it may be, but no one uses it in any rankings. so it's useless.
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21 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 12:40
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that being said, i would at least consider coming back if we start using WHISK as a stat.
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22 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 12:43
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WHISK, isnt that some kind of detergent? Next you will want Tide Pod swalllowing as a categpry.
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23 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Mon, Mar 05, 2018, 14:45
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WHISK, SHOVE, and PING are among the cool mathnerd stats all the hip leagues are moving towards.
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24 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Tue, Feb 12, 2019, 23:09
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I vote against QS.
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25 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Tue, Feb 12, 2019, 23:10
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And don't we need 2/3rds for a rule change?
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26 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Tue, Feb 12, 2019, 23:22
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I was wrong. 8 votes to pass.
http://rotoguru1.com/cgi-bin/read.pl?board=pol&thread=3087&last=1208263741
It's still wins.
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27 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Tue, Feb 12, 2019, 23:41
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I have also scanned all my emails. There was not even the slightest attempt to contact me, either before or during the 24 hour warning. A month before opening day. My work considers this site porn (which, in a way it is), so since the death of the poli board, I don't really come here unless we are actively drafting. In the grand scheme of things, I don't really give a shit, but it was a kinda crappy way to shove a pretty lousy rule through, without even a majority.
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28 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Wed, Feb 13, 2019, 15:34
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Bili,
This thread was started on 21 FEB, the 24 hour period started on 1 MAR. You had over a week to consider it and vote, even if you don't count the discussion in the main thread. Why would you wait for an entire year to make an issue of this?
You cite a 2009 thread for an 8 vote precedence, that is not documented in the constitution. I applied simple majority, which 8 votes would be, if not for the absentees.
I would ask again, why a year later?
You ask why you were not contacted. Is it your contention that it is the responsibility of the commish to contact every person who isn't paying attention to the threads during season planning stages that they aren't meeting deadlines? If so, I would invite you to be commish, or would even enjoy delegating the contacting responsibility to you. Interested?
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29 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Wed, Feb 13, 2019, 18:03
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No, I'm not interested. I run my own league. And I fly 1700 miles every year to run it in-person. And well. Plenty of responsibility for me.
But if I were commish, I would at the very least post at least once on the league yahoo page, if 3 league-changing votes were being discussed.
Especially given it was the off season with no activity in our league for months and no reason for those not playing any other sports to even be on rotoguru.
Simple courtesy.
I only bring it up now, because I'm being belatedly a bit of a self-righteous dick, but also because one of the original members is quiting the league due to this very dubious rule change.
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30 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Thu, Feb 14, 2019, 11:19
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I am only doing commish, because NOBODY else will step up. We've got a keeper league with staying power, that's not something I'd like to see evaporate.
As an owner in this league, you are required to check in on the thread at rotoguru during pre-season planning. This isn't negotiable. In season, you should probably take a look now and then as well, in case someone posts there instead of at Yahoo league.
I don't like seeing Tree go as well, but he has his principles I guess.
So far I haven't heard from Perm Dude, so I am about to give his team to someone else, along with Tree's team (I have three prospective owners inquiring). Let's take this discussion back to the main thread, if it's not done now.
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31 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Thu, Feb 14, 2019, 14:59
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one of the original members is quiting the league due to this very dubious rule change.
I don't like seeing Tree go as well, but he has his principles I guess.
i appreciate it.
it's not about principles, however.
it's about changing to an uncommon stat, one that will require extensive extra research, and, as pointed out, is likely already dated now that we've entered the realm of the SPBC.
give it a couple years, when half the games are started by a guy going 1 or 2, and no one qualifies for a quality start by the current standards.
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32 | biliruben
ID: 255502715 Thu, Feb 14, 2019, 20:17
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As an owner in this league, you are required to check in on the thread at rotoguru during pre-season planning
If I'd had any way of knowing there was pre-season planning going on, I certainly would have.
I do appreciate you stepping up Bean, but that kinda statement is just straight out of your ass. Just accept that you should have taken 10 seconds to post on yahoo, and move on.
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33 | Bean
ID: 304422310 Sat, Feb 16, 2019, 00:33
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Bili try not to pretend you dont know when planning is going on. Just admit to yourself that you didnt bother to look at the thread for over a week after checking in with the league. If you dont care enough to vote on the issue, then why would you care enough to start something now.
Either you give a shit or you dont. every American knows if you dont vote you arent allowed to bitch when you dont like the result.
There was no voter suppression here, so quit whining. This discussion is over.
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34 | Tree
ID: 77532019 Tue, Feb 19, 2019, 17:10
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so, this league is still using QS? :D
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