| Posted by: WiddleAvi
- [54640816] Tue, Jul 24, 23:28
Has anyone seen this movie ?? I just got back from seeing it and it was one of the most amazing movies I have seen in a long time. I walked out of the theatre shaking my head. This movie will play with your head. Anyway if other people saw it I wonder what they thought of it. I read some reviews that viewers wrote over at moviefone (Other reviews) But no one there really discusses the movie so I was hoping people might have seen it and give their opinion. Sorry for rambling |
| 1 | Y2JS
ID: 48312723 Tue, Jul 24, 23:35
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I saw it and it was confusing as hell with the movie starting from the end and working its way backwards. It was really good though for getting no publicity plus i like the dude from the matrix who was in it
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| 2 | F Gump
ID: 11625176 Tue, Jul 24, 23:38
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in general, what is it about? never heard of it
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| 3 | Y2JS
ID: 48312723 Tue, Jul 24, 23:44
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Its about this guy who cant remember any long term thoughts. His wife was raped and killed and he got thrown into a wall so he had some sort of head trama. So eventually he wants to find out who the killers were and he tattoos info he finds out on his body so he wont forget anything. He ends up killing someone but cant even remember how, why, or even when he did it. Its too hard to explain but its really a good movie. It starts from the end and works back to the beginning
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| 4 | James K Polk
ID: 4455731 Tue, Jul 24, 23:49
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Yes, it's a fantastic movie. It's been a long time since I've seen one I enjoyed more. The backward storytelling is crucial, because just when you think you've pieced things together, your context is completely thrown off when you find out what really happened just before.
And having Trinity from The Matrix doesn't hurt either :)
The movie also has one of the better movie websites around. link
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| 5 | WiddleAvi
ID: 54640816 Tue, Jul 24, 23:54
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I don't want to ruin it for people who didn't see it yet but what what I am trying to figure out is if he killed John G (Was that his name ?) cause he was the killer of just because he wanted to ?? It also seems to me that based on what happens he gets his memory back. Cause in the begining when he is about to kill John G ...the guy says wait come to the basement and he is about then screams out no and shoots him as if he remembers what is down there. What were youy guys impressions ??
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| 6 | Y2JS
ID: 48312723 Tue, Jul 24, 23:54
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Trinity and the other guy who was in the Matrix
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| 7 | James K Polk
ID: 4455731 Tue, Jul 24, 23:59
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Widdle -- kind of hate to post anything because I don't want to accidentally spoil things for someone who hasn't seen the movie. Let me try something: THIS IS A TEST.
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| 8 | James K Polk
ID: 4455731 Tue, Jul 24, 23:59
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Whoops. One more try: THIS IS A TEST.
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| 9 | James K Polk
ID: 4455731 Wed, Jul 25, 00:09
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OK, it works. Here's what I think:
The crew-cut guy who we know as "John G" when the movie starts is NOT the real killer. I think he was telling the truth when he said he was a police officer who helped the main guy find the punks who broke in to the house, and was there when he killed the REAL killer. But the main guy talks quite a bit about needing to have a reason to live, considering that his condition makes life quite difficult. I think he has decided to, in a way, take advantage of his memory loss, conveniently forgetting that he's killed the real killer already, so that he can continually start chasing another John G., giving himself something to focus on.
The picture of him with the blood all over him, pointing at his chest (the place where you get a glimpse of the "I Did It" tatoo in one scene) is from the time when he killed the REAL killer, I think. I'm guessing he may have had the tatoo removed, so he could keep going with his "game."
Now, I'm not sure about this last part, but I think it's even possible that his wife actually survived the attack. In the scene where you see the "I Did It" tatoo, she is there, with her arms around him. And it seems possible to me that the whole story about Sammy Jankis (the "insurance case" guy who accidentally killed his wife by overdosing her with insulin) is ACTUALLY the main guy's own story -- and HE accidentally killed his own wife because of his memory problem. That's what I think, anyway.
In order to read this post, click at the beginning or end of the box, and drag to highlight the text. This will make the "invisible" text appear.
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| 10 | WiddleAvi
ID: 54640816 Wed, Jul 25, 00:17
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James K Polk....o.k. Will try and do the same thing you did :-) At the end when it shows some picture of him and his wife it seems like he has tatoos already al over his chest but it seems a bit different the the tatoos you see during the movie. I also was thiking about the whole remember Jimmy Jankins thing thinking that he did that to his wife and this was his way of forgetting it. I think John G. Like you said may have helped him find "someone" to kill just to convince him that the story is closed and he found the killer when in reality it's himself. Anyway thats whats so cool about this movie is that there is so many ways to look at it and so many posibilities !! Have you seen it more then once ?? I heard that seeing when seeing it a second time you see alot of things you missed the first time. Sort of like The Usual Suspects.
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| 11 | James K Polk
ID: 4455731 Wed, Jul 25, 00:20
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I've only seen it once so far, but definitely plan to go see it again. I especially love that scene where Trinity goes out to her car after roughing herself up, just because she knows he's going to forget what happened. Nasty! :)
I've heard rumors that the DVD will have a special setup that will let you watch the scenes in correct chronological order, if you want.
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| 16 | Stiffler
ID: 49232217 Wed, Jul 25, 08:23
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For those who have already seen the flick: here's a link to a super detailed analysis on Salon.com...answered a lot of questions I had walking out of the theatre. Not sure if the conclusions at the end are right, but it certainly gives all the details.
Memento Analysis
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| 17 | WiddleAvi
ID: 346231015 Wed, Jul 25, 08:31
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What happened to posts 12-15 ??!!!
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| 18 | WiddleAvi
ID: 346231015 Wed, Jul 25, 08:52
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Well I just read the review over at salon.com Very well written but like he says no matter what story you want to believe there are still parts that make no sense what-so-ever !! What I do know is that I will probally see it again tomorrow or at the latest over the weekend :-)
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| 19 | biliruben Sustainer
ID: 231045110 Wed, Jul 25, 10:03
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Re: #11 - especially after she meticulously hides all the pencils or pens! Devious.
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| 20 | costanza
ID: 96132510 Wed, Jul 25, 10:13
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I can't remember the last movie before this one that I saw more than once in the theatre. It's definitely a film that was made to be watched/enjoyed more than once... things that seem inconsequential or just odd the first time around fall into place nicely the second time through.
Easily the best movie I've seen this year, and the best I've seen in awhile...
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| 21 | Makisupa Donor
ID: 456172510 Wed, Jul 25, 10:21
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This is a fantastic film...great to see it get the Gurupie seal of approval too, eh cc???
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| 22 | Roo
ID: 665497 Wed, Jul 25, 10:38
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Top film (and, like James K Polk says, an excellent website too), as is The Usual Suspects.
If you enjoy films like these but haven't read any books by James Ellroy you should.
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| 23 | Roo
ID: 665497 Wed, Jul 25, 10:59
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I forgot (how appropriate): the short story (written by the director's brother) is here.
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| 24 | deepsnapper Sustainer
ID: 52320226 Wed, Jul 25, 11:30
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Guru had to edit the thread for post 12-15. The thread was hosed by a crazy post that self-edit couldn't delete. (Thanks Guru). :-)
Kudos need to go out to coldwater coyotes. He worked on the film and also "The Mexican".
IIRC, he impacted our baseball draft by having to attend the premiere of Memento in Hollywood. It was a slow live and no big deal, we finished well in advance of the cutoff.
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| 25 | WiddleAvi
ID: 57658259 Wed, Jul 25, 12:05
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While the usual suspects was a great movie I don't think this movie should be compared to it. a) The Usual suspects took a good 30 minutes to get into and get caught up into it while Memento hooks you in right away. b) The Usual suspects after you watch it the second time it all makes sense. You can watch it more and you catch unto little things. While this movie seems more to play with your mind. There are way to many ways to look at the story and no matter what way you go their is something that won't sit right.
I loved Usuall suspects but I liked Memento even more....Alot more !! Once again.... Brilliant movie
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| 26 | Silver Streak
ID: 205511212 Wed, Jul 25, 15:57
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Willie: I agree with you. A couple of months ago I saw Memento 3 times within 2 weeks....and tried to spread word of mouth like crazy. I got into a discussion with a Usual Suspects fanatic, and he enjoyed that movie more. I was a huge fan of KSoze also, but I thought Memento was just ingenious when I first saw it. And you HAVE to see it more than once to understand it all. I had to wait a few weeks for it to get here in Tampa, and what do you know..10 weeks later, it is still playing here. Go see if you've never seen, and I can't wait for the DVD.....BTW, figuring out the stuff yourself instead of reading spoilers is WAY MORE FUN! Resist the temptation.
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| 27 | Blizz
ID: 28654105 Wed, Jul 25, 17:27
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when does this movie come out on video, it didnt come to the theatre in my town and i cant wait to see it because this isnt the first time ive heard it was an amazing movie
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| 28 | WiddleAvi
ID: 346231015 Wed, Jul 25, 17:39
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It's been in theatres now for a while and seems to be going strong. So I don't imagine it will be out on video for still a while. Sorry dude I feel bad for you that you have to wait to see this one !!
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| 29 | costanza
ID: 2642518 Wed, Jul 25, 18:04
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According to The Digital Bits' website (as of 6/20), the Memento DVD is due to hit the streets September 4th. Less than six weeks! :)
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| 31 | Blizz
ID: 28654105 Fri, Jul 27, 04:17
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re 28 i feel bad that the theatre in my town is such a joke, i dont even think were gonna be getting the score, which ive been waiting to come for a month or two, instead im stuck with movies like legally blonde playing here. oh well ill probably be going to vancouver in a couple weeks so i can check out memento and the score in my spare time
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| 32 | WiddleAvi
ID: 22725110 Wed, Aug 01, 10:45
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Well I went to see the movie again and I think I made some sense out of the whole thing. If you saw the movie then highlight below to see my understanding of the movie. The guy who forgets everything....well what happened is some guys attacked his wife and he walked in. He got knocked down and lost his short term memory. His wife though survives the attack. He is now really sammy Jenkis. His wife is diabetic. He kills his wife and is taken to a mental home (If you go the the web site you will see that he was in a mental home and escaped). He does not remember that his wife survived the attack and thinks she was killed. He then tries to revenge her death. Teddy is a cop involved in the original case of his wifes attack. Together with Natalie they want to screw over JImmy the drug dealer for his 200 grand. So Teddy knows about the guy and uses him with natalie to kill Jimmy so they can take the money. But Leonard Shelby walks out after killy Jimmy and sees Teddy and takes the car before Teddy can take it with the money. One other option to this is: His wife never dies but he thinks she did and tries to avenge her death. Anyway when he is about to shoot teddy teddy says wait why don't you come down to the basement and see who you really are !! Then Leonard screams NO as if he remembers whaty is down there and what he did. Seems like he gets his memory back and like the Sammy Jenkis story it was all psycological(spelling?). He then goes back to his wife which is what we see at the end and that explain why he has the tattoo on his chest while laying in bed with his wife that says "I did it". So if you saw the movie click and drag the mouse over this whole post to see what I wrote and let me know what you think !!
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| 33 | rockafellerskank Donor
ID: 4911539 Sat, Aug 04, 19:03
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The flashbacks to leonard when he was an insurance investigator were made to make him look alot (10 years?) younger and in a dulled color for effect. Anyone get hung up on think about how long ago the "incident" was? 5-10-20 years?
rfs
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| 34 | Blizz
ID: 54721318 Fri, Sep 07, 03:23
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Wow... Memento is finally on video and I rented it tonight, it is a fantastic movie. I have never been more confused in a movie so I plan on seeing it again before I have to return it and I will also rent the DVD sometime. I really enjoyed the backwards concept although that was the reason I was confused. As Leonard was having trouble with his short term memory, the backwards effect was causing me to have problems with my short term memory causing me to hardly remember scenes that had just happened. I dont know how to do the invisible font but I basically agree with Widdle Avi's understanding of the movie in post 32.
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| 35 | Jeddi
ID: 24519209 Fri, Sep 07, 21:47
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Teddy keeps trying in just about every scene he is in to get the keys to the Jag back, unsuccesfully, so he just wants the money.
As for Leonard I think he's trying to create his own reality so he has a reason to live.
I would say more but I don't want to spoil it, and have no idea the code to get my words to be clear
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| 36 | James K Polk
ID: 19351290 Fri, Sep 07, 22:00
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The code for "invisible" words is pretty simple.
Put this in front of the words: [font color="#EEEEEE"]
... just replace the [ and ] with < and >
and then put this to turn off invisible type: [/font]
... making the same substitution to use the < and >
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| 37 | ksoze Donor
ID: 50643419 Sun, Sep 16, 23:31
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Ok, I've seen the movie on DVD three times now and two specific things in the movie are making me wonder whether Leonard's memory loss is as a result of the accident or is a learned condition. For these to make sense you have to buy into the theory that Sammy never existed and that it was Leonard who killed his wife with insulin.
Maybe these are just nitpicking but here it goes. First, in the scene where the motel dude tells Leonard that he's rented him 2 rooms because "business is slow," Leonard calls him "Burt." Nowhere in that scene did the motel clerk identify himself. If Leonard's condition is for real he couldn't possibly know Burt's name because he hasn't talked to him within the last few minutes. Was this purposely scripted or just a continuity mistake? Second, it's not possible for Leonard to remember that his wife has been killed without looking at his tatoos or being reminded by someone. Her death would, in this case, have happened after his accident and thus be a memory he loses every ten or fifteen minutes after realizing it. However, throughout the movie Leonard refers to the death of his wife numerous times without any assistance.
I'm wondering if this isn't a learned condition. Did Leonard fake it long enough after the attack that it's now second nature? He doesn't really have the condition, hence the slip-ups, but he no longer remembers that he doesn't really have it.
The one thing that really throws me for a loop, though, is the "I did it" tatoo. There is no evidence on Leonards chest that it's something that's been erased. I don't know what to think there.
Great movie CC!!!
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| 38 | WiddleAvi
ID: 10840171 Mon, Sep 17, 01:40
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As far as his wife dying......He can remember anything from before the "incident". While in reality his wife did not die as far as he knows she did die. Now I also have just seen it again and am having some questions pop up. a)I am not os sure that he is Sammy Kenkis. He makes it very clear that Sammy didn't have a system while he does making it clear that there is a diffence between them. b)Where does Natalie fit in ? Is she in on the plot with Teddy to steal the 200 grand ? I don't think so. Also when leonard takes the Jag and pulls into the bar she thinks it her boyfriend. Knowing that her boyfriend is gone and now Leanard shows up with his car wouldn't she think he did it ? If show why would she help him at all ? Lastly I think Dodd is the one that raped his wife and knocked him out. a)Leonard says that the reason the Police think there was only one attacker is because the second guy took Leonard's gun and replaced it with the bar that he hit him with. So now the rapist has Leonards gun. When Leonard first runs into Dodd he asks if he knows him and Dodd says "Didn't I make a good enough impression on you last time?". Then later in Dodd's hotel room he gets Dodd's gun and we see it is the exact (or so it seems) same gun that Leonard had when he went to defend his wife. Lastly When he kills Natalie's boyfriend he says after to Teddy that he (Natalie's Boyfriend) knew about Sammy. I checked this again and he does not mention the name sammy, so where does leonard come up with this ? If anyone had any ideas let me know :-) I love this movie more and more everytime I see it.
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| 39 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 5965479 Mon, Sep 17, 11:17
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Ksoze: The "I did it" tattoo on Leonard which you see at the end of the film is just a wish fullfilment, day dreaming scene.
I checked again with Chris Nolan and he agrees. I have always regreted that we did not take this scene out of the film...but we felt that we had to follow the wishes of Chris. It is the scene that bothers alot of people.
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| 40 | WiddleAvi
ID: 2102389 Mon, Sep 17, 12:10
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cc - from what I read here you had a part in making this film. I was just wondering if you would say which of our theories is right :-) One question I have is, What natalie in on the plot with Teddy to get the 200 grand ? If so why did she help Leonard with the license info ? Did she plan on screwing teddy over ? If she was not in on it then why would she help Leonard at all ? Wouldn't she suspect that he is the one that killed her boyfriend ?
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| 41 | Goner
ID: 152302613 Mon, Sep 17, 12:26
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A friend of mine told me about it a few weeks ago. My wife and I rented it, watched it, and called my friend to tell him he owed us $4.25 for wasting our money. We just didn't like it. It reminded me of The Game, but with tattoos.
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| 42 | ChicagoTRS Sustainer
ID: 4324316 Mon, Sep 17, 13:05
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Saw this movie this weekend...definitely an awesome movie and very twisted.
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| 43 | ksoze Donor
ID: 50643419 Mon, Sep 17, 16:17
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Thanks CC, I doubt I'd have decided that on my own. Pretty soon I'm gonna have to use the DVD to watch the scenes in chronological order.
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| 45 | ksoze Donor
ID: 50643419 Mon, Sep 17, 16:38
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Oh, and you're right WiddleAvi, I suppose if Leonard thought his wife was dead when he was knocked out that it wouldn't matter if she lived and then died later, the last thing he'd remember would be her in the plastic, apparently dead.
I don't think Dodd is the one who raped his wife, however. Leonard has that old picture of him pointing at the spot on his chest where we later see the "I did it" tattoo; that picture was apparently taken right after he killed the rapist.
Also, Teddy set up Natallie's drug dealer boyfriend to be killed by Leonard so I'm thinking that she gives Leonard the info on Teddy for revenge. She never once tries to get the car away from Leonard the way Teddy does on a regular basis.
As for her boyfriend knowing the Sammy story, Leonard tells that to everyone he comes in contact with for a decent amount of time. We know that chronologically the beginning of the story (after the black and white scenes) is Leonard killing Natallie's boyfriend. We also know that Leonard won't just up and kill anyone (he tells Natalie that he won't kill Dodd just for her sake), he'll only kill John G. Therefore we should be able to figure that Leonard's been on to John G. the drug dealer/boyfriend for some time before the chronological beginning of the story and must have been close enough to him to tell him about Sammy. I think. Maybe?
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| 46 | absolut_cdi
ID: 35730916 Mon, Sep 24, 18:31
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i rented it last week as well, although i didn't see this post until now
i got it because guy pearce (la confidential) was the main character and the movie was getting some buzz
i thought it was a brilliant concept but it was somewhat slow and i found myself quite bored half way through... the tattoos rocked
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| 47 | rockafellerskank Donor
ID: 4911539 Mon, Sep 24, 18:49
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Here is a question that nags me...
Leonard and his wife was attacked by 2 unknown men. Apparently, he got the name "John G" from the police reports, yes?
Where did the police get that name from? Leonard? Who came up w/ the theory that the #2nd killer was "John G"? Did Teddy toss him a lead named "John G" to manipulate him for his own purposes?
Did Imiss that part?
rfs
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| 48 | WiddleAvi
ID: 88262420 Mon, Sep 24, 20:26
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rfs.....Good question....My guess would be that Teady threw him that piece of info somewhere in the police report. He was a cop so he could have put that in. It does seem that Jimmy is not the first person Teady had him kill. Also it's mentioned a couple times about pages missing in the police report. I wonder what kind of signifigance it has. What was in the police report that Teady took or Leonard himself threw away ?? Any ideas ?
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| 49 | rockafellerskank Donor
ID: 4911539 Mon, Sep 24, 20:34
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To those who have not seen the movie, please SKIP this post. I don't want to run it for you....
I think Leonard found things in the police report that didn't jive with the way he wanted things to be.... so he removed them (himself) or balcked them out knowing full well that the next day he wouldn't remember doing it and would just assume it was part of the ongoing conspiracy.
Some of the things that may have been in the police report:
1. his wife lived - If this was in there, he would have to delete it because he remembers her death. 2. The killers were caught - he would delete this because it seems to be his mission to live for.
This goes along w/ my overall theory that hunting the "killer" was his reason to live- his mission.
We know Leonard does things like that such as burning his wife's posessions knowing full well that he will not remember their existance after the act is complete. I can't find any motivation for his actios other than to purposely confuse himself the next day.
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| 50 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Tue, Sep 25, 07:45
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I saw this thread a few days ago and said to myself: "No way this could be about the movie I just rented." Idiot I am. Thanks for WiddleAvi, ksoze, and coldwater coyotes (what was your role in the production of this film?) for your high-tech and informative discussion posts. I learned a lot from reading this thread!
My view of this movie (I am a wannabe film critic): AWESOME, original flick. Very hard to figure out, and there is likely no "answer." I discussed this with two buddies who saw it, too. One of those great anti-hollywood film noirs. Guy Pearce and Joe Pantoliano were terrific. You really felt Pearce's character's confusion and obsession. Trinity = Carrie Anne Moss.
I saw it on DVD and did not see any option to view the movie in chronological order, but perhaps that was a hidden icon, which is often the case. I did watch some of the Nolan interview. The film was an adaptation from a story written by a friend or relative (brother?) who had told Mr. Nolan of his story that he had begun writing, but he just could not finish it. Nolan asked if he could turn it into a screenplay and he actually finished his screenplay before the story writer could finish his short story. I did not watch the entire interview, but I know my wife (who chose to watch CNN about the attack instead) would have loved this flick, so I am going to rent it again.
I remember when this flick came out in the theaters about 6 months ago, and the NY Times gave it a strong review. Clearly this movie could have a minor cult-phenom following given the complexity of the plot and the thought required afterwards. Not too many movies are made like this anymore.
- walk
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| 51 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Tue, Sep 25, 07:52
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OMG is that web site awesome! Thanks Mr. President and all others...I have called my buddies who saw the flick and were equally confused and have told them to go to www.otnemem.com, clever.
- walk
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| 52 | WiddleAvi
ID: 527362010 Tue, Sep 25, 10:17
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Walk - Post #23 has a link to the original story written by his brother. To take that story and make into the movie that is was is pure brilliance
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| 53 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Tue, Sep 25, 10:43
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Thanks WiddleAvi, I appreciate the direction. They actually had the entire story, page by page, on the DVD, but I just could not stay awake to read it. A 6-month old will do that to ya.
All this talk and reading (I just read the entire Salon article, very helpful...made me realize that I FELL ASLEEP and missed at least 10-15 minutes of this complicated movie, making it even more complicated for me...I actually had to watch it over two nights, typically parent kinda dilemma) has really inspired me to see this movie again. Maybe I will be able to stay awake this time!
Otherwise, thanks to all for the great scoops.
- walk
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| 54 | Sandlot Donor
ID: 59832108 Tue, Sep 25, 15:25
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thanks for BUTTing this - reminded me to go out & rent it. Getting ready to watch it for the first time. Have not read the spoilers. Here goes...
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| 55 | struggler
ID: 0514610 Tue, Sep 25, 17:29
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I thought that he shouldn't be able to remember that he had any condition if it were solely a result of the head injury. His last memory is of his wife, so I would think that everytime he "resets" he would remember that moment with his wife as having just occured and would be unaware that he had a condition etc.
Great Movie!
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| 56 | Sandlot Donor
ID: 59832108 Tue, Sep 25, 18:40
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wow. great movie
I need to digest this a little. And watch it again. Leonard is a very goofed up dude.
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| 57 | slimer
ID: 578511919 Tue, Sep 25, 19:53
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I rented this movie a couple weeks ago not knowing what it was about at all...must agree, was a good movie.
I just now noticed this thread.
It was a great movie...weird definitely, but very good. I need to watch it again before I read all the "invisible" reviews.
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| 58 | slimer
ID: 578511919 Tue, Sep 25, 19:58
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re: post 3, wasn't it his short-term memory that he didn't have?
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| 59 | Perm Dude Leader
ID: 488481411 Wed, Sep 26, 14:17
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Thought you guys would be interested in the page for this movie from Movie-Mistakes.com:
Memento
pd
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| 60 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 5965479 Wed, Sep 26, 19:16
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Perm Dude: mistake 1.....wrong Leonard spoke to Burt about 5 mins before so he would still have remembered his name. mistake 2....correct we blew it mistake 3...correct we had to move the SUV for security reasons hence the the problem
mistake 4 ......not yet picked up by anybody is that at the end of the film Leonard writes Fact 7 but he would not have remembered that he was up to number 7 in the list of facts.
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| 61 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Fri, Sep 28, 15:45
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Fascinating. coldwater coyotes: I just bought the dvd (after renting it 2 weeks ago), and plan on watching this movie with my wife at my leisure. Kudos to you and your colleauges for making an original, challenging, suspenseful and witty film noir.
- walk
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| 62 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 893160 Fri, Sep 28, 20:37
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Walk: thanks for the kind comments......let me know if you have any questions about the film....and watch out for our next release..Donnie Darko
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| 63 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Mon, Oct 01, 07:48
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Thanks coldwater...I watched the film for a second time this weekend (hope you get some royalties...hah!). I used the pause/step command to clearly see the beautiful wipe of Leonard appearing in the chair inside the sanitarium following the long shot of Sammy Jankis.
I also noticed the typo you pointed out at the end of the film in the tattoo parlor ("1" instead of "I") as well as the funny boo-boo of Leonard being able to drive away from his chase with Dodd, even though Dodd has originally parked his vehicle directly behind Leonard's Jag, blocking his way out.
The end of the film, after Leonard knocks off Jimmy G and shakes the polaroid, and the picture coming into color as the whole scene moves from B&W into color (as pointed out by the Salon magazine writer) is brilliant.
Also, yes, the very end, with Leonard in bed with his wife all tattooed with writings indicated "I've done it," amongst others, does cloud things up to the point of inconclusiveness. This is very different than the clever quick shots of Leonard giving insulin to his wife alternating pinching his wife in the same spot. The latter is quite clever.
I will gladly go out of my way to see your production company's next film, "Donnie Darko," and I could have sworn that I read some good things about it already in Paper Magazine (a NYC-centric pub).
- walk
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| 64 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Mon, Oct 01, 08:05
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Post #39 makes it make sense for me, CC. Leonard has now killed (again...?) the second killer and now can dream of lying down with his wife, back alive, fully knowing he has put to rest his demons and avenged her death.
Thx, I had to re-read this thread, like re-watch the movie to tie it all together!
- walk
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| 65 | patjams
ID: 4971917 Mon, Oct 22, 15:33
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Here's a link to the hidden features on the DVD. Looks like there is a feature to see who Lenny/Sammy actually killed. I'm going to check it out when I get home tonight.
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| 66 | CanEHdian Pride
ID: 426351415 Wed, Oct 24, 2001, 20:33
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Just noticed this thread. Interesting analysis.
I have a question that I just sort of realized upon reflecting on the film (which I saw about a month ago so my facts could be a little hazy)
There is a scene in the movie where Leonard tells Carrie Ann Moss about his past and how he attained all of the money that he has. Now seeing that he attained the money from the drug dealer it seems to me that the story would be one that he in fact made up after the fact to explain his new found wealth. My question is, how does he remember the story that he made up? I'm not sure if this makes sense to you but the question is obviously out there that he has to at least convince himself that the money, car and clothes are his. So he convinces himself that he is a successful business man. Is this true? Or is it an excuse that he comes up with on the spot to hide the fact that the money isn't his? If the latter is true then without a short term memory where does he think the money came from or does he just assume that its his because he doesn't remember it not being his? If that is the truth then the excuse wouldn't be in order? I'm confused.
That whole scene didn't add up for me. Then again I could be mis-remembering it.
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| 67 | silver-n-black
ID: 297382911 Thu, Oct 25, 2001, 09:59
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I'm hooked, and I haven't seen the movie yet. It's now on Pay-Per-View, so I'll order it tonight. Can't wait to read all the hidden stuff in this thread. Web site was very cool.
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| 68 | ChicagoTRS Sustainer
ID: 4324316 Thu, Oct 25, 2001, 10:10
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I was thinking that Leonard would be a very cool unique Halloween Costume. Walk around with a polaroid have notes written on your body and then just play his role at a party only remembering things for five minutes. For people who have seen the movie it would be funny.
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| 69 | Wammie
ID: 20039259 Thu, Oct 25, 2001, 16:20
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That would be a pretty good costume. the number one priority for a good costume is if you can still drink beer in it. and going as leonard has that going for it. plus chicks love to get their picture taken...
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| 70 | patjams
ID: 179152411 Fri, Oct 26, 2001, 11:57
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TRS, just make sure that you are in half way decent shape because what chicks don't want to see are tattoos written all over a sloppy fat, middle aged, beer swilling drunk. (I'm not implying that you are, I'm just telling any guy who falls into that category and is considering going as Leonard that he may want to rethink his costume.) On a side note, I was thinking of going as Sammy Jenkis, but I can't figure out what he looks like. ;o)
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| 71 | Perm Dude Leader
ID: 258492618 Sun, Nov 04, 2001, 12:01
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Just watched this on video last night. Great film! Lots to think over in this one. CC, what was your job in this one?
pd
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| 72 | Blooki
ID: 359321514 Wed, Nov 07, 2001, 17:02
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Don't know if anyone addressed this yet (there's a LOT of material in this thread and I just got here), but I'm anxious to post.
I've seen the movie only twice in the theaters. Actually, the first time I saw it, I missed the first 20 minutes (BIG DEAL) which gave me a very interesting experience because I had to make up alternate endings myself. The second time I saw it, I caught something rather interesting. Did anyone else catch a very brief moment of great interest during the last grayed-out scene flashbacking to Leonard's memories of Sammy Jenkins? (highlight if you've seen the movie) During the scene where Leonard's narration talks about Sammy 'faking' recognition of people because he didn't want his condition to make him look like a freak, at the VERY last moment when the scene changes and you no longer see Sammy for the remainder of the film, a person walks past Sammy in the foreground and you can't see Sammy for a second and when the person is fully past him "I think" I saw Leonard's face, not Sammy's, where Sammy used to be. Was this an intentional clue to tease observant viewers or was I just high? Just wondering if anybody noticed this or if anybody with the DVD could check for me.
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| 73 | WiddleAvi
ID: 531023717 Wed, Nov 07, 2001, 17:23
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This is when Sammy (AKA Leonard) is in the Mental home. I think most people caught that it flashed Leonard's face for a second. That is a big reason why I (and I think most other people) believe that sammy is a figment of Leonard's imagination. In fact Leonard is sammy or Sammy is leonard.
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| 74 | culdeus Donor
ID: 21839313 Wed, Nov 07, 2001, 21:05
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I saw that too and when I had it at home I went slow-mo over that scene. Yup, it's there.
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| 75 | Donkey Hunter
ID: 15634301 Thu, Nov 08, 2001, 06:18
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Hey coldwater, do you have any idea if/when Donnie Darko will be released nationwide? I am looking forward to it soon.
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| 76 | Tertius01
ID: 111049811 Thu, Nov 08, 2001, 11:49
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I think an important thing to remember throughout the film is that through repetition Leonard can still build habit/instinct/"new memories." This helps to resolve many of the seeming plot inconsistancies as Leonard strives toward closure by deluding himself.
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| 77 | Wammie
ID: 32104029 Thu, Nov 08, 2001, 14:02
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He talks about the fact that he can learn through conditioning, like when he says, 'nothing in the drawers, but i will check anyway'
The first time I saw the movie, i was confused. I bought the DVD and have watched it a few times. i think i have it figured out, except the last grey flash back of the whole movie. when is on his way to the tatoo parlor
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| 78 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 5965479 Fri, Nov 09, 2001, 12:25
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Donkey Hunter: we released Donnie Darko in a few major cities two weeks ago, unfortunately it did not perform very well and we will not be expanding to other cities. Where do you live?
Critical review was mixed which did not help. This week's edition of Entertainment Weekly has two very good articles about the film....unfortunately too late.
I was hoping that it would be an attractive alternative halloween themed film to the rather mindless 13 Ghosts and Bones. We only spent about $1 million on advertising rather than the $10 million plus for 13 Ghosts and as a result of this larger investment and with our mixed reviews, 13 Ghosts took most of the halloween business.
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| 79 | Perm Dude Leader
ID: 12943113 Fri, Nov 09, 2001, 12:53
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Too bad, cc. I guess we'll have to look for it in DVD/video, or are you guys going to try to re-package it theatrically?
pd
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| 80 | walk Sustainer
ID: 592181610 Fri, Nov 09, 2001, 14:13
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This thread has had the longest half-life of most any thread ever on these boards. Great memento to your movie, cc.
cc: Yeah, too bad, about donnie darko. I will see this movie for sure when it comes out on DVD (tough to see flicks with small kids and the wifey would not opt for that one when we do land the sitter; my kinda flick though). Paper Magazine, a NYC trendy rag, really loved it, well in advance, IIRC.
Blooki: Yep. I stopped my DVD on that shot of Sammi/Leonard in the sanitarium, and it was Leonard's face that flashes. WiddleAvi has that one covered.
PD: How ya doin'!
- walk
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| 81 | Donkey Hunter
ID: 91024104 Sat, Nov 10, 2001, 04:41
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I go to school in Gainesville, Florida so I was hoping that it would get to Orlando sometime. I stumbled over to donniedarko.com the other day as I wrote you and the website was pretty scary in itself but had me wanting to see the movie more to find out what it was all about.
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| 82 | KevinL Donor
ID: 48721523 Sat, Jan 05, 2002, 12:41
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Memento nominated for Best Picture at the AFI Awards Show tonight.
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| 83 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 571127417 Sat, Jan 05, 2002, 15:36
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Tough competition for best pic....we have a better shot for best screenplay.
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| 84 | Makisupa Donor
ID: 401144218 Sat, Jan 05, 2002, 21:46
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WTG!!!! They just won for best screenplay!!!!!
Congratulations!!
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| 85 | YR
ID: 4813222 Sun, Jan 06, 2002, 11:16
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Here is my opinion on the matter:
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| 86 | rockafellerskank Donor
ID: 359283123 Mon, Jan 07, 2002, 15:05
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Congrats C.C. & crew.
This is the only movie that I have ever watched at a theatre and walked out at the end, walked to the box office and paid again to watch the next showing.
Nice Job. This will be come a cult classic IMO.
rfs
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| 87 | OSU Rules Leader
ID: 15372315 Tue, Jan 15, 2002, 16:49
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I have to add my $0.02. We watched this movie on DVD last night (and I re-watched the ending this morning). It is a great movie, one of the most fascinating movies I have seen. After seeing this thread during the BB season I had been looking forward to see it and I am glad that I did.
There are a lot of great visual clues in this movie and I actually spent some time watching with the sound turned off and that was a great way to catch some of the things I missed the first time.
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| 88 | Makisupa Donor
ID: 401144218 Tue, Feb 12, 2002, 08:41
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Congrats on the Oscar nomination for original screenplay!! Good luck in March!!
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| 89 | KevinL Donor
ID: 10417811 Tue, Feb 12, 2002, 11:12
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And also an Oscar nomination for best editing.
Oscar Nominations
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| 90 | walk Leader
ID: 14154112 Fri, Feb 15, 2002, 09:39
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Ditto from me, CC & co. It must feel great knowing that a product you helped make is so widely liked (by folks like us) AND critically acclaimed. Wonderful news for you and Nolan.
BTW, this flick is in my DVD collection, and I rarely buy them...this movie will last a long time because the more you watch it, the more you learn and go "aha!"
- walk
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| 91 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 330491818 Fri, Feb 15, 2002, 15:34
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Thanks........my daughter is already insisting that she should have my ticket
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| 92 | WiddleAvi
ID: 412522123 Sun, Mar 24, 2002, 02:25
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Congrats again to you guys.....Won best Screen play, Best Director and best Picture in the Independant Film Awards or one of those shows.
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| 93 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 47035511 Sun, Mar 24, 2002, 15:24
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Thanks....we are up for 2 awards tonite
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| 94 | Sludge Sustainer
ID: 24914721 Sun, Mar 24, 2002, 21:23
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Darn. 0-1 for Memento so far. Here's hoping for a 500 batting average.
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| 95 | tommyd
ID: 141052279 Sun, Mar 24, 2002, 23:38
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Still my favorite movie in a long time. And how does Guy Pearce not get nominated for an Oscar? Great movie cc!!!
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| 96 | Makisupa Donor
ID: 401144218 Mon, Mar 25, 2002, 05:49
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Grrrr....robbed!!
If Opie Taylor hadn't won for Director when Altman should have finally been paid the respect he deserves, they wouldn't have been thrown a bone for original screenplay. Gosford was a quality production, but the script pales in comparision to the originality of Memento.
At least that poem reading Aussie boy didn't win for Best Actor. Someday he'll be alienated enough that the only production he'll get work in is a Roman Polanski picture opposite R. Kelly!!
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| 97 | chode
ID: 1810431921 Tue, Mar 26, 2002, 00:47
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I rented Donnie Darko tonight, and liked it a lot. Definitely original and macabre, as advertised.
I especially liked the inclusion of Joy Division's "Love Will Tear Us Apart" on the soundtrack.
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| 98 | walk Leader
ID: 262581610 Tue, Mar 26, 2002, 22:31
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Aaaaaah, Chose. One of my favorite bands, Joy Division. The New Order is nice throwback to JD, if you don't already have.
Sorry you guys did not land an Oscar, cc, but Memento was surely recognized in other ways.
- walk
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| 99 | WiddleAvi
ID: 172372714 Sun, Apr 07, 2002, 20:00
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I just watched Following and liked it alot. I also watched Donnie Darko but did not really like it. Would highly recomend Following.
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| 100 | ksoze Sustainer
ID: 50643419 Fri, Apr 12, 2002, 09:38
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Uh oh, do I even want to know what this is about?
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| 101 | darkside Leader
ID: 516203012 Fri, Apr 12, 2002, 10:18
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Whatever it is, it piqued my interest. I've only seen Memento twice....need to see it again. May wait to buy this DVD.
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| 102 | ScHRiLL
ID: 47453319 Fri, May 03, 2002, 21:12
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After waiting long time I finally watched memento. I come from Macedonia so the movie distributors have limited cash and they rent movies that will sell better and miss memento. When they sow afterwards how popular this film is among the cinema audience they decided to brig it to cinema here. I read about the film a long before I watched it and didn't want to spoil the thrill on some pirate tape taken from a cinema. I waited and it was worth it. My comment : A great film, may be the best I've seen (and I've seen a lot) , bringing a lot of new film-editing technics rarely seen on the big screen, story that is very intrigue, and doesn't let you be bored from watching it because of his inverse showing). You simply don't know what will happen next or should I say what had happen first. I like to watch Donnie darko it theater but as you say I’ll probably be seeing it on dvd. I’ve read a lot of reviews about memento, watched it a couple of times on dvd afterwards as well reading this entire discussion and I like to chat about some things that bothered me. You really pointed some alternatives that I didn't thought about. But still there are things. 1.I think that I have read some where that the tattoo on his hand “remember...” is actually pointed at him but in an inverse way. As Teddy says in one final scene “You really do remember thing that you like to remember” . He could be Sammy. 2. But his wife couldn't be a diabetic because he claims he remembers every thing before the incident and thing like that you don't forget especially if someone like that is your wife/husband etc.. The trick part here is here is the flashes that he gets seeing himself giving an insulin shot to his wife or pinching her. 3. I read upper that he couldn't remember about his wife unless he looked at the tattoos no I think he remembers his wife but isn't sure about her death (as we can see in a scene he is trying to reconstruct the incident “part with the hooker” thus remembering what really happened after he got banged in the wall) and needs to be reminded (the tattoos) about it. The tricky part here is seen his wife alive in flash memories. Overall I think he was in a mental institution he isn't Sammy he didn't kill his wife by overdosing her but in way consider himself responsible for her death and yes this is a game for him. Sorry guys its late and I confused my self even more now .I need time to settle my thoughts . If you like to discuss I be more than happy to do so. Good luck on you new projects guys.
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| 103 | rockafellerskank Sustainer
ID: 24215319 Sat, May 18, 2002, 10:00
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coldwater coyotes:
I see the Memento DVD Limited Edition 2-Disc Set is due out 5/21/02. I've been meaning to buy a copy. Can you outline what additional features the new version contains? I couldn't tell from the desciptions I could find what special features are included above and beyond the standard disc available now.
Thanks (great movie)
rfs ®
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| 104 | Ref
ID: 121135289 Sat, May 18, 2002, 11:40
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I've had the dvd ever since it came out. had to watch it twice to get everything. Have seen it several times now. Very good.
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| 105 | Slackjawed Yokel Sustainer
ID: 668290 Sun, May 19, 2002, 01:49
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here's a link to a good review of the new disc.
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| 106 | coldwater coyotes Leader
ID: 12412198 Sun, May 19, 2002, 08:20
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When we originally released the DVD Chris Nolan couldn't provide us with Director's comments...he was busy on "Insomnia". So this new DVD was planned to come out this year with Nolan's comments. I am sorry that we are going to be charging you "twice" if you want to buy this newer version as well. If the demand is not too high I will send the newer DVD to those who have the first DVD...honor system.....email me.
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| 107 | walk Leader
ID: 262581610 Sun, May 19, 2002, 09:07
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Thx, cc. I just sent you an email. If it's doable, that's a might generous offer you have made. And I most certainly do own the original DVD,
cheers, - walk
P.S. Looking forward to Insomnia mucho.
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| 108 | ksoze Sustainer
ID: 50643419 Sun, May 19, 2002, 10:24
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CC, Thank you for the generous offer, I'd love a copy of the new DVD to go with the original if you're able to do so. Email sent... Mahalo, ksoze
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| 109 | rockafellerskank Sustainer
ID: 24215319 Fri, Jun 14, 2002, 19:01
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Will,
Arrived today. Just wanted to give you a public acknowledgement and thank you for you generous offer.
Best success in the future,
rfs ®
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| 110 | DMAN
ID: 4310482122 Mon, Jul 01, 2002, 00:55
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For those of you with the Limited Edition, there's an 'easter egg' that allows you to watch it in chronological order, here's the link to the instructions.
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| 111 | Ref
ID: 28045169 Wed, Jul 03, 2002, 17:33
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Has anyone seen Insomnia yet? Thinking about seeing it tonight. I've watched Memento probably 10 times. One of the rare DVDs I actually get my money's worth.
What is weird is that sometimes he forgets after a few seconds and other times it's many many minutes.
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| 112 | WiddleAvi
ID: 19611319 Wed, Jul 03, 2002, 19:11
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Insomnia was a letdown in my opinion. It was an o.k. movie but I would not see it again.
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| 113 | ksoze Sustainer
ID: 50643419 Wed, Jul 03, 2002, 23:21
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Ref, Insomnia was decent but a bit of a letdown with regard to suspense... there wasn't a whole lot. Try Donnie Darko if you haven't already. It's a great, well written, well produced confusing flick. Donniedarko.com is a must surf for those who've seen the movie. And there are a lot of deleted scenes on the DVD that, for the sake of the story, really shouldn't have been cut.
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| 114 | WiddleAvi
ID: 19611319 Thu, Jul 04, 2002, 06:34
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I think I mentioned this before but Following, also directed by Nolan, was a great movie. Out on video now.
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| 115 | KrazyKoalaBears Donor
ID: 266182910 Sat, Jul 27, 2002, 22:53
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WOW! Unbelievable! I just saw this movie on Starz tonight and was blown away. Just read through this post -- which I forced myself not to do until I saw the much talked about movie -- and am still amazed by the movie. So here's a couple of thoughts (highlight as before): 1. The gun Leonard had at the attack and the gun that Dodd had were the same gun. This lends you to believe that Dodd is the 2nd guy. 2. I think Leonard is Sammy Jankins and Leonard killed his wife through an insulin overdose, who survived the attack. The tatoo "Remember Sammy Jankins" is Leonard's way of putting the thought of killing his wife into another story that happend before the incident. Remember that the story of Sammy Jankins is that the condition is mental, not physical. This means that he CAN have memories. I think if he mentally chooses to remember something as happening before the incident, then he will and he'll remember it. The tatoo also reminds Leonard that being careless about his memory could lead to bad things. 3. Natalie was not surprised that it was NOT Jimmy in the Jag when Leonard pulled up to the bar also decked out in Jimmy's clothes. She refers to him as "The Memory Man" in the bar. This lends itself to mean that Natalie knew Jimmy was going to be killed, specifically by Leonard. So does this mean that Teddy set this up somehow and used Leonard as a pawn in his plan to get rid of the drug dealer and take the $200k? I think so. After the killing, Teddy is constantly around Leonard, specifically around the car -- and the money. 4. Because Teddy used Leonard to kill Jimmy, Natalie decided to use Leonard to kill Teddy as revenge. She knew about the tatoo's and knew all the details of Teddy and knew they matched up. Now there's a part in here where Leonard is being played, but he's also already chosen this path when he writes down Fact 6 after killing Jimmy. I think Natalie is just pushing Leonard along. She may actually be a pawn from Dodd who has put her into all this to keep Leonard away from him and pointed towards Teddy. 5. I think Leonard remembers the basement the way he remembers Sammy Jankins. Same type of situation. Something he wants to forget, yet can't completely forget. He tries to burn the picture, but he doesn't fully burn in and actually keeps it. 6. In the end, I'm not sure I know what I'm talking about because my mind is still spinning from this movie. All in all, I think Teddy played Leonard to kill Jimmy and it got turned back on him through Natalie, and Dodd, when the whole time he should have been tracking down Dodd. Or something. ;)
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| 116 | rockafellerskank Sustainer
ID: 456181014 Mon, Jul 29, 2002, 08:57
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Since KKB, brought up Dodd---
What bothers me more than any thing is, why would Dodd (a hired killer?) just leave town after getting roughed up? Why would he not re-group and come back after the $200K/Sammy/drugs/revenge? Surely a tough guy ike that isn't going back to his employer and say "memory man hit me in the nose so I gave up."
Perhaps KKB's assumpion about Dodd is right in #1?
KKB, I believe that gun #1 was a revolver and Dodd's gun was a 9MM type (not sure what you call that type, Glock? ) No?
rfs ®
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| 117 | KrazyKoalaBears Donor
ID: 266182910 Mon, Jul 29, 2002, 09:17
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rfs, highlight as before... From what I can remember -- I missed watching it again last night -- both guns were a 9mm type. The revolver you're thinking about is the one that Leonard used to kill Jimmy, Natalie's boyfriend. He killed Jimmy, had the argument with Teddy, then emptied the revolver in the truck and drove away in the Jag. These are the shells in the truck that he handles when he comes back to kill Teddy. IIRC, both times Leonard handled the 9mm type silver gun, he loaded it in the handle the same way, suggesting a familiarity with it. Plus, when he found the gun in the hotel room, he wasn't surprised and wondering why it was there. He was just kind of ok with it, again suggesting familiarity with it. The point you bring up about Dodd just leaving town leads me to believe that he was setting up the plan to get Leonard to believe that Teddy was THE John G. In other words, if he hangs around too much, Leonard will think about him and wonder who he is. He knows that if he just leaves, then Leonard will completely forget about him because of the lack of memory and because Natalie will be pushing Leonard towards Teddy. Still need to see this again to even begin to understand it. ;)
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| 118 | Baldwin
ID: 6920139 Mon, Oct 13, 2003, 19:21
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Consider me your biggest Donnie Darko fan. I believe everyone involved with that fiolm will look back on it as their most important film. Great casting. Great use of sound and music.
I liked this review. I'm still chewing on the meaning of Frank.
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| 119 | Myboyjack Leader
ID: 21556266 Mon, Oct 13, 2003, 20:12
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Baldwin, according to the director's commentary on the DVD, Frank was simply the medium chosen by God or the aliens or whoever it was that wanted to get the message to Donnie so that he could right whatever it was that went wrong in time. "Frank" was a vehicle I'd say comparable to the burning bush or the talking ass.
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| 120 | Baldwin
ID: 6920139 Mon, Oct 13, 2003, 20:31
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My problem with just leaving it at that is that there were numerous further clues as to his identity. Frank's father's name is also Frank. I believe Donnie's father refer's to another Frank who died around the time of his prom who I am guessing was Sparrow's date and mate in their tangent universe. Donnie's father points out that Donnie [in the universe where Donnie survives] could have turned out just like his Frank who died around the time of Sparrow's prom. Frank remembers echoes of incidents in the tangent universe as he feels his eye afterward. Frank is Donnie's sister's date.
With all that material it's hard to ignore it all and just relegate him to faceless, storyless burning bush status.
It even occurred to me that one true receiver might hand off to or benefit another true receiver. "I'll pay the price this time and you redeem me next time."
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| 121 | Myboyjack Leader
ID: 21556266 Mon, Oct 13, 2003, 20:34
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Yes there are those references and lots more; lots of references to bunnies and bunny suits. Just subliminal preparation, I think.
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| 122 | coldwater coyotes SuperDude
ID: 33742418 Tue, Oct 14, 2003, 00:54
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We are presently considering re-releasing Donnie Darko next March/April. It will be the Director's cut plus additional music. Scenes to be put back in the Director's Cut include: We find out that Donnie is taking placebo drugs...further evidence that Donnie is not a crazy schizo but is being guided by an external force. Additional scenes between Donnie and his Dad. The visit of Gretchen and Donnie to Grandma Sparrow. This scene explains why they did not visit her in the present version of the film to try and get additional info.
I haven't followed all the comments above. I assume that people have picked up that Frank is Donnie's sister's boyfriend.
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| 123 | Landon
ID: 170523113 Sat, Jan 31, 2004, 14:52
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WTF IS IT PEOPLE? I hear sammy 'jankis' 'jenkins' 'jenkis' be consistent already.
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| 124 | rockafellerskank Leader
ID: 27652109 Sun, Feb 01, 2004, 17:09
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Sammy Jankis. Which would have been very easy to find by clicking on the link in the opening post.
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| 125 | DMAN
ID: 333161412 Wed, Apr 21, 2004, 12:51
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Darko is being re-released w/ an additional 20 minutes of footage, as well as new music and visual effects. link
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