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Subject: Good NY Times article on Shane Battier
Posted by: Perm Dude
- [1101610] Mon, Feb 16, 2009, 15:07
Michael Lewis tracks Battier against Kobe |
| 1 | Mat Cauthon
ID: 7171314
Mon, Feb 16, 2009, 16:10
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I loved this article. Makes me wonder how many statistical analyses (analysis's?) there are out there that aren't public. I bet there are a bunch.
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| 2 | Seattle Zen
ID: 591271611
Mon, Feb 16, 2009, 17:06
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Good job, PD, I was going to post this link myself. I've been spending a lot of time preparing for fantasy baseball drafts by going over some very arcane statistical analysis. I hope this type of study comes to the basketball public soon, though the complexity of the study could overtake even baseball.
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| 3 | Mike D
Leader
ID: 041831612
Mon, Feb 16, 2009, 19:38
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Great stuff, thanks PD! Brings back many Moneyball memories. But I love the bridge to Hoops.
We've all seen the "+" and "-" show up in the boxscores, but to see that they "adjust" it on their own depending on who is in the game (on both teams) is cool.
Most of the scouting report info is old school, but then adding solid statistics to it? New school.
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| 4 | Perm Dudes
ID: 351141617
Mon, Feb 16, 2009, 19:58
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I love how Battier completely buys into the system, to the point of being satisfied even when the hoped-for result doesn't come about. The guy is completely confident in what he's doing.
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| 5 | bibA
Leader
ID: 261028117
Tue, Feb 17, 2009, 13:06
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I wonder if TSN would somehow consider using the plus / minus in it's game. Could prove to be interesting.
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| 6 | donavan
ID: 1518179
Tue, Feb 17, 2009, 13:29
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The problem I have with the +/- scenerio in any sport, let alone basketball, is that a very mediocre player can be on the same team as a bunch of studs and profit just because he happens to be on the court/field/ice with them.
Conversely, the opposite is just as true. A stud playing with a bunch of worthless jocks, i.e., can be hit with a pretty nasty "minus" even though he may be dominate for his own team in the stats.
It's a pretty worthless stat if you ask me.
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| 7 | Scazmatic
ID: 57105548
Tue, Feb 17, 2009, 14:35
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Plus-minus can be somewhat subjective, but far from "worthless" in my opinion.
There's a paragraph in the article outling how the Rockets front office recognizes that actual personnel on the court greatly affects overall +/-, and they have developed a method for normalzing the data accordingly, but fall short of clarifying how because they feel they have an edge on other teams in that regard.
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| 8 | Great One
ID: 31112109
Tue, Feb 17, 2009, 14:44
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In a short sample I guess you could say its worthless cause its just a coincidence and I agree. But I think over time with a large sample of data, the fact that one particular player always has a good +/- obviously shows their positive impact on the game and their team.
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| 9 | Mike D
Leader
ID: 041831612
Tue, Feb 17, 2009, 17:53
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I'm surprised by donavan's post given my post (#4) about the adjustments, and then Scazmatic also commented after about it as well.
Without any adjustments, I might have agreed, but the article clearly mentions how they do look at who is in the game on both teams.
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