| 0 |
Subject: OT: Anti-Police Songs
Posted by: Hershy
- [31635315] Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 22:13
Since you all were very helpful with the movies about sports I have a new question for you.
Other than NWA's F*CK the Police
Ice T's Cop Killer
Snoop Doggy Dogg's 187 on the MuthaF*cking Cop
what other songs are there that are anti-police. I am not only looking for Rap songs. if you know of others, please let me know! |
| 1 | Ender
ID: 13443221
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 22:19
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"I Shot the Sherrif"?
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| 2 | TaRhEElKiD
ID: 42109719
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 22:21
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LMAO!
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| 3 | biliruben
Sustainer
ID: 3502218
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 22:22
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Not exactly rap (either), but Sublime had a song,
"April 29, 1992"
In it, they sing "187 on a M.F. cop", maybe as a tribute to snoops'? Dunno.
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| 5 | Slackjawed Yokel
Sustainer
ID: 668290
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 23:08
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Rage Against the Machine - Killing in the Name of
Kottonmouth Kings - Peace not Greed features mf the police
Veggie Tales - The Rumor Weed - Rife with anti-establishment propaganda - that LarryBoy can't fool me.
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| 6 | Seattle Zen
ID: 37241120
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 23:13
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Jimi Hendrix said on stage back in the day, "Be careful of the cats in the bebop hats, they're livin' in the past". I think it is on the Jimi Hendrix Live CD.
Bruce Springsteen did a song called American Skin (41 shots) about the Amadau Diallo shooting in NYC
At the start of a 10-night stand at Madison Square Garden, Bruce Springsteen tells the NYPD what it doesn't want to hear.
Mos Def headlines an entire EP of Anti-Police brutality songs Hip Hop for Respect:
Mos Def Planning Anti-Police Brutality Concert
Here is a site with all of the lyrics for Hip Hop for Respect
They claim to protect us, they serve and they wreck us, Never respect us, arrest us and always stress us
More
Rapper Jailed for Album Lyrics
Skunk Anansie, punk band
'Skunk Song' which has strong anti-police sentiments and suggests that it is 'time to f*ck them up'
"Cowards in blue more like. I was born in Brixton which bore the brunt of the SUS laws when I was growing up. There were two riots which I witnessed and the police in Brixton have always been very violent, very corrupt and basically very racist. Some individual police people are cool yeah but they are up for a lot of criticism because of the amount of powers this government has given them. I don't hate the police because its a trendy thing to do, the attitude I have is because of what I saw when I was growing up."
Amen, brother
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| 7 | Pistol Pete
ID: 3710531014
Tue, Jan 22, 2002, 23:41
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Not exactly pointed at the Police, but more like the law in general..
Judas Priest- "Breakin' The Law"
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| 8 | KB8ers GM
ID: 0616111
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 00:10
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KRS-One - "Sound of Da Police"
There are several by him.
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| 9 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 00:26
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KB8ERS,
e.g. KRS One & Zack de la Rocha - Criminals in Action (C.I.A.)
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| 10 | azdbacker
Donor
ID: 1832261
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 01:23
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Amazing how quickly America's policemen and women go from being heroes to hated again.
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| 11 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 01:29
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That seems to be a bit of a brash generalization. Not all policemen were/have been considered heroes, nor have all policemen all of a sudden been considered imbecilic finks. You have officers on both ends of the spectrum. Obviously, without police, our society would be so ochlocratic we wouldn't know what to do with ourselves.
Just my thoughts on the matter.
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| 12 | azdbacker
Donor
ID: 1832261
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 01:40
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Very true, but going out of your way looking for anti-police songs leads me to believe that the person doing so is not looking at things from the balanced perspective you imply. My own observations about people who are anti-police lead me to the conclusion that the majority are people who feel they have encountered some harm or injustice at the hands of the police. This is not a typical thought process of law-abiding citizens.
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| 13 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 02:01
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I don't believe I wholly concur with your idea that typical law-abiding citizens do not feel they have encountered some sort of harm or injustice at the hands of the police. I'm sure there are many persons who are "law-abiding" and have disparate views from those of law enforcement.
For what it's worth, it doesn't seem to me, just by reading the thread poster's syntax, that he is the kind of person who is going to take violent action against the police; he is probably just a person who has been subjected to some sort of a "leftist" idea that has sparked some thought. Or he could just be a guy who has heard a good song, by RATM (Rage Against the Machine) or NWA or Snoop Doggy Dogg, et al, that had negative connotations toward the police. Who's to say, really? I personally am a huge RATM fan; that is how I have been subjected to songs such as Killing in the Name, F The Police (they cover it), and that combination of KRS and Zack. I don't find all things police have done right (e.g. the Diallo incident), but I doubt many people have either, to a certain degree at least.
FWIW, the guys in the Politics forum (i.e. Seattle Zen, et al) probably have much more developed ideas on this concept than I, I just thought I would post this here for kicks.
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| 14 | migdallion
ID: 301011419
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 02:58
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Cypress Hill - "Pigs"
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| 15 | biliruben
Sustainer
ID: 231045110
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 04:46
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I think Hershy was following a scholarly persuit for his last request. It may be the same motivation here... or not.
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| 16 | joe suspect
Donor
ID: 441143311
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 07:17
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Don't know any specifics, but I'm sure Jello Biafra/Dead Kennedy's had at least one anti-police song.
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| 17 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 09:19
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Public Enemy - 911's a Joke. Brilliant song.
Joe Suspect
Good idea. I'd also look into Suicidal Tendencies and Mucky Pup songs. I'm just a little young to have been exposed to very much of it, but early to mid-80's punk/hard core was an entire genre who's bands often dealt with political subjectmatter in their lyrics. Most of this stuff was written by and marketed toward adolescents though, so if you're looking to avoid oversimplified topics and juvenile points of view you'll probably find late 80's and early 90's hip hop to be your best source.
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| 18 | Pistol Pete
ID: 3710531014
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 09:30
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I'd say the exact opposite. NOT all of the early to mid-80's punk stuff was written by and marketed toward adolescents. As far oversimplified topics and juvenile points of view goes, there's plenty of that in late 80's and early 90's rap and to smaller extent, hip hop as well. I guess it's all a matter of opinion/interpretation.
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| 19 | KevinL
Donor
ID: 13046239
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 09:54
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The song Alice's Restaurant by Arlo Guthrie is not exactly anit-police but it does tell the story of being arrested and put on trial for "littering"
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| 20 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 10:01
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Pistol Pete
Perhaps I'm guilty of an unfair overgeneralization. Mostly, I'm referring to American early '80s hc-punk. I think I would include The Dead Milkmen (they were American, right?) in with the bands mentioned in #16 & 17. Again, I was a little young at the time to have been exposed to much of that stuff, so there could certainly be more to it than I am aware of, but most of what I've heard is pretty juvenile, though still enjoyable IMO. Mucky Pup's "I Shot Reagan" and Suicidal Tendency's "Institutionalized" (great song btw) come to mind.
On late '80s and early '90's hip hop/rap, there's a lot of sharp and important social commentary to be found there. Clearly, I am not referring to groups like 2 Live Crew, but I should have been more precise. KRS 1, Boogie Down Productions, NWA and Public Enemy just to name a few worked to convey messages about very real inequalities and dificulties of life that were intended to be taken very seriously.
I do concede that many artists exploited this genre and used it as an excuse to sell records worth little more than the shock value inspired lyrics that had become trendy at the time, Like 2 Live Crew. I bet Public Enemy will be rediscovered again and again in generations to come.
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| 21 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 10:31
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Public Enemy - Fight the Power is another.
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| 22 | Bungers
ID: 38082016
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 11:34
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"Every Breath You Take" and "The Do Do Da" (or whatever)...after those I hated the Police.
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| 23 | Hershy
ID: 31635315
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 11:52
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azdbacker: Ever here the saying "Do you know what happens when you assume? You make an ass out of u and me"
I am doing a research project on police and youth relations. my main objective using these songs is to show how policemen are disrespected by youths who listen to these songs and take them for their literal meanings in that they do not respect police officers. How can we expect officers to treat youths with respect and honor when they are treated with such disrespect?
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| 24 | JonesI15
ID: 510592311
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 12:03
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F*** the police by NWA, a classic
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| 25 | gibby88@WORK
ID: 588371414
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 12:24
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"41 Shots", by Springsteen
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| 26 | steve houpt
ID: 270531916
Wed, Jan 23, 2002, 16:15
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How about the 'singer' taking it literally?
C-Murder arrested for murder. Pass the 'Club' his lastest 'alleged' shooting occured a couple times a week. He was not successful last year. Out on bail for attempted murder in a Baton Rouge 'Club' incident.
I would not want to assume if any of the songs in his "Trapped in Crime" album were anti-police. Somehow I'm missing that one in my music collection. :):)
NOLA.com
MTV links to anything and everything you wanted to know about C-Murder
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| 27 | booth
ID: 1524108
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 00:23
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just as advice.....the most classic of all these recommended songs/ones that had the most influence in hiphop are
KRS 1-sound of da police
PE-fight the power
good luck
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| 28 | azdbacker
Donor
ID: 1832261
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 01:17
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I definitely jumped the gun on my assumption, and apologize for that. Guess I'm getting too used to seeing things I would consider as poor behavior or thinking OK'd around here. Sorry, Hershy.
I haven't seen 'Murder Was the Case' by Snoop mentioned. Maybe because it doesn't out-and-out say "F- the police" like some others or even mention the police, but the message is more or less the same (anti-establishment, poor brother losing all hope and it's someone else's fault) - and I like the tune.
:)
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| 29 | Pistol Pete
ID: 3710531014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 08:48
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mith- Agreed. And, I'll double down on your bet that P.E. will be rediscovered over the years. : )
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| 30 | Pistol Pete
ID: 3710531014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 08:49
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OMG! A steve houpt sighting! Good to see you "source"...where have you been?
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| 31 | Wammie
ID: 32104029
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 09:20
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Fedz by TRU
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| 32 | PhillyTom
ID: 101055821
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 10:04
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There was talk in 2000 that Chuck D. of PE was going to join Rage Against the Machine when Zack split. I think that would be the only way to make Rage better.
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| 33 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 10:09
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I remember hearing that. No offense to Rage fans, but it would be a big step down in quality and sharpness of message for Chuck IMHO. That is assuming of course that the intent wasn't for Chuck to take over much of the lyric writing.
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| 34 | PhillyTom
ID: 101055821
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 10:14
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Gotta disagree. I would agree if Flava Flav was in the deal, but he wasn't, just Chuck.
I went back and listened to all my old PE albums (from my youth) after watching their Behind the Music. They had some really, really powerful stuff, alot of it along the same lines as Rage.
And Zack wrote all the lyrics, so Chuck would have to take that over too I would assume.
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| 35 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 10:54
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I find PE's message to be more deliberate and much smarter, but I guess that's just my opinion. Rage's message always seems to be little more than a general promotion for anarchy, though I admit that I'm only familiar with what I've been exposed to. I was never a fan.
Also, I totally disagree with that the addition of Flav (these days anyhow) could improve on any music act. PE, especially in the later years, succeeded in spite of Flav. His drug problem definately hurt them as it was probably the primary factor contributing to their decline/demise and it also consumed the social/political fire in Flav. The group was founded on that fire existing in all it's members. His only real contribution to PE was that he balanced out the vocals by contrasting Chucks deep voice. Listen to Muse-Sick-N-Hour-Mess-Age. Flav is awful in every track. A shame because the first track, "Whole Lotta Love Goin On" is one of their best songs, IMHO.
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| 36 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 11:04
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Also, does anyone watch that Dark Angel show? I caught some of it for the first time last week and part of the story involves a militant group called The S1W. Was that not also the name of the infamous group that followed/supported/protected Public Enemy? Does anyone know if this is established or suggested as deliberate?
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| 37 | PhillyTom
ID: 010402014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 13:13
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I meant that I would agree with you that Chuck D would bring down the quality of Rage if Flav came with him....which would have put both of them totally out of the question.
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| 38 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 13:25
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Oh, well in that case you misunderstood me. In post 33 I'm saying that Chuck would be joining an act of far lesser quality if he teamed up w/rage. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
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| 39 | PhillyTom
ID: 010402014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 13:31
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Ah. Gotcha.
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| 40 | MGL
ID: 1210341014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 14:27
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Chuck D composed the theme for Dark Angel so there probably is a correlation.
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| 41 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 15:17
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Mattinglyinthehall,
Re: post 38, I disagree, but I don't have time to respond. Maybe later I'll give some reasoning.
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| 42 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 15:20
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Oh yeah, re: post 33, Zack wrote most, if not all, lyrics for Rage, IIRC.
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| 43 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 16:28
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Interested in hearing some of your thoughts on RATM. Maybe you can sell me on spending the time (god I hate my home dialup conn.) to download a few songs. On Rage's lyrics, I was saying that Chuck D would be stepping into an inferior band from his previous setting. I specifically meant that Rage's lyrics (at least to my experience) lack deliberate meaning and, as a result, poignancy. I left open the caveat that if Chuck D would take over some of that writing, perhaps the whole act could be improved beyond my assessment. Again, I pretty much only know what I've heard on the radio and MTV, so I admit that I could be way off. If so, I welcome you proving me wrong. I have a feeling though that even if some or even much of their music possesses the lyrical meaningfulness that I accuse them of lacking, I doubt any argument could be made that it's presence is consistant in all or most of their music. "Renegades of Funk" for example, while a pretty interesting overall composition barely seems to mean anything. Great intro though.
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| 44 | PhillyTom
ID: 010402014
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 16:33
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That was a cover song, as was that whole album. My favorites off that one were Maggy's Farm (Dylon) and Ghost of Tom Jhoad (Springsteen). I will chime in with more later as I am kinda busy myself.
I didn't like 'Funk' either.
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| 45 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 16:44
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Well that would change things right off. Had no idea "Funk" was a cover.
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| 46 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Thu, Jan 24, 2002, 23:19
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OK, I did a little pick and choose from some Rage lyrics and I'll try to post here and make my analysis of what they are alluding to, to the best of my abilities:
Mic Check
Where nameless cold millions gaspin for air
They're naked and wageless
Scream within cages, huh
They make you pull your sh*t
Just to get your share, what?
In this passage, they are basically referring to the sequestration of American society that is plaguing us now. The partitioning of society they feel is caused by our focus on corporations and other big business. That is, the wealth of our country is vast, but is possessed by a tremendously vast minority of persons (i.e. the aristocracy, plutocracy, or whatever one would call it).
Guerrilla Radio
Yes a spectacle monopolized
They hold the reins, stole your eyes
All the fistagons the bullets and bombs
Who stuff the banks
Who staff the party ranks
More for Gore or the son of a drug lord
None of the above f**k it cut the cord
Here I believe they are referring to this aforementioned monopolistic control of large corporations/markets, etc. Also, these same persons seem to "stuff the banks" (which I would think could have two meanings: the stuffing of beaches, i.e. by rich people and the stuffing of bank accounts by the plutocracy) and the "party ranks" (those in control of our capitalist government).
Sound off Mumia guan be free
Who got 'em yo check the federal file
All you pen devils know the trial was vile
Army of pigs try to silence my style
Off em all out that box its my radio dial
This, obviously adverts to the trial of Mumia Abu-Jamal, which they felt was unfair. If you want you can read into this one more in the politics form or all over the Web.
Testify
The movie ran through me
The Glamour subdue me
The tabloid untie me
Im empty please fill me
Mister anchor assure me
That Baghdad is burning
Your voice it is so soothing
That cunning mantra of killing
I need you my witness
To dress this up so bloodless
To numb me and purge me now
Of thoughts of blaming you
This passage refers to the bombing of Iraq, which has perdured for years now; this, to the basic insouciance of our nation. I personally was unaware of our continued efforts in Iraq until last year, when an Iraqi Archbishop came to our church and told of the atrocities that have been omnipresent in Iraq.
Mass graves for the pump and the price is set, and the price is set
This one speaks for itself, I think (the pump being gasoline pumps).
Take the Power Back
'Cause holes in our spirit causin' tears and fears
One-sided stories for years and years and years
I'm inferior? Who's inferior?
Yea, we need to check the interior
Of the system that cares about only one culture
And that is why
We gotta take the power back
This one appears to refer to our culture (that being mass media, government, et cetera) that gives us a one-sided view of what goes on in countries, both here and abroad. The "one culture" I believe refers to the rich, upper class in our society. I don't know if this is a pure anarchical reference at the end, but is more of a "we need to rethink what is going on here and reform things." But they could really mean "burn 'em all." Not sure which.
Producer
I first met you and the ideas you uphold while incarcerated
A victim of a social experiment
Eventually addicted to your eight hour injections of hypocrisy and arrogance and greed
Forced to sit with complicity in front of my executioners
As they bludgeoned me with their so called superior values and demanded my submission
I bacame an indentured servant in a factory
Where I myself was the product
Whose useful quality was to protect their palaces
Every word uttered from their mouths strangled me
So that every thought I express
Shall sow the seed for the noose around their necks
This seems to discuss the corporate world, particularly those who work in mass production factories. They appear to speak of the indocrination of workers by their superiors in order to efficiently produce the desired product.
Killing in the Name Of
Some of those that were forces are the same that burn crosses
Those who died are justified, for wearing the badge, they're the chosen whites
You justify those that died by wearing the badge, they're the chosen whites
Interpret as you desire.
Bullet In the Head
They're the teachers who taught me to fight me
Compromise, conformity, assimilation, submission
Ignorance, hypocrisy, brutality, the elite
All of which are American dreams
Here, a discussion of our school system, which teaches a certain way of thinking, which is in a sense a "personal infighting." These ideas which are presented to us at school paralled with what is viewed as the "American Dreams." This is what I get out of this one.
Bulls on Parade
Weapons not food, not homes, not shoes
Not need, just feed the war cannibal animal
I walk tha corner to tha rubble that used to be a library
Line up to tha mind cemetary now
What we don't know keeps tha contracts alive an movin'
They don't gotta burn the books they just remove 'em
While arms warehouses fill as quick as the cells
This seems to imply: a distaste for war; the naive nature of those being held by capitalist contracts; censorship/the lack of leftist thought; and finally how our prison system is overflowing, just as at the same time, we mass produce weapons as a means for $$, without noting a parallel between the two.
Like I said at the top, I did a little picking and choosing of lyrics, in order to bring their views to the fore. I think that Rage is/was for a rethinking of our society and how it is set up; if it has to be classified in some sort of governmental philosophy, I would have to say that they would be more for socialism to some degree, with a bit of anarchy to get things moving in the "right direction." Anyway, I'm sure my interpretations probably have some gaping holes in them, which could be ripped apart by the literati (particularly those in the Politics Forum), but I hope this clarifies any questioning to Rage's political nature. And, to those who don't want to hear this in the bball forum, I'm sorry, but I felt this was the proper place to answer this.
Disclaimer: These are just my interpretations, I could be off in certain aspects, but I just put a few thoughts here and there
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| 47 | booth
ID: 1524108
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 00:25
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here rage_22...if you really like analyzing lyrics analyze the deepest anti police song ever
malcolm
by ghostface
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| 48 | Mattinglyinthehall
ID: 1832399
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 09:34
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Rage
Thanks for the lesson in contemporary music. I stand corrected in my opinion of Rage, clearly smarter than I gave them credit for. I will say though that whoever makes such decisions (record company execs?, radio sta. execs?) should probably rethink which songs get released for air play. Songs like "Funk", "Killing in the Name Of" and that 'Rollin down Rodeo with a pocket full of shells' song apparently don't do the band justice as far as providing samples of what these guys are about.
Funny, I'm not sure why I held such a bias against them for so long, they emerged from that early '90's industrial phase that much of my favorite music comes from. Probably the amount of radio play they get had something to do with my turning a deaf ear. I went to a Lalapalooza in (I think) Waterloo where they played. They were one of the opening acts and we heard them from the parking lot but didn't go in until the end of their set.
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| 50 | Seattle Zen
ID: 411302615
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 20:00
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Hershey post 23
I'm curious about the project that lead to this post. Could you elaborate on what it entails? You mentioned in post 23:
my main objective using these songs is to show how policemen are disrespected by youths who listen to these songs and take them for their literal meanings in that they do not respect police officers
How are you going to show that youth who listen to these songs disrespect police? Perhaps a young citizen may listen to these songs and then research police brutality. From this research they learn that the police in certain areas (Seattle, for one) disproportionately harrass, beat and even use deadly force against people of color. They learn that the police arrest people of color who sell drugs, yet hardly ever arrest white drug dealers. Armed with this new knowledge, this young citizen writes a paper in school, teaching other students of this injustice. This young citizen goes to a police accountability panel meeting and asks to to speak. He/she shows the panel the plain facts. A reporter is at the panel meeting and writes a story. The press starts a public dialog that leads to improvements in police relations with communities of color.
I think that good things can come from art that expresses an ugly truth. There can be many ways young people will react to these songs.
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| 51 | SilverSurfer
ID: 341154191
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 20:23
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Good point Seattle - There is always a silver lining to be found in the darkest of clouds.
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| 52 | rage_22
Donor
ID: 490311415
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 23:00
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Mattinglyinthehall,
Here's a link to some Rage tracks you could possibly gather some songs from (sans their newest album, Renegades, which is also good). The first Rage song I ever heard was Freedom, and that is still probably my fave. A lot of the rarities are good stuff. That unreleased Rage and Tool song that was meant to be on the Judgment Night soundtrack is a great song, but I have never found it in a high quality MP3 form. I think whoever spread it had a pretty crappy original copy to work with. No Shelter, Zapata's Blood, and Producer are some good ones. Hell, they're all good IMO.
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| 53 | PhillyTom
ID: 101055821
Fri, Jan 25, 2002, 23:05
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Cinema, simulated life, ill drama
Fourth Reich culture - Americana
Chained to the dream they got ya searchin for
Tha thin line between entertainment and war.
--No Shelter
Easily my favorite. Still can't believe that they got that on the Godzilla (pure Motha F#ckin' filla) soundtrack.
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| 54 | Hershy
ID: 31635315
Sat, Jan 26, 2002, 00:08
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Seattle zen: Great points which I am considering. I am simply showing both sides of the argument and will encourage the class to discuss each side and give their reasons for opposing or going with these views. I am guessing you may have experienced some type of police harrassment!?!?!? If so, I would love your perspective. Please email me at hershy1979@yahoo.ca. My presentation is on Tuesday but I am putting this thing together tomorrow.
My plan so far is to play some anti-police songs, discuss them, show a video of police being over-represented in the "bad" neighbourhood in Toronto, show clips of New Jersy Drive to show both sides of the story, and discuss some personal accounts of those who have encountered police in their everyday lives.
I encourage anyone with experiences to please email me as soon as possible. Also, ideas would be appreciated. the topics I am to cover include police and youth relationships and how those of colour are portrayed by the media.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed so far.
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