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Subject: AOL glitches in RIFC AA
Posted by: mjd
- [592112011] Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 14:55
We've experienced 2 glitches in AOL this week.
#1 occurred Wednesday after 1 PM (free agency period) Several people tried to pick up J.Trotter, who by rule should have been a FA, since he was dropped on Saturday and his prossessing time was to have occurred after his gametime freeze. Those who tried to pick him up were told that they needed to wait an additional 48 hours. I had to manually place him on the team who tried to get him first. Another player, who was dropped Sunday morning, WAS allowed to be picked up as a FA after 1 PM on Wed. Why it allowed one and refused the other is a mystery to me.
#2 occurred yesterday. One league member had the Panther's D on his bench. The Panther's game was at 1 PM, so their gametime freeze was 12:55 PM. At 2:44, said manager traded the Panther's D for C.Carr, whose game was to start at 4 PM eastern. AOL allowed the transaction. The guy who made the trade had already been denied once before AOL allowed the Carolina D transaction, so he figured it was OK since the Carolina D was on his bench. Further, he states (and I have no reason not to believe him) that he would have traded a bye week player if his second attempt was denied. And of course, C.Carr scored 11.02 points in 2 highly competitive matchups.
One question brought up is: Is a player on the bench affected by their gametime freeze? I said yes, but we are requesting further clarification, just to be sure.
A solution to this situation is (as I see it), to place the Panther's D back on his roster, allow C. Carr and his points and remove one of his bye players from his roster. Allow him to pick one.
All this can be viewed on our Season discussion thread here
Mainly I wanted to alert other leagues using AOL or see if anyone else has had problems. Also, are we handling these issues appropriately? I believe all my league settings to be correct, but have no problem if anyone thinks I might have messed them up and the should be checked by a third party or another league member. |
| 1 | Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:03
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Can't allow points for a player illegally obtained.
You can't have a transaction after the weekly freeze. So you'd have to reverse any move that somehow was enabled.
You can change a bench player to active lineup and vice versa up to 5 mins before that game, but it is illegal to add/drop/trade a player after the freeze (5 mins before the start of the first game of the week).
You don't need to penalize anyone, just have to put the lineups back to the way they were at the time of the transaction.
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| 2 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:12
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Actually, his next move was to trade a bye week player for Carr had not AOL allowed the Panther's D to be traded.
That would have been legal. Is it OK to assume that and keep Carr on his team and remove a bye week player?
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| 3 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:18
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Ref, I believe that a gametime freeze occurs 5 minutes before THAT player's game, not 5 minutes before the first game of the week.
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| 4 | Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:19
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Not in any league I've ever played in before.
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| 5 | Guru
ID: 330592710
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:27
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I thnk we had a similar issue at Fanball last year - or maybe it was two years ago. We discovered that Fanball (and therefore probably AOL as well) permitted dropping a bench player after he was frozen.
As I recall, we decided that the rule should be that frozen players cannot be dropped, even though it would have to be manually enforced. I can't recall the issue arising again, although I suspect it's seldom attempted, because you would naturally assume that it won't work.
I'd probably restore the Carolina D to his roster and drop a bye player.
I'm sure there is discussion of our initial incident in a prior season's discussion thread. (I don't have time to hunt for it now.) In fact, until you raised the issue, I'd forgotten about it.
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| 6 | StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:28
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One question brought up is: Is a player on the bench affected by their gametime freeze? I said yes, but we are requesting further clarification, just to be sure.
From the rifc rules:
Starting five minutes prior to the scheduled start of each NFL game, no player in that game may be dropped, regardless of whether the player is an active or bench player.
Since the Carolina game had already started it seems pretty clear that they could not have been dropped. I think the question becomes whether you want to allow him to drop a bye week player instead.
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| 7 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:29
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Here it is from post 193 of this thread
"Starting five minutes prior to the scheduled start of each NFL game, no player in that game may be dropped, regardless of whether the player is an active or bench player."
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| 8 | Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:29
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So this league permits us to add/drop trade players after the inital freeze as long as those players games haven't been frozen yet?
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| 9 | StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:45
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For issue #1, how is your "conflicts with game time" set?
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| 10 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:54
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Cards
Conflicts With Game Time
If a player's waiver processing date/time is set to occur after the player's game for the week has started, do one of the following:
Player becomes a Free Agent next week Tuesday at Noon EST.
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| 11 | StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 15:59
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That's the way ours is set too. That seemed to be the only place that problem 1 could occur, so I don't know the answer to that one. It sounds like aol used the option of putting that player whose game hadn't started yet on waivers instead of FA.
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| 12 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:02
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Re: 9 No one put in a claim for Trotter, so we didn't notice it until after 1 PM on Wednesday when several tried to get him as a FA.
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| 13 | StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:02
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or in other words I thought maybe it might have been set to:
Place player on waivers next week Tuesday at Noon EST using the full waiver wire duration set above.
At least you were able to manually take care of it. Hopefully it doesn't keep becoming a problem.
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| 14 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:06
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Mainly, I just wanted to notify you AAA guys that it's something to watch out for so it can be fixed manually if it pops up again.
Please, someone answer Ref's question in post 8.
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| 15 | Guru
ID: 330592710
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:27
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[8] yes
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| 16 | The Treasonists
Donor
ID: 171572711
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:34
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Re: #8......I would say yes, except for trades. I wouldn't mess around with a trade between noon Sunday and midnight Monday.
Re: #2........Do we not get to vote on trades?
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| 17 | StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:37
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re:16 I believe he means free agent pick up and not trade.
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| 18 | Guru
ID: 330592710
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:43
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Yes, F/A only. There would not be enough time for a trade to be processed (with 24-48 review period) in time for activation.
I did find the discussion about dropping a frozen bench player. This happened in the RIFC near the end of the 2004 regular season. Although most were surpised that it was permitted and most agreed that it should be disallowed, since it was at the end of the regular season, we never really dealt with it effectively.
Nonetheless, since it is intuitive that a frozen player should really be frozen, it seems like the Commish is within his rights to void that. Given the abiguity, though, reasonable accomodations are appropriate.
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| 19 | mjd
ID: 592112011
Mon, Oct 23, 2006, 16:44
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16 Yes, FA
Thanks, Guru and all, for the help.
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