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Subject: Gurupie 20 - 2015 Regular Season Discussion

Posted by: Species - [42011619] Wed, Apr 01, 2015, 16:53

It's a few days before Opening Day! With the annual 'Tosh has commish powers?' sighting (thanks Tosh for re-entering the draft!), we now should have our keepers/draft/callups all entered, waivers have been turned on and the regular season is now open for business!!

Feel free to post your trade needs, trash talk, projections, predictions, rankings, steals of the draft, reaches of the draft (cough....Fowler), etc!!

blue hen needs to be knocked off his perch!!! Let's do this!

Toral
Leader
ID: 2111201313
Wed, Apr 01, 2015, 17:11

blue hen needs to be knocked off his perch!!! Let's do this!

I don't think it's appropriate for a commisioner to say this.

I think it's all non-commishes in the league who should be saying this.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Thu, Apr 02, 2015, 13:22

Ok then, as a non commish, I will second Toral's statement, but the only way we can slow him down is to limit all those transactions...maybe only one per day?

blue hen
ID: 01052416
Thu, Apr 02, 2015, 13:53

While I find Species to be one of the most unbiased commishes there is, I am quite comfortable with that comment. After all, he appears to be the #1 contender.

Pretty sure it's a bad idea to limit transactions. If you really want to make this league less active, I'd say it's acceptable to decrease slot limits and inning limits. But I don't condone it. And I don't remember it ever coming up for discussion, except for a few token mentions in September, by managers who were too busy to approach the limits during the other months.

I quite enjoy this perch.

Slizz
ID: 53015288
Thu, Apr 02, 2015, 19:38

Agree with BH, I have zero problems with what Species posted. I also think Toral was half joking...just because everyone should want that #1 spot.

Re: Judy - absolutely not. That would be the beginning of the demise of G20. Every owner has the same opportunity to make moves like BH. Not his fault some owners choose not to take advantage of it like him.

BH tries his hardest to meet the positional limits we have in this league. For example, if you only use 150/162 games, that's 12 games of production you left on the table. Now, multiply that across all positions and it's almost two seasons worth of a players production, and lots of points at stake.

Annual draft diary is done (and has been done). Just need to audit the results of the projections and will post when I have time.

R9
ID: 11320220
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 00:47

My projections have me finishing first. I didn't bother to enter anyone else's teams in, I'm pretty sure I got this thing locked up. Verlander's going to lead my staff and Cargo is going to smash his way to the NLMVP!

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 09:42

R9 and WG: You still owe dues. Deadline was April 1. Several notices have been sent out. Please settle up.

Everyone else has either paid or has made arrangements to pay (e.g, the check's in the mail.)

Species
ID: 54740122
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 12:28

Toral was kidding. I say something like that every year!!!

Opening Day is near! I have 3 starters going, two with blue hen connections:

Hughes vs Price
Buchholz vs bh's lame-ass Phillies
Felix vs. the Angels

SOOOOOOO ready for Opening Day!!

Bean
ID: 14147911
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 12:49

<4>For example, if you only use 150/162 games, that's 12 games of production you left on the table.

Isn't games played limit 170 per position? That said, its even more vital to have good player rotation to compete in counting stats for hitters. Why would you set a limit of 170 games then limit everyone's ability to use them?

Species
ID: 57329123
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 14:44

Post 2, Post 8: Our rules are our rules. blue hen quite skillfully works within our rules.....he should be applauded for his diligence, not restrained because of it. I agree with Bean -- if we do not want that type of league, we need to change our rules.

Ref could speak to this I'm sure, but the point of having such a high games played limit is to encourage some player rotation, waiver wire pickups, etc.

GO
ID: 432341310
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 16:27

It adds another strategy option.

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 20:30

I got ahead of myself calling up Gray. He was promptly rocked the next day. Sending him back to the minors.

Species
ID: 57329123
Fri, Apr 03, 2015, 21:12

LOL. That does count as a call up and send-down. Gray has one more.

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 13:54

Are we free to pick up free agents now?

WG
ID: 552431321
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 14:26

Aaron Sanchez is my prospect that I called up.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 15:54

Correct, Tosh needs to drop him. You forfeited your last pick to keep him, so presumably you need to drop that guy (I think it's Stubbs) as well.

Tosh
ID: 3822913
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 16:03

He was not added to the roster when I re-entered the draft because it showed your team as having 23 players in draftime. I only went back to the prospect thread if a team roster did not equal 23. Took enough time as it was.

Shoot me a trade offer with that last pick and I can trade him to you. Then we'll both be at 23 again.

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 17:10

<13> Ahem, a little help for the new guy please.

ARE WE FREE TO PICK UP FREE AGENTS NOW???

Species
ID: 54740122
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 17:24

17: YES

Just remain on the lookout for prospects on our prospect list. They will continue to show as ESPN free agents until called up.

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 17:27

thanks

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 20:18

Bean, in this league we have a special rule. New managers aren't allowed to pick up free agents until June 15. Enjoy!

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 20:33

OK, OK pick on the new guy.....guess I have to make the coffee too.....how many scoops per pot? How come my chair only has three casters?

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 23:56

We have to make sure that guys who have called up prospects don't end up using their forfeited picks.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sat, Apr 04, 2015, 23:59

21: Bean, last year I was at a game at Wrigley and watched Joc Pederson walk out of the ballpark in uniform and go down the street to get coffee for several teammates. He only had a media guy or someone like that with him. Now that is hazing.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 18:46

Whoa. Kimbrel to SD. Maybe the Phillies won't be last...

Nerfherders
ID: 2211442615
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 20:09

Wow shocker. I'm going to miss Kimbrel. Grilli looking like a great pick, suddenly.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 21:06

Who has put a logo on their team page. I get nothing when I put the URL in the space except good job judy (I'm joking...). Logo doesn't even have the gray hat anymore!

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 21:38

Try a different image? Maybe you tried to upload a BMP, which couldn't be handled.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 23:05

Bmp?

Toral
Leader
ID: 2111201313
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 23:19

Had no luck with a logo myself.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Sun, Apr 05, 2015, 23:27

BMP

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Mon, Apr 06, 2015, 00:17

Mobile app wish list:
-Show pitching matchup and if they are a righty or left.
-Sortables with our league stats(does anyone give care about their PR7?).

Super excited for the start of the season!

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Apr 06, 2015, 00:44

After one game, we have a 3-way tie at the top: Pete, Ref, and Jaydog. In last place? Species.

Cameron Maybin is available for a mid-level pick.

But seriously - good luck this season!

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Mon, Apr 06, 2015, 03:27

I called up my prospect Michael Taylor for this first and hopefully last time.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Mon, Apr 06, 2015, 10:26

32: I have a half game lead. Don't cheat me. I might need that in the end! Just think if I was able to keep Holliday. He is a masher. I have regretted dropping him since I hit Post Now!. Hope my other guys I kept over him can make me forget about it.

mjd
Dude
ID: 501381415
Mon, Apr 06, 2015, 10:59

I'm calling up Dalton Pompey for the first time.

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 05:00

summary after 1 game:
2 injuries: Ryan Braun is my 3rd outfielder that seems to go on DL. John Jaso looks like he can avoid the DL, but not much is known right now other than he will be out for a few games. whoever at ESPN that sees Odubel Herrera as a SS and not as a OF: Thank you for nothing!

this will be a long season and the probability of winning it already went way down after 1 game. not that it was high 2 days ago.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 10:08

Standings after one day, for the lazy:

Bean 162
BH 137.5
Species 137
Nerf 133
Darkside 128
Ref 120

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 10:41

I need to relish this while it still real, strike while the fire's hot, so....

I'm in first and you're not....neah...neah-neah, neah...neah-neaaaaaah.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 11:15

Lohse destroyed my huge lead. Thing with Lohse is that he's always so steady. Ooops!

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 16:41

Species' Draft Recap:

Preamble -- preparation for this draft started roughly in the middle of my 2012 season. My aging team (including VMart, Arod, Teixeira, Rivera, etc.) was floundering after 2 titles, and in going with the Ricky Bobby theory (from the Will Farrell Talladega Nights movie) I decided....if I didn't have a chance to finish first, I might as well be last. This spawned numerous trades in a multi-year rebuilding mode....and eventually engendered a new rule in my honor, from which no draft pick trades may be made more than 2 drafts into the future. By then the damage had already been done, and I had a treasure trove of early picks in this draft.

Keepers and preseason ballyhoo -- I had a solid 9 keepers planned since the end of last season. Well....deGrom kind of forced himself in as my 9th based upon his finish and based upon the advanced stats and scouting observations on him during the winter. Sadly I am too attached to my players and likely missed opportunities to improve due to stubbornness. I'm sure I could have acquired a solid closer....but them deGrom would have to go....PLUS the cost of acquisition.....so I got self-paralyzed into doing nothing. I regret not jumping on WG's interest in trading Adam Jones....even if I had to sweeten the pot to make my offer better than Lester. But I digress.

Draft -- I had something ridiculous like 10 picks in the first 7 rounds. I wanted to trade down.....specifically to get picks for 2016...but got no nibbles. So I took the opposite tack and tried to trade up... offering 8 to 10 rounds of value in exchange for 2 rounds higher in the draft. Nobody bit on a 1st, but GL traded down so I got an extra 2nd for a 4, 5 and 6. That 5th and 6th for me were like my 8th and 9th picks....so it made sense. That was huge for me, as it added a lot of flexibility.

When GL traded up to 1.03 I celebrated. With 5 pitchers already on his roster, with obvious choices of Holliday and Victor available, I figured he would pass on Carlos Carrasco. Oooops. That sent me scrambling and I eventually took Phil Hughes. Hope that turnaround sticks!

Toronto naming Cecil really helped. Cecil's peripherals rock. Outside of being left handed, there is nothing to say he won't be successful as closer....so he was my other 1st rounder. I actually had Brett Gardner queued up in that spot all weekend. THANK YOU bmd for taking your time....it convinced me that I could afford to let Gardner go ... and sure enough I got him in rd 2! That was huge for me....I got a top of the order guys with double digit power and 25 sb potential. I then rolled the dice at 2.10 on Addison Reed as closer.....with my 4th overall pick and 2 more 3rd rounders to come, I felt it was worth a shot.

It was after that where my plans went awry. I felt with my pick depth I could fill key spots with my first 5 picks (thru 3.01) and be ready to jump on the high K/9 relievers who could fall into closeling roles. That went out the window as Miller was gone at 2.19 and Boxberger at 3.02. I did get what I felt was a steal at 3.01 in Melky Cabrera: a decent obp bat hitting 2nd in front of Abreu and Laroche seemed pretty good to me for OF and (since my dh qualifies at 1b/3b) corner infield depth.

After getting sworn at in text/chat for nabbing stud-in-waiting James Paxton at 4.06, I nabbed Soria (goes back to my high-K, good ratio setup men strategy) then Valbuena in round 5. I like Valbuena at 2b hitting in Houston (he hit 3rd on Opening Day! Booo yeah).

For my late picks I snagged CHW 2b speedster Micah Johnson and got lucky he won the job to provide sb options. I took a flier on an Opening Day starter in Buchholz in rd 8 (if only he could face the Phillies every day) before taking closer fliers in the final rounds.

Great picks I liked: Hutchison (bh 2.20), Pearce (Ref 4.19) Pagan (Nerf 6.12), B. Anderson (Ref 10.19), Stubbs (WG 10.20), (Hamilton bh 11.17), Roark (Guru 12.18), de Aza (Ref 13.19).

I give Ref high marks for his draft....a lot of great value. He will be tough. I thought Pete had a nice draft as well.

blue hen rightfully is the one to beat, but many of us will be hot on his tail. He and I both have a lot of ammo to trade....will be interesting to see which one of us blinks first.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 16:55

Nice, Species wins the diary contest. Hopefully that means he'll falter in, you know, fantasy baseball.

Would love to see Jaydog's draft thoughts - his RIBC one was amazing.

And eager to hear Bean's thoughts, but that's mostly because he's so knew that we don't know what to expect from him. Last time that happened, Yokel's old team won the whole freaking thing.

slizz
ID: 335717
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 18:09

2015 TEAM SLIZZ DRAFT DIARY - PART 1

Whoohoo!!! 2015 is finally here! As a Chicago Bears fan, the months of January and February have not been kind to me. There is much downtime, and my interest in the game only extends to the actual playoff games themselves. Beyond that, I move into full-out baseball mode. I know, I know, one can always watch regular season hockey and basketball...but I find both to be quite boring as most teams just go through the motions until the playoffs. Without further ado, here is my 2015 Draft Diary:

KEEPERS & TRADES

Getting down to nine keepers can be quite the issue when one actually has an abundance of keeper-quality players:

MUST KEEP:

1B - Eric Hosmer
2B - Anthony Rendon
3B - Nolan Arenado
SP - Jon Lester
SP - Jose Fernandez

No long-winded analysis needed on these folks. Its a 20 team league and these are all fine keepers.

SHOULD BE KEPT:

OF - Rusney Castillo: I feel hes worth it based on hype. I know what i'm getting with the rest of my guys...this guy has potential to be a 15 HR bat with the possibility of 30 plus stolen bases. That would make him close to a Top 50 player in our format, even if his OB% is only in the .330's.

OF - Marcell Ozuna: Just turned 24, was a top 60 player last season in ESPN leagues and should do at least the same.

DH - Chris Carter: If it wasn't for his DH-only to start the seaon, he would be a "must keep". No bat did more damage in the second half than Carter.

RP - Addison Reed: Saves, but he flat out STINKS. Is it worth wasting a spot on a quality player / keeper long term given how fluid bullpen situations are league-wide?

COULD BE KEPT:

SS/OF - Danny Santana: As i've posted above, Santana has the potential to pull a Jose Reyes-like season off. Will he return to his rookie year form? I dk, but one could do alot worse at SS than Santana considering a ADP in the 130's. I'm really going out on a limb here, but my guess is that Santana gets selected in the S-Draft 1st round.

OF - Avisail Garcia: My sleeper I want to get in my re-draft leagues.

OF - Oswaldo Arcia: Power is a valued commodity and this guy has lots of it. Just turned 23 and I think the future is very bright for him. In only 415 AB's he hit 20 home runs at the ripe age of 22. Without any improvement in skillset, this guy is a 30 HR bat if he plays at least 150 games.

SP - Kevin Gausman: 99 mph fastball (out of the pen) and 4 pitch arsenal. Possible cy-young candidate, just not sure if its this year.

SP - Marcus Stroman: Went from afterthought to keeper quality after seeing how awesome he was (scroll down for further analysis)

SP - Michael Pineda: Solid starter who will fill the stat sheet and should stabilize a team's WHIP.

15 keeper-quality players for 9 spots. Looking over that roster, I said to myself "Gotta get moving and try to find fits for some of these guys".

TRADES:

Avisail Garcia: Had exchanged emails early on with Judy to see what direction she wanted to go with her team. She knew she was devoid of keeper-quality talent and didn't want to give up the farm to get someone. She basically described that she wanted Avisail Garcia (someone who is young and with upside) and had expressed a lot of interest in Chris Carter. We went over her projected 2015 and 2016 keepers and, at that point, felt that Garcia was the best fit for her roster. Like her, I believe Garcia will have a top 100 type of season should he stays healthy. Worst case, you've got a guy who steals a bag every 11 or so games which will put him in the double digits. Also, hitting in the middle of a whitesox lineup will get him RBI's and at least 20 home runs. Who wouldn't want to keep that?

I originally planned on taking Garcia with my pick at 2.14, but didn't think he would be there for me to take in the second round, so I felt it was better for me to trade him to someone who will appreciate and value his services while being compensated in the meantime.

Jon Lester for Adam Jones: I never publicly advertised Jon Lester as a guy I was serious about trading. I sent email feelers to a couple teams that were in contention about acquiring him, and what they were interested in giving up for him. Amit (WG), has been trying to do just about anything to get a front-line starter. He didn't feel comfortable going into the season with Gio Gonzalez as his #2 and had a glut of outfielders to offer.

We originally discussed Ellsbury for Lester straight up as he had 4 outfielders and I felt I could get by with Gausman as my other pitcher kept. The only thing holding me back is that a move like that would now give me 4 outfielders worth keeping. So I passed. A week or so went by and he traded Andrus for Dahl. Amit could not afford to lose Ellsbury's speed, so I thought I was going into the season with Lester as my anchor.

Amit approached me and said he was thinking about offering Adam Jones for an inferior pitcher in comparison to Lester straight up. I didn't want to see Adam Jones, a top 30 player in our format, go for a guy who might make the top 100, so I had a decision to make: Lester for Adam Jones. Figured, Jones is going to repeat his performance from the last 3 years as he's still in his prime and I could use the hitting. Amit gets a frontline starter that he desperately needs...win/win.

This created a problem for me as now I had 4 outfielders that I would want to keep plus Chris Carter. Now, I didn't worry about trading Carter as there was a market for his services. For Carter, it was about timing when to trade him...

I made a bet that I could trade Ozuna so I could clear the way to keep Oswaldo Arcia, and didn't think it would be an issue given his age and top 60 performance last season.

Chris Carter and Marcell Ozuna for picks: I sent out a couple emails about Ozuna and had 2 bites. One was Judy who felt that she could upgrade Cozart and Asdrubal Cabrera (borderline keeper, if that) to two must-keeps. I knew she was willing to pay for Carter, but what was she willing to give up to get Ozuna?

I proposed my terms that I wished to get up in the lottery in both drafts. Judy had no problem with the prospect draft lottery swap as she planned on taking a pitcher and this is arguably the deepest prospect draft in years. However, she was apprehensive about about s-draft. We eventually came to an agreement which gives her a very young core that could surprise people this year and come 2016 will be another in contention if things break right.

How does this improve me?

I think Carter is going to be awesome and get at least 35 home runs. I also think Oswaldo Arcia is going to do roughly the same thing and is almost 6 years his junior.

Oswaldo Arcia - Cheap Source of Power

Its a massive bet on my part because I'm giving up a virtual lock for 35 home runs in 2015 for a guy who could hit that, or fall flat on his face in Arcia.

Ozuna she got cheap...lets face it, I could have extracted more value for him, but I wasn't getting two (2) lotto tickets anywhere else. Judy's picks give me odds to get a solid closer (which I need because I have no plans of keeping Addison Reed), and a shot at Yoan Moncada. Moncada isn't falling to 14, and if I don't get Moncada, it was a waste of Ozuna's value because this draft is DEEP. One could argue that you could get the same caliber of player at 13/14 that you would at 4/7 (This would prove to be true as I would've been quite comfortable with Mazara instead of Judge).

3 down, 1 definitely throwing back, 2 to go.

1B - Hosmer
2B - Rendon
3B - Arenado
OF - Jones
OF - Castillo
OF - Arcia
SP - Jose.
SP - Stroman
SP - Gausman

Throwing back Addison Reed and keeping Michael Pineda around as insurance (which proved to be valuable in light of Stroman's ACL injury) in case one of my arms gets injured leaving Santana as the only "keeper quality" player cut.

In order for me to contend, I need a lot to go right for me:

-Eric Hosmer needs to have at least an .800 OPS like he did in 2013 accompanied by 10 stolen bases. If he can do that, I will be in good shape at the position going forward.

-Arenado needs to just play all season. As per Razzball: The most important thing for drafting is drafting for the upcoming year and not drafting for what players just did. It sounds simple, and it is, but it still trips up people. You want guys that are trending up. As I go through the laundry list of great attributes Arenado possesses, keep in mind he’s only going to be 24 years old. First, he was a great prospect. Everyone loved him in the minors. He hit .388 one year, .298 another year, .364 another… Pretty much he was the bee’s knees and toes, knees and toes, knees and toes. Second, he doesn’t strike out. For guys with at least 18 homers, there was only five guys with a better strikeout rate. A who’s who of older players who know what the hell they are doing: V-Mart, Brantley, Pujols, Posey, Beltre. Third, there’s no third. Fourth, as you’ll see when I go over the top 20 3rd basemen, the position is a joke. Fifth, his batted ball profile added more fly balls and they went a further distance. That sounds like a nice way to say, “He will hit more home runs this year,” and it is. Sixth, he didn’t sacrifice batting average for power. He only had a .298 BABIP (about neutral luck) and he hit .287.

-Rusney Castillo needs to be the star I hope he can be.

-Oswaldo Arcia needs to hit 30 home runs

-Kevin Gausman - The guy has top of the rotation stuff and I think he could be that cy-young caliber pitcher. Would I rather keep Addison Reed and risk him losing the closers job or a guy who could be a #1 starter in the MLB?

Obviously, I'm choosing the latter.

-Marcus Stroman needs to show last season wasn't a fluke. I wasn't even thinking about keeping him until I saw his name popping up in the top 30 just about everywhere:

Marcus Stroman / Roy Hallady?

Other than rotowire, he seems like a safe bet to beat his projections.

I'm quite confident that Hosmer, Arenado, Arcia, and Stroman do just that...Will Rusney and Gausman follow?

***EDITORS NOTE*** I wrote this approximately one (1) month before he tore his ACL. Ugh. That Stroman injury made me sad and forced me to keep Pineda. Its a huge loss for my team and a bigger loss for baseball fans worldwide. Pineda is no Stroman, but if he can give me 150-170 innings, he should be a must own in fantasy.

PROSPECT DRAFT

Once Keith Law releases his annual top 100 list, its time to start full-out prep work for the draft. As stated above, I made the trade of Ozuna for a shot at drafting Moncada. Given that I lost the lottery and was picking 5th, there was no way Moncada would fall to me thus making the Ozuna trade a complete and total bust. Judy now has a potential star and I have what I would've had if I didn't make a trade.

Since I believe in full transparency, here is my "Top 20" prospect list in the event I traded back in to the draft:

1) Yoan Moncada - Think Ian Desmond OB% / Power Combo, 2B eligibilty, and maybe 30 SB. Awesome Prospect
2) Aaron Judge - See Below
3) Nomar Mazara - Tried to move back in the 1st and get him. Nice pick, Toral!
4) Kyle Schwarber - Power (see a trend here)
5) Blake Swihart - Top 20 prospect universally (Law, Baseball Prospectus, MLB, etc). Swihart is likely better in real life then fantasy baseball. However, he has an extremely high floor and will be a superb addition to any team.
6) Jesse Winker - Best pure hitter in the minor league and should have a .400+ on base % in the majors. Sure he won't hit 20 home runs regularly, but will be a solid cog in the middle of the Reds lineup.
7) Carlos Rodon - no explanation needed.
8) Robert Stephenson - Awesome raw stuff. Still has the potential to be a front-line starter
9) Yasmany Tomas - buying on potential. great power, but is he going to be a stud? His value slips should he be OF-only
10) Alex Jackson - best raw stuff in the rule 4 draft. Could vault himself into a universal top 10 prospect next season after a year in the minors.
11) Hunter Harvey - solid starter with front-line potential
12) Dalton Pompey - ready now and can steal bases
13) Tyler Kolek - 103 mph on the gun with little to no effort. If he can develop secondary offerings, this guy will be a star. More potential than Giolito due to his elite fastball.
14) Daniel Norris - Ready now and gives a team a 10th keeper for this year, but will likely exhaust his prospect eligibility for 2016.
15) Henry Owens - Solid starter, possible #2 in the show.
16) Rafael Devers - Got a big bonus and could be a 25-30 HR guy who gets on base in his prime....key word, Could.
17) Steven Souza - Ready now
18) Josh Bell - First base pipeline is extremely thin. After him you have Greg Bird who is good but yet to flash power potential.
19) Nick Gordon - Raw and has a better hit tool than Dee, but slightly less speed. Obviously a must own in fantasy, but 3-4 years out.
20) Braden Shipley - starter who is ready now, but won't be called up till super two. Has a good chance to be under 110 IP making him eligible as a 10th keep next season.

If you noticed, every one of those players was drafted.

1.05 - Aaron Judge, OF, NYY This is more of a hunch type pick. He is big, athletic, gets on base, and is the closest thing to Giancarlo Stanton in the minor leagues. Yes (for you Moneyball readers), I am selling jeans with this pick.

Stanton is 6'6, Judge is 6'7 and both have that raw power where routine fly balls can go 400 feet. I'm hoping he can continue on his trajectory of playing in the Bronx sometime in 2016. #23 on Keith Law's Top 100 List and possesses raw power (notice a trend?) like no other. He should be a perennial bet for 30 home runs, even with a compact stroke, thus making him a must own in today's power-devoid game. If Judge fulfills his potential and continues on the path that he's on, I will get a 10th keeper next season and someone who could be a perennial all-star for years to come. If he fails to develop, I whiffed and will monitor Mazara as a comparison.

Takeaways from the Prospect Draft

-Blue Hen. Blue Hen. Blue Hen. The rich keep getting richer. He gets Moncada, Schwarber, Devers and Kolek to go along with stud-prospect Joey Gallo. Sure, he will have to sell two, maybe three of them to get in compliance with the 2016 prospect draft should he want to have a selection. However, he should have no shortage of suitors lining up to get one of those 5.

-The lack of Rule 4 draftees taken in favor of more known commodities. Kolek, Gordon, & Jackson are lottery tickets that could make or break a teams farm system.

-Ref extracting value from late picks. His selections are never sexy, but boy are they effective. Winker will be up and likely a staple of his team for years to come and Shipley is #19 on Keith Law's top 100. Ref could go into 2016 with 3 prospect picks, and 12 keepers!!!

-The knowledge of all 20 owners. Everyone I spoke to was extremely knowledgeable of all prospects. There is no fooling anybody.

SUPPLEMENTAL DRAFT

When I made the Ozuna trade with Judy, I knew I would be able to get a closer at 1.04-ish that was of decent quality. I put Jake McGee atop my board and sent feeler emails to non-G20 owners to see what their thoughts were on the projected Free Agent closer market. The consensus was "If Britton is there, grab him". So, I re-adjusted the board to include the following names at 1.04:

Britton, Uehara, McGee, Mejia

Sure, I could've got 1.07 in the draft lottery, but chances are 4 closers won't be selected in the first 7 picks. Once Ref traded away Uehara / Casilla and BH kept Britton, I was left with the dregs prompting me to change my mind on who to take at 4. I sent Toral a quick email to see if he would trade Mejia to me and he thought I asked about Lawrie and the deadline soon passed. I then set my focus on Carlos Carrasco as he finished 2014 strong and is primed for a quality year based on his finish.

The lottery was ran and I got the #3 pick and was faced with two choices (Pete informed me he was going with Holliday):

McGee or Carrasco. Had BMD not spent two (2) days monitoring the health of Victor Martinez's knee, I would've selected Carrasco at #3. The more time went by, the more I looked for reasons not to take him. For whatever reason, I got cold feet as I don't think last seasons' 10 game stretch is sustainable over 150+ innings. I offered to trade down in the draft and Goatlocker offered me a fair deal and I jumped on it. Figured I would still get one of my targets at #10 and it got me a valuable 4th rd pick.

As I stated the past two seasons of doing the diary, I try to script the first 5 rounds as the picks generally comparable to mock drafts. After the 5th, the goal is to find value and see what sticks.

S-Draft Targets:

1.10 - Carlos Carrasco, Jake McGee, Jenrry Mejia
2.14 - Jose Quintana, Drew Pomeranz, Trevor Bauer
3.14 - Drew Pomeranz, Trevor Bauer, Justin Verlander, James Paxton,
Drew Hutchinson
4.01 - Trevor Bauer, James Paxton, Drew Hutchinson, Wade Davis
4.04 - Wade Davis, James Paxton, Drew Hutchinson
4.14 - Marcus Semien, Chris Owings, Asdrubal Cabrera,
5.14 - Mark Teixeria, Ryan Howard

Why did I target pitcher heavy early on?

I have six (6) position players and three (3) starting pitchers. I absolutely needed a closer, really loved McGee, and didn't want to be in a position where I might not get him. For 2015, I have 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and the outfield covered by my keepers, so it was really about finding a SS and utility player. I felt I could wait on SS until the 4th where I would likely choose from the above list and maximize my value with those guys.

1.10 - Jake McGee, RP, TB: As per Baseball Prospectus "He's been the Ray's best reliever even though the save opportunities went elsewhere". McGee has struck out more than 10k/9 and his fastball is consistently in the 95mph range. He added a curve giving him yet another punch out hit and there is no reason to think that he can't do this for a few more years.

2.14 - Jose Quintana, SP, CHW: Quintana was a 4 win pitcher last season and is projected to be the 20th most valuable pitcher in baseball this season as per Baseball Prospectus. He will eat 200 innings, provide a ratio of 8k/9, and is going to feast on other teams as the #3 starter for the White Sox.

3.14 - Drew "Pom Pom" Pomeranz, SP, OAK: Honestly wanted Marcus Semien here. I needed a SS and since he had multiple position eligibility, I figured Semien was going to get taken before 4.01 based on team needs behind me. Was willing to deviate from my board to get Semien but jaydog stole him from me! (Was later told by Pete if I chose Semien, he was going with either Pom Pom or Bauer at 4.02).

Plucked this gem late in the 2014 draft and stupidly threw him in a deal with Pete for Hosmer. Honestly, I would've kept him over Pineda if he was still on my team. Been superb in Spring Training generating 15 strikeouts in 12 innings work and looks to have picked up where he left off last season.

4.01 - Trevor Bauer, SP, CLE: Had a feeling he would fall to the late 3rd/ Early 4th round, which was part of the reason I wanted to trade down. Bauer's problem isn't his stuff, its the 8 inches between his ears. He offers a 8 pitch repertoire and I read he has simplified his offerings in the off-season. Just because one can throw 8 pitches, doesn't mean he should. His command finally showed improvement towards the end of last season and has been pounding the strikezone in spring training. Is this the year he finally puts it all together and delivers on his promise when he was once a highly touted prospect? Team Slizz brass hopes so.

4.04 - Chris Owings, SS, ARI: Worst pick in my draft. I panicked as both of my target SS's were gone and I underestimated how bullish the market for SS's was. Owings has the potential to be a solid, top 150 type player if he can play a whole season with upside of a 15/15 type line. If I could do it again, I would've chosen James Paxton at 4.04. Awful, awful pick! My only silver lining with respect to this pick is that Owings will likely obtain 2B/SS eligibility at some point this season (read on one site he had 19 starts at 2B last season...1 game away from dual eligibility!).

4.14 - Wade Davis, RP, KC: Bingo Bango! According to MLB Network, the best relief pitcher in the game today. I don't think anybody will dispute Davis' talent or splits as he is good for 70 innings, 100 strikeouts, sub 2.00 era, and 1.00 whip. He is a Holland injury away from the closers role and will help my ratios all season long a la Betances for Blue Hen in 2014.

5.14 - Mark Teixeria, 1B, NYY: Two years removed from surgery and read a puff piece on him regarding his physique. He has put on 13lbs of muscle and stated this is best he's felt in a while. Hoping that he still has some left in his tank as my utility player to be that 30 HR / 100 RBI player. Shoot, I would even take 25 HR!

6.14 - Michael Bourn, OF, CLE: "Over 34 at-bats, the veteran outfielder boasts and impressive .382/.482/.471 triple-slash with a home run, three RBI, five runs scored and a 5-3 K/BB ratio." Combined with a solid Spring Training and his pedigree, Bourn gets me the much-needed speed and runs atop the Cleveland Indians lineup. His dreadful 2014 can be attributed to a really bad hamstring injury. He has since had surgery and looks to be spry again. I'm not expecting 40 SB, but 25-30 SB is not out of the question.

7.14 - T.J. House, SP, CLE: It's a House Party! This pick came down to two names:- Kyle Hendricks or T.J. House. House is a ground ball pitcher with a xFIP of 3.10 last season. He's only 25, has room to improve, and the differentiating factor between House and Kendricks was the K/9. He doesn't walk alot of batters, has a high ground ball rate (60.9%), and strikes out batters at a clip of 8k/9. As my last starter, he could be quite valuable.

8.14 - Tony Watson, RP, PIT: As per MLB Networks Top 10 Reliever Countdown, Mr. Watson finished at #10. Sure, he doesn't get saves, but he is the go-to guy in high leverage situations and continues to increase his K/9 and lower his xFIP. 70 strikeouts and great ratios make him a solid addition to round out my stellar staff.

8.17 - Brad Miller, SS, SEA: After exchanging messages with the CSN Baltimore beat reporter, Everth Cabrera was not an option. The O's plan on giving Schoop an extended look and regular AB at 2B and there is no way, barring injury, he will ever start. Cabrera will be utilized in a superutility role and fill in where needed. Miller offers me a mea culpa at my Nick Owings abortion of a pick. Miller had an awful start to last years season and, starting in June, "hit a respectable .265 thereafter, and if you take out a July swoon (.172), he was even better. To hear Seattle insiders tell it, too many people were trying to mess with his swing, but he'd settled down by season's end." Tosh need you to confirm!

9.14 Derek Norris, C, SD: His name was the top one on the board for the past 4 rounds and I kept passing. In the 9th round, the value of Derek Norris was too great to pass up, so I pulled the trigger. I'll take an excerpt from Razzball, but only about another player: Token late round catcher should "catch about 135 games this year, hit 15 homers and hit around .240. Basically, the same as every other 12th ranked catcher. Since the bottom of the order looks as appealing as imagining E.L. James as the girl in Fifty Shades of Grey, Norris could move up in the order and start counting stats."

11.10 Kevin Jepsen, RP, TB: Honestly wanted to move one of these picks. Thought other owners might see some value in the players that are left and be willing to send me a 2016 11th just to move up. That was not the case so I was left having to make a selection. I recognize that I could've filled out a backup infielder, but on the off-chance Jepsen is named the Tampa interim closer, this was a tremendous value. Kevin Cash was quoted as saying Jepsen will have "significant leveraged roles”...If not, he will be cut! (Cut due to Rendon going on the Disabled List and the fact that Boxberger got the job to start it out)

11.14 Tony Cingrani, P, CIN: Cingrani was awesome as a starter for WG during his championship run and has a career 10k/9, as a starter. Those ratios should only increase now that he has shifted to the bullpen. He has always had a low WHIP and the lack of secondary offerings hinders his chance of being a successful starter. Hoping to catch lightning in a bottle which is all one can hope for in the 11th round. (Cut due to the Craig Kimbrel Trade -- replaced by Jim Johnson)

TEAM SLIZZ OVERVIEW

I look back at how the draft went and realized I made a massive massive mistake in keeping Arcia over Avisail. Arcia might have massive power, but Avisail is, at least, a 15/15 player in the middle of the White Sox Lineup and would be really help my overall counting stats, and be a potential anchor for years to come.

Also regret not making a more significant push for Carlos Carrasco pre-keepers after my Stroman injury. Ref didn't want to entertain my 5th round offer for him, and had I chose Carrasco I wouldn't have taken Pomeranz in the 3rd...

I feature awesome pitching if I can get a relief pitcher who can generate saves. If all goes as planned with the bats, I could challenge for a Top 5 spot come year-end. I still need improvement on the OB% end, but that comes with seasoning as my young bucks get more experience.

PART 2 TO FOLLOW ONCE I AUDIT THE PICKS AND WILL POST PROJECTED STANDINGS...

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 07, 2015, 19:12

<41>OK, OK, so you want to know “What was he thinking?”

So, this baseball season started with me having four keeper league teams and a desire to remain active in the RIBC tournament. I was commissioner of two of the keeper leagues last year, and knew I was going to be travelling during the peak of the drafts. So I tried to find replacement commissioners for those two leagues. One league dissolved completely because nobody wanted the commish job, and I found someone to run the draft for the other, though he declined full commissionership. This was gonna be one busy draft time for me as all four remaining leagues use Draft Time. However, I knew I could do OK as long as I was well prepared. Stuff happens and my preparation wasn’t at its best. Then Species calls me and offers me a last second position in Gurupie that I didn’t want to pass up, I was at a truck stop when he called. How bad could I do with all the other prep I had already done. I accepted. Was happy with my prospect draft, but...

I whipped together some cheat sheets and waited for my turns all the while travelling. My first pick came when I began driving to Cleveland, I finally got reliable internet on 26 MAR, after my 7th pick but all the damage was already done by then, Clean up was all that was left for me to do.

1.15 I wanted three closers and already had Chapman. I knew that they go fast in ALL rotoguru leagues in the draft. I also know that I am never fast enough to get the closer in waiting mid-season, so if I am going to compete in saves, I have to draft closers early. I hastily put together a closer list and Mejia was at the top of it when my turn came up….who knew he would be injured at the start of the season.

2.15 Old man Latroy Hawkins better have another good year in him.

3.15/4.15 Though my keepers filled out my batting order nicely, I only had one SP and Latos was mediocre at best. So, starting pitching became my next great need, I had a list of starters and just took the guys off the top, but I didn’t have time to double check the guy just before the pick as I usually do, cause I was on the road. Oh, home boy Cliff Lee is out for 60 days, and maybe his career? And Santana is up on drug charges? Nice picks there Bean, batting one for four now on your first four picks. Go get em tiger.

5.15 Still don’t know I have been striking out on pitching, Seems I am no good with fast balls on road games. Austin Jackson is the top guy on my list at OF, why, I don’t know but he is.

6.15 Apparently Garza’s lack of Ks is OK enough that Toral thought I stole him from him, so maybe this wasn’t such a bad pick all things considered.

7.15 Bartolo Colon, my hidden ex-Indian gem, he was opening day pitcher you know, which says what the coaching staff thinks of him. Hopefully he holds it together this year and they don’t find out what he’s using to stay so young. He did nicely on opening day, dont ya think?

8.15 Jarod Saltalamachia, I am trying something new this year, if I need a DH I get a back up catcher as a first choice, someone else can DH when the back up needs to start. Pretty sure anyone can play DH.

9.15 Justin Turner, betting he gets traded to a starting gig, if not, was a waste. He is 2B and SS eligible in Yahoo, screw ESPN.

10.15 Emilio Bonifacio, Should be starting this year in OF and is 2B eligible. Great rotation guy who can help with steal totals.

11.15 Everth Cabrera, will start at beginning of season, maybe he can keep the job. If he stays a starter and returns to pre suspension numbers he is trade bait.

12.15 Jon Jay, pick a guy any guy

13.15 Tsyoshi Wada, well he had a shot at fifth starter until hurt. He could be high reward. We’ll see, wont drop him till we know more.

14.15 Garrett Jones, figured I would prolly be dropping him for Yasmany Tomas, but Tomas is in AAA now. In any case he is just a fill for rotation spot so who cares.

So, I dropped Lee and Santana and grabbed Locke and Vogelsong. To say I had a poor draft does not begin to describe my pain. It’s 10 out of 10 doc. Thank god I had a good team to start with, but it did not improve with my drafting prowess.

Nerfherders
ID: 2211442615
Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 12:21

After the decent move up last year I wanted to continue that momentum. After the trade for Max Scherzer, my entire team makeup changed. I suddenly had a plethora of pitching and not alot of keeper quality hitters.

I tried to trade Shields after he signed with SD, but I didn't get a great offer. So that left me with 4 definite pitchers to keep, and 3 hitters. The last two slots I had to make a decision between:

Sean Doolittle: Easy decision except he got hurt in the offseason.
Rajai Davis: His playing time is a concern.
Michael Cuddyer: Maybe if he stayed in CO.
Matt Shoemaker: Came out of nowhere last year, but nobody expects him to be that good again.

I decided to go with the two pitchers. Maybe Shoemaker is legit - nobody knows for sure. Doolittle is legit and he will be back so that was an easier decision.

So I went into the draft with 6 pitchers and 3 hitters, and the plan was to draft hitting every round for the first 5 rounds. The only real pitching I would need to get would be relievers.

As for prospects, I was the only team to not draft. I certainly was hoping to have Taillon and Buxton ready to go this year, but alas injuries held them back a year, maybe more. I have to keep them. And even though Frazier didnt have a good first year, I wanted to give him another chance.

So then came the S-draft, and my plan worked pretty well. My weaknesses on offense were going to be OBP and SB, so I got a good OBP guy in Napoli, several guys who will get 15-20 SB's (Cabrera, Pagan, Aoki), and some lower level but well-rounded MI. My biggest upside drafteee is Alcantara. I didnt draft any saves, but I have guys who could get saves - Romo and Qualls - if their main guys falter. My only SP draftee was Norris, who I had last year and actually delivered positive value.

So that's it. My pitching should be great. My hitting doesn't look that spectacular, but I feel all the pieces fit well together. Power guys and OBP guys and SB guys all mixing in.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Apr 08, 2015, 15:25

BH recap:

(No way can I keep up with Slizz)

2014 Recap: I won.

2014 Offseason: After some of the most dominant pitching in G20 history, I knew I needed to balance my team better. It started with trading Scherzer for Altuve. Had I known where Scherzer would end up, I might have asked for more. But entering the offseason with Price, Sale, Cole, Arrieta, Odorizzi, Betances, Rosenthal, and Britton, I knew I needed to trade some pitching for hitting. Eight keeper pitchers, for crying out loud. My main targets were Joey Votto, Miguel Cabrera, Mike Trout, Adrian Beltre, and Carlos Santana. I knew I could trade pitching with my borderline hitters for top shelf hitting. And presto, that's exactly what happened. Most of you know how hard I worked this offseason, and it paid off.

2015 Prospect Draft: I knew I'd have a lot of picks, and I knew it was a deep draft. Going into the offseason, I had 3 main targets: Kyle Schwarber, Carlos Rodon, and Yasmany Tomas. By the time the draft rolled around, Yoan Moncada was the clear #1, and Tomas had fallen massively. Nomar Mazara also established himself in the top tier. So I won the lottery, took Moncada, and went to pick at #7. I knew I'd only get one player from the top tier, and I decided on Schwarber, for a few reasons: in Theo we trust, catcher eligible outfielder, and high walk rate. Ref, were you looking closely at this Indiana guy? After that, my first and second tiers started to clear out, but I still got two guys from my second tier: Devers and Kolek. Both born around the time I graduated high school. True story: I had 5 tiers, and 43 players ranked, and I got 4 from my top 14. Very happy with the prospect draft.

2015 Supp Draft: I had a lot of early picks, and only 3 holes to fill: outfield, third base, and catcher. I had wanted to keep both Odorizzi and Britton, and it became obvious that Britton was going to be #1 overall. So I kept him, and still got Odorizzi. Later in the draft, I scored two guys I hadn't really been looking at because I thought they were going to be kept: Fowler and Zunino. Very pleased with that. And I got my #1 overall sleeper (just ask Slizz how hard I was after him), Drew Hutchison. Overall, the draft went almost exactly as planned. My only issue was that I had so many early picks that I started my endgame early, and wound up wasting a pick on Tommy La Stella, who was intended as a streamer for the first game (wound up dropping him for David Ross for the same game). And there was Josh Hamilton right at the end. With no suspension and good injury news, that one is already much better than expected.

So here we are. As I have said, the best draft was clearly Species and he is the #1 contender right now. Also watching out for Ref, R9, and Toral. And never, ever count out WG.

Some picks I enjoyed:
Collin McHugh, Tosh, 2.03
Adam Eaton, Jaydog 2.07
Desmond Jennings, Nerf, 2.12
Marcus Semien, Jaydog, 3.07
Trevor Bauer, Slizz, 4.01
James Paxton, Species, 4.06
Steve Pearce, Ref, 4.19
Luis Valbuena, Species, 5.06
CJ Cron, WG, 6.06
Wilmer Flores, Great One, 7.01
Micah Johnson, Species, 7.06
TJ House, Slizz, 7.14
Jace Peterson, WG, 7.17
Chad Qualls, Nerf, 8.12
Jon Schoop, Great One, 9.01
Brett Anderson, Ref, 10.19
Everth Cabrera, Bean 11.15
Odubel Herrera, Youngroman, 12.11
Devon Travis, Tosh, 13.03
Ryan Rua, Darkside, 13.13
Miguel Castro, WG, 13.17
Zach McAllister, WG, 14.07

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Apr 10, 2015, 11:56

Way too quiet in here. It's like you save everything for these long posts.

Hey BMD, I thought you were a contender. 19th place?

Hey R9, when you keep two premier closers, you might want to get more than ZERO saves.

Hey Tosh, maybe you shouldn't have traded your best hitter for three pitchers. Get back to me when that OBP is over .200.

Hey Goatlocker, Darkside, and R9, are you planning to make any roster moves this year?

Hey Judy, look at you leading the league in transactions!

Hey Species, enjoy it while it lasts, because it won't!

And finally...

Hey BH, it's only four days. Small sample size much?

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Apr 10, 2015, 13:23

All dues payments for 2015 have now been received. Thanks.

Jaydog
ID: 3216916
Fri, Apr 10, 2015, 15:10

Alrighty... Recap time.

Preface
My team went into this off season in a difficult spot. I had some very high end keepers (Votto, Cueto, Desmond), but not much depth. My last two keepers would have likely been Josh Hamilton (before his injury and relapse broke) and Brett Gardner. While I considered doing a full roster tear down and entering full blown rebuild mode, and it was probably the better decision, I figured to roll the dice once more and try and make a run.

Trades
After I decided that I would do what I could to contend this year, I realized I needed to add some depth in my keepers. My last few keepers just weren't going to cut it. Votto, as my most marketable keeper was the logical choice to trade and was drawing considerable interest from a few parties. After much deliberation and soul searching, I traded him for Choo, LaRoche, and Ortiz. While Blue Hen definitely got the best player in the deal, Choo, LaRoche, and Ortiz were all major upgrades to my keepers and definitely helped to provide depth. My other thought was that while Votto has tremendous value in an OBP league, his health and power have declined greatly, and one more season of down power and/or health issues would have dramatically impacted his value going into next year. If Choo can rebound from a down 2014 and stay healthy, LaRoche can continue to put in his consistently above average numbers, and Ortiz doesn't fall off a cliff I think this trade puts me in a good position. If the three players don't work out, I'll be more motivated to start rebuilding next season.

Keepers
C: Yadier Molina - Seemed to be a bit more catcher depth than in past years but still opted to keep Molina. Good for 140+ games and shouldn't hurt me in any category. Hoping for a bounceback from a down 2014, and his defense will keep him in the lineup.
1B: Adam LaRoche - Always good for 25 HR's 90+ RBI's, and an above average OBP. Hoping the move from Washington (pitchers park) to "The Cell" (hitters park) only boosts his numbers into the upper tier. Would not be suprised to see LaRoche as a top 10 1B.
SS: Ian Desmond - Elite SS providing above average production in 4 of the 5 offensive categories, and his OBP has improved a bit.
OF: Matt Kemp - Traded Jay Bruce for him last year when I thought I could contend. Bruce ended up having a terrible season and Kemp rebounded with a huge second half. Am not expecting the steals to return, and San Diego should zap some of his power, but still think 20+ HR with 100+ RBI's is likely.
OF: Shin-Soo Choo - Should replace the OBP I lost with Votto. Not batting leadoff will hurt his run total, but hopefully add more RBI's.
UTIL: David Ortiz - Hate locking up my util spot, but can't argue with Ortiz's 30+ HR and 100+ RBI production, in an improved Sox lineup. Always the risk that age catches up to him, but hasn't yet.
SP: Johnny Cueto - Elite production across the board.
SP: Chris Archer - Hoping for a breakout year. Was serviceable last season but has all of the stuff to become an ace.
RP: Fernando Rodney - As good a bet as there is for 40+ saves on an improved Seattle team.

Pretty happy with my mix of keepers. Lots of power with LaRoche, Ortiz, Kemp, and Desmond, and a good start to my staff with Archer and Cueto. If I decide to rebuild, I'll have a good trade chip in Rodney, and a few young players I can build around in Archer and Desmond.

Prospects
Existing prospects were Kyle Zimmer and Austin Meadows. Zimmer was once an elite prospect for KC who has been slowed down by injuries. Still only 23 w/ elite K upside, I considered throwing him back into the pool, but decided to keep him. Austin Meadows is young, and a ways away from the bigs, but has 5 tool potential. 9th overall pick in 2013, the Pirates will give him every opportunity to move up the ladder.

With my prospect draft pick, given that my two existing prospects are realistically still 2-3 years away, I was hoping to get someone who could contribute sooner. I had my eye on Swihart or Tomas, but missed on both so took Dilson Herrera for the Mets. Fantastic production in 2014, and even looked decent during a short stint with the big club in September. If the Mets decide to trade Daniel Murphy he's likely a candidate to win the starting job in 15. My team does not have a long term keeper at 2B, so felt he was a great fit.

Supplemental Draft
My goals for the supplemental draft were to fill out my roster with players that had the upside to help me contend this year, but had good keeper value long term. It's likely that I'll have 3-4 keeper spots open next season, and wanted a good stable of options. With that in mind:

2.07 - Adam Eaton: Felt my biggest holes on offense were steals and runs, which Eaton has the potential to excel in. He should bat first in a decent White Sox lineup. Great upside where I need it for this season, and could end up being a perennial keeper.
3.07 - Marcus Semien: Needed to fill a 2B and 3B slot, which Semien can play either. Lot of buzz around him after a nice spring, will open the season as the A's opening day SS. Has the potential to provide power and speed across multiple positions, and like Eaton, could become a keeper for me.
4.07 - Lonnie Chisenhall: For the first half of last year was one of the best 3B in the game. 915 OPS in the first half, but 591 in the 2nd, if the truth is somewhere in the middle, he could be a productive 3B for me for several years.
6.07 - Bobby Parnell: Will start the season on the DL, but all news points to him coming back in early May, and likely reclaiming the closers job. He'll either help me compete this year, serve as valuable trade bait mid season, or be a closer that is under consideration as a keeper. Great value in the 6th round.
7.07 - Jason Hammel: With only two pitchers, needed to round out my staff. Hammel provides slightly above average K potential, and hoping that a trip back to the Cubs leads him back to his sub 3 ERA.
8.07 - Aaron Hill: Definitely strayed from my rebuilding plan with this pick, but needed a middle infielder and the options were drying up. Hill has had some very good years (only one year removed from an 800+ OPS), and in the event that my team is contending could be very valuable.
9.07 - Jimmy Nelson: Big arm brimming with potential, and a solid hold on a starting spot in Milwaukee. Control had been an issue in the minors, but brought his walk rate way down in 2014. Lots of upside, with keeper potential, all in the 9th round.
9.17 - Juan Lagares: Young OF with good speed and elite defense that should keep him in the lineup. Was some talk about hitting leadoff with the Mets which would help his R and SB's which my team needs. If Eaton doesn't work out, Lagares could provide meaningful stats for my team.
10.07 - Dillon Gee: Looks to have the 5th starter spot locked up for the Mets. Has had some very good years in the past, and gets to face the abysmal Phillies and Braves lineup several times. Nice option to stream in favorable matchups.
11.06 - Darren O'Day: Good setup guy that gets a decent number of strikeouts and has always had elite ratio's. Next in line for saves if Britton falters.
11.07 - Pedro Strop: Good setup guy that gets a decent number of strikeouts and has always had elite ratio's. Next in line for saves if Rondon falters. (see what I did there...)
12.06 - Justin Smoak: Hoping a change in scenery (and ballpark) helps Smoak get back to his elite prospect status. Not likely, but as a late round roster filler, there's upside in his bat.
12.07 - CC Sabathia: Even with his disasterous ERA last season, CC still had elite K numbers with a very low walk rate. Hoping that the added lbs that he put (back) on in the off season can get his ERA down a bit.
13.07 - Rafael Montero: At the time of this pick, it was between Gee and Montero for the Mets 5th starter spot. Montero was coming off of a few excellent starts in spring. This pick "handcuffed" the Gee selection, and also provides some nice upside as a high end prospect, if I'm patient enough to wait him out.

Draft Recap
Overall I was very happy with my draft. Eaton, Semien, Chisenhall, Nelson, Parnell, Lagares, and Montero all have enough youth and potential to become keepers. I need a lot to go right to contend this year, but if:

Choo and Molina bounce back from terrible 2014's,
Ortiz holds off father time one more season,
Kemp holds his power up in Petco,
Desmond's OBP doesn't weigh me down,
Archer shows progression,
LaRoche is LaRoche,
A few of Eaton, Semien, Nelson, Chisenhall, etc... build on their potential,
and I make a few decent in season moves I think my team can contend... we'll see!!!

Good luck to everyone!

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 10, 2015, 16:23

46. I have 2 P on the DL and 2 in the minors. Cannot afford to drop any of them...

My P stinks.

Jaydog
ID: 3216916
Sat, Apr 11, 2015, 10:36

re: 48... nice to see my team in 19th :) but with 5 SP's going today... lets see what difference a day can make!

Species
ID: 54740122
Sat, Apr 11, 2015, 16:19

Pitchers are REALLY dominating right now. My offense is AWFUL.....but relative to everyone else....it's not so bad.

GoatLocker
ID: 59214619
Sat, Apr 11, 2015, 16:33

Ditto on 51, still real early though.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, Apr 11, 2015, 19:52

Finally
A home run
Thanks Freddie...

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, Apr 11, 2015, 23:42

Really loving the steals from Votto, Miggy, and Moustakas. Is Zunino next?

Toral
Leader
ID: 2111201313
Sun, Apr 12, 2015, 07:20

51 Someone forgot to tell Mr Kershaw that the pitchers are DOMINATING.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, Apr 12, 2015, 10:35

51: Yeah, my era and whip are in such a deep hole, I may never climb out.

Speaking of elite pitchers:
Madison Bumgarner last October: 6 ER in 42 2/3 IP. Madison Bumgarner last night: 5 ER in 3 IP.

Toral
Leader
ID: 2111201313
Tue, Apr 14, 2015, 07:55

I have a very funny story to tell about how I missed out on Betancourt despite getting to him before he was actually picked up, but it's too embarrassing for me to tell, unfortunately for you all.

BTW that was the first time I can remember where a new putative closer was picked up in my other leagues before this one.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Apr 14, 2015, 10:04

Toral had hit the "add" button, then suddenly had to use the bathroom, and as he was running in, he slipped on a bar of soap and broke both legs. He was able to reach his keyboard, but not his mouse, so instead of picking up Betancourt, he typed "BLERG."

Get well soon, Toral.

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 14, 2015, 10:20

The "run" on Betancourt was interrupted by a case of the "runs" followed by a "running" accident?

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Apr 15, 2015, 10:12

You can't win the title in the first month, but you can sure lose it. Only I may have lost it in the first week. Can be tough to come back from a bad pitching outing, but it seems like every outing from my guys have been bad. Going to be a long year. What stinks is that even my "studs" that I have to send out each time are bad. At this point I have no choice but to send everyone out there every time now. I'm sure they will settle in and be fine, but the damage may already be done.

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, Apr 15, 2015, 15:35

Just a bad first week/10 days Ref. At least I hope so. I feel my offense has been awful.....thank gawd we are obp. I will have to calculate my team batting average. It can't be much higher than .230.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Apr 15, 2015, 16:51

Yep, look at Curtis Granderson with twice as many walks as Joey Votto. He's really taking to being a leadoff hitter.

That said, if Ref wants to throw in the towel, I'm all for it.

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 10:15

Let's get this Kris Bryant party started.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 10:30

61: Yeah Species, thing is, you can get hot and make up those counting stats. That ERA/WHIP is a very arduous process.

So I just re-read our rules. Removed from the Prospect rules when we switched from mid-season to preseason draft was the Prospect-eligibility check that came at the All Star Game. When we added the prospect rules into our game, part of the compromise to get prospects added was to have a check so guys who were over the limit couldn't be stashed for the whole year for no reason and further hinder the FA pool.

Since players are no longer prospects at the end of the year and must be kept as part of your 9 or renounced, it is no benefit to not put those players on your team during the season. Furthermore, if they aren't picked up all season, then there is little to no chance of them being kept as your 9. With our shallow FA pool, I submit that this hurts our league.

Thus, I propose we add back in the Prospect limits check at the All-Star Break where the owner of those prospects over the limit must add them to their team or be lost as a prospect.

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 11:16

I understand where Ref is coming from. I am against this, but not strongly. I'll suggest that thinning out the FA pool is actually a good thing.

Further, the odds of someone hitting the 300 AB limit by July are low - see Schoop, Jonathan, 2014 - so it won't matter anyway.

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 14:16

65: You are assuming they are all starting at 0.

slizz
ID: 335717
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 14:39

G20 2015 PROJECTIONS

	A	B	C	D	E	F	G	H	I	J	K	L
1	Team	Total	HR	RBI	SB	R	OB%	SV	W	SO	WHIP	ERA
2	Blue Hen	152.5	19	17	7.5	20	20	20	9	14	14	12
3	Species	152.5	20	19	2	16	14	14	15.5	17	18	17
4	R9*	145.5	15	20	20	18	12	19	15.5	19	4	3
5	Ref	140	17	10	16	12.5	13	17	17.5	11	15	11
6	Toral	138.5	9	18	12	10.5	17	9	19	4	20	20
7	Roto Guru	126	18	13	3.5	17	8	12.5	13	15	13	13
8	Pete N.	119.5	13.5	13	14	12.5	11	18	5.5	10	12	10
9	Slizz	116.5	16	15.5	3.5	10.5	5	2	12	18	16	18
10	Nerfherders	111	7	2	15	5	3	10	20	16	19	14
11	WG	102.5	12	13	18	19	15	4	7.5	7	1	6
12	MJD	101.5	10	9	7.5	3	4	16	14	20	10	8
13	beastiemike d	100.5	8	8	10.5	14	16	6.5	10.5	9	9	9
14	Jay Dog	94.5	11	7	6	8	19	8	10.5	13	7	5
15	Darkside	92.5	2	5	13	7	7	5	17.5	12	8	16
16	Bean**	83.5	5	6	17	15	18	12.5	1	1	6	2
17	Youngroman	82.5	3	4	10.5	1	10	6.5	5.5	6	17	19
18	Tosh***	73.5	1	1	19	4	1	11	2.5	8	11	15
19	Goatlocker	68	6	15.5	5	9	6	15	2.5	3	5	1
20	Judy	67.5	13.5	11	9	6	9	3	4	2	3	7
21	GO	31.5	4	3	1	2	2	1	7.5	5	2	4

*R9 was over total innings projection therefore Marco Gonzalez and Jaime Garcia were not counted
**Replaced Santana and Lee on Bean's Roster
***Reflects Tosh & WG Trade with Familia

The projections that I did at the season-end review were not totally accurate with respect to the pitching. Last season, the projections only included the top six (6) pitchers from each team factored into the overall standing. I have since adjusted it for this season to include all pitchers taken up to 1400 IP. As noted above, only R9 went over the 1400 IP projection.

As far as hitting, the bench player's statistics were not included towards the projections. I debated on adding a second utility spot to account for that by way of the best bench player, but opted not to. Hope you enjoy!

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 16:12

Huh. I'm 20 out of 21?

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 16:14

What does PR15 mean in the research column?

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Apr 17, 2015, 16:55

Judy, note that the list starts at 2.

PR15 is player rater value over the last 15 days. Here's everybody's rating: ESPN Player Rater

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, Apr 18, 2015, 15:44

70. What's the math for it? Start at 2?

darkside
ID: 81492120
Sat, Apr 18, 2015, 17:20

Calling up Steven Souza and Jake Lamb. Each for the first time.

slizz
ID: 43320199
Sun, Apr 19, 2015, 10:20

About time...haha

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Sun, Apr 19, 2015, 12:59

just like the Nationals I am sending down Michael Taylor.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 07:43

Come on up Addison. Show us your stuff!

Toral
Leader
ID: 2111201313
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 09:59

Good. With position change looks like he's not gonna displace Starlin.

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 13:12

Baez getting called up any time soon?

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 13:26

Who?

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 13:43

Some bum on GO's roster.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 16:46

Yeah lots of position possibilities going forth.

For now 2B where I have gordon, with talk that maybe Castro to OF, addy to SS or addy to 3B maybe eventually if Baez returns and does well.

Gonna be exciting to see my babies produce -- cf Archie too!

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 16:48

Another baby -- Salazar!

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 17:25

Addison to 3B? Gonna be crowded with Bryant there and Ott due to return as well. Cubs got so many talented young guys, there has to be a trade on the horizon.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 18:17

Read that Bryant maybe to OF as well. But you are right, gotta be a trade in there somewhere...

Species
ID: 57329123
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 20:56

Castro needs to move off of SS. Russell a significant upgrade there.....

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Apr 21, 2015, 23:10

Time to use this forum for some good. Slizz has never seen a single Star Wars movie. Hopefully, the collective of this forum can influence him to make the right decision. Have at it.

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Wed, Apr 22, 2015, 19:01

Yowza. Bud Norris: 20 ER. The rest of the staff - 28 ER.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Wed, Apr 22, 2015, 20:04

Can someone please explain to me why after I put addy into last night's lineup, he went back to the bench today. So I had to put him at SS for FIVE MORE games before he automatically is listed at SS.

Seriously? How stupid is THAT???

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Apr 23, 2015, 09:14

If Miguel Cabrera is a late scratch, and I put Kennys Vargas into the lineup, do you think I want him to be there by default tomorrow?

It's difficult to make a fantasy sports website. And we're all playing on the same one.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Thu, Apr 23, 2015, 11:29

Yeah, but you know you will be making the change so you will wake up the next day and put miggy back in.

I make a change I want it to stay. If it is a one day thing, I'll know that ahead of time and plan to make the change the next day.

Toral
ID: 143242315
Thu, Apr 23, 2015, 16:28

'm with bh on this one. No way that if I plug Take-Some Bench in today, he should be the default starter tomorrow.

Does Yahoo! do this? i don't know, but some fantasy hosting site did this in the past and I was extremely annoyed.

Just be thankful that you *can* set your lineup 5 days in advance. On some platforms, you couldn't (unto recent times).

GO
ID: 541392319
Thu, Apr 23, 2015, 21:19

I still can't with MFL G24. Its like the current week exists in a magical vacuum.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 07:26

Wow... It's gonna be a long year...

"For the first time since treating us to a parade in 2008, the Phillies yesterday fielded a starting lineup that did not contain a single member of their World Series champion team."

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 09:32

Actually, I think yesterday's lineup might have the lowest career OPS of any lineup in the history of baseball. Would love to see if that's actually true.

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 13:54

GO -- you can in MFL. Check the email I just sent you...

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 14:18

Anybody got a good closer for me?

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 22:12

No, no, no

Me first. I have no closer thanks to Nathan...

GO
ID: 541392319
Fri, Apr 24, 2015, 22:47

I think its actually ESPN you can't set future NFL lineups. Thanks Judy.

slizz
ID: 43320199
Sat, Apr 25, 2015, 14:39

Re: 86 - they need to get gausman in!!

100

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, Apr 26, 2015, 11:55

The pace feature for g20 is way off. Not even close to the pace for AA...

???

101

Toral
ID: 143242315
Sun, Apr 26, 2015, 16:08

G20 maxes are higher.

102

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, Apr 26, 2015, 21:57

101. How come? Why?

103

Toral
ID: 143242315
Sun, Apr 26, 2015, 23:46

Just different rules. We have 170 games per pos, RIBC leagues 162. We have 1400 IP, RIBC leagues 1350.

104

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, Apr 28, 2015, 22:36

Wow, you can see Archie's face is already blown up. What a shame for the kid.

105

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Apr 29, 2015, 15:05

Folks, looking to deal Moncada, Devers or Kolek for something a little more current. Let me know if you have something in mind....

106

darkside
ID: 1425647
Wed, Apr 29, 2015, 16:54

Sending Jake Lamb back down.

107

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Wed, Apr 29, 2015, 17:16

Tigers score 10 runs. Victor Martinez and Rajai Davis go 0-10 together. How is that even possible?

Victor Martinez with 1 XBH this year. Great pick by me.

108

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Apr 30, 2015, 10:38

VMart was a fantasy goat yesterday.

109

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 01, 2015, 09:48

Blue Hen May 1 Report

Like last year, I'll give you guys an update each month. I hope you'll do the same, since it's always fun to hear what's going on in everyone's head.

April 2015 might be my best month ever in G20. So many things went right, and so few went wrong. I'm at 19 or above in 7 categories, and at 183 overall despite 13.5 in saves. I have a 30 point lead on second place, and a 43 point lead on WG, who I consider the biggest threat.

On the negative side, the biggest disappointment is Dellin Betances. Don't get me wrong - he hasn't allowed a run all season, and has retired 25 straight batters, with his usual awesome k rate. But in a season where I am struggling for saves, he hasn't come through as an elite closer.

Minor struggles from Troy Tulowitzki and Jose Bautista haven't hurt too much, and Drew Hutchison, Mike Zunino, and Kennys Vargas have struggled when they should be leading the youth movement.

On the plus side, well, everything else. Mike Moustakas is the big one, who appears to finally be hitting his stride, and making me look good for waiting so long to draft a third baseman. I gambled on Dexter Fowler and Curtis Granderson in the outfield, and both have been pretty great. I maneuvered to keep both Jake Odorizzi and Zach Britton this year, and both have been fantastic, and Jared Cosart and Gerrit Cole have taken a step forward. Most importantly, Jose Altuve, Miguel Cabrera, and Joey Votto have played like the elite players they are.

When I lost G20 in 2013 after being awarded the paper championship by several of you, I vowed to dominate this league as best I could. So far, so good.

See you on June 1.

110

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, May 01, 2015, 15:50

Addison is on my bench today...

111

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 01, 2015, 16:05

Oops on that.

112

mjd
ID: 23182817
Sat, May 02, 2015, 01:41

Sending Pompey down.

113

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, May 03, 2015, 12:50

How come the action column is blank. I want to bench/play different guys...both the G20 and AA...?

114

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, May 03, 2015, 12:51

Ok. It's back.

115

GO
ID: 344132921
Sun, May 03, 2015, 22:25

I bet you weren't logged in Judy.

116

GO
ID: 344132921
Sun, May 03, 2015, 22:33

Here's my report... any of you who I continue to beat should be embarrassed - I had crap for keepers and like one draft pick in single digits!

117

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, May 05, 2015, 15:08

Folks, looking to deal Moncada, Devers or Kolek for something a little more current. Let me know if you have something in mind....

118

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 06, 2015, 09:35

Some really interesting shakeups in the standings yesterday.

Toral gained 12 points, giving him a nice cushion on WG and Species for second place.

Great One and Pete were +15.5 and +17, now in 6th and 7th place. Two historical powerhouses who have struggled in recent years. A couple moves could turn these two into contenders.

And even Bean gained 5.5, putting him within 21 points of Goatlocker for 19th place.

Where did the points come from? Well, big losses in the middle of the pack - Guru, Nerf, MJD, and R9.

Interesting that we're already into May and the big swings are still happening.

119

slizz
ID: 43320199
Wed, May 06, 2015, 10:00

April Review:

I love the month of April for G20. The standings have large daily swings and everyone is optimistic about the upcoming season. Managers get to see their draft strategies pay off...or foil.

Nevertheless, April started off with a dud for me. Rusney Castillo sent down for reasons that I can't fathom (Shane Victorino?!?!? seriously?!?!?). Rendon's knee. Bad pitching. Etc. Hitting was stagnant and I found myself in 19th place.

Then week 2 started. My team's pitching sorted itself out, Adam Jones turned into BALCO Barry Bonds, Bauer dominated, I pickup some cheapie wins & saves (thanks, Jim Johnson), start to rocket up the standings, and even touched 150!!! Unfortunately, that might be the high watermark for me this season. I proceeded to make a couple bad choices (House @ DET, Quintana @ DET) and my hitting plateaued.

All in all, I did a solid job outside of those two brain fart starts considering how banged up my team has been:

-Rendon still hasn't played
-Castillo sent down and injured his shoulder. I'm sure Cherington would like to have a mulligan on how he handled that one
-Jose on the 60 day DL
-McGee out until May.
-Arcia suckage
-Gausman in the pen

I hit my target of 110-115 (125) at April's end considering the restraints on my squad: 40% of my first 10 players giving me 0 production. Right after that, my team imploded and had nearly two (2) straight nights of sub 2 runs/rbis and little to no production. That caused me to lose over 20 points in a span of two days! I'm still optimistic about climbing up the standings and finishing around the top 5!

Keepers Review: (only time I'll do this as April is a good barometer to measure your draft)

1B - Hosmer: awesome. This is who I was hoping I'd get when I traded Kris Bryant. If he can stay in the top 50 of the player rater, I won't care what Kris does.
2B - Rendon: ugh.
3B - Arenado: Classic change of scenery trade. Frazier has blossomed since going to Nerfherders and Nolan has become a solid player for me as well!
OF - Jones: Stud.
OF - Castillo: ugh.
OF - Arcia: one of the worst keepers in G20.
SP - Jose. Can't wait to get him back
SP - Pineda: fortunate I held on to him. Been the lone starter who has provided consistency.
SP - Gausman: ugh. Hoping Baltimore moves him to the rotation once they feel confident they won't go over his innings limit.

Draft Review:

1.10 - Jake McGee: incomplete
2.14 - Quintana: heats up after April. Satisfied with the pick.
3.14 - Pom Pom: bust. League average pitcher.
4.01 - Bauer: hit. Needs to shake whatever sickness wiped him of his stuff.
4.04 - Owings: OK. Not the terrible pick I thought he was. Still a reach.
4.14 - Davis: huge hit. Just awesome.
5.14 - Teixeria: huge hit. One of the top 3 picks in the s-draft for hitters.
6.14 - Bourn: huge bust. Was counting on his speed but it's gone and now he's a platoon player who only hits vs righties.
7.14 - House: mega bust who crippled my ERA/WHIP. Over 15 ER in under 3 innings.
8.14 - Watson: hit. was toying with Familia at this point in the draft (can be confirmed by WG, BH, and Ref). Even my wife said to take Familia bc he's Spanish (my wife is from PR, so she has a bias...) and now every time the Mets win she asks me "how's that pitcher doing I told you to take?" just to fire me up...
9.14 - Norris: hit. Above average catcher.

The rest I've churned through...

What has impressed me?

-Blue Hen. Wow. I knew his team was awesome, but he has really started hot and is showing no signs of cooling off. Gonna be a tough team to beat.
-WG. Working his annual magic.
-Ref. Talk about unfortunate luck. Just not executing. Feel for him bc his team was so well-rounded post-draft.
-GO. No early picks? No problem. Had some of the best picks in the draft, starting with Vogt (C eligibility and arguably the best pick in the s-draft!!!). He follows that gem with Marisnick, who is the second best pick, and could be a long term keeper for him. Volquez. Morrow (pre injury). If he only had a closer he could be top 5 right now...

I could go on but it's only April and those story lines really stuck out.

120

Judy
ID: 54203110
Wed, May 06, 2015, 13:05

Anyone want Cobb for the future?

121

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, May 06, 2015, 15:44

Trade announcement:

Species gets:

Bartolo Colon
Bean's 2016 9th

Bean gets:
Danny Farqhuar
Species' 2016 5th

122

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, May 06, 2015, 21:46

Correction: My 5th for Bean's 10th.

123

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, May 06, 2015, 22:24

Concur with 121/122

124

mjd
ID: 23182817
Thu, May 07, 2015, 10:52

Closer's available.

Interested parties should inquire within.

Don't let me trade them to BH.

125

Ref
ID: 55156513
Thu, May 07, 2015, 13:13

I am also getting some interest in my players--including bh lol. Don't know why, my team is cursed. I'd suggest everyone stay away. But if you want to risk it, we can talk!

126

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, May 07, 2015, 14:16

Just in case it wasn't obvious, mjd and Ref both have multiple closers, so of course I'm interested. For those of you who are unable to read the standings, my worst category is currently saves. So if you have a closer, let's work something out.

127

GO
ID: 344132921
Sat, May 09, 2015, 00:20

GO's Tip of the Cap? Tip of the Day!
Add prospects to your watch list. And then make your free agent sorts with the filter of "Not on Watch List" taking them out of the sort.

128

bmd
ID: 27442823
Sat, May 09, 2015, 00:42

Calling up Rodon.

129

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, May 11, 2015, 12:46

Proposal for discussion. Starting with the 2017 prospect draft, allow 4 prospects instead of 3. Basically, convert everything that says 3 in our rules to 4.

Goals: encourage pick/prospect trading, put a little more emphasis on the minors, and thin out the player pool (make the league "deeper").

Any interest?

130

judy
Dude
ID: 7771722
Mon, May 11, 2015, 16:47

You can't be SERIOUS! (John McEnroe, tennis player)

You WANT to thin out the player pool?

Are you trying to make the league harder for everyone who lives a normal life with other things to do? Isn't your lead big enough?

131

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, May 11, 2015, 17:25

Are you trying to make the league harder for everyone who lives a normal life with other things to do?

Actually, yes. I am trying to increase the average interest level per manager in this league. That is exactly what I am trying to do.

133

Toral
ID: 143242315
Mon, May 11, 2015, 18:18

I assume that transitioning to the rule, we would still be required to, next year, reduce our lists to 3 players (for the last time) before going to 4 prospects. Otherwise the rule's major benefit would be to teams that have 4 or more good prospects. Like yours.

134

Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Mon, May 11, 2015, 18:29

You know, I'm no longer in this league, but I can't imagine a better way to make it *less* interesting than to squelch, even further, the possibility of a decent player coming up who isn't already on a roster or prospect list.

Just my 2 cents.

135

Judy
ID: 54203110
Mon, May 11, 2015, 22:05

And what is your evidence for a lack of "trying to increase the average interest level per manager in this league." Do you have statistics (since baseball is a game of statistics) to prove your point that there needs to be an increase in "the average interest level per manager in this league."

Who are you to judge the interest level of any manager? Is it hundreds of player swaps, a myriad of trade offers. What? I think it is an insult to suggest that managers are not trying. Personally I resent the implication.

136

Species
ID: 54740122
Mon, May 11, 2015, 23:27

Trade:

mjd receives :

WG's 2016 4th

Species receives :

Koji Uehara
mjd's 14th

137

Ref
ID: 55156513
Mon, May 11, 2015, 23:42

The effect of adding another prospect would have quite the opposite effect. Even with three, the player pool is so thinned out it is nearly impossible to find players to gamble on to keep. Can't even replace players too often. I'd rather be done with prospects altogether. No more drafts.

Surprised Species was able to get Koji for a 4th. Guess mjd had no plans to keep him going forward-but he is a major closer and not a bottom of the barrel closer that most contenders end up getting.

138

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, May 12, 2015, 00:59

136 confirmed.

Still not done. Headley, Heyward and others could be next.

139

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, May 12, 2015, 01:19

Trade

WG gets Santiago Casilla and mjd's 13th rd 2016 S-draft pick.

mjd gets Josh Fields and WG 5th rd 2016 S-draft pick

140

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Tue, May 12, 2015, 03:47

I just called up Noah Syndergaard for his major league debut.

141

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, May 12, 2015, 09:19

137: I think a 4th is quite a reasonable price/return for Uehara. Looking at historical closer prices,obviously the earlier in the year, the higher the price is one factor. Stability in the job and quality of the team is another.

Uehara is approaching 40. He has diminished stuff. But he somehow gets the job done. I disagree that he has strong keeper value going forward due to age and stuff. I paid a fair to possibly too high a price.

142

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, May 12, 2015, 09:22

Wow, lots of conversation. After a silent May 11, it looks like May 12 was anything but.

I'll tackle these as best I can.

[133] Correct. I don't need to add a loophole to help my team finish ahead of you. But I appreciate the mean-spirited attempt to imply that I do.

[134, 135, 137] You're both near-originals of this league. What's the point of having a 20-team league with prospects if the goal isn't to find real diamonds in the rough? Do you care that the teams with the fewest moves this season are in 12th, 15th, and 18th place? That the teams with the most moves are in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd? That the low-ranked teams have the fewest posts on this board?

Very few of us are friends or have met in real life (fun fact: I lead G20 in that category as well). So since we're not in this league to hang out with our friends, why are we in G20? If we're here "just to be in a league" then I can recommend some public leagues for you. Or maybe you're here for the high comedy of BH rants. Well congrats, you just got one. But I'm in this league for the competition. In 2007, this league was so competitive that I finished in 19th place!

[136, 139] Thanks for the help MJD.

143

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, May 12, 2015, 10:21

As the new guy who has already decided that wait til next year is a good strategy, I enjoy this banter. It's definitely keeping my otherwise "average interest level" piqued.

Keep it up, please, I need to decipher who hates who and how much, so I can use it to my trading advantage, hehehe.

144

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, May 12, 2015, 10:38

143: That's easy. Nobody likes blue hen! Hahahahahaha

145

slizz
ID: 43320199
Tue, May 12, 2015, 11:02

Blue Hen is the heel of this league and fully embraces it...

146

WG
ID: 552431321
Tue, May 12, 2015, 11:18

139: confirmed
145: confirmed

147

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, May 12, 2015, 11:46

I may need a commish to move Josh Fields to my team, as he's not really mentioned in the official league trade.

In the trade, he's the player to be named.

Go competition!!! I'd like to see an interesting finish and do not wish anyone any personal ill will.

148

Judy
ID: 54203110
Tue, May 12, 2015, 21:57

142 most of your moves are cycling pitchers in and out as far as I can tell...?

149

GoatLocker
ID: 404291221
Tue, May 12, 2015, 22:29

I'm here. Just setting in the dark listin to BH bark.

150

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, May 13, 2015, 00:23

141: Too much is made of age IMO. We don't have multi-year contracts but I digress. The point I was making was that I was paying 4th and 5th rounders in July/August for a closer by committee guy at times and you got one of the best closers in the game in middle May for a 4th. If you are not going to keep him and he "somehow gets the job done." Lets see, he has been pitching just one month due to the preseason injury and has given up a run just one game. In fact he has pitched 10 games. He has 2 wins, 6 saves and one blown save. ERA of 2 and whip of .67 with a 12K/9.

Casilla has been really nice too. 4 wins 8 saves with a 1.99 era and 1.26 whip. His K rate is about 7/9IP but he is not a strikeout pitcher.

These were really nice gets for these two managers and I scoff at any notion that the buyers somehow overpaid for them. Usually when there is competition you see contenders overpaying for scrubs and all I am saying is that with closers being in such need, I am surprised they didn't go for much more. Now I am not hating. MJD wanted to blow up his team and rebuild now and these two managers needed these two players now. Both of these players WERE kept this year.

151

mjd
ID: 23182817
Wed, May 13, 2015, 01:00

I kept them after getting both for a 2nd from you predraft.

152

Bmd
ID: 2642138
Wed, May 13, 2015, 09:02

4th round for an established closer is a steal. Koji is a pretty big injury risk so it's not some huge steal. If he goes to the DL MHD wouldn't be able to get a 10th rounder for him.

Same thing with Casilla. Good price but his job is far from secure.

I would've made the deal for either if they were offered to me and I'm sure most don't consider my team a contender(judging by inquiries for Papelbon).

153

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 09:33

Re 148: Not sure where you would get that impression. I have 17 hitters who have played 3 or fewer games for me. Definitely using a ton of those transactions on hitters.

Re 149: Perhaps you should stop doing that, and start making moves to improve your team. Entire list of transactions this season - add Colby Lewis, add Tyler Matzek, add Jose Ramirez. That's it. Also, you might want to turn a light on.

Re 151: Interesting. You paid a 2nd, used two keeper slots, and traded away for a 4th and a 5th. Some part of that math doesn't add up.

154

Bmd
ID: 2642138
Wed, May 13, 2015, 11:28

There's nothing more frustrating then coming up with a price for a player that was not on the trading block only to not receive a counter. Something like "cool, I was thinking a 4th for him instead of a 1st, we are probably too far apart." would be appreciated.

Bh, it seems like every post you make is ragging on people not making enough moves or making bad trades. Yes, some owners could make more moves and some make bad trades. It's not necessary to always be the villain in this league. Just enjoy the ride with the occasional brag when things are going well.

155

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 11:33

BMD, I'm guilty of the first. Including to you, today. I'll try to be better about it.

I will always rag on people for not making enough moves. Especially if they started it, as above.

And I'm not ragging on anyone for making a bad trade, just saying the math didn't add up. By the way, WG and Species, nice trades.

156

darkside
ID: 1425647
Wed, May 13, 2015, 11:54

I've called up Alex Guerrero for the first time.

157

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, May 13, 2015, 12:55

bmd, I agree with you. I told bh, that for a 4th and a 5th, I'd have made that deal and I don't even need them. Injury risk. While I tend to agree, most players could be classified as that to some degree.

I have had people not trade with me before because they didn't want to deal with the fall out on the boards.I was told by one that no matter what deal you make, you always catch "crap." I get tired of trying to even think about trading because several don't even try to make it a win-win. I'd rather eat the player and cut then to give them away.

What's funny is that some people contact me telling me how bad a player is then asking me what I want for him.What is surprising to me is that when I need a category I will tend to overpay for him when trying to win and here you have guys who need closers and people missed out because they underbid what still came out to a great deal. Instead of what will it take to get this and this player and listen, people come in telling you what he is worth. The buyer doesn't determine his worth, the seller does. If the buyer doesn't agree he can see if there is some wiggle room or shop somewhere else.

158

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 13:45

Most of us are probably just scared. Sure, a third for a good closer is reasonable, but then I think back to this year's fourth round and about how all the players I had wanted just went. So if I spend a third, that's going to happen next year.

And what if the closer loses his job in a week. It happened to me just last year - I traded for Sergio Romo, who was on top of his game, and he just lost it, killing most of the value I had acquired.

When I make a trade, it's not trying to "win" but rather about doing everything I can to avoid that situation. Like the Miggy deal - if the worst does happen, at least I get a token pick out of it.

159

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, May 13, 2015, 14:33

<154> Bmd and I have not had any dealings yet, and this comment isnt directed at anyone in particular, but my being in 20th place may make a few of you predatory types respond to the blood in the water.

When I lived in Hawaii I was taught that if you are visited by a shark while swimming, punch them in the nose and they go away.

I always assume that a person coming to me with an unsolicited offer is trying to rip a piece of me off. I'm usually right, so I often just punch them in the nose, and if they come back with a reasonable offer, then I may pay attention to them. I'll look at the offer, if its crap that's how I treat the person making the offer. After all that's how they are treating me. Troll somewhere else.

With me you better get it right by the third try, or my ignoring you isn't being rude, its your telephone solicitor at dinner time behavior that's rude. I dont want to buy your product or donate to your charity, and our politics aren't aligned, so lets not waste one another's time further. Put me on your do not call list.

I assume the same treatment if I come to you with an offer, and I dont like a punch to the nose, so the offer will be a good one. I enter the deal thinking about what is in it for you, and I rarely waste anyone's time.

I have a very low opinion of predators, unfortunately vetoing trades that are uneven or open discussion may only serve to embarrass the loser, so I wont call you out publicly. You'll just have to live with the thought of getting no respect, despite your standings in the fantasy baseball league.

If you get to the third strike with me, you'll know what I think of both you and your offer.

160

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:01

Does anyone know which teams are which?

Previous owners: StLCards, MBJ, Code Cracker, BJ21
Current owners: Jaydog MJD, Slizz, Youngroman

161

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:15

Got em.

Jaydog = MBJ
Slizz = Code
MJD = BJ21
Roman = Cards

162

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:15

This is best I have: http://www.angelfire.com/games5/gurupie/basemanagers.html

I think it is:
Code: slizz
Cards: YR
mbj: Jaydog
bj21: mjd

163

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:22

More questions, going back a year.

CC and Cards co-ran a team in 2005. When it split, who kept it? Who got the other team?

Also Promize, Khahan, RFS, and THK. They became GO, Darkside, and Trip. Who was who?

164

Guru
ID: 330592710
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:25

mjd addded Raisel Iglesius today, who I believe is a prospect of R9. I emailed him.

Part of the problem may be that he's misspelled in the prospect list on the league page. If you searched for Iglesius, you wouldn't find anything. You'd have to spell it "Inglesius".

Unless, of course, there really is a prospect named "Raisel Inglesius." If so, never mind...

165

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, May 13, 2015, 16:47

Isn't it Iglesias?

166

Guru
ID: 330592710
Wed, May 13, 2015, 17:23

Yep. Even I can't see straight, apparently.

167

Toral
ID: 143242315
Wed, May 13, 2015, 17:34

159 My trades are almost always about an offer made, usually by me or sometimes by one of a few whom I know to be fair traders, either accepted straight up or concluded after one or two counter-offers.

Alas my approach is probably not optimal. It has now been conclusively demonstrated that you can succeed by making offers that get you slapped in the face 99 times so long as you get the "Yes" the 100th time.

I never try to puff the player I'm trading or dump on the player I want to acquire (why would I want such a bum?). I assume that managers, especially in a league like this, know as much as I do, or can easily find or figure out what they don't know. Occasionally I will throw in a (factual) piece of information that I regard as irrelevant ("Joe has hit 50 points better in the second half in both of the last 2 years!")

Once I actually didn't an accept an offer that I should have because it was accompanied by arguments so fatuous and ridiculous that I felt compelled to refute them in detail. By the time I was finished I'd talked myself out of a deal! (Otherwise bluehen and I would have one completed deal on our record!)

I always assume that a person coming to me with an unsolicited offer is trying to rip a piece of me off.

There is one situation where you need to make an unsolicited offer in great comprehensiveness and detail: when you're trying to pull off a blockbuster. No point breaking the ice by just asking, "Say, have you ever thought of trading Mike Trout?"

168

Toral
ID: 143242315
Wed, May 13, 2015, 17:43

As long as we're correcting prospect names, I own Nomar Mazara, not Nomar Maraza.

169

darkside
ID: 1425647
Wed, May 13, 2015, 18:01

I took over the Promize team.

170

darkside
ID: 81492120
Wed, May 13, 2015, 18:09

I'm of the Bean school of thought when it comes to trading. I'm not aggressive and don't usually end up making deals with aggressive traders. If the first offer I get is a joke, I'm probably not even going to bother with a counter. If the first offer is fair, I'll give it a go, but don't get into haggling. This approach, I'm sure, will keep my teams from being elite. That's ok with me. I still have fun.

Also, trading for closers is just like going to Vegas. You may win, you may lose, but the house will always win in the long run. Closers just don't last. I'll never pay a high price in a trade for a c-loser.

If anyone's looking for a straight shooter who likes to get deals done, give Great One a call. I think 98% of my trades have been with him.

171

Species
ID: 42011619
Wed, May 13, 2015, 19:49

My trading style tends to be inquisitive. I like to ask a manager what his or her intentions are first before I make specific offers. A little effort to understand a potential trading partner's perspective goes a long way.

When I am rebuilding, I seek out those who are going for it, identify what assets they have I desire, and craft my inquiries around their priorities. A perfect example was the Matt Harvey trade in 2014. Jaydog was giving it one last shot, and I gave him 3 keepers for one. Sadly other players' injuries and bad seasons made it not work out so well for him, but at this point in 2015 it has worked out swimmingly for me.

When I am contending, it is more delicate. I have some highly valuable prospects.....but if the team I am approaching isn't rebuilding or doesn't have the patience to wait for them or see the value in them that I do, it's a non-starter and I move on. A great example was Judy last year -- I didn't take notice that she already had SS/3b prospects -- so we were a bad match because the assets of the greatest value I had were not needs of hers.

90% of the time I am initiating the trade idea. I usually identify who I might be targeting and ask what assets I think I have that I am most willing to part with that I think fit the other team and why. It is very rare I just shoot a trade offer out of the blue.

172

mjd
ID: 23182817
Wed, May 13, 2015, 21:08

164- I know that I searched before picking him up. Moved him to my bench tonight and dropped for tomorrow. He pitched a nice game tonight.

I used to think about the post trade fallout, but now I don't care.

I prefer a trade that has a benefit for both teams. Regardless of what the peanut gallery has to say. As long as both teams are satisfied.

173

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Thu, May 14, 2015, 19:11

Singleton with a 4-6, 2 HRs and 10 RBIs stat line last night. That's now 11 HRs for the year at Triple-A Fresno. Call him up Houston!

On another note - If anyone rebuilding is interested in Drew Smyly, let me know.

174

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, May 15, 2015, 14:57

Calling up Franco.

That's Franco, Russell and Bradley up for me this season. Tonight it's Bradley v Franco, but I didn't get Franco up in time for my team...

Got 8 keepers set for 2016 (baring injury):
Freeman, Gordon, Russell, Franco, Ozuna, Garcia, Bradley, Salazar. The oldest is Gordon at 27...

Just saying...

175

Judy
ID: 54203110
Fri, May 15, 2015, 15:01

Cobb might be in the mix as well...

176

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 15, 2015, 17:23

Folks, I've been doing some research into the history of G20. I have something close to resembling all-time standings in a spreadsheet that we'll post here eventually.

Did you know that my franchise was once run by someone called APerfect10? And that he quit the league over a controversial trade?

Did you know that we didn't used to have a prospect draft?

Did you know that a guy named StLCards tied for a G20 championship with Ref? And that he has been part of 3 different G20 franchises?

By the numbers, the top franchises in G20 history are: Ref (205.5), Jaydog/MBJ/Nerve (158.5), and BMD (154.5).

To whet your appetite, here is the list of franchise owners:
Blue Hen/Trip/THK/Smartone/APerfect10
Ref
Guru/Azdbacker
WG/Yokel
Toral
Allhair/Bean
Slizz/Code/Cards
Darkside/Promize
Nerf/PD
Roman/Cards/RFS
Goatlocker/Coyotes
R9
MJD/BJ21/Cards
Jaydog/MBJ/Nerve
Species/Baldwin
BMD
Judy/Twarpy/DaveR
Tosh
Pete
GO/Chris/Khahan/ksoze

177

GO
ID: 344132921
Fri, May 15, 2015, 23:08

Pretty neat BH. I look forward to seeing how bad my franchise has been. I've been pretty bad in this league. I had one good year and contended the same year I believe I won G20NBA and G24 and was going for the Grand Slam but even that one I crumbled.

178

beastiemiked
ID: 9441167
Sat, May 16, 2015, 08:41

Packing it in. Whole team available minus my best young guys(Pederson, Wacha, Rodon).

Adrian Beltre
Papelbon
Axford
Russell Martin
Victor Martinez
Lackey
Plus much more!

Looking for draft picks, prospect picks, or prospects.

179

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, May 16, 2015, 21:02

Trade:

Sam gets papelbon, afford and bmd 2016 supplemental #14

Bmd gets Cobb, buehrle, Sam 2016 supplemental #8 and 2016 prospect #1.

Let the complaints begin!!!!

180

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, May 16, 2015, 21:03

That's axford. Darn auto spell...

181

beastiemiked
ID: 9441167
Sat, May 16, 2015, 21:15

Confirm

182

GO
ID: 444591621
Sat, May 16, 2015, 22:59

Judy giving up Phillies all time saves leader and fan favorite Jonny Papelbon?! oh no!

183

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:10

Nice trade. The prospect pick is key here, since BMD is a great prospect hound and it could be pretty early, although Judy may move up with more trades like this.

I'm not sure BMD will keep Cobb since he could also miss a bunch of 2016, but maybe others disagree. Buehrle could be a decent trade chip at the deadline. And an 8th rounder is an added bonus.

From Judy's side, this fills her biggest need, without giving up any of her core. Again, the big piece is a prospect pick, but we know how Judy feels about those.

Pretty even trade, slight edge to Judy but depends how you feel about Cobb.

184

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:12

I'm still looking to make a deal. Likely need another closer. Have a bunch of prospects to offer, or youth.

185

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:18

Oh, no GO.

I am getting super jerk Papelbon. Cannot stand the man, but need his stats. Probably will end up keeping him too...ugh.

186

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:28

Two of my prospects are up: Franco and Russell, as well as Bradley who I held in the bigs all of last year, waiting.
So I still have one prospect pick. Works for me.

Papelbon more valuable than Cobb right now as #9 keep. I HATE the saves category. Buehrle too inconsistent so far. I like the other SP I have better.

187

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:58

I tried as hard as I could to trade Papelbon before the season and I received no offers. I get why people don't like him but he seems to always deliver. He was one of my first prospects so trading him is a little bittersweet.

I value prospect picks pretty high. Guys like Kris Bryant, Mike Trout, Bryce Harper are never going to be found in the supplemental draft. It's unlikely Judy's pick turns into a lottery prospect pick but there have been some very solid players that have been drafted in the prospect draft in picks 10-20.

It sounds like Axford is going to be given a leash in Colorado but you never know. I might've been able to get a bit more for him if I waited, but if he bombs tomorrow or in a few days it would be very hard to get much for him.

Cobb was more a less a throw in to move the supplemental pick back a round. I like the idea of keeping him but if he's out til June or July of next year I might just let him go back to the draft pool. He gives me options next March so it was worth the slightly worth draft pick.

Still looking to deal more. I'm not always going to seek out the most value I can get but rather take any decent offer that comes along.

188

GO
ID: 394581622
Sat, May 16, 2015, 23:58

Well maybe he'll get traded to save elsewhere and it'll work out for both of us since I have Giles.

189

Judy
ID: 54203110
Sun, May 17, 2015, 08:43

Wow beastie, you had Paps as your prospect? How far back was that???

190

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, May 18, 2015, 10:27

More fun facts:
- The Yokel/WG franchise is actually 4th (154, right behind BMD). Yokel was quite successful, never finishing below 10th from 2003 to 2011. But in 2012, he fell to 19th, and I imagine priorities shifted, and WG took over with two finishes in the money.
- STLCards tied for the title in the first season of G20 with the current MJD franchise. But he never found the money in any other season, across three franchises (the other two are currently Slizz and Roman).
- As best I can tell, Ref has the most finishes in the money, with 11 in 12 years. Nobody else has more than 5. Team with 5: BH/Trip/THK/Smartone/AP10, Toral, BMD, Pete. 5 franchises have 4 seasons in the money. Nerf/PD has never finished in the money (and, I believe, didn't contribute to the pot for several years). Goatlocker/Coyotes have done it exactly once, and several teams have 2.

191

beastiemiked
ID: 9441167
Mon, May 18, 2015, 20:48

Bh, I looked for the original prospect draft but couldn't find it. I think it would be neat looking back at the prospect drafts to see all the busts and great picks.

Also looked for the original draft but only found a dead link. I wonder if any original draftee is still on their original team.

192

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, May 19, 2015, 09:33

Trying to figure out how to best post links to this stuff.

That said, the 2004 prospect draft went like this:
1.1 David Wright, Twarpy (pick acquired with Larry Walker for Brian Giles and picks)
1.2 Delmon Young, Twarpy
1.3 Brad Thompson, Promize
1.4 Scott Kazmir, Tosh
1.5 Felix Hernandez, coldwater
1.6 Ryan Howard, allhair
1.7 Ervin Santana, AP10 (later BH's franchise)
1.8 Bryan Bullington, PD
1.9 Stephen Drew, BMD
1.10 Jose Capellan, Code
1.11 Jered Weaver, Pete

Taken later in the draft: Michael Aubrey, Clint Nageotte (by Ref), Clint Everts, Kyle Sleeth, Eric Duncan, Merkin Valdez, Brendan Claussen, Royce Ring, Michael Hinkley, Andy Sisco, Greg Miller, and Twarpy's pick at 3.16, Robinson Cano.

193

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, May 19, 2015, 09:35

Link. Enjoy.

194

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, May 19, 2015, 10:47

Yeah. Way to go Baldwin. Missing your picks,including 1.02!!! Jackass!! LOL

A real manager came in after that.

Cole Hamels 2.15

195

beastiemiked
ID: 94171912
Tue, May 19, 2015, 13:17

Ugh Ian Stewart. What a bum! He stringed me along for a few years wasting a prospect slot and keeper spot. It's crazy to think that one guy can have such a negative force on your team.

196

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, May 19, 2015, 19:30

Calling up Kang for the first time. I see that he just got 3B elegibity

If he continues to get playing time, I could be in a position to fill someone's need with a trade.

197

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Tue, May 19, 2015, 23:39

John Lackey 2.96 ERA 1.14 ERA. Would look good pitching for a contender. He's no longer a bum.

198

darkside
ID: 81492120
Thu, May 21, 2015, 22:40

The trade between me and WG is structured like the Rex Brothers deal from a few years back. It was based on the number of saves Brothers got. The setup was saves - round pick:

00-9 - 8th
10-19 - 7th
20-29 - 6th
30-39 - 5th
40+ - 4th

The only wrinkle here is that WG doesn't have a 2016 4th or 5th. So, the deal is that if he trades for another 4th/5th and that level pick is triggered, I get that 4th/5th. Otherwise, if he doesn't have the appropriate round pick, I'll get his 3rd round for anything greater than 30 saves from Ramos.

199

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 22, 2015, 09:38

I am looking to make a similar deal for a closer. If you can guarantee he'll get 30 saves this year, I'll give you a third rounder.

200

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 22, 2015, 10:02

For #198, on what date does the transaction actually take place? October 4? Are we basing this on what picks WG has on Oct 4, when we'll know the answer to the saves question?

201

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 22, 2015, 10:03

Also for #198, is the 2015 total season saves, or rest of season saves?

202

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 22, 2015, 10:30

Not trying to be a jerk, but this is not Nam--there are rules.

What gives with starting Ellsbury, Wazaap Guy? I know why, but I dont know that it was reasonable for you to drop Nicasio and pick up Hechevarria without someone not on the DL to fill the OF slot. You've since picked up Barnes, but thats 3 days of breaking the rules in a pre-meditated fashion.

Im not really down with that, even if youre obviously trying to win.

203

bmd
ID: 50442212
Fri, May 22, 2015, 13:05

That rule is still in place? Can we please vote to shelf it?

204

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, May 22, 2015, 13:10

198 confirmed
200 pre keeper declaration if that is acceptable to the league
201 total
202 I've got no justification or excuse for you. Early games and deadlines is as close to one as I can offer. Happy to accept any punishment the league or commish hands down

205

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Fri, May 22, 2015, 19:00

Fun fact, those are the exact words Darkside used in 2010 during the 2010 Hanrahan fiasco, word for word except the names. But I agree with 203; time to kill the rule.

206

Species
ID: 54740122
Fri, May 22, 2015, 19:02

My feeling is this: the intent of the rule is mostly to prevent tanking or the stashing / hoarding of prospects. WG is doing neither.

Barring a wave of opinions to the contrary, I would choose to give him a pass, while reminding him and everyone that you must have a legal roster of eligible (ie - not DL'd, not in the minors) players sufficient to field a complete lineup.

207

GO
ID: 444591621
Sat, May 23, 2015, 00:15

Got a couple feelers on Prince. Yes he's available for a young and/or injured combo.

208

bmd
ID: 50442212
Sat, May 23, 2015, 21:37

Bmd sends Jeff Samardzija and his last round 2016 supplemental pick(lowest pick still in my possession).
WG sends 2016 3rd round supplemental pick.

209

WG
ID: 552431321
Sat, May 23, 2015, 23:15

Confirmed

210

Species
ID: 42011619
Sun, May 24, 2015, 12:42

Trades updated. Please review.

211

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, May 24, 2015, 16:59

Ok, great so I can dump my Catcher then hoard other positions I can actually keep? The rule goes beyond tanking. Ir forces people to make tough decisions.

212

Bmd
ID: 44162416
Sun, May 24, 2015, 17:16

Ref, that's tanking. You really think it's right to handicap teams that are trying to win? We are pretty good at policing this league with regards to tanking. The rule does little besides force teams to always field a healthy lineup. If somebody wants to tank there are 50 better ways. They can try those and then get kicked out of our league.

213

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, May 24, 2015, 18:17

bmd, no, not tanking. There are several times when I was at the top, where I could not pickup someone because I had no one to drop and keep my team legal. I usually have bad catchers and those are the ones I'd love to drop to pick up the pitcher du jour, etc. Also several times a player got hurt and had to drop someone I didn't want to so my team could stay legal. I'm saying you can definitely get a competitive advantage by not having legal players starting/available for your team each day.

214

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sun, May 24, 2015, 18:49

I think the rule should stand as is. I get looking towards the future, but for the integrity of the league, everyone should have to field a full and active lineup. I'm 100% opposed to any idea of allowing someone to leave a slot open..unless they have hit the max GP or IP.

215

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sun, May 24, 2015, 19:23

Ref, shouldn't that be encouraged? Just because you couldn't do it in the past doesn't mean we should keep the rule. I think the competitive advantage is moot since it would be legal for any team to do it. It adds an extra layer of strategy. It's not a rule in football or hoops why in baseball?

If it's about tanking then a minimum game and inning limit would be much more effective.

Where does the rule stop? Let's say I'm ahead of pace at the catcher slot but my primary catcher is put on the 7 day DL slot, my backup catcher happens to be on the DL too. Do I really have to pick up a 3rd catcher even though I'm going to easily reach the game limits with my other 2 catchers? I'd have to waste a roster spot on a catcher that stinks and waste precious games played on him when my other two catchers are way better.

216

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sun, May 24, 2015, 21:12

Bmd, that's an extreme example but yes I would say you would have to find a scrub at catcher to fill the role. I didn't like what wg did last week, even though I know he is trying to win. Fielding a healthy and active lineup should be the goal for everyone.

217

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, May 26, 2015, 09:36

Folks, looks like I am way ahead of pace in pitcher innings, so would like to turn my pitching into hitting. Looking for upgrades on Moustakas, Granderson, or Fowler (or perhaps Zunino, but can't see too many ways for that to happen), or a closer or other value.

Pitchingwise, I'm really only attached to Cole and Odorizzi. Everyone else is available, including Price, Hutchison, Weaver, Cosart, Peavy, McCullers, or Foltynewicz. Could also offer Tyler Kolek (prospect), or perhaps another prospect like Moncada or Devers in the right deal.

218

GO
ID: 444591621
Wed, May 27, 2015, 22:16

BH - are you related to Zunino or something we don't know about?

219

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, May 28, 2015, 09:13

I assuming that wasn't a denigration of Zunino (watch it, buddy), but rather wondering why I consider an upgrade unlikely.

Wasn't implying that Zunino is untouchable; was merely referring to the fact that it's unlikely I'll actually spend something for a catcher who is better than my 23 year old with power.

There are a bunch of catchers who are better than Zunino (less so when considering age and power potential), but none of them are too high on my list of trade targets.

That said, if you have an offer that will upgrade Zunino, let's hear it.

220

beastiemiked
ID: 224472812
Thu, May 28, 2015, 13:47

Russell Martin available for a 4th round supplemental pick.

221

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, May 29, 2015, 12:38

Thanks to Roman for a detailed and useful response to a trade offer - big props to you.

222

Judy
ID: 29453020
Sat, May 30, 2015, 21:05

I swear every time I sit Chris carter he hits a hr...

223

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, May 31, 2015, 15:09

I also swear that every time I sit Peralta, he homers!!!

224

Judy
ID: 35493114
Mon, Jun 01, 2015, 22:56

So now I sit Freddie because he has been in a mini slump and he hits a 2 run HR. Anyone wanna manage my starting lineup for me???

225

slizz
ID: 43320199
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 06:11

Judy - I will. Don't get upset if Avisail Garcia winds up on my team somehow ;)

226

GO
ID: 432341310
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 14:05

Time to shake it up...

Trade
WG gets
Gordon
Vogt
Gio
Fiers

GO gets
Dickerson
Swihart
Dahl
A. Sanchez
random player

227

slizz
ID: 43320199
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 14:33

Instant Analysis:

Win / Win for each. Long term (2016 - beyond), GO is going to come out ahead but I doubt WG cares much.

WG gets much needed pitching help and significantly lowers his pitching standard deviation. He should get a massive uptick in wins, era, and whip which gives him a legitimate shot at BH (should he falter). Once he gets Jacoby back he will, again, rack up some SB and continue to dominate hitting. Going forward, their respective rosters look as follows:

WG 2016:

1B - Crush
2B - Kipnis
3B - Donaldson
OF - Bryce
OF - Jacoby
OF - Gordon
SP - Lester
SP - Shark

Other options:
C - Vogt / D'Arnaud
SP - Ross
RP - Ramos?
RP - Rondon?

Plus #4 prospect JP Crawford and 2 2016 picks.

GO 2016:

C - Swihart
1B - Prince
2B - Baez
3B - Panda
OF - Dickerson
OF - Betts
SP - Shelby
SP - Walker
RP - Giles

9th alternate if Swihart has prospect elig:

Moore / Marisnick / Barrett (if he ends up closing somewhere)

228

GO
ID: 432341310
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 15:09

Prince still available...

229

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 16:12

Bring it!!

Excited about this trade. For WG, there are obvious benefits, particularly if Vogt and Fiers are more Jekyll and less Hyde. For GO, it's a clear push to rebuild, although Swihart and Dahl are not two guys I'd have targeted. Why not Crawford?

On the balance, this favors WG by a bit. But we'll call it a win-win, since GO definitely used his older guys to get younger guys. As usual, he's made several impactful trades and his usual bevy of timely and effective waiver moves. Good work!

WG and Toral sure are giving it a good fight. Toral's got some firepower, and WG is always a contender. Species has struggled, which is unfortunate after that great draft. Pete and Slizz are looming, and they're probably the next two best teams. It's a shame for Pete - if he spent one more season rebuilding, it'd probably help him long term with Bryant and Stanton. But can't do that when you're in the money. Is anybody down below going to join them? Darkside has gone from 18th to 11th in a week, so he's the big mover right now.

Still looking to make a deal, most likely for a closer or upgrade an outfielder. Jered Weaver, Drew Hutchison, Yoan Moncada, and Tyler Kolek are all very much on the table. Let me know!

230

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 18:37

I am not at the bottom in saves!!!!

231

darkside
ID: 81492120
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 22:08

Just a heads up to the commishes--Alex Guerrero needs a (1) next to him since I've called him up once.

Thanks very much for continuing to put in the effort to run the league. It's generally a time consuming and thankless job, but we do appreciate it!

Also, I love the WG/GO trade--good work, fellas!

232

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 22:09

My team is driving me nuts!! I sit Franco as he is 2/17 this last week. So tonight he goes 2/4, scores 2 runs, has 2 RBI and hits a HR --ON MY BENCH!!

I need a ouiji board to figure them out!

Oh, also, paps gets the W and I need him to get a SV!!!

233

GO
ID: 444591621
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 23:25

Was Swihart called up at any point?

234

WG
ID: 552431321
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 12:08

Nope

235

WG
ID: 552431321
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 13:09

Nope

236

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 20:57

And it keeps happening... I put Peralta in the util slot and bench carter, who, OF COURSE, hits a bloody HR! At least Freddie in the 1B got 2 HR.

An embarrassment of HR riches but how to predict who will hit them when is driving me nuts!!

AAAAACCCCKKKKK!

237

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 22:39

Carter hit two homers on your bench tonight, not one.

238

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 22:41

Oh and Franco homered too.

239

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jun 03, 2015, 23:21

Yea, I just saw that. I figure I have 10 homers by my bench guys.

This is getting ridiculous.

240

Nerfherders
ID: 2211442615
Thu, Jun 04, 2015, 22:59

I wish I had enough viable bench guys to even consider benching guys like Freeman or Carter.

241

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 11:13

Nerf, just sent you a trade offer with a guy you can leave on your bench.

242

Bean
ID: 14147911
Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 11:22

Screw that Nerf, I'm sending you an offer with a guy you can leave on your DL....wait we dont have a DL, nevermind.

243

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 21:07

Well,waddaya know, Franco hits a HR and he's not on my bench!!!

Shame I have to sit russell, with Carter, Freeman and Peralta doing well.

244

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 23:09

Cuddyer's turn to HR from bench... Carter 0/3...
Just keeping you all up to date...

245

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sat, Jun 06, 2015, 10:31

240: preaching to the choir, my friend.

246

GO
ID: 444591621
Sat, Jun 06, 2015, 11:15

Seems just like yesterday I overpaid in deals by throwing in Nathan and Romo as valuable trade chips. Gotta love cLosers.

247

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 09:23

Nathan did get a full season of saves in there. And Romo was considered elite and continue to be elite everywhere other than saves. And yeah, those were throw-ins for much larger deals. As it stands, Nathan alone for Baez was likely overpaying.

248

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 09:31

Heh, looks like I "pulled a Judy" yesterday with Granderson. On my bench in favor of Barnes @Col. And he hit two homers.

249

slizz
ID: 43320199
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 12:19

TRADE ANNOUNCEMENT

Ref gives:

Drew Storen
Steve Cishek
Evan Scribner
Odrisamer Despaigne

Slizz gives:

Oswaldo Arcia
Josh Hamilton
Tony Watson
Bruce Rondon

No picks. Ref please confirm.

250

slizz
ID: 43320199
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 12:20

I love it. "Pulling a Judy"

251

slizz
ID: 43320199
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 12:51

Once the trade clears I will be dropping Despaigne and calling up Correa.

252

Ref
ID: 55156513
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 13:24

Dropping Despaigne? I thought he was your target!!! ;)

253

slizz
ID: 43320199
Mon, Jun 08, 2015, 14:28

Ok Scribner! Despaigne did get me a win last week!

254

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Jun 13, 2015, 03:31

Here we go again.
Starters: 0 runs, 0 HR, 2 RBI
Bench: Carter 2 R, 1 HR, 1 RBI
Prado 1 R, 1 HR, 1 RBI
Russell 1 RBI

SHEESH!!!!!

255

beastiemiked
ID: 535371419
Sun, Jun 14, 2015, 20:39

Anyone interested in Matt Adams? Looking for a bag of balls.

256

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 16, 2015, 16:07

Great One, you've been invalid for two days. Please pick up a pitcher.

257

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Jun 17, 2015, 11:26

One of the issues on prospects is that it thins out the FA pool and doesn't allow managers to take chances on players or rebuild. But my biggest problem with them are the ones who are playing and even playing well who get left on FA wire. Now that really hurts the league. For instance, there could be a few players who are on rosters now available to teams that would help them. For whatever reason, teams don't want to do well, or don't want to drop someone they have now, or whatever--I just think that is crazy.

I'd like to see some kind of rule that says, if your prospect is called up to the majors (and not on DL etc), you have to put him on your team. I know this going to be met with huge pushback and resistance, but that is my opinion.

258

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jun 17, 2015, 12:16

Thanks Ref. Happy to talk about it.

The point of prospects is to allow you to keep young guys without impacting your roster, right? A rule like the one above kind of kills that. I only see three viable solutions that work standalone or combined, none of which I'd vote for.

- Replace prospect slots with additional bench slots. If you really like a prospect, use the slot on him. Have to consider keeper functionality here, not sure how it'd work.
- Lower the prospect limit. Why is it 300 AB, which is most of a season? Why not 150 AB, like ROY eligibility? Or 50?
- When someone exceeds limits during the season, THEN they must be called up.

Again, I wouldn't vote for any of the three, but I can see those as actual "working" solutions.

259

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jun 17, 2015, 20:41

Russell, HR on bench...

260

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jun 17, 2015, 22:32

More russell: 2 R, 3 RBI
17-0 cubbies win.

261

Beastiemiked
ID: 48571812
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 13:07

I'm with Ref. I just don't understand why people aren't immediately calling up their prospects. We have very forgiving rules if they get demoted back to the minors. There's no way whoever has Tomas as a prospect has 25 better guys than him. Same with Gallo.

262

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 13:27

I'd rather gamble on, say, Mike Foltynewicz, than use the spot on Gallo, especially when I already have Mike Moustakas playing third, who is almost as good as Gallo (at least for now).

You might argue that I am trying to game the system, similar to playing without a catcher. I can see the logic there, even if I don't agree with it. But not that I'm not trying to win.

And what would you do about Schwarber? Would I be required to call him up if he's on a major league roster?

263

Bean
ID: 14147911
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 13:29

Have I somehow broken a league rule by not promoting Tomas? If I have, I will be glad to correct it after a non-ambiguous rule is cited that has been enforced uniformly.

Meanwhile, there is nothing to be gained by my promoting him, there is only something to be lost.

264

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 13:51

Bean is definitely within the rules now, and at best, we're talking about a potential rule change for next year.

265

Beastiemiked
ID: 48571812
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 14:42

Bean, what is to be lost? You can demote him at any time.

266

Beastiemiked
ID: 48571812
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 14:50

Well schwarber is 10x times better than Zunino. No idea why you like that dead weight but more power to you.

Obviously there'd be some leeway. Not sure what the proper solution should be. Having teams let their prospects sit on the wire when they should be starting is probably not what we envisioned when we created the prospect system.

267

WG
ID: 552431321
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 15:28

Bean would lose one free opportunity to send him back down. The bigger issue there I think is the lack of disincentive for not fielding your best team. Whatever incentive is introduced to still try to finish as high as you can would have to outweigh both more lottery balls for bad finish + extra opportunities to demote. Maybe change who gets the most chances at early picks? But then if 10th place gets the most then 8th and 9th start tanking. No perfect solution.

268

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 16:06

Even though it hurts my current team's situation, I might support a rule that says when a player passes a threshold (maybe 50 or 150), he is no longer a prospect and must be called up or lost. I might also support a rule that eliminates callups - if you want him on your roster, you eliminate his prospect eligibility. I'd also support eliminating 10th keepers - either you call him up and keep him, or keep him as a prospect and lose a prospect pick.

As for Zunino, he is tied for 8th in home runs among catchers, and younger than anyone else in the top 20. Pretty sure that's a reasonable player to roster. And when Schwarber's in Iowa next week, even more so.

269

Beastiemiked
ID: 48571812
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 20:45

Correct me if I'm wrong but can't you:
-call a player up.
-send him down.
-call him up.
-send him down.
-call him up and can't be sent back down.

270

Beastiemiked
ID: 48571812
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 20:48

Zunino tied for 8th in homeruns reminds me of the blurb MLB.com had up for Omar Infante about his all star worthiness.

271

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 21:10

Bh likes collecting prospects, but not utilizing them and would rather pinwheel through the FA pool. He's obliterating the league so I guess there is a method to the madness.

272

Bean
ID: 14147911
Thu, Jun 18, 2015, 21:33

<268> I thought there was already a rule concerning the threshold and how its applied:

"Before the season at the keeper deadline all hitters must have less than 300 ABs and pitchers less than 110 IP or 40 GP or they must be moved to your active roster or released. Managers must monitor their own prospects. If they are later to have found to be over the max. at that deadline, the player will be immediately removed as a prospect and put on waivers. "

Are you talking about an additional application of a different threshold to be removed from prospect eligibility?

273

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 00:50

BMD - I don't often agree with you but you hit the nail on the head in 266. But look at the history of BH - he seldom, if at all, has called up any of his prospects in season regardless of their performance. Since he already owns the players rights, he can do exactly as Pete said: Pinwheel through the FA pool and potentially find another keeper like McCullers or continue to make "Folty" decisions.

We can rectify this issue by doing the following:

-eliminate the number of call ups and allow it to be unlimited.
-prospect is called up by the big league club, you need to make space for them.
-prospect is sent down, you can release and still retain their rights until they pass the thresholds established in our by-laws.

Doing so eliminates the loophole that we can take advantage of.

274

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 10:49

I think it is total BS when people tank to get the best draft position possible. I should be in 19th place but I don't believe in tanking and am fielding my best lineup possible ON A DAILY BASIS. Maybe the fantasy Gods will see this and give me a lottery ball next year.

As I said before, it is crap that we have nice players who no one can touch because people are either tanking or in such good shape they can leave them on the wire. As far as taking up one of your callups away. you get 3 of them.

I think Slizz and bh's ideas might be combined with mine to make something palatable by all.

So here is my proposal:
1. If a prospect is called up to the majors, they must be put on your team.
2. If they go on DL or sent to minors they can be sent down.
3. We have unlimited call-ups.
4. We cut in half the prospect limits to be in line with their draft eligible limits: (A draft-eligible prospect is defined as a hitter that has less than 150 AB or a pitcher with less than 55 IP or 20 GP).

So once they hit their limits they will already be on a MLB team and will lose prospect status. This doesn't have much of an impact in that regard as if they hit their limits they can't be kept as a prospect anyway.

275

beastiemiked
ID: 19581910
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:08

I think #1 should be a bit looser like "if a prospect is called up you have 10 days to roster him unless he's sent back down".

I definitely think the bigger issue is "tanking". I'm all for allowing teams to rebuild but there needs to be some incentives for managing your team well eventhough you have no shot at the money. It shouldn't be a race to the bottom.

I've mentioned it before but I would love if we had some "losers" fee to the bottom 3 teams. Make it super small but enough where teams at the bottom won't want to finish there.

276

Bean
ID: 14147911
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:10

Look, I didnt realize that my keeping Tomas on my prospect roster was such a big deal for so many people. I will move him to my active roster now, and maybe people can quit whining.

In the future, if I am doing something that is an affront to your sense of fair play, but isn't documented by the written rules, I would appreciate not being publicly shamed for it, send me a private e-mail. You guys need to get your shit together, and document the rules you are playing by if you expect me to play by them. I am not a mind reader.

277

Bean
ID: 14147911
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:16

I am turning in my modem today as I am heading back to Colorado Springs now that my Cavs blew it (been at the playoffs here in Cleveland).

I will have only limited internet access, so if yet another of my players gets injured, he will remain in my lineup until Monday, so sorry if thats a screw up, but there is little I can do about it.

278

Species
ID: 6031912
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:26

Depending upon the rookie, there are legitimate reasons for not rostering them when they are called up to the majors......they're rookies and might have been rushed, lowering their chances of making an instant impact (Buxton to me is a prime example - ready for prime time in the field....but going to need some time at the plate). Not every rookie is as ready as Correa, Pederson and Bryant (and apparently Schwarber's bat.....good lord).

Considering removing restrictions on callups makes sense. If I do not increase my risk of having my prospect rights lost, I am significantly more likely to roster a prospect than otherwise.

I would just like a better understanding of Ref's issue. Whether the prospect is called up to their team is immaterial to the FA pool -- they aren't available to anyone anyway.

Admittedly Tomas (way to bully Bean into calling him up Ref....hahahaha) stuck out like a sore thumb......but outside of him, what was the big deal?

279

Species
ID: 6031912
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:33

276: Don't apologize. No way. You aren't wrong.

But realize that pretty much our best banter starts with some good whining.......particularly from blue hen. It's nothing personal, and we as a league evolve through the ensuing discussion.

I am supportive of some method of encouraging more competition designed to promote activity and avoidance of low finishes. But it also can't be so onerous as to materially restrain a team's ability to rebuild.

280

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 11:56

Not directed at Bean at all. And if you think I bullied him, you are simply not being as alert as most when they scour the barren FA wire. This has been going on for many many seasons.

Go look at the top FAs owned and 4 of the 5 are prospects. Gallo is owned by 78% of all ESPN teams. In a 20 team league that is nuts. Then you have Buxton, Lindor and Shwarber. There have been a few prospects called up recently who were sticking out as well.

The issue is NOT that no one else can have that prospect, but by using players on your roster who may otherwise be on someone else's roster limits other teams. So, if bh really thinks Zunino really is the 2nd coming, then he would keep him when Schwarber comes up. In reality, he's not keeping him, so it really doesn't matter but another team could use him. Gallo is one of the best players in the game right now but is sitting on the FA wire. Why? so bh can hoard other players. If Mouse is so great he can go to DH or if he doesn't want Gallo in his lineup then put him on his bench. If he really thinks Folty is so great he can cut someone else. Btw, I cut Folty and don't regret it one bit. In reality he is probably hoping he can hype him enough that someone will buy him from him.

Right now it is very tough to play in this league because of the haves and the have nots and teams not wanting to pay (let alone overpay) market value for players to make a run to the top 6. Once people start not having a shot to win it--they simply stop trying to improve their team for the short-term.

I just made a trade that puts all the risk on me instead of the other way around. I had several high pick offers for Storen, but as a Keeper for me, it didn't make sense to move him. Typically you are getting possible keepers and/or picks for non-keepers. Instead I gave away a sure-fire Keeper for hopes at multiple keepers--none of them which would/should be kept as of today by my team. It is possible I gave away a keeper for nothing and my team needs a big re-build. High risk/high reward. In reality, I will probably have to keep at least one of them next year and hope it works out.

I don't agree that you need to get 10 days to add them to their roster because these same people will take all 10 days. With unlimited call-ups, there is no reason to delay. You selected this person as a prospect, so he is your property and you must roster him when he's on a MLB roster or renounce his rights.

281

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 12:27

I would support requirement to call up prospect when he is called up to ML roster, as long as the player can be sent back down whenever he is actually sent down. Some time frame is desirable so that managers have a chance to react. Maybe a week is plenty. But we'd need to allow for times when managers are unavailable.

I would definitely support anti-tanking rules. Species tried to implement something in G20 Hoops last month, but it failed to gain support, largely because the threshold was so lax that it could actually encourage tanking (IMHO).

Bean suggested what I thought was a good idea - that a tanking penalty should result in dropping a team's draft sequence - perhaps by 2 slots. For example, if a team with the first draft pick was subject to a tanking penalty, then that team would end up drafting 3rd. Since the only reason for tanking is to get a better draft pick, this would seem to strike at the motivation to tank.

A tanking penalty could be assessed based on not reaching a GP or IP minimum, or by failing to have a legitimate roster (however defined), or by some other standard(s).

282

beastiemiked
ID: 19581910
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 13:33

Bean I wasnt trying to single you out. There have plenty of other examples but Tomas was one of the most current.

283

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 13:36

I agree again with BMD that they should have a timeframe to make a decision (ex 5 games).

For me - I would like to see more bold trades like WG and GO did...but to be honest, it's not worth it for managers to make bold moves like that for this season given BH's massive (&impressive) lead.

I've spoken with a handful of managers in private who have agreed that it (G20) is boring this season due to lack of activity. Given that, why not create some incentives to finish in the top 3, 4, or even 5?

I thought of these proposals to incentivize G20:

Proposal A:
1st place - extra 1st rd prospect pick (likely 1.21) for following season
2nd place - extra 2nd rd prospect pick at the end of the second rd
3rd place - second to last prospect pick in the third round
Bottom 5 - lottery for extra prospect pick (last pick in the third round)

-or-

Proposal B (modeled after the EPL):
Top 3 finish - sandwich picks at the end of the first round p-draft (kind of like the huge financial boost a team gets from making the Champions League)
4th place - 2nd round p-draft sandwich pick (like the play in to make the champions league)
5th place - 3rd round p-draft (Europa league)
Bottom 5 - lottery for extra prospect pick (last pick in the third round)

-compensatory picks cannot be traded.
-prospect bonus is only good for that year only.

The prize pool isn't a motivator for me to make trades towards the end of the year and I can't imagine it is for anyone else...If I was in striking distance of a prospect bonus, I know I would do everything I could to get it. I imagine a good amount of you would too!

284

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 13:38

Just wanted to get your thoughts on something like that.

Lesser teams would stand to benefit as those teams in the hunt would likely pay for rentals...

Just my two cents.

285

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 13:42

281: You are on the same page as me. The only thing I'd say is that instead of giving a team a week, we notify them just like we do when they have an invalid roster like a DLed player in the lineup, etc. That way, while they are required to be changed asap, obviously, if someone is out of pocket, they aren't going to be penalized, etc. Giving someone a week would give several extra days for teams trying to game the system to do so.

I am absolutely for a tanking penalty. One year instead of removing Twarpy from the league we took his first pick and made him draft last in the first round. I'd like the penalty to be harsher than what they would have been if they didn't tank. Like maybe 10 spots every round and not eligible for lottery. It can be as objective as min games as well as subjective as putting in scrubs to fall, etc. At some point we need to simply remove managers who aren't putting in the effort, IMO.

When I was building these deep leagues, I wanted teams to have to use players they wouldn't normally use in smaller leagues to get by. I also wanted constant activity. The have's would trade away their future to win now and the have-nots would trade away players now to help them in the future. If you couldn't simply find players on the FA wire all the time, it would force trades for impact players. It should be a bidding war.

There shouldn't be teams who are at the top every year. The bottom teams shouldn't be near the bottom every year. But as activity slows, so does this "change of fortune." Instead we have some rich get richer and poor get poorer effect. Apparently pride is not enough incentive.

286

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 14:24

My issue with tanking penalties are that they are very subjective. Sure, games played can be an indicator but what if I play worse players? What if I intentionally stream guys that will get hit? What if I forget to start my good SP when there are early deadlines?

I don't see why 20th has to get the most lottery balls. Why can't 7th get the most? Then 8, 9, etc, and 20th gets 14th most balls (the fewest amount). I would have only picks 15-20 already set based on 6th through 1st place finish. So 14 teams in the lottery. That way a guy in 18th at least has incentive to add drop and actively manage to get to, say, 12th, and improve his chances at the lottery. 5 and 6 might tank to get to 7? Better than 14 teams tanking to get to 20.

I would try to add some safety valves. For one, you can't fall more than, say, five spots below your expected pick based on finish. So 20th would get at least the 6th pick. Additionally, maybe some worst case scenario where if you finish in (bottom 3?) for (2? 3?) years in a row, you get some sort of boost (Extra keeper? Sandwich picks? Choose 1 player from BH's team?).

Thoughts?

287

Species
ID: 54740122
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 14:26

Good discussion.

We have to be very careful in implementing any penalty structures. We have objective standards to consider (GP, IP, bottom 3 finish) ..... and those can result in specific, well defined penalties.

The subjective standards can really only result in removal from the league. It is uncomfortable enough to enforce rules as it is. I want little part in trying to levy penalties just because I "thought" you tanked.

And yes, this year sucks ass. I am pissed and feel trapped. I need a shake up for next year. Who wants to do something big for a premium player? Felix....Harvey.....prospects.....all on the table for a top 20 hitter!!

288

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 14:42

I am surprised by how well these ideas have been met with on here (and in private). I assumed there would be a lot of push back as several do not like change.

I like the say Slizz and WG are thinking outside the box too. WG basically said, "why are we incentivizing finishing at the bottom?" Slizz is basically suggesting the same. Well, the idea is that we want the worst teams to have the better players to come up. But if we are active and do this like it supposed to work, with 9 keepers, we should all be closer. The problem is with the top teams also seemingly to net the top prospects and so many top picks that isn't working. Also, the better managers tend to draft better anyhow--but that's how it should be (This means I'm one of the worst managers!!! LOL!)

I don't know the right answer, but this game has grown stale and boring and it shouldn't have EVER been like this. Something has to be done and it should start by not allowing the top teams to game the rules and the bottom teams (or all teams not in contention) from giving up. As someone who is trying their hardest and back in 19th place, it would help to have a guy actually playing to put on their roster. Taking 8-10 prospects on people's rosters (now reduced to 5 or 6), suddenly there are more players to choose from as well as streaming players for those top teams.

289

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 14:47

To steal from Slizz I might even add a small bonus for 2-6 finishers, like an extra prospect pick at end of draft. So 2nd place gets pick 3.21; and 6th place, who fought hard and didn't tank to get 7th, gets prospect pick 3.26.

290

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 15:01

Bottom line, if you are bad at Fantasy Baseball your team will struggle no matter what. Rarely can you tank one year, draft amazingly well with your high picks the next year, and then never sniff the bottom again. You can, however, actively manage and turn a team around in a short period of time. I went from 19 to 1 in a year. Species went from bottom to top because he's good, and I'm sure he could have accomplished the same if 7th got most balls. Slizz only drafts stud prospects. Bean kills it in other leagues so I know he can do the same here. Again, not calling him out but it's all about incentives. You play within the construct of the rules and incentives in place. Wouldn't you rather be in a world where a guy in 19th has more incentive to rise to 18th than fall to 20th??

291

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 15:15

While I get what Slizz is saying, I really can't think of any reason why BH should get any additional benefit next year after he puts up a 190 and demolishes us all this year. Hell, I'd sooner vote for a rule where the winner can only keep 8 players the following year.

292

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 16:03

Don't get mad at the guy who is #1. BH would deserve it. However, my prospect proposal would be effective beginning 2017 drafts based on the 2016 finishes.

It's no different than rewarding the top sales rep at any company. Not only does he or she have the distinction of finishing atop...they also get the biggest bonus.

293

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 16:23

It's not a matter of anger or deserving but rather one of necessity. Why does he or whoever wins need anything more at all? Wouldnt it be better for the league overall to close that gap between 1 and the field rather than expand it? You could maybe argue more motivation for the field to try and win the next year. I think that motivation is there just as much even without any additional benefit to finishing 1st.

Not sure the sales analogy works in full. No one tanks in sales to get more shots at fresh leads. Enough motivation already exists: don't get fired.

294

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 16:32

I think it absolutely applies with respect to incentives. Only thing that we don't do here is relegation (like the EPL)...Maybe we should 😉

Using Pharma sales as an example:

-we all have the same information and "leads";
-each doctors prescriptions are knowledge for the companies to use in their analytics and routing for the salesmen;
-what they do with it is on them...how hard do they want to work?
-year-end, those who finish atop all get recognized.

Why should they apologize for getting a bigger bonus?

295

WG
ID: 552431321
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 16:55

The company can pay the top salesman a bonus out of the extra profits that salesman brought the company. It can motivate salesmen 2-5 to sell more and bring in more money for the company. The salesmen's successes aren't really mutually exclusive; they can all sell a billion dollars. The company benefits and prospers.

If our league is the company, it paying BH a bonus is necessarily detrimental to the rest of the league. Their potential successes are directly impacted by BH benefiting. I don't think the company prospers in this case.

296

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 17:31

That's a fair point. We are all partners in this league. I just don't feel that it's fair finishing first and not getting a bonus others would.

However, I think we all agree that something should be done to make the league more engaging though...this would be a positive step towards solving it.

anytime you can work glengarry glen ross into a post, you have to do it.

297

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 20:10

I would be in favor of a proposal that would incent folks to continue competing even when the 1st place team is dominating (post 283). My goal this year is top 5. The motivation isn't money. It's to say, "HA!" to some that said I wouldn't compete until at least 2016 after the deal for Giancarlo. :-)

298

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 21:10

Wow, a lot of discussion in just. Few hours.

My team is an odd one this year. Assuming no catastrophic injury, my 2016 keepers (Freeman, Gordon, Russell, Franco, Garcia, Ozuna, Salazar, Bradley, Papelbon) are all set. Aside from Papelbon, they are all babies. I am praying SP Stephenson does not get called up and lose his prospect status...please, no. I have no 2016 room for him!

So I needed to fill in my roster from the draft -- so I did:
Peralta (did not expect Russell to be up so soon and Peralta to be so good, so Russell is on my bench half of the time)
Nathan - DL
Prado - recently on DL, doing OK
Cuddyer - has moments
Markakis - has moments

Carter whom I traded for has been a bust and fills my util slot, but seems to only play well when I bench him. I traded for 2 keepers to try to bolster my SV, but can only keep one.

When I go to look for FA/subs there is nothing left. There is a disincentive to even try. I get lots of web info, notes, tweets, etc, but just cannot do the research to find the hidden gems and quite often when I read of one, and go to the site, he is gone already. So frustrating, there is no way I watch the wires 24/7. I have a life.

While I can give credit to BH for micromanaging his team within the rules to an incredible first place, I lose interest in aiming for any really high position. Maybe BH needs to find a tougher league than ours?

It's not like I am not trying, but it gets really frustrating to find so little available.

Just my 2 cents.

299

GoatLocker
ID: 404291221
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 22:31

Lot of discussion, and don't have time to read all of it.
I'm disagreeing with the if the majors call him up, you have to call him up.

Hedges is the example of why.
He is up, but only playing one of every five or six games.

3 for 30.
I drafted him for a reason, but I'm not about to use a slot on him when he is only getting so little playing time. If that became the way things were, I would call him up and then drop him.

I'd rather do away with prospects than force them to be brought up just because they hit the majors.

300

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 22:58

And oh, yeah. I drafted Peralta and Prado for SS and 3B because Russell and Franco were not expected to play until after the ASG, at the earliest. I just looked over the draft and mine was not that bad considering what I knew. Prado is now on the DL and Franco is raking for a truly crappy team, so that seems settled. Peralta is raking it, so I can't play Russell all the time at util just in case Carter decides to wake up!

I probably have 12 HR and 25 RBI on my bench trying to figure out who to start among those guys. It's a crap shoot and no stat line is gonna be able to tell me who to pick for any given game.

301

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jun 19, 2015, 23:05

What is the rationale for having the position players limit up to 170?

So we could look for FA to fill in when, say, Gordon or Freeman sits? Do we seriously want folks to draft multi position players to fill those extra 72 games. (Actually that is one of the reasons I chose Prado, eligible at both 2B and 3B...to fill in for Dee as well as be a placeholder just in case Franco got the call.)

Can someone give me the reasoning behind this, other than "it's always been that way." Doesn't make sense to me in a league with 9 starters and limited FA pick ups. You almost need a loser on your team to flip on and off to cover those days. What fun is that?

302

GO
ID: 432341310
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 00:15

Establish a cut line like golf. 40 points or some arbitrary percentage from top 3 spots at the All Star break and you compete for MOST ping pong balls the rest of the way. 20th place gets least lottery balls and so on.

Eliminate call up limits. Encourage people to use their prospect.

303

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 08:45

Re 301: I suspect the 170 limit is to keep teams active and encourage waiver pickups. It appears to be working.

As for these proposals: I like the idea of extra p picks for 2-6. No reason to incentivize #1. In fact, I think I could get behind #1 only getting 8 keepers. Or even 7.

Also really like the cut line idea, except that it encourages tanking to hit the cut line. But love the idea of teams fighting for 10th in the second half. That far down the standings, it's not necessarily rich get richer.

304

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 11:38

301: I have answered this numerous times...it was established because I wanted activity. I hate the "draft and play" leagues. People draft their teams and plug their guys in and do nothing unless there is an injury,etc. By having more than 162, in not only forces teams to use multi-position players, but forces some strategy to your roster. Do you want to pick up players playing that day at the risk of cutting a guy or two? If y our guy is D2D, how long are you going to wait to replace him in your lineup?

It all goes back to keeping the league as active as possible. After the first year, it was clear that the pitching and hitting limits were too high. We decided to cut the pitching limits but all attempts and cutting the hitting limits have failed to win enough support. Those hitting limits were never even hit until last year IIRC.

When prospects were introduced, it curtailed a lot of activity as there were less players on the FA wire to choose from since so many prospects were left on there. Adding the 3 call-up rule helped a lot but as you can see to this day, not completely.

About the only good thing I see in prospects is that there is another trade possibility and people don't draft them and keep them on their team for years at a time trying to make sure they get them. Making them be in the database helped a ton but there were always a few who were there but not going to play for awhile. But making them be on your team when they are in the major leagues is akin to drafting them like the s-draft. You immediately put them on your team. If you don't want to put them on your team when they come up, then maybe you should wait for a guy not supposed to come up for a couple years. I don't know, maybe we make this a rule with the caveat that anyone who is called up after Sept 1st does not have to be called up that year? Unlimited call-ups should really ease anyone's fear of having to call them up. Again, you drafted them, so if they don't play a lot and you don't want them taking up space, renounce them and cut them like you do for the S-draft.

As far as incentives go, I am against ever adding any more prospects. If you want to talk about compensatory S-draft picks, I might be convinced, but 60 prospects in a 20 team league already is painful enough (esp. after Sept 1).

305

darkside
ID: 81492120
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 11:43

I am fully on board with incentivising teams to continue to compete even though they know they'll not win or end up in the money. I think it's been a problem much more than just this year, but maybe more people are noticing because blue hen has such a big lead. This isn't new, though.

I don't think I like the 'you must call up a prospect' idea. I've been thinking about sending Alex Guerrero and his .915 OPS back down since he's played like twice in the last two weeks. But, he's definitely keeper material if he could find a full time gig. So, it would suck for a team to have to keep him on their roster, especially if they were competing for one of the top 6 slots.

Like I said, I'm definitely game for changes to the rules to try to keep people engaged and prevent tanking, though. I just don't think the prospects are the problem. The Schwarber/Zunino example is a great one...everyone knows Schwarber is going back down, but to get him on his roster blue hen would have to drop someone that might get snatched up. It's not just as simple as one guy is better than the other. Forcing roster changes sounds a bit heavy handed to me

306

darkside
ID: 81492120
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 11:48

RE: 304 and "If you don't want to put them on your team when they come up, then maybe you should wait for a guy not supposed to come up for a couple years."

The problem will still exist a few years down the line. Guys are going to get a cup of coffee and then sent back down, regardless of it's the year you draft or two years later. Forcing teams to drop a starter for a bench player with a high ceiling doesn't seem to be a way to improve the league, just give everyone else a deeper waiver wire. If it's a deeper waiver wire you want, then we should eliminate prospects altogether, which I would be more than fine with.

307

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 12:18

I'm against the 1st place team having to keep less players. That is counterintuitive.

308

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 13:16

307: I agree
306: Then cut them. You drafted them, play them. They are going to hit their limits anyhow so you are going to have to keep them next year, so if you don't want them, renounce them. What's the difference of cutting them now or later? If they get sent back down to the minors, then you can send them down as well with unlimited call-ups. If your team is so loaded, maybe you can trade them.

I'd be happy to do away with prospects as well, but if we are going to keep them, cutting those limits to those of the draft limits and making your drafted players be on your team when they are in the majors, makes sense. Otherwise, we are encouraging hoarding and takes playable players out of the mix.

309

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 13:31

I kinda like the idea of no prospects. We would end up with the risk taking of where to draft a prospect in the main draft, not really knowing when he would be coming up to the BIGS... Adds some intrigue and lucky planning to the mix...it also increases the size of the player pool, which I think in a 20 team keeper league is a good idea. This year it would have been fun to see where this year's call ups would have fit into our draft. I know some were taken in the regular ribc leagues, but given the keeper aspect, we might take the risk to take more.(?)

310

darkside
ID: 81492120
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 14:57

308: Under the current system, cutting them now vs. later is evaluation of the situation. In my case, Guerrero should be a starter, but he's not. Maybe someone will get hurt or he'll be traded and his ability to produce can be measured.

I guess I'm not as bothered by the prospects as others (and given my approach of getting near-ready guys, I'd say there's a chance over the last few years that I've gotten more innings/games out of prospects than a lot of teams). Unless we create incentives not to, there will continue to be hoarding going on. Every 'rebuilding' team rosters guys that should be out on the wire. Hell, even competing teams hold onto guys that should be dropped thanks to this being a keeper league. The only reason this is even noticed is because a few highly owned guys are sitting on the wire.

I'd be happy to dump prospects, but then I don't know how Species would ever make any trades :)

311

GoatLocker
ID: 404291221
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 19:31

308,
Going to hit their limits anyway.
Not going to happen unless Norris gets hurt.
Came up 4 May.
30 AB
Been in 14 games
9 catching
5 PH

If I had to bring him up, as I said earlier, I would bring him up and drop him.
And you are pretty well ensuring Catchers will very rarely be prospects.

312

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 19:40

Removing prospects doesn't make sense to me. It would lead to less activity. Having prospects offers another avenue for trades.

313

darkside
ID: 81492120
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 21:51

I don't think that's absolutely true, but I do see your point. 60 more players in the available pool will have to increase some form of activity, I would think.

314

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 23:03

I guess I should clarify. I meant more trade activity and strategy. This is an expert league. The more we can foster that, the better.

315

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 23:12

How about one lottery? The lottery winner picks if he wants the 1st pick in the supplemental pick or the 1st pick in the prospect draft. If he selects the #1 pick in the prospect draft then he would automatically get the last pick in the supplemental draft(or 14th pick if we choose to keep the money teams out of it).

I don't like the 170 GP limits. It doesn't encourage activity as the only teams that can hit it are the one's with the healthiest players and those teams already have a huge advantage.

If we don't lower GP limits then I would LOVE if we lowered roster limits by 2 spaces and added 2 DL spots. 8 bench spots when we start 17 is CRAZY. If we lowered the roster limits it would make the FA pool slightly bigger and give those with injuries a fighting shot.

316

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, Jun 20, 2015, 23:18

I'm looking to acquire a cheap closer. Any teams looking to tank(I kid, I kid!) that want to send me one for cheap, please send me an offer.

317

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 12:35

Here is why I don't like the 170. For 8 games a year PER POSITION, you want me to find a loser off the FA list to fill in and maybe have a lucky day and get a few counting points (since by now the percentage ones won't change that much). And to add that loser, I need to drop a guy I might want to keep and some one else might snatch him up.

That's a crap shoot.

The only place that makes sense is swapping out pitchers because there are tons of them, mostly losers on the FA wire. Another crap shoot.

And we can't use any prospects being hoarded. I agreed that some of the prospects called up to the bigs don't play much so I do not think that should be a requirement, but when a prospect reaches a certain AB or IP limit (less than the limit to remain a prospect) he must be called up or dumped onto the FA wire, where BH will probably be first to see it and snatch him up. So maybe that isn't a good idea, but it would move some of HIS prospects to the FA wire for the rest of us or force him to add them.

318

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 12:44

Posted by BH:
"Re 301: I suspect the 170 limit is to keep teams active and encourage waiver pickups. It appears to be working."

Seriously? Look at the data!

Yeah for one person, BH, who has 145 moves, followed by the next ten managers at:
68
67
67
40
33
29
26
26
20
20

How can that be called "appears to be working"?

Just to get to the position player limits, you would need to make 72 moves, unless you have many multi position players on your team. This does not include pitchers, but I think the pitcher limit is not the issue here.

319

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 13:44

How is it that you can do this?

Drop player x at 12:34 and then pick him up at 1:32 on the same day? How is that legal?

I thought all drops went to the waiver wire?

If this is a loop hole, it needs to be closed.

320

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 14:01

Judy, I have tried to cut the batters limits down from 170 several times and it was defeated. I have tried to cap the number of moves and that didn't even get a vote.

The problem is that even if you cut it down to say 162 (mine was for 166 but probably didn't go far enough), you will still have a manager hit 162 as fast as they can at say 2B, (and with that new rule on the fly last year of letting managers not have to even roster that position once that happens) and then they can simply cut their 2B or SS or whatever and stream other positions.

I don't blame bh at all. But it does bother me that simply because you were able to make 431 moves and max a position you suddenly don't have to stick to the rules of everyone else because you've maxed it out. We've never allowed that with Pitchers to go under 6 healthy and active players when they maxed it. If we cut the limits down, I think we have to take that "exception" back out. I like the activity, but with the lack of FAs who are actually playing, it is tough.

When people stream so much it also hurts us because there are so many WW players in which we have to wait yet another day (at least) to be able to use.

311: Not hitting their limits means you can keep them as a prospect for as long as you need. It is not often that a stud prospect is called up and sits on the bench. So many people would be drafting these prospects on their roster anyhow and letting them sit until they played if not for our prospect draft.

314: I wouldn't call this an expert league. Too many people have real life stuff to deal with and can't treat this like their job. If you look through the rosters and activity and lack-there-of, it's obvious that we all have different levels of time to dedicate to this. Obviously, moves do not necessarily correlate 100%.

315: DL: It's very hard to monitor that. Not sure if things have been changed in the last few seasons or not.

I have thought of having one big lottery for the bottom 14 w/o being weighted but then maybe 2-6 might tank if they couldn't win. Also 20th place needs a lot more help than 7th.

The only time I have finished out of the money before this year, I finished last. Like this year, I had my stud pitchers on DL--same for stud hitters. I tried as hard as I could but to no avail. I could not trade players as I was getting 8th round offers for healthy Keepers. The next year I finished 2nd or 3rd I think. Yes, some teams can turn it around, but when teams aren't going for it and trading injured keepers or high picks for players who can help them now (who are likely not keepers) that helps the league now and later. Some people are treating draft picks like they are gold, when in reality a first rounder is at best a 10th rounder and with prospects, possibly less. Most people seem so risk-averse. Also, I had two different people nto trade with me for Holliday or Carrasco because they didn't want to hear crap from others about judging their trade. WOW!

321

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 15:10

Slizz and bmd along with my ideas could go well together in some form. We could work out specifics or tweaks...

Even though I am against ever going over 60 prospects, I might be able to get behind Slizz idea for added prospect picks at the end of the first or whatever which cannot be traded if we had to put them on our team when they were called up and had unlimited moves to send them down when they were in the minors or on the DL. Mainly, they would still have to get back down to the prospects limit the following year.

No one should ever be giving up because they don't think they can win it all. I was shocked mjd started selling his closers when he did and for what he got out of them. I really liked his team and thought he could do really well this year. BMD has also given up quickly in the past. I know he wouldn't do that if he had incentives. I love the way Pete and Slizz and WG and others are still trying to do the best they can. However, sometimes, the injury bug just bites you so hard you are helpless. We can't kill the teams who really need the help while throwing out the incentives. Remember these teams selling players off to help their teams in the future is good for the league as well.

322

GO
ID: 444591621
Sun, Jun 21, 2015, 22:47

Judy - 319 - We do this one every year, but if a player is added and dropped in the same day they go back to Free Agent, not through waivers.

323

WG
ID: 552431321
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 12:37

Anyone have any interest in JACOBY ELLSBURY?

My team is hitting well without him and I can use pitching help. Ideally would like to pair him with one of my SP for a better one. Let me know, thanks.

324

mjd
ID: 23182817
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 13:12

I don't play to finish 10th.

It became apparent very early in the season that my young hitters were not ready this season for the breakouts that I would need to contend. That was easy to see.

That and BH's early dominance caused me to make my decision to trade my closers much earlier than I would have liked.

Had I kept my closers, I'd have a few more points, but the market for closers is all but dead right now, as everyone else plays for second place.

My only shot at getting anything for them was while someone had a outside shot at catching the leader. That was not going to be me.

What would I get for those closers today? Or even 2-3 weeks ago?

325

mjd
ID: 23182817
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 13:19

And maybe I was throwing in the towel, but in a league like this non-contenders really don't need non elite closers and I need to be looking towards the future.

326

Bean
ID: 14147911
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 14:05

<286 and others> I think most are missing the obvious when it comes to not promoting prospects. It provides a way to retain the maximum number of players going into the following season. Even if you dont keep them all, there is a chance they could be keepers for someone else, and therefore have trade value. And, if your prospect is still prospect eligible in the following year, you effectively get an extra keeper. That's the incentive, nothing more. If you want to fix that issue, add three more roster positions and add the prospects to the active roster. Of course if you do that, there really is no difference between a prospect and a veteran player.

My recurring theme is no matter what bandaid you put on some issue, there is a way to game rules to your advantage. And any discussion of taking away the highest picks from the worst teams is just a destruction of parity, so lets quit talking about that nonsense, that's going to ruin the league faster than any gaming of the rules would ever do.

The reality is that if we were all really trying to be the best we could be, we'd all be grabbing streaming players at the earliest possible moment like BH does. So, I would argue if you arent doing that, you are slacking. Slacking could be just as easily be called tanking. So lets just stop this finger pointing nonsense, OK?

If you see something as gaming the rules, either do it yourself, or suggest a specific rule to change it (without all the whiny judgement).

Suggest a rule change, vote on it, tally the vote and press on. This stuff aint rocket science.

327

WG
ID: 552431321
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 15:09

Re: 326
I fully understand it (and said as much in 267)... Do you? It's not an issue of retaining the player; they are yours no matter what. It simply has to do with the call ups and send downs. If you brought up Tomas and he gave you 200 amazing AB this year you can still send him down and make him a 10th keeper next year. All you lose is 1 out of 3 free call ups. I think people are questioning leaving him down because the cost is so minimal. But if you're not competing now then there's no point in getting those 200 good AB (and with our current reward the bottom setup, it hurts you), and a Tomas with 3 free call ups is more valuable than a Tomas with only 2.

328

WG
ID: 552431321
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 15:33

I understand the nobility in a "2nd place is the 1st loser" attitude and the rationale that if I can't win it all this year then I'll do my best to position myself to win next year. But I think it's more enjoyable for all if that is accomplished by continued competition this year even if you don't think you have a shot at 1st. Like my 'fighting to get 7th' proposal. Sure it's a concern that some teams have difficulty improving without high picks but that's why I suggested those safety valves. So what's the downside in trying something like this?
If you're not going to win it all then doing bad is preferred to doing good; how can any proposal that aims to reverse that be seen as nonsense?

329

Bean
ID: 14147911
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 16:26

<326> It is this simple, with three prospects on your prospect roster you have the rights to 26 players. Promote one and you have rights to only 25 players. So, it makes no sense to promote a prospect unless you are competitive for the top 6 spots, or there is a rule that specifically requires it, which there is not.

The best attempt of playing judge over people's intent is going to be subjective, so its better to sustain a rule of law when governing fantasy leagues. When you choose to judge your fellow player's motives, bad feelings arise, and playing the game is no longer fun for many, as crime and punishment become more and more unpredictable. Incorporate a well written rule, enforce it uniformly, or just drop the subject.

330

Bean
ID: 14147911
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 16:29

<328> This is a money league, so nobility has nothing to do with it.

331

Bean
ID: 14147911
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 16:58

The proposal that Guru alluded to that I had for Gurupie 20 basketball translated to this baseball league would be to set minimums for GP (lets say avg 162 GP/pos = 1458) and IP (say 1300). For every 9 GP or 10 IP below these minimums, a team could be penalized one tanking point. If nobody has any tanking points then we draft in reverse order of finish. Otherwise we start with reverse order of finish and apply one draft order pick penalty for each tanking point.

So, for example, lets say I am the only one who gets any tanking points this year. I finished last but have 7 tanking points. As a result, i draft in the 8th spot vs the 1st spot.

If more than one person has tanking points, apply them in order of the number of tanking points.

One could argue with the correct minimums and the increments for tanking points, but this actually can increase participation, is unambiguous, and is easily monitored and enforced. It can improve participation without destroying parity.

332

WG
ID: 552431321
Mon, Jun 22, 2015, 17:28

You're right Bean, my apologies. Thought we were more talking about cases when that prospect was clearly better than your 23rd best player.

Doesn't look like there's much interest in changing the direction of ball distribution so I'm happy to just play by whatever rules the rest of the league feels are best to play by.

333

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 09:34

What do you guys think is the biggest problem in this league, specifically?

1. 2-6 are not incentivized enough
2. 20 is more desirable than 15
3. Teams don't make enough moves
4. Teams make too many moves
5. Prospects sit on the waiver wire
6. Waiver wire should have better players on it
7. Waiver wire should have worse players on it
8. Player doesn't go to waivers when dropped at < 24 hrs
9. BH is just too good

I think we have a few issues being discussed here, but it's worth figuring out which one(s) are the biggest pains for the league as a whole.

334

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 10:00

<333> I would add one more that is common to all keeper leagues. Participation.

Too often in rotisserie leagues people check out once their team is no longer in competition. It affects the standings as a result, and is actually encouraged because it's effect can be equal to tanking.

As I suggested to you during trade negotiations, if every one in the league was sitting by their keyboard at the start of the first game of the day, there would be competition for the FAs you've been using to stream. Suddenly your strategy would no longer be effective, and we'd all have to start grabbing starting pitching two days before a start. Those days when only a few games are on the schedule would have a frenzy of pickups as well. But nobody (except maybe you) is dedicated enough to be ready to pick up players at the earliest possible moment for the next day.

335

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 10:15

Well true. It's too bad they don't have an app, so you can make pickups wherever you are. Someday, maybe we'll invent that, and all these excuses will go away.

I'd say that falls into #3 - people don't make enough moves.

I long for the day when I am no longer able to use the waiver wire as a bench.

336

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 10:47

I've been in a league or two where there was competition for the waiver wire players. It becomes a race. I imagined that you could fix that by putting all players on waivers and settle the waivers like two hours before the first game the next day.

Bottom line is that are so few people dedicated enough to stream like that, to bother to create a system for fair distribution of the streamed players. This league has potential for that level of competitiveness, but we all have lives to lead.

337

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 13:08

Once it becomes obvious that one's team has no shot, it's only human nature that interest and activity levels go down, Especially if you have other teams still in the hunt in other leagues.

While I still check lineups in this league daily, I do admit spending more time on the leagues where I'm still in contention.

338

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 13:37

Right, the question is: in contention for what? If 3rd place really meant something in G20 (like, an extra P pick?), you'd be more inclined to pay attention, right?

339

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 13:42

(and I agree with Bean - messing with incentives doesn't solve the problems at the bottom)

340

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 18:26

<338> 1st-6th place doesn't need any more incentives, there are cash prizes.

The real challenge is to figure out how to incentivize people to try to become 7th through 19th, vs shooting for 20th. You cant do that easily, you can just penalize them if they purposefully tank.

Use my system in <331> and set the minimums at the maximums and I guarantee you people will be incentivized. That's right, I am suggesting that if you dont get to 170 GP at every position and finish with 1400 IPs you pay a penalty in next year's draft.

So, they wont be incentivized to do well, they'll be incentivized to just do some analog thing that might raise the bar. Maybe they will begin to use the strategy that WG alludes to in <286>. But I think that is a bit harder than just blowing off IPs and GPs while maintaining a viable roster.

The best piece meal incentives in the factory get gamed by the laborers every time, so there's nothing new here. Dont let the sound of the bugle of revolution scare you. Join or do not.

341

Judy
ID: 92552311
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 20:21

333: #9. Seriously? You make it no fun. You game the system beautifully with daily timed moves that those of us with real lives just cannot do.

My youngsters are doing fine, but when I go to maybe find someone to improve, there is no one left unless I want to ditch a known player of mine for a crapshoot.

I think the thing I questioned above is unfair. All dropped players need to go thru waivers. Period. Then you will see some activity.

342

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 21:37

The rules are consistent for everyone. If you don't hold a player for 24 hours, he doesn't go on waivers. But if you wanted to change that, you'd probably be in worse shape, especially if you needed to make up innings in September.

343

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 21:41

Also, I ditch known players all the time. Cameron Maybin is a key player on a contending team this year. So is Carson Smith. Logan Morrison and Mark Reynolds too. Last year was even worse.

344

GO
ID: 444591621
Tue, Jun 23, 2015, 23:29

Judy - re: same day add/drop doesn't hit waivers. I feel like we've discussed a few times in all the G20/G24 leagues, but this is done because it prevents owners from milking the system and blocking i.e. add/dropping the entire free agent pool to freeze out other teams from making moves. Its standard in any format and in any sport I've ever played - CbS/Yahoo/ESPN... NFL/MLB/NBA/NHL

345

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 10:42

Looks like I "pulled a Judy" last night- Luis Valbuena on my bench for 2 homers. He's up to 19 for the year!

Also, got Betances'd last night. Gave up 4 runs, bringing his season total to 5. Also took his first career loss. Still feeling good about him closing, at least until Miller comes back.

346

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 11:26

Bean - I love the fact that your active and engaged on the board.

However, I disagree with you in post 331. The cash prize isn't an incentive enough to "be active" and proactively seek out finishing strong by way of making trades. Based on the current format, I commend MJD (325) for recognizing that this wasn't his year and actually got something of value for his closers. I highly doubt MJD would get anything even remotely close to what he got in this current climate. Most, if not all, teams see that it's BH's year and they're better off pinwheeling through the waiver wire to get possible keepers rather than expend future assets. Can't say I blame them...

I know for a fact that I wouldn't sacrifice my team's future for cash prize bump in this format. The cost benefit just isn't worth it to me -- I.E. Not worth making significant moves at the expense of next season's potential enjoyment so that I can order an extra bourbon on G20's dime.

***NOT A PROPOSAL*** With as much time as its required to devote to competing in this league, I would be all for increasing the dues by $100...even $200. Then, the prize pool would actually mean something because we would all have a significant investment in the league. (It would also mean the end of G20 lol)

I also disagree with lowering the pitching limits. I was easily able to hit 1400 innings and it adds to the strategy of streaming the right players at the expense of ERA and WHIP.

I do agree with lowering the positional limits to 162. It's much easier to find pitching than hitting outside of the utility spot on waivers.

347

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 11:27

We should keep score of that BH. Which team pulled the most "Judys" over the course of the season!

348

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 11:28

Tweaked Proposal
I will show some flex and alter the proposal slightly:

1st - cash prize & prestige of winning G20
2nd - 1.21 prospect pick slot
3rd - 1.22 prospect pick slot
4th - 2.21 prospect pick slot
5th - 2.22 prospect pick slot
6th - last pick in prospect draft

-unlimited call ups
-Prospect plays in 5 games, he is to be called up to your active roster (BMD - 266 & 275). Doing this would subject guys we are currently hoarding to waivers (Ref - 280). That would, in theory, help teams get players that normally would not be there. 5 game buffer also eliminates unnecessary drops (Schwarber) in the event they're only up to DH and whatnot.

We would never go over 65 prospects at any given time and, as Ref said in 321, we would all have to comply and get back within limits (60) the following season.

This would serve as incentive to trade for the Ian kinslers, john lackeys, john axfords, and john papelbons of the world...gives teams in the money more incentive to trade with teams "out of the money".

Prospects taken won't likely impact the upcoming season like an extra s-draft pick would (which I would be against) as those taken at 20 or so are a total crapshoot.

349

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 14:05

<348> Unless you are resigned to the notion that BH will win every year, and that nobody else has a chance to compete, then there is no need for this. In a 20 team league, one would expect at least 5 teams to be in contention for the title going into the final month. Normally you need not incentivize these people.

This proposal only ensures that the rich get richer.

350

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 14:07

If you want to make for more parity, the easiest way to accomplish that is to reduce the number of keepers.

351

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jun 24, 2015, 15:52

We all know BH will win every year, so give up now.

352

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Jun 25, 2015, 09:29

True. True. BH is the king

Baseball America - 2010 Prospects

Was trying to find information on Dom Brown and found this...reminds you that not every top prospect ends up succeeding. Thought you guys might enjoy!

Notable busts from the Top 10:
Dom Brown
Desmond Jennings
Jeremy Hellickson
Jesus montero
Dustin Ackley
Aaron Hicks

....and just about every one of those names has played for Team Slizz!

353

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Jun 25, 2015, 09:35

Bean - it's a general theme for the league that it tends to get stagnant way too fast. BH's dominance just magnified this problem even more.

People complain - this is at least a step in the right direction rather than continually focus on the bottom. They should be the ones striving to get better and have a plan like Pete, Species, and I did!

354

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Jun 26, 2015, 12:51

Hey, remember the 2007 G20 Prospect Draft?

Matt LaPorta and Eric Hurley (who?) went 2 and 3. Other picks:
1.06 Ellsbury
1.09 Kershaw
1.14 Jake McGee, a move that singlehandedly earned Species a share of the 2011 title
1.15 Nick Adenhart
2.09 Scherzer

355

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Jun 26, 2015, 20:51

Singleton finally called up! I'm ready to see how his second tour in the majors goes.

356

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, Jun 27, 2015, 23:28

Biggest problem in the league is the high GP and IP limits. I have no idea why people don't want to get 2nd place but I'll be happy to be take 2nd place if no one else wants it. Not having to send Guru money every year for fees is pretty huge incentive for me.

357

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sun, Jun 28, 2015, 00:25

Pulled a Judy tonight with Zunino- homer and two runs scored. Oh well.

358

Nerfherders
ID: 2211442615
Mon, Jun 29, 2015, 18:46

So I was trying to think... why isn't any of this an issue in G24 football? The answer is playoffs. When a third of the teams have a legit chance at winning the title, and 4 or so more have a shot at getting that chance, there are no issues as far as incentivizing. One idea is to have a concurrent September roto competition for the top 8 teams. This will create a race to top 8 in August, and then give that 8th slot a chance at the title.

Tanking is still an issue, of course, and there is no easy answer for that unless you make it impossible for a legitimately bad team to get better. Tanking points are not the answer. I've seen many roto leagues where the winner gets neither the GP or IP limits.

I would be for lowering those limits for this league. I remember Ref telling me the limits and saying "Dont worry about them, you'll never reach them." I usually run with 10 pitchers in this league, which is one less than RIBC, and that limit is 1350. In the keeper league I run we lowered the limit by 50 because hardly anyone ever reached it.

359

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 09:07

Re 358: It also means you can work your ass off for 6 months, build a big lead, and lose because Clayton Kershaw throws a stinker in September. I don't think anybody wants a league like this to be decided by that kind of luck.

360

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 10:16

Hey, R9, you haven't had a healthy 2B on your team in 8 days (since Utley got hurt on 6/22). Get that fixed up.

Loosely related, R9's had 13 SB in that time, including 7 last night.

361

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 10:47

<358> If nobody gets to max IP/GP, then the person who is highest effectively sets the standard for participation. Why is it OK to trade off IP/GP to bolster ERA/AVG but tanking is not? Seems that's just gaming the rules, and is therefore just as worthy of punishment as tanking.

362

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 11:48

We lowered IP Max to its current status after the first season. GPs on the hitting side should have been lowered at the same time. When setting these above the 162 mark, I did so because I do not like "draft and play" leagues. I want activity. However with 20 teams and the lack of available backups and space, 170 was overkill. As I have said before, at least 3 times, I have attempted to cut this back to at least 166 but it has failed. I think it only by a couple votes that first season. However, it needs to be done without being able to cut positions you max out in like it had always been.

My proposal about having to put your prospects on your team when they are called up has support. As a compromise, I am willing to agree to allow managers the option of not being forced to call up your prospects if their first time called up all season comes on Sept 1 or after. Reasoning is that when the rosters go to 40 man, many of these will be called up without a reasonable chance to be put int he lineup with regularity. Before that date, teams generally are not calling up a player who could be getting every day PT in the minors to simply sit on the bench every day.

Otherwise, a prospect should be akin to a player going on waivers with their rights holder getting first chance to pick them up. If they don't want to put in their claim then the next person should get a WW crack at them.

If we make the threshold to lose prospect status being the same as it is to draft them, that should also help matters out. This rule could really hurt me as I might have to make room for all 3 guys on my roster next year and by all accounts Urias won't get a lot of innings.

Unlimited call-ups means if your guy goes on DL, you get to send him back down--as long as he hasn't hit the thresholds and is still a prospect. Once he hits those limits, he is no longer a prospect, obviously. If he is over the limits at the end of the year, he must be one of your 9 keepers and can't be kept as an extra player anyhow, so there really isn't a lot to be gained by leaving them on the FA wire.

363

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 11:56

If he is over the limits at the end of the year, he must be one of your 9 keepers and can't be kept as an extra player anyhow, so there really isn't a lot to be gained by leaving them on the FA wire.

Disagree. After Mike Trout, the second most valuable commodity in G20 is a keeper slot. That's why people are always on the lookout for 10th keepers. After that, the third most valuable commodity in G20 in a roster slot. For most teams, every player on the roster has significance, either because they are playing and contributing every day, or because you're taking a gamble on them (see: Hamilton, Billy). Removing that roster spot eliminates one more chance that you'll stumble onto someone good. There is a lot to be gained by leaving them on the FA wire.

That said, we all play by the same rules, so whatever the league wants to do, we can roll with. Just trying to avoid eliminating things that benefit smarter managers, so we can see things like what Pete and Species have just completed more often.

364

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 13:22

363: Smarter managers. Get over yourself already. Good grief.

365

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 13:52

Ok fine.

Just trying to avoid eliminating things that benefit me.

366

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 15:02

<362> My proposal about having to put your prospects on your team when they are called up has support.

As a fantasy league commissioner for over 40 years, it always concerns me when the membership creates rules that further burden the commissioner with compliance checking and enforcement. Further, any rule should attempt to minimize the latitude of the commissioner in deciding outcomes. This is not just to protect the player, but to protect the commissioner from accusations of bias.

Whatever rule changes you implement, we need them spelled out precisely, we should not be subject to subjectivity. Either something is a rule or it is not, either we have to promote our players within a very specific timeframe before they turn FA, or we should not have to promote them at all until the following season. Touchy feely doesn't cut it in my book.

Also what will be the enforcement mechanism? Will the commissioner be required to notify the owner? Will the commissioner check for compliance daily? Will the player go on waivers when first introduced, or will it just be a race to see who gets him first? Is there a very specific time that the race will start?

367

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 16:32

Good points, Bean. We've actually done pretty well with ambiguous rules in the last few years, for a variety of reasons. But the rules in place before that, perhaps not so much - evidenced by post 360.

Definitely wouldn't want a prospect drop to be a free for all, which is probably why it hasn't come close to happening before.

368

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 16:46

367: it's not a free for all. When someone renounces, we put them on their team and they drop them which puts them on waivers.

366: Really would be as it is right now with our DLed players in our lineups. We have violations which should be brought to their attention like we currently have. The only way to eliminate dealing with the current prospect rules is to eliminate them altogether or make them be on their current teams at all times without callups/options. What Id really like to know is who was playing fantasy baseball in the early 70s? I commished a fantasy football league in the late 80s and people thought we were nuts then.

369

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 17:15

Second what Ref said. My first team was in 1993, but I've read plenty about the original Rotisserie folks.

370

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 18:44

<368> Rotisserie baseball was around in the 60s, though it was rare to see it then. I played it sparingly off and on in the 70s. I started playing Strat-o-matic baaseball in 1970, and that was really the beginning of my addiction. My first commish duty was a strato league in 1971 using the old timers set while still in high school.

Started playing fantasy football in the late 80s like you, though I had one friend who played in the late 70s. I started playing basketball in mid 90s with the advent of AOL leagues paying fees for transactions as I recall.

371

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 19:05

Re 358

Lee threw a stinker in the WS and the Phillies lost. Life happens.

372

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 19:07

360. Utley is not hurt. He is being phased out in an honorable fashion. He is done.

373

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 20:33

Alright then, I guess R9 is squarely within the rules.

374

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Jun 30, 2015, 23:10

Utley has been listed as on the DL. As such, bh is right, R9 has to cover that position with a healthy body.

375

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 07:40

Yes, he is on the DL, but he is not really hurt. He is being phased out and his sub is doing a nice job, unfortunately for him.

376

GO
ID: 432341310
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 09:34

Anyone in the bottom five want to swap 1st rounders next year? Just don't like having my own pick.

377

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 09:41

375: We are talking about our fantasy game here. R9 must replace him in his lineup because he is on the DL.

378

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 10:44

Blue Hen July 1 Report

Overall: Yay!

Hitting: Just fine. The plan to have a variety of options has worked well, since there's always someone to pick up the slack. Tulo was cold in April, and Votto picked it up. Altuve was cold in early June, and Miggy picked it up. Bautista is cold now, and Granderson is on fire. This was exactly why I wanted to turn pitching into hitting, and turning Sale and Scherzer (#1 and #2 probably) into Altuve and Miggy has helped my hitting and hasn't hurt my...

Pitching: Pretty perfect so far. For starters, Price and Cole have been my aces, but great performances from Odorizzi and McCullers have also helped. Along with the up-and-down Hutch, that's 4 pitchers under 25 who are likely keepers. And somehow, I got 37 innings of 2.15 ERA out of Jered Weaver.

The bullpen has also been extremely great, with Britton, Boxberger, and Betances combining for 48 saves, an ERA under 2, and 142 strikeouts in 102 innings. Strong strength for an already strong pitching staff.

Prospects: The big story is probably Rafael Devers. The youngest player in full-season ball, he shot up all the lists since March. He's now among the top prospects in the minors, and will play in the Futures Game on July 13. The rest of the prospects have been about as expected, with Gallo and Schwarber flashing potential at the top level, and a mixed bag for teenagers Moncada and Kolek. Still need to trade someone, but this appears to be a pretty good group.

So far, so good - see you on August 1!

379

R9
ID: 6640117
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 18:43

Goodbye Chase Utley, you will be missed. :(

380

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jul 01, 2015, 18:47

379. He was good while he lasted, but this year has shown that he is really done. No power, no stroke, no hits, etc. It is a shame, but you can't fight old age. Baseball is really becoming a young kids sport -- with some exception, of course!

381

Judy
ID: 35493114
Thu, Jul 02, 2015, 16:59

Saw a Twitter comment today.
Too bad there is not a list for "so bad, we need to hide you to make room for anyone else."

Reference was Utley and Harang for the Phillies.

382

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 16:09

Trade announcement:

Judy sends Freddie Freeman*, Atl 1B from Bench to GO
Judy receives Ken Giles, Phi RP from GO to Bench
Judy receives Prince Fielder, Tex 1B from GO to Bench

Judy gets GO second 2016 supplemental.
GO gets judy third 2015 supplemental.

383

GO
ID: 432341310
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 16:16

Deal confirmed.

384

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 17:38

Wow, Judy traded a pick in the 2015 draft? GO must be a real sucker.

All kidding aside, this one is pretty close. I give the edge to Judy mostly because I don't have faith Freeman will ever become a true superstar. Fielder is the better player now, and has a few years. Freeman will always be a high OBP, middling power guy, fairly replaceable. Giles is also a coup, since there's a good chance he's kept next year. Judy is now in pretty good shape for 2016, just needs to get another keeper or two and draft well.

I also get it from GO's perspective. He needed to go younger, and Freeman is that. And I don't think there was much market for Prince, though there should have been.

385

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 19:54

Hen, I now have ten keepers...that will not be the problem.

386

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 21:03

Judy, you can't trade a pick that has already happened.

387

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 03, 2015, 21:22

Pete it's a typo! Should be 2016!😏

388

GO
ID: 444591621
Sun, Jul 05, 2015, 23:02

I think I'm the only person who posted at all on these boards in the last 48 hours... Guru, can you confirm that? sounds like everyone had a fun 4th weekend.

389

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Mon, Jul 06, 2015, 10:23

Pretty sure you have nine keepers.

I guess we should mention Miggy here. He'll miss six weeks, which means he'll have less than 50 games to hit 10 homers, or else the insurance kicks in. No guarantee but much more likely than before. Glad I took out the policy.

390

Judy
ID: 35493114
Mon, Jul 06, 2015, 19:09

389: I said ten (10, X).

391

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Mon, Jul 06, 2015, 22:39

Did I miss the discussion and vote where we changed the number of keepers? Or do we mean 10th keepers? I don't think Franco will stay under.

392

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Jul 07, 2015, 19:43

Read carefully hen. I said I have ten keepers. I never said I could keep all ten.

394

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 08, 2015, 10:00

Fine, fine, you win. I was referring to the fact that you still needed to upgrade one or two keepers (and draft well) to have a contending team. I stand by that.

That said, I think Judy's been one of the better "improve future keeper" stories of this season. I'm looking at Fielder, Gordon, Franco, Russell, Peralta, Carter, Papelbon, Salazar, with Giles/Avisail/Ozuna in addition, all of whom were kept this year. That's certainly in the top half of keepers in the league. It's a good mix of traded for (Fielder and Carter at bargain values) and held onto (Franco and Salazar are two great examples of that).

Again, it's hard to win a championship with some of those guys (says the guy who won one after keeping Gyorko), so I'd wait for a couple more upgrades and a good draft to label Judy as a true contender for 2016.

395

Species
ID: 54740122
Thu, Jul 09, 2015, 12:18

Calling up Miguel Sano for the first time.

Hey Dodgers - bring Seager up, whydontcha??

396

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Fri, Jul 10, 2015, 11:06

Accidental drop of Maybin. Was attempting to see "recent games" and the app froze on my iPhone...attempted to hit the screen a couple times and accidentally hit continue. Please add him to my roster.

397

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Fri, Jul 10, 2015, 23:00

I'm sure the same thing happened to bh and Zunino. Please add Zunino back to bh's roster.

398

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Fri, Jul 10, 2015, 23:58

Ha. IF I pick him back up, how will I see how long he lasts on waivers???

399

GO
ID: 444591621
Sat, Jul 11, 2015, 16:07

Nobody is gonna pick him up cause they know you are actually related and there is no way you would have intentionally dropped such a stud C.

400

Ref
ID: 55156513
Mon, Jul 13, 2015, 13:25

395: http://www.latimes.com/sports/dodgers/la-sp-seager-dodgers-top-prospect-20150713-story.html?track=lat-email-latimessports

401

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 15, 2015, 10:21

Reminder for Species to update the prospect list - Swihart and Dahl should be on GO, not WG.

Not sure if there were any other trades, but you guys should all check the League Page to make sure yours are listed properly.

402

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 15, 2015, 10:22

Also, Raisel I(n)glesias would like his name spelling corrected.

403

Species
ID: 6031912
Wed, Jul 15, 2015, 10:41

It is time to recognize that Jacob deGrom is one of the best pitchers in baseball. He was filthy last night.

He is comfortably on par with the likes of David Price, Gerrit Cole, Felix Hernandez and Johnny Cueto for that second tier behind Kershaw, Scherzer and Sale.

404

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 15, 2015, 11:29

He was indeed filthy last night, although Chapman was just as filthy - 12 of 14 pitches over 100 mph, and the same 3 strikeouts.

Cockcroft just released his Top 250 keepers, which consider 2015-2019. DeGrom is 50th, which a testament to how far he's come. Pitchers ahead of him, in order, are Kershaw, Cole, Sale, Scherzer, Fernandez, Felix, Bumgarner, Price, Harvey, Archer, Kluber, and Sonny Gray, and DeGrom is the 13th pitcher. I think that's pretty accurate, although I could see moving DeGrom up a couple spots.

Most of those guys were highly touted prospects. I think Kluber and Sale were the only ones not held as prospects in G20. I usually give a little extra credit to players who were once big prospects - they tend to grow into the magic. Of course, this from the guy holding two former #1 picks in his rotation.

That said, DeGrom is pretty awesome. I held him for a little bit last year (and I think a few others did too), but if we'd known where he would get to, we would definitely have held on.

And that's why we play, right?

405

darkside
ID: 81492120
Wed, Jul 15, 2015, 22:45

Sending Alex Guerrero back down.

Note to commishes: his callup still needs to be noted on the league page. Thanks!

406

Ref
ID: 55156513
Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 14:43

Not mentioning Grienke, with any talk about the best pitchers in baseball, hurts your credibility.

407

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 16:31

Good point, Ref. The next two pitchers on the list are Greinke and Strasburg. Greinke's been amazing this year, and definitely belongs in this company. But where does he fit? Interestingly, I think Greinke is the oldest guy in that entire top 15. If we're looking out for 2019, that has to be a strike against him.

Anyone find it interesting that of this entire list, the only one who plays in a hitters' park is Sale? That's really interesting.

408

Judy
ID: 35493114
Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 20:58

Ok WG. You grabbed Nola after I got tired of the phillies saying they wouldn't bring him up and I felt I couldn't keep him for 2016. Shoulda kept him anyway...

409

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jul 21, 2015, 10:10

Species, let's talk about your team name.

As everyone knows, it was recently changed from "2nd Place Is The First Loser" to "I Am Last." I postulate that the new name is just factually incorrect.

You currently sit in 6th place. If 2nd Place Is The First Loser, I guess 3rd Place Is The Second Loser, and 4th Place Is the Third Loser, and 5th Place Is The Fourth Loser. Following the pattern, it appears that 6th Place Is The Fifth Loser. So to be more accurate, your team name should probably be I Am The Fifth Loser.

Bean should take offense to your choice of names, since he is, after all, last. In fact, Bean is quite good at being last, with only 29.5 points, almost 30 points out of 19th. Jay Dog is closer to MJD at 14th than to Bean. Good work, Bean.

But back to Species and his incorrect name: perhaps he is being ironic. Maybe he is telling us that he is last "among people named Greg" - buck up, buddy; you're also first in that department. Or maybe he has changed his name to Last (in the spirit of Not Sure), and he's just using this medium to tell us. Or maybe he's just trying to disassociate with all those terrible teams from the last couple years.

Either way, it's a boring name. I expected a much more interesting name out of you.

410

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Jul 21, 2015, 13:14

Grienke now is in the lead for Cy Young this year. Kershaw said last game was the first time all year he felt good about his slider. Watch out MLB! I also really like Scherzer. Sale is also underrated. Strasburg also looked like he fixed his mechanics before he had to go back on the DL. I wouldn't sleep on him either. I am a big Cueto fan but he hasn't looked like himself at times either. Same for Hamels. With Price now in play, teams are goign to have to pay less at the trade deadline to get some of these guys.

411

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jul 21, 2015, 13:17

Greinke is indeed in the lead for the Cy Young, according to a pretty reputable source.

412

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jul 21, 2015, 13:19

Also, Jacob deGrom is indeed an ace.

413

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 07:49

After a nice lull, the curse is back.

Carter on bench, HR, 2 RBI, 2 R

414

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 09:22

Yeah, I had Carter on my bench in RIBC too. He's been pretty cold. But Judy, I'm wondering why you didn't sit Franco, put Prado in the 3B slot, and Carter at Util?

415

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 09:36

Hey, GO - are you dropping Sanchez or sending him down? He's got 35 GP and 99 IP, so he is still eligible to be sent down. However, you are required to post here when that happens.

417

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 15:38

BH. I was away from computer until too late, didn't get to one until after 8:00 from 8 am.
Already made that change last night for today and tomorrow,

418

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 16:27

Heh, oh well. Win some, lose some.

419

GO
ID: 444591621
Wed, Jul 22, 2015, 22:43

I don't think Sanchez is a prospect, but sure, send him back there if he is.

420

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Jul 23, 2015, 09:52

Actually, I think he was 10th keepered by WG before the trade, so fair game to anyone. Have at it!

421

Guru
ID: 330592710
Thu, Jul 23, 2015, 10:29

Calling up Francisco Lindor for the first time.

422

Species
ID: 456182615
Sun, Jul 26, 2015, 16:19

** League Announcement **

For non-sports reasons, GoatLocker is choosing to vacate his team. This will be done by his choice effective immediately. He wanted a new owner to be able to set things in motion NOW in preparation for the offseason. Thanks Cliff for all of your years of dedication to G20. If you have interest in coming back in the future, please let us know.

I have awarded GoatLocker's team to Meatwads. He is experienced in G20 via his activity in G20 Hoops and will make a fine addition to our league. Welcome, Meatwads! I will do my best to indoctrinate him into our rules - our prospect rules in particular. I have sent Meatwads an owner invite......as soon as he accepts I will remove GoatLocker from the team. GL noted that he is short a 3rd baseman due to injury. I will give Meatwads a few days to get a new one in there.

Meatwads - please post your preferred email so all of the ~~sharks~~ --- errr, esteemed leaguemates --- can contact you.

423

Species
ID: 456182615
Sun, Jul 26, 2015, 16:22

League rules:

Commissioner:
"Species" gmrobinson1@yahoo.com - "Tosh" lodnar@gmail.com - "Guru" (Treasurer) davehall@rotoguru2.com

Positions
C - 1 1B - 1 2B - 1 3B - 1 SS - 1 OF - 3 DH - 1 P - 6
Active - 15; Bench - 8; Total - 23; Must have active players on roster at each position

Returning Managers
As commissioners, we reserve the right NOT to extend an invitation to (or remove) any manager for any reason. Primary reason for being excluded would be abusive behavior, purposeful rules violations (ie colluding on a trade), inactivity (ie leaving injured/OUT players in as starters or not actively trying to improve your team), not participating in league business or repeated delays/unresponsive, or failure to pay your share of league fees. If an owner is removed or NOT invited back, a new owner will be recruited to take over the vacated team in its exact state. All monies will be forfeited.

Activity/Unforeseen Circumstances
Activity will be monitored. Every team and circumstance is different. Not every team will want to change their lineup every day or be able to respond to every trade or answer emails immediately. Not every manager will make as many transactions (add/drops or trades) as others. Albeit, if we notice some time of inactivity or it is brought to our attention, we will address it. Please understand that we are trying to work with you to resolve the issue. You are expected to respond to all trades/emails in a timely manner whenever possible. You are also expected to keep healthy and competitive players who are playing in your active lineup. Activity on our threads in the Rotoguru boards and on our league site are encouraged and required at times for league business, including rules discussions, drafts, etc. Should unforeseen scenarios arise, the commissioners will use their best judgment to settle any matters in the best interest of the league.

Trade Policy
If there are 7 votes against the trade it will be sent to the commishs to be vetoed. There will be a min. of one full day to vote before the trade will be approved if the max objections are not reached. Everyone will be emailed by ESPN automatically as soon as the trade is accepted so they may review it. Make sure your email notifications are set up! Please check the site daily.

Trades involving draft picks/prospects will be listed in the trade and can also be posted on our leagues bulletin board and/or our thread at rotoguru.com. Note that off-season and pre-season (before draft is complete) trades will still be approved by the commishs.

Trades for draft picks - be they Supplemental or Prospect picks - may only be consummated within two drafts from the date of the trade. Example: in March 2015 before the Supplemental Draft, one can only trade either 2015 or 2016 picks. In June 2015, one could trade either 2016 or 2017 picks, etc.

Keepers
There will be 9 players available to be kept heading into the season. You will have a deadline to post your keepers. You may change your keepers up until the deadline.

Players drafted in the Rule 4 draft the previous June are not eligible to be kept as keepers. This rule applies even if that player has played in the major leagues. All Rule 4 draftees must go through at least one Prospect Draft prior to being eligible as keepers.

2014 PRIZE POOL
There are 19 of 20 people in the prize pool @ $15 each. That means there is $285 to distribute. Teams are required to always be in it or out of it once they committed to it in 2005. These will be the payouts: 1st $110; 2nd 65; 3rd 45; 4th 30; 5th 20; 6th 15. If a non-participant places 1st-6th, his money will be reallocated so there is always a 100% payout. 1st-5th place will be moved up a spot in the prize money and the 6th place $15 will go to the treasury to help defray dues costs to all. Dues are used to pay for the league champion trophy and draft.

Timing of the Keeper Deadline, Prospect Draft and Supplemental Draft
Each March, as proposed by a Commissioner, the league hold the following events, in this order:

1) Keeper Deadline: all teams must designate their keepers. They may designate up to 9.
NOTE: At this time, once the Keeper Deadline has passed, managers may also call up a prospect to their active roster. In this scenario, that prospect is separate from their 9 keepers.
2) Prospect Keeper Deadline: Managers designate their Prospect Keepers. They may designate up to 3.
3) Prospect draft picks are assigned and the Prospect Draft is commenced per our rules below.
4) The Supplemental Draft is completed.

Supplemental Draft, FA Pickups and Waivers
The Draft will be held prior to every season after Keepers are announced. A "NBA style" lottery will determine the top three selections. The lottery for the following season will be completed within 30 days of the end of regular season. Picks 4 - 20 and all picks in subsequent rounds will be in inverse order of previous years finish and will not snake.

Players must be available in the ESPN player pool to be drafted or added during the season via FA or WW. No amateur player may be drafted or picked up via FA or WW if the player in question still has amateur status or is a prospect. Also, if a player is drafted in the June MLB draft, while he may be freely picked up and used on a roster, please note that per our keeper rules they may not be kept the following season. All Rule 4 draftees must go through one Prospect Draft before they become keeper eligible.

There is a 3 hour per draft pick time limit and a cumulative time limit of 12 hours. (Subject to change). You may not exceed 23 players. You may not drop a player (or add a non-drafted player if you are short) until waivers have been turned on. You may trade for extra picks and you may trade your excess picks as long as it is done before the preceeding pick has been made. If you make a duplicate pick, the draft will continue and you may correct that pick at any time. Once you have been skipped, you will continue to be skipped until you are caught up. If a clock runs out, the next person on the clock will be charged for any time before his pick. If you are skipped due to a pick or c clock, you may still post your selection at any time.

Waivers will begin the season in the same order as the supplemental draft. Lottery picks and traded draft picks will not be considered when determining the waiver order.

Prospect Rules
Prospect Draft: The Prospect Draft will be held during the preseason after keepers are finalized (but before the Supplemental Draft). Drafts will be in inverse order of the final standings of the previous year and will not snake. A "NBA style" lottery will determine the top three selections. The lottery for the following season will be completed within 30 days of the end of regular season. Picks 4 - 20 and all picks in subsequent rounds will be in inverse order and will not snake. Players will be selected on our thread at rotoguru.com if possible. If that site is down, our draft will continue on the bulletin board of our page if we have knowledge of all picks selected previously. Ties will be broken by a dice roll. There will be up to 3 rounds.

A draft-eligible prospect is defined as a hitter that has less than 150 AB or a pitcher with less than 55 IP or 20 GP. They do not need to be in the ESPN player database, but can not be still in high school/college, etc. They need to either be on a pro team, drafted by a team, or a current free agent/professional Japanese or Cuban player.

There will be a 3 hour per pick clock and a 4 hour cumulative clock to draft. If you are skipped, you may make your selection at any time. Time will not accrue from midnight to 8 am ET, though anyone may select during that time if their pick is up. Once the draft concludes, the only way to add a prospect is via trade or future drafts. After the draft, you may bring this player on your active roster at any time (as long as hes in the ESPN database) by dropping a player.

Managers may call-up and then send down their prospect up to two times without losing their rights as a prospect as long as that player has not hit the maximum ABs/IP/GP threshold. Once a commish allows the call-up, he will add the number of times that player has been called-up next to his name in the Prospect List below. At the end of the season, all prospects on the roster will be considered optioned so they won't have to be counted as a keeper so long as they have not hit their threshold. Before a commish will option or send-down a prospect, he will look at the stats for that player including games played that day if the lineup freeze has passed. If a prospect is renounced or hits his threshold while on your roster (called up), his name will be removed from your prospect list.

All prospects are listed below. It is each managers responsibility to alert a commish when your prospect is entered into the ESPN database so an email alert can be attached.

Before the season at the keeper deadline all hitters must have less than 300 ABs and pitchers less than 110 IP or 40 GP or they must be moved to your active roster or released. Managers must monitor their own prospects. If they are later to have found to be over the max. at that deadline, the player will be immediately removed as a prospect and put on waivers.

At the prospect draft keeper deadline, all managers must have no more than 3 keepers on their prospect list. They may keep all three or none as long as none have been traded, (see below) but they will only get as many draft picks as it takes to max their prospects at three, barring a trade.

Prospect draft picks are assigned after your prospect keepers are announced. So if you have 3 prospect keepers, you dont have a prospect draft pick to trade. You may trade a pick at any time, but if you have traded a prospect draft pick, you may only declare two keepers. If youve traded two picks, you can only keep one and if youve traded all three, you may keep none. Once prospects have been declared and draft picks assigned, a manager may again exceed three prospects via trade.

424

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Jul 26, 2015, 17:36

Judy curse continues:

Peralta resting today
Russell on bench: 1 R, 1HR, 3 RBI

Sure wish I could sit by my computer like BH does, but I cannot due to life activities...

425

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Sun, Jul 26, 2015, 22:39

Welcome Meatwads!

426

Tosh
ID: 44628198
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 01:32

Thanks for the many years of great fantasy play Goatlocker. You will be missed.

Meatwads is a great addition to our league. He is very knowledgeable and loves to make trades. Welcome!

427

Meatwads
ID: 13514823
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 03:15

Thanks guys, I'm glad to be in the league. I appreciate the invite. As Tosh said, I like trading. Whoever has Mike Trout, I'd like to acquire him at reasonable price.

My email is michaelpatrickrichards@gmail.com

When I have some down time I will read the rules and figure out the prospects. I've followed the league and talked with some people so I should get it quick.

428

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 09:37

Judy, that's mean. You have hurt my feelings. Also, I don't own a home computer, so it's a little difficult to sit by it all day.

Goatlocker, thanks for your time in this league. In the early years, you were one of the people I talked to most. Also, it's pretty perfect timing to step down - allows the manager a large chunk of season to get ducks in a row. Best of success in the other parts of your life - hope you will continue to drop in here occasionally.

Welcome Meatwads! I can vouch that Meatwads is very knowledgeable about baseball and fantasy strategy, and should be a major player in this league in short order. Guess I'll have to find someone new to run hokey trade ideas past.

429

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 09:47

Some prospect usage notes. Remember, 300 AB / 110 IP / 40 GP.

Yasmany Tomas: 282 AB
Addison Russell: 272 AB
Carlos Correa: 163 AB
Maikel Franco: 302 AB
Joey Gallo: 87 AB
Kyle Schwarber: 48 AB
Francisco Lindor: 141 AB
Carlos Rodon: 77 IP
Jung Ho Kang: 259 AB
Byron Buxton: 37 AB
Miguel Sano: 60 AB
Brandon Finnegan: 21 GP / 31 IP
Michael Taylor: 314 AB*
Steven Souza: 313 AB*

430

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 12:28

Welcome, Meatwads!

I know you've been chomping at the bit to get in here for the past 2 seasons. Look forward to seeing what you can do as I hear great things...

Goat - sorry to see you leave but thanks for your contributions and good luck in future endeavors.

431

Toral
ID: 1753514
Mon, Jul 27, 2015, 23:33

As many of you know, I have been very dissatisfied with the league's tolerance of Lipman for some time. Lipman should have been thrown out a long time ago, for intellectual dishonesty above most -- he has never made a proposal about the league that was not desngned to help him or draw attention to him; nothing he says can be trusted. In his entire life here, I don't believe he has said one thing with a purpose other than to make an impression on some people, or call attention to himself.

The invitation to Mr Richards -- a bluehen clone in his trading philosophy -- without any inquiry to me solidified it.

I would have enjoyed fighting for second place. But you-all aren't worth it.

There were a lot of good folks in this league. It's probably no coincidence that most of them are gone now.

I resign from this league. bluehen, Species: please never contact me again.

Toral

433

Species
ID: 456182615
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 00:28

Apparently Toral is dissatisfied with my Commissionering. I won't go into the details of our short couple of emails. I'm really sorry you feel that way dude.

Sadly I apparently cannot put his players back on his team until they clear waivers. Strange because I have done that before many times (anyone?). If Guru or Tosh can make an attempt to do so either tonight (Tosh) or tomorrow (Guru?), it would be greatly appreciated.

Please do not pick up any of the dropped players from his team. Any pickups will be quickly reversed.

When GoatLocker contacted me to find a replacement for his team in order to focus attention elsewhere, I quickly went to Meatwads, who had been recommended in the past for a Baseball spot and has proven his activity, attention and mettle in G20 Hoops.

In this case, I don't have another possible replacement handy who has already been (more or less) vetted by enough league managers to give me comfort. So.....please help my recollection of other managers who have expressed interest in the past or might be good managers to invite to the league. In a general sense, priority is typically given to other G20/24 managers (although that is not a requirement) or, at the very least, other Gurupies who have shown competency in RIBC or other formats.

434

Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 01:19

That's more than a little effed up.

I am unable to add any players back to the roster either. Odd, since I have also done it previously. ESPN says that the Commish can bypass waivers, and add players. But attempting to add a player leads to a 'player has not cleared waivers' error. Weird.

435

Khahan
ID: 34255168
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 09:13

I would be interested but am in the middle of the mountains with spotty access until saturday

436

Fosten
ID: 23640289
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 10:40

I am very much interested.

437

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 10:45

We can now add all of the players back onto the open team. However, I only have phone access and that is highly aggravating. If Guru or Tosh have 5 minutes, I would be grateful.

Please feel free to nominate other potential managers.

438

Fosten
ID: 41645289
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 11:00

I am very much interested. I have been active on rotoguru since '99, participate in RIBC qualifying leagues annually, and commish a 20-team league called Happy Baseball. Always wanted to try this league. Would be excited to join the fun.

439

Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 15:35

I have successfully re-added all the players to the Open team, and activated them all in time for today's games.

Game on!

440

GO
ID: 444591621
Tue, Jul 28, 2015, 18:19

Fosten and Khahan would both be great additions. If no other nominations tonight just flip a coin and the other guy gets wait-listed.

I believe Meatwads won G20, so that fastracked him into an open spot. Hard to argue with that.

441

Guru
ID: 330592710
Wed, Jul 29, 2015, 14:01

Khahan wins the coin flip.

442

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, Jul 29, 2015, 14:27

So, I had each manager tell me a bit about their fantasy experience and history in deep leagues and with prospects. Both managers were equally qualified, so I took the wuss' way out and asked Guru to do a coin flip. Khahan won and will be invited to take over Toral's team. As he noted he is traveling so can't run full force until next week.

Fosten - please stay in touch and know that you are high on our list for any future openings.

I have set the lineup of Toral's team through the weekend.

Welcome back Khahan.

443

Fosten
ID: 126512913
Wed, Jul 29, 2015, 14:51

Ah, foiled by coins! Thanks for the consideration though. You have my contact info, so let me know if anything opens up in the future. Thanks again.

444

R9
ID: 44646300
Thu, Jul 30, 2015, 01:53

Yikes. Sorry to see both Toral and Goatlocker go. Both great longtime managers who will be missed.

Welcome Khahan and Meatwads! The show must go on.

-----------------------------------------------

I have been entertaining the unthinkable, namely trading Mike Trout. I have one very good offer, so anyone else interested may as well give it a crack. Its a really, really, really, really, really good offer though, so if you're going to send me an offer, wow me. :)

Email me if you want my cell #, as its easier talking trade over IM/txt for me.

445

WG
ID: 552431321
Thu, Jul 30, 2015, 11:24

Hey R9, just sent you an email.

446

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Jul 30, 2015, 21:07

Pulled my first Judy of the season.

Didn't check the lineups for the 12pm game and missed Norris' gem. The malaise continued into the evening when I left Big Teix on the bench (@TEX no less) for the first time this year.

So far, they are a combined 7/7 2 HR, 4 R, 5 RBIs

447

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Jul 30, 2015, 22:33

UPDATE: 8/8 5 R, 3 HR, 6 RBI

The Judy continues...ugh.

448

mjd
ID: 23182817
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 12:58

Wonder how many offers R9 is getting on Trout.

More than a few, I'd guess.

450

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 13:59

Wow slizz.

That is one ugly line!

Worse than anything I've had, but less than my total left on the bench!!!

451

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 14:01

Also, a pleasant goodbye to Toral and GL. Although I have met neither of you in person, it has been fun to be in contact over the seasons in fantasy.

Good luck in your lives!

452

darkside
ID: 81492120
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 15:37

Had to delete my previous post to make it more accurate now that I reread Toral's post and saw what he did:

Sorry to see Goatlocker go. I hope all is well in his life.

Welcome back, Khahan and welcome Meatwads!

Let's all try for a drama-free rest of the season. This is just a game, after all. Good luck to everyone trying to finish in the money.

453

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 15:49

Can any Philly phan explain the revere deal? Young, fast, cheap??? Don't get it.

454

Judy
ID: 35493114
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 15:49

Also now no OF of note to play. Who is Jordan danks?

455

GO
ID: 444591621
Fri, Jul 31, 2015, 22:11

Revere is about to go to arbitration so I suspect he won't be that cheap after this season. And considering he doesn't know how to take a walk he's not a very good leadoff hitter and isn't worth the money he'll probably want.
Also not very good at defense. "Revere has shown subpar defensive skills in center field. Despite his speed, he has taken odd routes to fly balls and has arguably the weakest arm among all outfielders in the majors"

456

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, Aug 01, 2015, 00:25

Yeah, Revere wasn't going to be part of the solution. Got more than I expected for him. Jordan Danks (brother of John) can hit a bit- always wondered how he'd do full time.

And Dom Brown is heating up!

457

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Aug 01, 2015, 18:41

Ok. Thanks...

458

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Aug 01, 2015, 23:18

Just saw this on the Phillies app I have. Also read that he has only 50 something swing ana misses this season.

"Revere spent a bit more than two and a half seasons with the Phillies, first as their everyday centerfielder and then this year splitting his time between center and the corner outfield positions. He hit .303 over 335 games with Philadelphia, tying for the National League lead with 184 hits last season. His skill set was better suited for a club in contention than on baseball's worst team. He is not set to become a free agent until 2018."

So he could have been kept thru 2017.

Confused again.

But glad Phillies are winning and seem to be having fun. Much more relaxed. Maybe they will get out of last place soon!!!

459

Khahan
ID: 54152322
Sat, Aug 01, 2015, 23:30

He is not set to become a free agent until 2018."

So he could have been kept thru 2017

Phillies wont be contenders until at least 2018. So they can keep Revere thru 2 more seasons of losing (they're losing big time with or without him) or they can move him for some pieces that may help come 2018 and beyond.

Now if they could only get rid of Ruben Amaro Jr. That is one thing I still do not understand - how does that guy still have a job?

460

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Aug 02, 2015, 08:28

Sadly, they are saying that Amaro's moves last week might save his job. 99.4% of the Phillies phaithful hope NOT!!
I've met him. He is an idiot.

461

Khahan
ID: 54152322
Sun, Aug 02, 2015, 11:03

I was out of town last week so didn't hear much on the rumor mill. But about 3 weeks ago word was that Amaro was on the chopping block and wasn't the one making the deals. Guess at this point only time will tell.

462

GO
ID: 444591621
Sun, Aug 02, 2015, 14:58

Amaro is long gone so don't worry. McPhail and Gillick were involved with these deals.

Revere is controlled for 2 more years yes. But thats through arbitration. I wouldn't be shocked if he wants Michael Bourn money. And I'm not paying a slap hitter, no power, no walks, bad defense corner OF like 10 million a year he'll probably want or arbitration will award him cause the AVG and SB's look good. Look what Bourn has done since getting his deal.

Another rule of thumb. Never pay a one trick pony for his legs as they get old. Cause as they approach 30 they become worthless. Cash in why you can.

463

GoatLocker
ID: 404291221
Sun, Aug 02, 2015, 16:10

All, thank you very much for the comments. Will still stick my head in and see what it some.

Some are aware of my situation, some are not.

My wife has Poly-cystic Kidney Disease (PKD).
10 years ago she caught pneumonia and it forced her into End Stage Renal with a huge drop in her kidney function.

She was told that she would be on dialysis in 6 months.

She is still not on dialysis and her doctors all call her their Miracle Woman.

The average size of a kidney is the size of your fist. Both of hers are 3 times that size. Both kidneys are completely covered with cysts as are her liver, pancreas, gall bladder, bottom of both Lungs. The extra weight and huge protrusion of the stomach create a lot of other issues.

She is also anemic and I have been giving her a shot of Procrit once a week for the 10 years.

She is starting to have a lot of other issues, and I am doing a lot more around the house than I used to. Just felt I did not have time for the team, and didn't feel it was fair to the rest of the owners. At the end of every season I found myself asking myself if I could really continue on. Felt this was the right time to do it to allow the follow on owner to mold the team the way they wanted.

Don't worry, I won't disappear completely.

Again, thanks for the comments here and emails.

GL

464

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Aug 03, 2015, 10:48

Goatlocker, thanks for sharing the story. Here's hoping the miracles continue for a LONG time.

465

Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Mon, Aug 03, 2015, 18:22

Activating prospect Daniel Norris for the first time.

466

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Wed, Aug 05, 2015, 04:39

I called up Luis Severino for the first time.

467

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, Aug 05, 2015, 18:50

The following players have exceeded prospect limits. Because they are on their respective teams' active rosters, they are no longer eligible to be sent down. Accordingly, they are being removed from the prospect list.

Yasmani Tomas
Stephen Souza, Jr.
Addison Russell
Mikael Franco

The following prospects have exceeded their prospect limits, but they are NOT on their teams' active rosters. Technically they can legally remain on the prospect list - ineligible to be picked up by anyone else - until called up by their teams or through the end of the year. Per our rules, at the end of the season, all prospects that have exceeded limits automatically get called up to their teams' rosters and removed from the prospect list. They can then be kept by their teams as part of their 9 keepers, if so desired:

Jake Lamb
Michael Taylor

Let me know if anyone needs some clarification.

468

Khahan
ID: 54152322
Wed, Aug 05, 2015, 21:30

Ok, question - I missed that Santiago started tonights game. What am I supposed to look for on the site to indicate a pitcher I have is starting on a given day?

469

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Thu, Aug 06, 2015, 06:08

as of today I don't plan to keep Michael Taylor. He was ok at the start of the season when I needed an outfielder, but I currently have 4 quality outfielders and no room for a mediocre Taylor who may do better at some point in the future. I give him the chance to get better until the end of the season, but his outlook in my franchise is not promising. If I would have to renounce his prospect rights right now I would do it. I am not forced to, so I am waiting.

470

judy
Dude
ID: 7771722
Thu, Aug 06, 2015, 14:12

I have both Maikel and Addison...they're keepers for 2016 for me. Original thought was that they would be mid season call ups but both have proven to be valuable, especially Franco.

471

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Aug 06, 2015, 18:04

Just want to say one thing about Toral on the way out. He's a competitor, and the quality of Khahan's team is a testament to that. He made moves, and good ones, up until the end.

472

beastiemiked
ID: 12651297
Fri, Aug 07, 2015, 09:55

Khahan, usually ESPN will mark starting pitchers. Sometimes, they miss them. I missed Wacha's start yesterday because of this :(

473

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Aug 10, 2015, 11:23

Was just perusing Cockcroft's Top 250 Keepers. 13 current members of Team Blue Hen, 21 former members. Enjoy.

*Stanton 4
*Rizzo 8
Altuve 13
Cabrera 16
Cole 17
*Sale 18
*Scherzer 19
Votto 26
*Encarnacion 28
*Jones 35
Tulowitzki 42
Bautista 47
*deGrom 50
*Dozier 54
*Fielder 59
*JDMartinez 61
*Arrieta 63
*Braun 69
Gallo 70
*Rosenthal 77
*Hosmer 80
*Carrasco 82
Betances 91
*Melancon 99
Moustakas 110
*Belt 114
Odorizzi 122
Boxberger 126
*SMiller 127
*Maybin 129
*CGonzalez 134
*Matz 136
Britton 142
Schwarber 148

474

Judy
ID: 35493114
Tue, Aug 11, 2015, 20:11

Who has the time to "peruse"?

475

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Aug 12, 2015, 09:02

It took about 5 minutes. I get it if G20 isn't your #1 priority. But is it #10? #100?

476

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Wed, Aug 12, 2015, 18:24

who is the owner of the last 2 pitchers that threw a no-hitter ? this could be the only stat where my team is better than blue hen's.

478

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Thu, Aug 13, 2015, 11:55

Apologies for picking up Iglesias. It didn't come to mind that he might be on a prospect roster. I run a keeper with a 100 prospects, so usually if a prospect is not in that league, it is also not going to be in this league. I found the exception!

479

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Aug 13, 2015, 15:25

100 prospects?!?!?! [bh drooling]

480

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Thu, Aug 13, 2015, 16:22

Yes, but we can keep them on our rosters longer. Originally there was no max - you could keep them as prospects indefinitely. Eventually we instituted a very liberal max - 300 hitter games, 400 IP, or 150 pitching games. Even so, at 100, there's still plenty of talent to find out there. It also helps teams rebuild faster (hint, hint).

481

Species
ID: 54740122
Fri, Aug 14, 2015, 15:35

FYI - We have an opening in Basketball. One for now....could be more as we start the season.

482

Meatwads
ID: 13514823
Sat, Aug 15, 2015, 12:50

Now that I've gotten settled in, released some of the dead weight on my roster, and become more aware of some of the complicated rules, I want to let everyone know that I'm open for business if anyone is looking to make some additions for the stretch run. Everyone on my roster is available for the right price.

In general, I'm most interested in acquiring a keeper bat. Besides that, I'm always interested in elite prospects, prospect picks and draft pick upgrades. Anyone who's interested in discussing anything from a multi-player blockbuster to a pick swap, send me an email and we can discuss. Full disclosure, I like to let the entire league know before I'm about to trade a specific player. I like to give everyone an opportunity to beat any offer on the table.

483

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Aug 19, 2015, 20:27

475. That requires me to remember every player I've ever had on my roster. I did have pujols and wright once upon a blue moon...

484

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Aug 19, 2015, 20:37

475

I have eleven on my current roster.

486

Meatwads
ID: 13514823
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 05:55

Went camping for a couple days in case someone offered me a trade, I wasn't ignoring on purpose. Slizz, let's talk about that offer you sent me if you still want.

Multiple managers have been asking and offering deals for Buster Posey so if someone wants him badly, make me your best offer. I'm going to want something good for him.

I'm probably trading Kendrys Morales and Torii Hunter for a pick upgrade later today. If someone wants to swoop in and steal those sexy old men, holla at ya boy.

Holla holla holla holla holla holla hollalala

487

GO
ID: 432341310
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 10:17

Volquez available to a contender looking for good IP cheap. Also have some closers all of a sudden.

488

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 11:40

Looking to deal off the following, some very cheap:
Closers: Brad Boxberger, Zach Britton
Power/Speed: Curtis Granderson, Dexter Fowler
Speed: Delino Deshields, Cesar Hernandez
Youth: Stephen Piscotty, Jose Berrios, Bradley Zimmer, Tyler Kolek
Catcher: Welington Castillo
Third Base: Mike Moustakas, Luis Valbuena

489

Meatwads
ID: 13514823
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 21:11

Trade Announcement

Meatwads trade
Kendrys Morales
Torii Hunter
2016 - 10th round pick

Tosh trades
Rafael Betancourt
2016 - 5th round pick

490

Tosh
ID: 307102122
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 23:10

Confirmed. I'm waiving Norris, but he remains on my prospect roster.

491

Species
ID: 11730119
Fri, Aug 21, 2015, 23:10

Trade noted.

Also removed some more prospects that exceeded limits.

FYI - I am going to be mostly available for the greater part of the next 3 weeks starting Monday. Don't eff things up while I am gone.

492

Khahan
ID: 54152322
Sat, Aug 22, 2015, 01:13

Hey guys. I know I've been pretty silent since joining. Its just with the team I was handed I dont see the point in making moves right now. Though w/ the demotion of Castro I could use a SS who can steal some bases.

I have some plans for the off-season though.

493

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Mon, Aug 24, 2015, 23:33

ESPN is the most craptastic site. They upgraded the app so I can't load it anymore on my iphone. Their webpage is like some bad remix from the dot com boom with way too many videos and ads. Let's see how much stuff we can jam on the page at one time... So so bad.

494

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Aug 26, 2015, 09:34

R9, please get Billy Hamilton out of your lineup.

495

Ref
ID: 55156513
Sun, Aug 30, 2015, 12:08

Just, FYI, I have had to CUT valuable players (It's all relative!) due to all my DLed players. Today was my starting C. I've also had to cut Ps with tons of potential to try and stay legal--even though I am at the bottom of the standings. This has really hurt my team. If you can't follow those same rules--regardless of where you are in the standings, then you don't need to be playing in this league. /rant

496

Khahan
ID: 527313111
Mon, Aug 31, 2015, 12:31

I'm familiar with the requirement to field a full team every day possible from my first stint here but honestly I could use a few reminders as I don't see it really addressed in post 423 except to say, "must have active players at each roster position"

A review of this would be good.
For example when Howie Kendrick went down for me I had Brett Lawrie able to fill the spot but he was day to day at the time. I didn't jump to fill second base for 1 day because Lawrie would be back the next (most likely) and Coghlan was getting 2nd base eligibility within a day or two as well. Should I technically have dropped somebody for that single day to pick up another second basemen?

Also what happens on a Monday or Thursday when its a light schedule. I fill in all my active players but find out 2 of them getting a day of rest. Do I need to find FA or WW fodder to fill in for them?

I'm not arguing the points, just asking for clarification.

497

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Aug 31, 2015, 13:40

From Eric Karabell's column:

After Chicago Cubs right-hander Jake Arrieta completed a dazzling August by no-hitting the Los Angeles Dodgers Sunday night, I think it’s well past time we all apologize to the man for allowing him to fall to the 11th round and No. 27 starting pitcher in ESPN average live drafts. Julio Teheran and Tyson Ross over Arrieta? Gio Gonzalez? Hey, I admit it. I didn’t rank Arrieta among my top-20 starters because his 2014 performance, while awesome and certainly relevant to deciding fantasy championships, seemed like a fluke. Arrieta was hardly special over four seasons with the Baltimore Orioles. He was dealt along with Pedro Strop for Scott Feldman and Steve Clevenger. It wasn’t a blockbuster deal.

The Arrieta on display Sunday night is a legitimate Cy Young contender, and while he’s owned in all leagues and nothing I write is going to change that, I can announce this: Everyone was wrong about Arrieta back in March, but next March, he has to be viewed as a top-10 starting pitcher, if not a top-three choice, along with Dodgers Zack Greinke and Clayton Kershaw. Are Washington Nationals right-hander Max Scherzer and Chicago White Sox lefty Chris Sale better, safer and laden with greater upside? What about San Francisco Giants lefty Madison Bumgarner, New York Mets right-handers Jacob deGrom and Matt Harvey, and free agents David Price and Johnny Cueto? Even that comparison might sound ridiculous, like it’s not good enough. After all, this is the No. 2 starting pitcher on the ESPN Fantasy Player Rater today, fourth overall, behind Arizona Diamondbacks first baseman Paul Goldschmidt, Greinke and Toronto Blue Jays third baseman Josh Donaldson. Arrieta passed Kershaw. He passed Mike Trout. He’s been great all year, and it’s not that we hadn’t noticed, but it understandably takes time for praise to catch up with a 29-year-old who many had given up.

Not only is Arrieta the lone pitcher on pace for the elusive and often-overrated 20-win season, but also we can now be certain that he's truly earned his 2.11 ERA, 0.94 WHIP and excellent strikeout rate -- things he can control -- unlike last season, when there was at least some doubt, as Arrieta made only 25 starts and we needed more evidence. Arrieta's 2015 numbers aren't the result of a spate of good luck. In six August starts, he permitted two earned runs for a 0.43 ERA, with 0.70 WHIP. The last starting pitcher to win six starts in a month with an ERA that low was Chicago White Sox lefty Jim Kaat in 1974. Arrieta’s ERA since the All-Star break is 1.03. An extreme ground-baller who induces many strikeouts, Arrieta is efficient with his pitches and dazzles with his cutter and curveball. Left-handed hitters are flummoxed, managing just a .161 batting average and .471 OPS. In Baltimore, Arrieta threw an ineffective slider, but now it’s morphed into a dominant cutter. In Chicago, he is not only throwing harder but he had also improved his command and home run rate. It’s a joy to watch, actually. I don’t know if Arrieta can win the NL Cy Young award over Greinke, whose ERA remains a ridiculous half-run better, but it should be fun watching.

Tosh, you're welcome.

498

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Sep 01, 2015, 09:28

For my own future reference. BH stats on Sept 1:

694 R, 178 HR, 601 RBI, 102 SB, .3653 OBP
1052 K, 76 W, 81 Sv, 3.187 ERA, 1.191 ERA

1076 IP, 1215 GP, 209 moves

499

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Tue, Sep 01, 2015, 19:47

RE: 496: I believe the intended rule is to not have DL'ed players starting for your team. Off days are for sure okay, and DTD I *think* is okay, but could use some clarification. (Yahoo doesnt even have DTD, so I often have a guy out for a week before I even realize he hasn't been playing. On the other hand, ESPN doesn't have the NA listing).

I think there should be some allowances in the rule. If it means cutting otherwise useful players just to get a full team every day, that's a problem, especially for rebuilding teams. We've discussed this before, but perhaps adding a DL slot would be helpful.

500

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 00:58

This is where I make my plug for a GP penalty to discourage all of the options for tanking through inactivity.

501

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 10:46

Bean, we have tried and tried to add this stuff to no avail. I have lost so many top notch players trying to follow the rules over the year. Last year I had to cut DeGrom as I needed 2-3 days before a guy came off DL. Others just fudge it and see how long they can go or ignore with no penalties. Some may be honestly not paying enough attn to even realize it. Problem is that people who are playing by rules and following our bylaws to try your best at all times (even when you are at the bottom like me) are ignored. Maybe it's just me. Maybe I need to step away from fantasy baseball.

502

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 11:27

Re-read my post and that doesn't make total sense. Should say that the rules that say you should try your best at all times are ignored. Obviously, the teams at the bottom are also trying to have their best future lineup on their squad while also doing their best to put the best possible lineup in your lineup each day.

If a player is day to day, use your best judgment. If a player is on the DL in your starting lineup, then your lineup isn't legal and you need to make an adjustment.

503

Khahan
ID: 2982829
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 14:46

I think that clarifies it a bit. I'm active checking my line up every day. I'm making the decisions I feel are best for my team. I should be ok.

504

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 15:33

To be clear, there is a rule that if a player is on the DL (not day-to-day) or in the minors, he cannot be in your starting lineup, and must be replaced by an eligible player. Off days are irrelevant here. That's the rule, period.

To Khahan's point, that's not always in the best interests of your team, either in the short term or the long term, but that's the rule as it exists now.

505

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, Sep 02, 2015, 19:20

Bottom line is that we are left with a rule set that is vague, subjective and hard to enforce. It is a recipe for bad feelings.

506

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Sep 03, 2015, 09:16

Agreed, and there are several not-so-vague historical examples of those bad feelings. However, that's the current set of rules; I'd be very happy if we took the time to solidify them, but that hasn't happened yet.

507

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Sat, Sep 12, 2015, 17:39

Looking to trade Mark Teixeria for a mid-round 2016 pick to help my push for 4th place this season.

After consulting with the good folks at dynasty guru, the consensus is Teixeria too good to drop in a keeper league this deep with his raw power.

508

GO
ID: 432341310
Sat, Sep 12, 2015, 19:18

Trade deadline?

509

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Tue, Sep 15, 2015, 21:25

FYI - Correa is no longer a prospect 😢

510

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, Sep 16, 2015, 17:41

All -- I am putting forth a list of rule changes/additions/tweaks for us to consider. With the title having long ago been finalized, let's use this time to sharpen our rules so there are as few gray areas as possible.

Since there is no trade deadline specified in our rules - and because the title is spoken for so a late season trade will have no effect - I am ruling that there is NO trade deadline so fire away.

Rule changes to discuss and consider:

Trade deadline: August 15....September 1st or September 15th

Activity requirements: The ambiguous wording in our rules is outdated and puts too much on the Commissioner. In the league’s infancy it was ok.....everyone knew the rules and the "spirit of the league".....but with so much turnover in recent years it is time we specify. Some points to consider:

- I like the rule that states you must have a healthy, complete starting lineup at all times, but it's a bit ambiguous. Do we go to a minimum games played by position and a minimum innings pitched rule?
- if so, what are the limits?
- what would the penalties for non compliance be?

Any other potential rule changes that have been on your mind? Or.....we have several new managers.....any suggestions that have worked well in your other leagues?

Thanks to all.

511

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Sep 16, 2015, 18:00

As I try to get to 15th place and stay there with Franco on the DL, I just have one rule change.

If you drop a player on a day, you cannot then pick him up on the same day. This kind of flipping is not in the spirit of the rules. You drop a guy you like to fill a bye week and before anyone realizes he is a FA, you pick him up again. Every player dropped should go to the waiver wire, not just sit there for an hour or two hour to be picked up again yet by the same manager.

Or limit the total number of transactions / month, year, or whatever.

512

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Sep 16, 2015, 18:02

511 should be "off day" not "bye week" -- already into football...

513

darkside
ID: 81492120
Wed, Sep 16, 2015, 18:55

I'd be fine with a minimum games/innings pitched. It'd need to be pretty high--like 140-150 for all positions besides catcher, which should be more like 100-120. IP should be at least 800, but to ensure competitive lineups it should be higher...I'd throw 1000 out, but expect that would be met with resistance.

That would still be a lot to track, and it would need to be at the end of the season unless you did it by month (which would be harder to track, I assume). If it's an end of the year thing, some sort of draft penalty?

RE: 511...I don't see the problem, but I've not thought about it at all.

514

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 09:36

Would anyone be open to a roving trade deadline, that is later if more teams are in contention? We'd have to put certain exact numbers on it.

I'd like to add to the list of proposals:
- The winner only gets to keep 8 players, and automatically moves pick #20 to #10 (and eveyone else moves back one slot, post-lottery). This aims to level the playing field a bit - repeat champs are boring.

- Add a 4th prospect slot. This decreases the likelihood that players like Jose Berrios, Blake Snell, and Jurickson Profar are clogging up rosters by August. It also gives a rebuilding manager one more tool to get back in contention.

- Decrease the prospect thresholds to 150 AB, 50 IP, and 20 G, and institute a rule that prospects must be called up to the roster within 4 days of hitting that limit. We'll police this manually - if someone mentions it on the board, that is official notice, although any time after 4 days, the commish reserves the right to put the prospect on the roster and remove his worst player (and the manager can ask for it to be a different player later, as long as the player is still on waivers).

- Remove the 10th keeper loophole. If you want to keep a prospect, you either keep him with an available prospect keeper slot, and call him up, or use a regular keeper.

- Any prospect pick you own can be used to keep a prospect, whether it is yours originally, or you traded for it. If you have 12 picks, you can keep 12 prospects.

As for the innings and games minimums, I don't think penalties are appropriate there. They are already hurting their team, and the penalty just means that the next owner is in a deeper whole.

Instead, at the end of each season, each manager sends the commish the three most inactive managers, in his opinion. Then the commish tabulates, and posts the 3 with the most votes. Anyone in the bottom 3 in consecutive years should be removed, although the commish can override, especially if all 20 managers are very active. The commish can also remove managers anyway, if the inactivity is egregious, at his discretion.

I would support Judy's proposal if we had a clear way to police it and dole out punishment. ESPN and all other sites don't support this, so someone either has to volunteer and have a clear, viable plan. We also need to have specific rules against picking up a zillion players so no one else can. Very specific. Until that happens, I can't vote for that one.

Also, for Judy's rule, keep in mind that this only works for player who have been on your roster for 24 hours, so it's not like you're dropping keepers and picking them back up.

515

Bean
ID: 14147911
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 10:24

Haven't run a league at ESPN, so not familiar with the settings, but choose a Trade deadline that can be implemented in the settings. If anything goes, then JUL 31 or AUG 31 is easy to remember, if you dont want to just use the MLB deadline.

As to the participation rules, I've put forth my thoughts repeatedly. So, I will just go into listen mode now.

516

Khahan
ID: 198471710
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 11:59

Since there is no trade deadline specified in our rules - and because the title is spoken for so a late season trade will have no effect - I am ruling that there is NO trade deadline so fire away.

Rule changes to discuss and consider:

Trade deadline: August 15....September 1st or September 15th

Have there been shady deals in the past that makes you think we need a deadline? If there has been no reason to implement one in the past I don't see the need for it now. I'd vote leave it as is. If a deal is good, its good. It shouldn't matter if its 2 weeks before the end of the season or two weeks into the season. And if a manager wants to push for standings by making a deal that could garner him a few points why should an arbitrary deadline stop him? One thing about this league is that it is so deep that people can't really rely on the WW as much for the stretch run.

Activity requirements

Is this something we need to have a rule change on or is it a matter of a 'rules clarification.'
If a change can keep the spirit of the rule in place and reduce the commish workload that is great. What if we kept the rule as is but added clarification like - to the best of your active rosters ability (this addresses DTD people). And add some clarification that a player on the dl cannot be in the starting line and a replacement must be utilized (saying utilized allows for a replacement from your current roster or from the FA pool. I was thinking a replacement must be found - but found implies that you must pick up a new player even if your roster can accommodate the injury).

This also does not exclude a minimum games played limit. I think the minimum games played gets more at manager activity than it does 'must have active players on roster at each position.' They are related, but I think separate, issues. I don't think the minimum should be applied to IP - that should stay a cap. Min innings limit is better for weekly transaction or H2H weekly leagues. Cap is better for whole season leagues.

I'm neutral on Judy's proposal. I'm just used to players being on waivers so if we change its just par for the course for me. But at the same time I feel its a little disingenuous to rotate players that way (like judy said its not in the spirit) so I wouldn't do it myself to begin with if its unchanged.

Add a 4th prospect slot. This decreases the likelihood that players like Jose Berrios, Blake Snell, and Jurickson Profar are clogging up rosters by August. It also gives a rebuilding manager one more tool to get back in contention
It also further limits already limited resources for a rebuilding team. For a contending team its 1 more resource they have that rebuilding teams don't.

The winner only gets to keep 8 players, and automatically moves pick #20 to #10 (and eveyone else moves back one slot, post-lottery). This aims to level the playing field a bit - repeat champs are boring
Interesting and certainly a way to level the playing field. But it just seems to punish success.

517

Judy
ID: 35493114
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 12:51

514. How are you defining "most inactive members". You cannot use the number of moves made because some people like their lineups as is and don't seek too many changes,

518

mjd
ID: 23182817
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 12:57

Why bother with a trade deadline?

If someone wants to upgrade a keeper at the end of the season, we should be OK with that. After all, we want to encourage league activity, not stifle it.

What are the major pros and cons to a trade deadline? I've gotten trade offers in January. If I can make a trade in January, why not in September?

If the deadline is say, Aug 31, then when does "trade season" begin?

519

Species
ID: 54740122
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 13:15

511: In my opinion we need as many mechanical aspects to be handled by our league site and not manually. If that is a "glitch" or imperfection on ESPN, we either live with it or change sites.

Admittedly we do have to handle our prospects manually....thankfully Guru at least set up the email notifications, which is a big help. It would be nice if ESPN had a prospect or other type of block based upon a list.

I don't think we necessarily need a trade deadline either. If that's the case.....I just want us to eventually vote on it so it can be official in our rules.

BTW - Miguel Cabrera has gone 10 for 53 with NO HR in September. Please root for him to hit 3 HR (or 8 would be better) so bh gets fewer (or no) picks. Speaking of which.....Tosh did pretty damned well in that trade....Sale and Arrieta are stud SP and Rosenthal has been amazing.

520

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 13:25

We absolutely need a trade deadline. If you have your 9 keepers set, the 10th guy is worth nothing to you, and you could let him go for next to nothing, though it could dramatically impact the standings. This year, everyone gave up, but if there was a race brewing, there would be potential for very shady deals.

I recommend August 15.

521

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 13:28

And Tosh really killed me with that deal. I knew Arrieta was great, and I knew Rosenthal was great. And I knew Miggy was both an injury and regression risk. Thank goodness I got insurance.

522

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 13:38

Speaking of that trade, there is some housekeeping to do...there has been some behind the scenes discussion and I wanted to clarify the interpretation of the trade:

--------------------------------------

Trade Announcement

Bh gets:
Miguel Cabrera

Tosh gets:
Jake Arrieta
Trevor Rosenthal
Chris Sale

Caveats:
If Miggy under 800 ops OR 100 games OR 20 homers, bh gets Tosh 2nd supp and 1st prospect

If Miggy under 900 ops OR 25 homers, bh gets tosh 4th supp 1st prospect

In both cases, tosh gets Bhs worst remaining pick on last day of season.

If Sale has TJ surgery on or before Sept 30 (date of surgery, only TJ), all picks are negated.

--------------------------------------

As it stands, Miguel will hit the OPS qualifier, but is going to fall short on home runs.

The way the trade reads to me is that Miguel needs to hit one (OPS) or the other (HR) to negate the caveat.

I talked with BH and he told me that Miguel needed to hit both HR and OPS.

Tosh - could you please confirm what the original deal was?

523

Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 16:40

BH wanted some insurance in the case the Cabrera tanked.

The standards, copy/pasted from the emails we had, were -
OPS under .800, under 100 games played, or under 20 homers ~~ Round 2 pick & my first prospect pick
OPS under .900, or under 25 homers ~~ Round 4 pick & my first prospect pick

As of today, Miggy has -
GP - 108
OPS - .977
HR - 17

My understanding was that if Cabrera did not achieve any of the standards noted, BH would receive additional compensation. So I believe that if Cabrera does not hit 20/25 HRs, I would owe additional picks. So I need Cabrera to hit more HRs in the upcoming 2 weeks.

524

Guru
ID: 330592710
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 16:54

Agree that we should have a trade deadline. I'd support either Aug 15 or Aug 31, or something thereabouts.

I also support minimum usage limits for both IP and GP. The penalties should be related to positioning for the next draft, since that is the benefit that a team currently earns by minimizing usage. Maybe a team that fails to meet minimum limits is removed from the lottery. Or at the extreme, its first round pick is moved to the end of round 1.

Frankly, I wouldn't mind if there was a maximum limit on moves either. I know we are trying to encourage activity, but I'm not sure there is any compelling reason to reward hyperactivity.

525

GO
ID: 448111720
Thu, Sep 17, 2015, 21:11

I like last available date in August for trade deadline. Also like the thought behind minimums and maximums.

526

Meatwads
ID: 13514823
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 00:40

I'm just letting everyone with more experience in this league discuss ideas before I give my opinions about anything. Once most people have chimed in, and I'm not spending the majority of my free time trying to win playoff matchups in other leagues, I'll post something thought out.

527

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 12:45

Since, there's no trade deadline, Jose Berrios is available.

Twins' Jose Berrios top 2016 prospect

Tommy Rancel, ESPN Insider

1. Jose Berrios, RHP

Minnesota Twins

2015 highest level: Triple-A

2016 starting level: MLB

Analysis: An apparent lack of planning on Minnesota's part saw the right-hander toss 166⅓ innings in 2015. But none of them came at the major league level on a club battling for a playoff spot with apparent room in the rotation. Instead of dwelling on what could have been, we fast-forward to 2016 with a fresh set of innings for Berrios. Lacking prototypical size or ideal fastball velocity, the Puerto Rican native uses plus control and a pair of above-average secondary (changeup and curveball) offerings to keep opposing lineups off balance and, more importantly, off the fastball. He has immediate middle-of-the-rotation ability as a solid source of strikeouts and the chance to be a contributor in WHIP.

Also offering up #2 and #6 if middle infielders are your thing.

528

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 17:28

I think this one is a no brainer:

- Remove the 10th keeper loophole. If you want to keep a prospect, you either keep him with an available prospect keeper slot, and call him up, or use a regular keeper.

529

mjd
ID: 23182817
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 21:39

Calling up a prospect right as the season starts is essentially the same as the current rule.

530

Species
ID: 456182615
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 23:05

The following players are on active rosters and have exceeded prospect limits, and have been removed from our prospect list:

Carlos Rodon
Francisco Lindor
Carlos Correa

Some in danger of exceeding limits this year:
Blake Swihart
Miguel Sano

Several prospects have exceeded limits (Lamb, Taylor) that are not on their teams' active rosters. They may continue to be stowed on the prospect list until the end of the year, when they are considered "called up" and may be kept by their teams as part of their 9 keepers.

531

Species
ID: 456182615
Fri, Sep 18, 2015, 23:12

Playing Devil's Advocate:

514 / 528: Why is the "10th Keeper" an issue?

The mechanism might seem different than in the past when we had the Prospect Draft in July.....but in reality it is the same. You drafted someone in the previous prospect draft....they have reached the point of being ML ready and they are called up after your 9 keepers are done. Where is the issue?

532

Guru
ID: 330592710
Sat, Sep 19, 2015, 09:41

[531] Agreed. I don't see the issue.

533

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Sat, Sep 19, 2015, 12:28

531/532: I think the issue is that you get a 10th keeper and a prospect pick. you should only get one.

534

Guru
ID: 330592710
Sat, Sep 19, 2015, 15:40

I know - but that's not materially different than when the prospect draft was in July. You could still call up the prospect at the beginning of the season, renounce his further prospect rights, and get the extra prospect pick.

It's actually a bit less advantageous now than it was before, since you have to renounce prospect rights at the beginning of the season, rather than waiting until July.

535

Guru
ID: 330592710
Sat, Sep 19, 2015, 15:45

... so my point is that if it's a "loophole" now, then it was an even bigger loophole when the prospect draft was deferred until July. But I don't think anyone considered it a loophole back then.

536

Khahan
ID: 54152322
Sat, Sep 19, 2015, 20:14

I would only consider it a '10th keeper' if it allowed for more players to be carried over than the total roster size and prospect list size allow.

Otherwise I'd call it good resource management if you can get a keeper quality player on the prospect list that still qualifies.

537

Guru
ID: 330592710
Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 14:26

OK - in the interest of putting something concrete on the table, I submit the following three proposals:

Proposal #1: Minimums for GP and IP:
A team must accumulate a minimum of 1385 GP by hitters over the course of a season. For each 20 games of shortfall, a team is assigned one demerit. Demerits will be integer values only. Thus, a team with 1-20 games of shortfall will receive one demerit, 21-40 will receive 2 demerits, etc.

A team must accumulate a minimum of 1150 IP over the course of a season. For every shortfall of 20 IP, a team is assigned one demerit. Demerits will be integer values only. Thus, a team with 1-20 IP of shortfall will receive one demerit, 21-40 will receive 2 demerits, etc.

GP and IP demerits will be combined for each team.

If a team finishes “in the money” for prize pool purposes (ranked 1-6), then demerits will be ignored.

For lottery teams, the following penalties will be applied to the first round pick in the next year’s supplement draft:

If a team accumulates more than 10 demerits, then it will be removed from the lottery and assigned the 14th pick in the first round (i.e., behind all lottery teams, but ahead of any prize pool teams.)

For teams with less than 10 demerits, that team is pushed forward one place in the "lottery rankings" for each demerit. For example, if a team finishes in last place (20th) and has 5 demerits, then that team will be treated in the lottery as though it finished in 15th place (and the teams actually finishing in places 16-20 will each move down one place.)

If more than one lottery team has a demerit, then the lottery rankings will be successively applied starting with the worst finisher and then moving up to the next worst finisher, etc.

Rationale: the primary incentive for a team to fall short of GP or IP minimums is to improve lottery standing for the following year. For now, I’m proposing penalties that impact only the first round of the supplemental draft. We might also want to establish some sort of demerit-based grounds for replacing a manager. Also, if a manager is replaced, then we may reserve the right to waive any demerit-based penalties (depending on the perceived strength of the team.)

1385 GP assumes 9 slots x 162 games x 95%.
1150 IP assumes 162 starts at 6 IP per start, plus three relievers at 60 IP per reliever.

Proposal #2: Complete lineup
There will no longer be a requirement to field a complete, healthy lineup for each game day.

Rationale: GP and IP limits should be a sufficient motivation for ample activity. The current rule cannot be automatically enforced anyway.

Proposal #3: Player acquisition limit
Each team will be limited to no more than 180 player acquisitions over the course of the season. For purposes of this limit, callups of prospects will be ignored. (In this eventuality, a commish will need to process an exempt transaction.)

Rationale: This limits the ability of a manager to improve his team results with “excessive” player transactions, thereby helping to level the playing field with managers who do not have the time or energy for multiple transactions per day. The limit of 180 still allows for approximately one player pickup per day. ESPN currently has the ability to automatically enforce this limit.

538

GO
ID: 39727167
Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 22:32

GO Votes
Proposal 1,2,3 - YES

539

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 01:42

Bean Votes
Proposal 1, 2, 3 - YES

540

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 04:13

Proposal 1, 2, 3 - YES

541

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 11:49

531: agreed

537: 1. I have been calling for that for a long time. Never discussed the demerit issue or don't remember the number of games/innings I was calling for but something like this needs to occur. I would think it would be every round too and not just the first round.

2. The problem with this is by not making teams have a lineup not on the DL, they can hold onto players they may not have been able to hold onto. It's not just the bottom teams, but top teams too. If demerits are ignored if they hit the money then this could still be an issue. So if I don't have to field a complete lineup, how can you make me even have a C on my team at all? I get the thinking on this but I think there is more to it.

3. I have proposed this as well and it never came to a vote. The problem with total streaming is all the players on waivers as well. How many times has BH, for example, used the FAs as extra bench personnel? More power to him, but in such a deep league WITH PROSPECTS who are playing but not picked up to further limit potential players, there is just no one there. There is a feeling of hopelessness and "why should I bother looking anymore?"

When your team is ravaged by injuries or simply need to be upgraded, it's near impossible to gain any kind of traction.

If you have a prospect on the active 25 man roster, I'd say you have to put him on your team. Why? Because he is taking up space on the FA wire where someone who has a player who must be good enough to produce is helping another team. IF a player he going to hit the limits, it does no use to not pick him up except to keep an EXTRA player on your roster. That was NOT the intent of prospects. You can call them up 3 times. If this player isn't playing a lot, there are things you can do--like trading him for some nice returns. Maybe that player can stash him on his roster. Same thing goes for an injured player you need to replace on your roster. If we want to keep prospects, then we have to figure out a way to keep the league more competitive.

542

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 11:50

1, 2: NO

Did you actually look at GP stats for this league? There are only 8 teams projected to reach that number this season, and I have never reached that number in 5 seasons. I am not against the rule, per se, but it should be 1300. If you are purposely tanking, you will be under 1300 GP.

3: YES

I think it should be less, like half that number, but I don't believe in using the entire FA pool as a 10th man in a keeper league. (BTW, BH has had to make 213 moves just to get his GP safely over 1400 this season.)

543

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 14:39

But how many moves since August 1?

Seriously, does limiting us to 180 moves do anything for the competitive balance in this league other than punish the guy who cares enough to log in and make moves every day?

Holding off my official votes until there are a few more in. Ref, I'd suggest you actually say "yes" or "no" on each proposal.

544

Khahan
ID: 568162214
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 15:16

1. No - not that I'm opposed to the idea but one thought I had that nerf solidified for me was the actual numbers being used. I think they need to be looked at for the games played.

2 and 3 I'll vote no for now only because I see these working best only if #1 is implemented. And like I said, I think #1 we'll need to look at the numbers.

One thing about the numbers (and this happened often). Lets say you insert a guy in your line but he does not play due to D2D or just a day of rest. He doesn't count towards that total even though you were actively managing your roster and trying to make decisions.

545

Guru
ID: 330592710
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 15:28

I wasn't necessarily expecting people to start voting. I was trying to throw out some straw men, thinking that discussion would be more productive with something actually on the table.

1. I actually did look at the GP this year. I knew that 1385 might be a tad high, but almost two weeks remaining, it looked to me like about 75% of teams would get close to that number - without any motivation. If we had such a rule in place, teams would be more attuned to keeping active lineups in place.

The purpose is not solely to address tanking. It's also to try to keep teams moderately active and attentive throughout the season.

2. I could be persuaded that we should at least have a body in each slot, so that each team would need to have at least one catcher. But if that catcher gets injured, or is on paternity leave, you could just leave him in that slot.

3. I also agree that 180 may be too high, but thought I would throw a high number out there, and one move per day seemed like a start. I'd certainly support a lower max if there is support for it. I had no idea what the level of support for this type of rule might be.

BH - the purpose is not to "punish the guy that cares enough...", but rather that many of us don't want to play in a league where that level of hyperactivity is almost necessary to compete. You certainly don't see real MLB teams exercise that type of transactional excess.

546

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 16:28

I'm not really taking it too personally, although capping it at 180 really only impacts one person in this league, if not the standings.

Honestly, one of my favorite parts of this league is looking at the lineups each morning, and taking action based on them. I know that might be more active than other managers in this league, but it's quite enjoyable. My vote will almost always be in favor of keeping that action relevant, but I do understand that there are 19 other owners with 19 other routines and desires. I'm happy to adjust to whatever the league decides. Surprised there isn't more support for limiting the champion to 8 keepers.

547

mjd
ID: 23182817
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 17:25

I don't think that the champion should be handicapped.

548

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 19:22

I guess I took it the wrong way because people had already started voting. As I said before, 1300 GP is a fair number, and accounts for catchers and random days off. Many NL catchers barely get 130 GP, so that eats into alot of the excess already, and a high minimum would basically force many managers to carry two catchers. 1100 IP also seems like a fair number.

On transaction limits - I am all for limiting them as much as reasonable, specifically to prevent streaming. Again, 90 seems like a good number - that is 1 move every 2 days. That still seems like alot to me, but I am very conservative when it comes to moves. I am also thoughtful about the moves I make, and like to think that the player I pick up will do very well and be a long term asset. I dont even think about getting a player for one start or one game unless it's the last 10 days of the season and I am trying to get to the IP cap.

549

Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 20:04

If there is a desire to minimize the effect of streaming, you could simply lower the max GP and IP. I thought using a number of over 162 GP per position and high IPs was to encourage this hyper activity.

Unfortunately, nobody wants to bother unless they are in contention, and for the top teams, the activity becomes a race to the FAs once the first game of the day starts. It seems BH always wins that race.

If you want a rule that reduces the effect of streaming, just go back to 162 GP/pos like every other league and find a more suitable IP max.

550

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 20:07

543: I am not prepared to vote. I simply made comments based on each one. I have not even looked at the numbers really. I also like a couple of the ideas a lot but there could still be some tweaks I'd be in favor of. All in all, I'm so glad that someone else has really looked at things and put some time into it so we can be better. I've had no fun at all this year and that's not because my team is awful. It has been hopeless to try and improve. I've run into this problem in the past as well when my team was good and needed help. No one wants to play in a hopeless league. I've tried my best to work it to the end to see if we can figure out a way to improve or someone can have my team and see what they can do.

551

Ref
ID: 55156513
Tue, Sep 22, 2015, 20:09

549: I've tried that ever since season two and it has always failed. I did managed to get IPs pulled back to the current state, but that was it. Then only two teams hit the max.

552

Guru
ID: 330592710
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 10:30

I'd certainly support pulling the GP maximums back to 162 per slot. Maybe to 162x9 for all slots combined.

I'd be happy with a max of 90 transactions per season.

Again, I'd like the minimums for GP and IP to be primarily for the purpose of encouraging activity throughout the season, even if your team has no shot at finishing in the money. They should not be viewed simply as "anti-tanking" penalties. I have a sense that by mid-season, many teams are essentially on autopilot, with really no incentive at all to continue to try to stay as competitive as possible. That's not really the same as "tanking". So if my targeted minimums look like stretch objectives, that's not because I didn't look at the actual data. It's because I did. Frankly, I don't think hitting those levels requires a significant effort.

I might temper the demerit concept by "forgiving" 2 demerits - at least in the first year. So you'd calculate your total demerits and then subtract 2 before applying any penalties.

I'd also be supportive of applying penalties to all rounds of the supplemental draft, rather than just the first.

Is there a reason why we don't have a DL slot (or two)? If we were to move to more stringent minimums, perhaps we shouldn't force teams to use an active bench slot for an injured player.

553

Species
ID: 456182615
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 11:19

I think 1385 is a bit too high.

I "kind of" oppose the maximum transaction limit......I was resolving to the fact that "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" was going to have to be my motto in 2016 and beyond if I wanted to beat bh and WG. I was having to evolve into a daily player to keep up. But being on the West Coast was going to be a severe disadvantage....I was even considering a "two day out" streaming strategy to beat the East Coasters to the best streaming options.....

But.........this is a 20 team league and 'the league' can make it what they wish. I can appreciate the difficulty of rushing to the FA pool every morning at 6:00am trying to win the race to that RH hitter vs. the LH pitcher.

I do like the idea of a DL slot. Perhaps we adopt ONE DL slot to try it out for 2016?

554

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 12:14

DL slots are ill-conceived across fantasy. If we want teams to have more flexibility, I'd prefer to add an extra bench slot.

555

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 12:27

Also strongly support GP maxes over transaction maxes, and I'd definitely support 162x9. A GP max minimizes the value of streaming, a transaction max minimizes the value of being Blue Hen.

I'd also support a transaction minimum. 25 means (averaging) one move a week. Too many managers struggle to meet that feeble mark. As I've said before, not sure why those guys are "playing" fantasy at all, let alone in a 20 team league made up of fantasy enthusiasts.

When I joined G20, I was amazed at how often I went to the waiver wire, and the player I wanted was already on a team- most often Great One, but also Ref, Pete, Twarpy, Toral, Species, even Darkside. That has definitely changed, and I'm not sure why. Maybe the world is changing. Either way, I use the waiver wire as a bench because you let me. So, thanks?

Appreciate Guru putting out some suggestions. I'd support a much more extensive referendum of all the ideas we've talked about lately. But that takes effort, and perhaps that effort is better used on a couple more moves.

556

Species
ID: 456182615
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 13:12

Regarding Trade Deadlines:

ESPN's current system has trade deadlines for every Friday, starting at the end of June through the 2nd Friday of September.

I propose to have a trade deadline on the last date in August available on ESPN.

Please discuss..........but barring a lot of feeling otherwise, I will put that to a vote with our other referendums in discussion.

557

Species
ID: 456182615
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 13:30

I am in favor of Guru's 1st and 2nd proposals in post 537 - although I would like to discuss and possibly reconsider the minimum GP and IP numbers. The IP I think is pretty good........but GP seems aggressive. Although I might change my mind once I see the year-end results as to how many teams missed them.

I agree that the implementation of #1 makes the approval of #2 easy. That said, I think I will author something akin to "The Spirit of G20 Baseball" -- a creedo if you will of what the league's expectations are of one another. This doesn't mean it is a rule......but I want us to all be accountable to the league for the manner in which we run our franchises. Maybe its just me.

558

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 15:23

Another bench spot or a DL spot would thin the WW even more. When this system was established I did a lot of work on the players ranked just outside our rosters and there were plenty of players who could help us. But now with prospects added, that's an additional thinning of the WW. Many of those prospects would be swooped up. They are not eligible to be drafted either. While the concept of prospects is nice, it has hurt our league IMO. How much would the WW be changed with even 6-10 added available players who are on people's current teams and are playing? I'd be in favor of either eliminating hte prospect draft and all prospects (grandfathering the ones who are already on the list of course) or make serious adjustments to how we are allowed to store them so some of them or other players are available to be picked up. We don't want a bunch of great players on WW, but we need some players who actually play.

I don't want to beat a dead horse and many of Guru's thoughts echo mine. The people who are posting care enough about the league to take the time to chime in and that is appreciated.

559

mjd
ID: 23182817
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 18:54

Why do we need a trade deadline?

560

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Wed, Sep 23, 2015, 19:37

I see a ton of players on the wire who play every day or close to it. Do you really think this is a thin league?

561

mjd
ID: 23182817
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 12:53

Can someone please explain the necessity of a trade deadline?

562

Species
ID: 54740122
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 14:33

mjd -- I don't have a strong opinion on it, tbh. There IS a deadline in MLB and it is fairly common in fantasy leagues......so I proposed we add one. At a minimum, if we choose not to have one, we should vote that in so it is official in the rules.

I would like to hear more feedback on Guru's minimum GP / IP rule with demerits.

Do you have an argument against having one?

563

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 14:36

If someone doesn't care enough to improve their team by making moves, they aren't going to care about a lower draft pick.

564

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 16:14

Interesting discussion all around...

Let me start off by thanking Guru for putting some well thought ideas into "unofficial" proposals.

PROPOSALS 1 & 2:

Guru on the right track. In NJ Court System, they like to use the "reasonable person" standard when it comes to cases of negligence:

The “reasonable person” represents how most people within a community would behave in any given situation. The reasonable person standard embodies this behavior and is used to determine whether a defendant has acted negligently.

Applying that standard to G20 now quantifies what we feel that a reasonable manager should do to make sure they aren't being negligent to the other 19 managers.

I think you are on the right track by quantifying GP, but I am more of a traditionalist where I feel we should have to field a healthy, complete, lineup. It allows for more flow of players in FA.

In a league this deep, my loss (dropping some pitching to field a healthy, valid, roster) has been another team's gain for a handful of players this season. Isn't that what we want to do as managers -- achieve the best roster possible?

I probably would've held on to some of those players (mainly the ones that became closers in the days following) as I could've made the GP up later.

PROPOSAL 3:

Against it. I find the "off day" streams the most enjoyable. They help you achieve the games played and when the stream is a success, it is so satisfying. Sure, streaming comes with its risks (OBP, ERA, WHIP), but the reward can outweigh it.

Limiting it would lead to decreased interest in the league down the road. I.E. It would become more of a "draft and play" type league...leading to less posts on the board and ultimately ::::yawn::::

DL SLOT:

I would be vehemently against a blanket DL slot. It would only be abused and would only thin out the already thin FA pool even more.

I could be swayed in allowing those players kept could be allowed to be slotted in the DL, but to police it would be a nightmare.

PROSPECTS:

I love me some prospects. Who doesn't?
*cough* Judy *cough* (jk judy, just busting chops for the papelbon trade :p)

I think it's fine as is. I got burned during my rebuild with getting down to 3, but it balanced itself out for the greater good of the league. Where I do see an issue is with what Ref has touched on:

Prospects (going in order of % owned) like Schwarber, Seager, Bird, Swihart, Buxton, etc. are all on active MLB rosters and are consistent starters unowned in G20.

I understand why they're unowned, and agree with Ref that something should be done. I have an outside the box proposal I am borrowing from the European football transfer window:

Prospects can be loaned to another team only for that season if you don't plan to call him up to your active roster. Let's use Schwarber as an example.

-When the player is called up and crosses the 10 games played threshold, the owner has a decision to make wether to call him up for that season or not.

-If the owner chooses to call the prospect up, he falls under normal prospect rules and should be rostered.

-if not, we can hold a silent auction style by way of draft compensation where a trustworthy Gurupie (Guru and he can elect who sees his bid?) would see all of the bids.

-winning bid gets the rights to Schwarber for the remainder of the season. Dave gets the silent bid compensation and retains Schwarbers rights for 2016.

I would've paid a mid round pick for his production even if I couldn't own him next year. I'm sure others would've too!

However, we are all aware that for every Schwarber there is a Byron Buxton who would've burned a hole in your roster...

Solves Ref's issue and compensates BH! Win win

565

Judy
ID: 35493114
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 16:15

Look by,

I care about my team, but do not have time to research a marginal player who might help my team for one day...

566

Khahan
ID: 558112414
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 16:57

Isn't that what we want to do as managers -- achieve the best roster possible?

I probably would've held on to some of those players (mainly the ones that became closers in the days following) as I could've made the GP up later
I think, Slizz, this is where the disagreement comes in. Generally speaking I'd say that by you dropping a longer term value player for filling a roster for 1 day you have actually hurt your team and not given yourself the best 'roster' possible. Others argue that on a given day if you have a dl'd guy or a few d2d guys and don't put a full line up in then for that day you don't have the best roster possible.

I think first clarifying what the league is looking for from this rule would help us all develop a better idea of what (if any) rules changes or clarifications are needed.

If the rule is to be applied on a daily basis as some think - then I can be on board with that. I wont agree with it, but I can be on board with it. If the rule is meant to be on a longer term value of a quality roster then I can be on board with that. I recognize some legitimate concerns about policing (did Khahan not drop Howie Kendrick to replace him when he went on the dl because he isn't paying attention or think he's Howie will be right back? Is keeping an out for the season guy like Uehara or Wainwright a 'long term' positive or lazy indifference?).

But starting there and defining what the rules we have mean would go a long way.

567

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Thu, Sep 24, 2015, 17:04

I am with blue hen on the GP/IP proposal. my goal is to accumulate as many stats as possible.
for hitters this can only be done through GP. for pitchers getting stats does not necessarily mean to get as many IP as possible because it usually comes with a bigger hit in ERA/WHIP than it hits your batters OBP. eating up IP hurts you in 2 of 4/5 pitching categories, while eating up GP may only hurt you in 1 of 5 hitting categories.

I looked at how many teams would have been penalized since 2011. for 2015 I assume 85 GP + 77 IP for the last 11 days

1385 GP: 12, 10, 11, 6, 7
1350 GP: 5, 7, 5, 4, 4
1325 GP: 2, 5, 5, 1, 3
162*8 = 1296 GP: 2, 2, 2, 1, 1

lowest ever: 1242, 1251, 1264, 1278 (all the same team), 1278, 1279, 1290, 1294
highest ever: 1505
maximum: 1532

1250 IP, 8, 10, 7, 8, 10
1200 IP: 8, 9, 5, 3, 8
1150 IP: 6, 6, 4, 3, 2
1100 IP: 2, 4, 3, 2, 2
1050 IP: 1, 2, 3, 1, 2
1000 IP: 1, 2, 3, 1, 2

lowest ever: 718.2, 814.2 (both the same team), 937.1, 962.2, 971.2, 972, 981, 989, 997.1
highest ever: 1427.2
maximum: 1400 + 6 starts

I see a trend that managers tend to use more GP/IP every year. based on these stats 1150 IP looks like a good value for such a system. 1385 GP might be too high.

568

Ref
ID: 55156513
Fri, Sep 25, 2015, 11:51

The trade deadline was August 31 at 11:59 PM and was in the rules. When we came to ESPN we had to choose what they had and I modified the rules to say that date or the closest to that date that ESPN would allow. If it is no longer there then it got deleted by mistake at some point.

Slizz, as for prospects, you don't get rewarded for refusing to roster them. You get first chance and if you won't roster them then you lose them for the rest of the year. If they subsequently lose prospect status, then you lose them forever. Or you get the opportunity to roster them and if you decline then you lose them and they are no longer a prospect. I like that better. 25 man roster. A spot start wouldn't count unless they had say 5 spot starts. And if they get sent down you could always send him down up to two times from your roster.

569

mjd
ID: 23182817
Fri, Sep 25, 2015, 17:52

I agree that something should be done about all the prospects currently playing on an MLB team, but still appearing in our FA pool.

As much as I like prospects, I'd be willing to eliminate them completely and add a roster spot or even 2.

570

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Fri, Sep 25, 2015, 22:37

I agree with slizz in post 564.

571

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Sep 26, 2015, 07:49

While I can appreciate that BH checks lineups each day and acts accordingly, here is an example where it doesn't work for me.

Last night pagan was given the day off. I could have put in markakis or asche both of whom hit HR (again another HR from the bench), but I was not anywhere near a computer to be made aware of that day off for pagan probably on the west coast as well...

I lose tons of stats because due to life I am not often near a computer at game time to make last minute changes. I do the best I can given that restriction. I rarely miss a SP start, though I did miss one guy last week.

I am in favor of limiting the total # of transactions. I am pretty close to limits for most position except for C. I did try to fill my lineup even on off days; look at my flex bench guys who can play multiple positions so I can use them as fill ins. Done on purpose, so I did not need to be at the computer finding stray guys each day... I also think 162 games is plenty.

572

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Sep 26, 2015, 10:55

Whatever rules we adopt in the end, lets make sure that they are easily enforced and do not require constant monitoring by the commish (and the individual owners for that matter). Lets have very specific penalties for violations as well, not just something made up on the fly at the time of the violation. Finally lets not allow ANY subjective application of the rule.

573

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, Sep 26, 2015, 14:01

I think lowering games played and innings limit would help immensely with the transactions. I think passing that and then reevaluating transactions after next season would be best.

574

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Sep 26, 2015, 21:59

Carter -- on bench -- hits --- a home run! First one in ages...

575

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Sep 27, 2015, 18:18

Again, carter HR from the bench...

576

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, Sep 29, 2015, 19:07

No trade deadline rules! ;)

Minor trade today......

577

Ref
ID: 248182918
Tue, Sep 29, 2015, 19:18

There has always been a trade deadline of August 31 or earlier. This trade cannot happen.

578

GO
ID: 432341310
Tue, Sep 29, 2015, 19:28

I was just thinking that. Reject it. But post here and confirm to apply after season ends.

579

Species
ID: 54740122
Tue, Sep 29, 2015, 20:09

577: I do not see it in the rules.

When queried earlier this month, I already noted that, in the absence of a rule, I would not have a trade deadline until such time as we vote on an official rule.

580

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Sep 29, 2015, 20:33

Yeah, pretty sure there was consensus on not having a 2015 trade deadline. Definitely not sure 5 days matters anyway.

581

Ref
ID: 55156513
Wed, Sep 30, 2015, 10:55

578: exactly. Just wait until Monday or whatever.

580: I never saw this conversation. You'd think since I created this league and ran it for the first dozen years or so, people might lean on me a little if there was a question about a rule or method of doing things.

582

Species
ID: 54740122
Wed, Sep 30, 2015, 13:47

Ref: I mentioned it in post 510....and there was further discussion.

I have often relied upon you for how we have done things in the past. I have managed this league as close to that spirit as I could.

However, with more and more manager turnover, we have evolved. Fewer managers have the same history with the league and it's spirit (that's what I like to call it) and desire concrete rules that are objective and remove the subjectivity from the equation. Having been the one to interpret and enforce that subjectivity, I agree wholeheartedly.

So.....we are going to vote on whether the league wants a trade deadline....and if so, when that would be. Without a concrete rule in place, I decreed that there was no trade deadline for this year.

We are also going to hammer out a minimum GP and IP rules with draft penalties for non-compliance. These will be concrete and objective.

Your knowledge and experience as one of the founders of the league continues to be valued by me.

583

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Sep 30, 2015, 13:50

Ref, see Post 510 of this thread, an official ruling from the commissioner on Sept 16:

Since there is no trade deadline specified in our rules - and because the title is spoken for so a late season trade will have no effect - I am ruling that there is NO trade deadline so fire away.

After that, there was a lengthy discussion about the future rule for trade deadlines, and nobody challenged the commish's ruling. I'd say that's pretty concrete.

That said, this one makes almost no difference. If they want to make the deal on Monday, fine; I'm fine leaving it as is, personally.

584

Species
ID: 54740122
Sat, Oct 03, 2015, 13:48

Please note: rosters finalize at the start of the FIRST game tomorrow. No roster moves/free agent pick ups from that point on.

585

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Oct 04, 2015, 19:17

Solidified 15th place today. YEA!!!!☺️⚾️

Gained 7 pointd using all six SP for 36 IP, 24 K, 3 W, ERA 0.98, WHIP 0.79

Think of all those bench HR and RBI lost this season...

586

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Sun, Oct 04, 2015, 20:22

Big congrats to Dave (BH). You had Midas' touch this season...Every move you made was the right one! Well earned, and deserved, championship.

Next year I'm coming for you!!!

Dave and I had a side bet for a round of drinks for the end of season NYC G20 round table:

Mark Teixeria (31) HR, O/U 28 - Slizz wins
Andrew Miller (1.90 and 14.59k/9) sub 2.5 era and at least 11 k/9 - Slizz wins
Luis Valbuena (25) HR, O/U 31.5 - Slizz wins
Fowler (7.32) vs Eaton (7.65) Player Rater - Slizz wins

Kennys Vargas (5) vs Oswaldo Arcia (2) HR total - BH wins
Odor (16/6) 12HR / 12SB - BH wins
Maybin (33) 40 sb / hr combined - BH wins

He's good but doesn't win at everything 😉

Judy - good things happen when you do those type of things! You should make more moves 😉

587

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Sun, Oct 04, 2015, 21:19

To Slizz's note, I definitely now owe "a round" to everyone who shows up. WG and Slizz have already committed (date TBD), but any of you that show up, the first one's on me.

588

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sun, Oct 04, 2015, 22:19

Slizz -- it was a no brainer. I just picked up all the SP for today, dropped everyone except Salazar and my closers and let them pitch. Dropped some nice SP for me but can't keep them for next year so why not...

Not moves I would make in season. BH would snatch them up before I could reput them on my roster likes he does with game day players.

589

GO
ID: 39727167
Sun, Oct 04, 2015, 22:23

Congrats to The Blue Hen. You have 2 drinks paid in advance waiting on you at The Stone Balloon.

590

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 06:00

congrats bh. what a dominating year.

I tried my best to get into the money. was 6th 2 days ago, but my hitting sucked the last 2 days so I ended up in 8th.

for all that also participate in G20 hoops. see you there.

591

Species
ID: 54740122
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 13:07

Congratulations blue hen on the most dominant win in G20 history. Thanks for making the league SUCK this year by eliminating most teams' desire to go all out this year.

I have resolved all of the conditional trades for this year and updated the constitution. Specifically:

- Miguel Cabrera hit less than 20 HR. The conditions of the trade with Tosh indicated that if he failed to reach ANY of three milestones mentioned, Tosh would owe blue hen a 2nd round supplemental and a first round prospect pick.
- Chris Carter hit 24 HR. The conditions of the Slizz /Judy trade indicated that 24 or less HR would result in a 6th rounder going to Slizz.
- AJ Ramos had 32 saves. This results in darkside getting a 5th rounder from WG.

Congrats to all of the teams that ended up in the mo ney. Sadly for me, when I got back from Europe and started streaming pitchers.....I only managed to cement my mediocre standing. Ugh.

That said, I am already crafting ideas for how to position my team for 2016. One of the benefits of this league is that trading doesn't have to wait until March! Don't be afraid to send some trade inquiries out.....and be ready to respond to those inquiries when you get them!

The playoff look really wide open with some huge early games (CHC vs PIT) and series (LAD vs NYM) that look awesome.

592

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 14:16

Annual Blue Hen Victory Speech

Thanks all for a great year. I am honored and lucky to have come out on top this season. Congrats to all the top finishers and to anyone else who met their goals this season.

From a baseball perspective, things went pretty perfectly, which is rare. It was a fantastic combination of holding onto the right players (David Price over Max Scherzer and Chris Sale, for example), trading for the right players (Joey Votto over Freddie Freeman, Chris Davis, and Adrian Gonzalez, among others), and luck. Luck played the biggest role, as it often does.

This championship was won back in 2013. I usually subscribe to the ABC method (Always Be Consolidating), but in 2013, I made a desperate attempt to Win Now, trading Giancarlo Stanton in a 10-player deal. While none of the five acquired players played for Team Blue Hen in 2015, the trade had long-standing benefits. Not like Pete's complaining about Stanton and Bryant (acquired for Hosmer), but here is how that trade impacted the current roster:

Stanton -> Fielder -> Gerrit Cole
Stanton -> Fielder -> #1 prospect pick (Yoan Moncada)
Stanton -> Fielder -> 4th rounder (Curtis Granderson)
Stanton -> Fielder -> Adam LaRoche -> Joey Votto (used in deal)
Stanton -> Scherzer -> Jose Altuve
Stanton -> Choo -> Joey Votto (used in deal)

We also count Kyle Schwarber here, since the Votto deal upgraded my prospect pick to get him.

The information above underscores the point I want to make about G20: after trading the guy I considered the #1 commodity in baseball for three guys I targeted, I didn't sit still. Scherzer, Fielder, and Choo would not have been enough to win in 2015. Well, maybe it would have been close, but I wouldn't have had Miggy (from Sale/Arrieta/Rosenthal) or Tulo (from Braun) or any of the guys above.

We talk about making moves, and limiting the number of transactions we make. But championships aren't won through transactions; they are won through the draft and through trades. A few years ago, one manager amassed a huge amount of talent, probably 5 sure-fire first rounders. But he made essentially zero trades, and all those guys are still on his team, many with less value than they had previously. It's not about the number of transactions, it's about EFFORT, how much you TRY to compete in this league. So here's a heartfelt thank you to the guys who did NOT try. Made my path a little smoother, thanks.

For the rest of you, I really enjoy being the league with you. AJ Ramos named closer? Awesome, I'm in a great league where someone else was on the ball and got him. Someone got Chris Carter cheap? Man, wish I could have made that deal. Let's have more of that in the future, otherwise I'm ruling over a possum kingdom.

/preach

Now for some fun facts:
BH's 2015 G20 MVP: Joey Votto
BH's 2015 Bust: Drew Hutchison, Mike Zunino (tied)
BH's 2015 unsung hero (hitter): Delino Deshields
BH's 2015 unsung hero (pitcher): Zach Britton, Dellin Betances (tied)
Most likely to be traded: David Price
Players still on my roster from Trip: just David Price
2nd longest tenured player: Jose Baustista
BH's first ever G20 pick: Edwin Encarnacion
Player I love following the most: Joey Gallo
Guy I wish was on my G20 team: Bryce Harper
BH's projected 2020 MVP: Yoan Moncada
G20 member I secretly like, but people think I hate: MJD
G20 member I secretly hate, but people think I like: WG (ok, that one's a lie)
Most underrated G20 member: Youngroman
Worked hardest to earn his finish: Slizz
Worked 2nd hardest to earn his finish: Guru
Surprised he wasn't better (lower division): Bean
Surprised he wasn't better (upper division): Species
Biggest threat in 2016: WG

Hope you guys enjoyed that, and I hope each of you posts something lengthy about your experience this season. THAT should be a requirement for people in the league. Especially looking forward to hearing from Slizz, Species, Pete, BMD, Bean, and Youngroman.

How about a challenge next year? Have a great winter. David Price is now on the block!

593

Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 15:07

Thanks to everyone for a successful 2015 season. Congrats to Blue Hen for running away with the league. I was hoping to finish in 4th, but Guru was just too good in the final week.

Even though I owe Blue Hen some additional picks from the Miggy trade, I feel I got a good deal in the end ...
** I moved from 18th in 2014, to 5th this season.
** The trade did not impact the overall race for #1
** In the recent 'keeper rankings' at ESPN, Miggy was #20. I've ended up with #21, #22, and #78. Those 3 guys will hopefully keep pitching stabilized for years to come.

As a final note, Judy [post 585] added Daniel Norris, who is my prospect. Looks like those 3 Ks, and 1 Win didn't impact anything.

See y'all in 2016!

594

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 15:26

Yeah, I'd have to say Tosh won the trade, and actually by quite a lot. I'm not complaining, and I didn't need pitching anyway, but let's talk again in 5 years when Arrieta is 34, Sale is 29, and Rosenthal is 28, and all still producing.

And remember, the point of the picks was insurance against Miggy getting hurt... which he did!

595

slizz
ID: 3556212
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 16:20

G20 2016 Keeper Rankings as per Cockcroft

Slizz
1B - Hosmer, 35
2B/3B - Rendon, 77
3B - Arenado, 8
SS - Correa, 5
OF - Jones, 59
SP - Jose, 26
SP - Stroman, 112
RP - Davis, 106

Last Keep:
1B - Teixeria, 173
2B - Profar, NR
OF - Rusney, 134
OF - Maybin, 100
SP - Quintana, 164
SP - Bauer, 176
SP - Gio G, 177
SP - Gausman, 237
RP - McGee, NR
RP - Storen, 203
RP - Capps, NR

Blue Hen
C (10th) - Schwarber, 38
1B - Miggy, 20
2B - Altuve, 10
SS - Tulo, 48
OF - Bats, 63
OF (11th) - Gallo, 101
UT - Votto, 24
SP - Cole, 18
SP - Price, 39
RP - Betances, 83
RP - Britton, 137

Possible Keeps:
OF - Pisciotty, 123
OF - DeShields, 195
SP - Odorizzi, 127
SP - McCullers, 183
RP - Boxberger, 163

WG
1B - Crush, 46
2B - Kipnis, 40
3B - Donaldson, 12
OF - Harper, 2
OF - Ellsbury, 87
SP - Shelby, 128
SP - Lester, 130
RP - AJ Ramos, 142

Last Keep:
OF - Billy Burns, NR
OF - Alex Gordon, 192
SP - Tyson Ross, 139
RP - Hector Rondon, 175

Khahan
1B - Gonzalez, 67
3B - Lawrie, 210
OF - McCutchen, 7
OF - Upton, 23
OF - Brantley, 32
SP - Kershaw, 14
SP - Greinke, 60
RP - Tolleson, 182
RP - Street, 194

Others:
2B - Kendrick, 249
DH - A-Rod, NR

Guru
1B - Rizzo, 11
3B - K. Seager, 82
SS - Lindor, 57
OF - Springer, 17
SP - Lynn, 159
SP - Richards, 92
SP - Kluber, 43
SP - Corbin, 179
RP - K-Rod, NR

Possibles:
C - Gomes, 246
2B - Zobrist, NR

Tosh
1B - Kendrys, 150
3B - Machado, 6
OF - Marte, 19
UT/3B - Castellanos, 116
SP - Sale, 21
SP - Arrieta, 22
SP (10th) - Finnegan, NR
RP - Rosenthal,78
RP - Familia, 103

Last Keep:
2B - Travis, 238
2B - Murphy, NR
OF - Revere, 220
SP - McHugh, 191

darkside
1B - Pujols, 110
2B - Odor, 71
3B - Carpenter, 96
OF - Pollock, 28
OF - Cain, 50
OF - Cespedes, 58
UT/OF - Souza, 135
SP - Zimmerman, 86
SP - Wood, 166
RP - Perkins, NR

Other notables:
SP - Ryu, NR
SP - Anderson, NR
SP - Garcia, NR

youngroman
2B - Cano, 91
SS - Crawford, 109
UT/SS - Segura, 155
OF - JD Martinez, 52
OF - Braun, 69
OF - Pence, 151
SP - Thor, 80
SP - Hamels, 121
SP - Teheran, 160
SP (10th) - Severino, 154

Others:
2B - LeMahieu, 204
OF - Michael Taylor, 207
SP - Iwakuma, 248

OF - Reddick, 187

Species
1B - Abreu, 13
2B/SS (10th) - Peraza, 162
3B - Longoria, 105
SS/3B (11th) - Seager, 41
OF - Betts, 12
OF - Myers, 117
OF - Gardner, 132
UT (12th) - Sano, 16
SP - DeGrom, 25
SP - Harvey, 45
SP - King Felix, 51
RP - Osuna, 125

Others:
1B - Santana, 133
OF - Bruce, 156
SP - E. Rodriguez, 196

BMD

3B - Beltre, 118
SS - Reyes, 141
OF - Blackmon, 34
OF - Joc Peterson, 64
OF - Calhoun, 119
UT - Grichuk, 178
SP - Wacha, 73
SP - Rodon, 84
SP - Cobb, 198

Other Notables:
C - Russell Martin, 201
SP - Ventura, 206
SP - Lackey, 226

Mighty Meatwads
C - Posey, 44
1B - Zimmerman, 208
2B - Dozier, 107
SS - Castro, 189
OF - Yelich, 42
SP - Carrasco, 72
SP - Keuchel, 93
SP - Pineda, 94
SP - Darvish, 122

Other Notables:
3B - Harrison, 223

R9
C - Wieters, 227
1B - Goldschmidt, 4
SS (10th) - Trea Turner, 120
OF - Trout, 1
OF - Hamilton, 61
OF - CarGo, 95
SP - Carlos Martinez, 62
SP - Heaney, 167
RP - Kimbrel, 90
RP - Robertson, 126

Other notables:
SP - Verlander, NR

MJD
C - Sal Perez, 145
1B - Belt, 104
SS - Kang, NR
OF - Heyward, 47
OF - Polanco, 89
OF - Soler, 85
SP - Bumgarner, 31
SP - Tanaka, 136
BN (10th) - Pompey, NR

Last Keep:
2B - Neil Walker, NR
3B - Headley, NR

Pete N.
C - Mesoraco, 131
2B - Wong, 75
3B - Bryant, 3
OF - Stanton, 9
SP - Sonny, 49
SP - Smyly, 184
SP (10th) - Jon Gray, NR
RP - Miller, 153
RP - Allen, 180

Last keep:
1B - Singleton, NR
1B - Adams, NR
SS - Andrus, 224
OF - Holliday, NR (Pollock is 28! Listen to me next time, Pete!)

Judy
C - McCann, 138
1B - Fielder, 79
2B - Dee Gordon, 36
3B - Franco, 65
SS/2B - Russell, 55
OF - Avisail Garcia, 146
OF - Ozuna, 205
SP - Salazar, 66
RP - Giles, 97

Other Notable:
1B - Carter, NR
RP - Papelbon, 221

Jay Dog
C - Molina, NR
SS - Desmond, 169
OF - Eaton, 181
OF - Kemp, 161
OF - Choo, NR
UT - Big Papi, 242
SP - Cueto, 98
SP - Archer, 37
SP - Nelson, 243

Other Notables:
SS - Semien, NR
SP - Happ, NR

Nerf
3B - Frazier, 33
OF - Cruz, 102
OF - Kh. Davis, 200
OF (10th) - Buxton, 68
UT - Gattis, 230
SP - Scherzer, 30
SP - Cashner, NR
SP - Anibal Sanchez, NR
RP - Hoover, NR
RP - Doolittle, NR

Other:
OF - Span, NR

Ref

1B - Encarnacion, 27
2B - Kinsler, 170
3B - Pedro Alvarez, 140
OF - Puig, 76
OF - Hanley Ramirez, 88
SP - Strasburg, 53
SP - Wainwright, 108
RP - Watson, NR

Last Keep:

OF - Hamilton, NR
OF - Arcia, NR
RP - Rondon, NR

GO

C (10th) - Swihart, 199
1B - Freeman, 56
2B - Panik, 143
SS - Bogaerts, 29
OF - Dickerson, 74
OF - Conforto, 129
UT (11th) Bird, 124
SP - Matz, 99
SP - Walker, 113
SP - Nola, 193

BN - Baez, 144

Other Notables:
C - d'Arnaud, 157
2B - Schoop, 229
3B - Panda, 232
SP - Moore, 222
SP - Wheeler, 231

Bean

C - Lucroy, 148
1B - Duda, 115
2B - Pedroia, 149
3B - Wright, NR
OF - Carlos Gomez, 54
OF/3B - Tomas, 158
UT/C - Grandal, 174
SP - Estrada, NR
RP - Chapman, 70

Other Possibilities:
OF - Jackson, NR
OF - Inciarte, NR
RP - Ziegler, NR

596

slizz
ID: 3556212
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 16:25

Was speaking with Dave (BH) and after going over the normal 5 team's rosters he asked if I could post it on here...well I took an extra hour and went through the whole league to give everyone a snapshot of the teams in the league and their likely 9 (in order of the standings after posting my team first).

As you can tell, I have plenty of keeper quality players on the bench and one could actually field a decent roster with my leftovers...hahaha That said, I will be emailing some of you to plant the seed for trade talks as I will definitely be a seller. As anyone who has dealt with me in the past knows I am always fair. I try and make it work for you. The more excited you are for your team, the better the league is as a result..

I will post my season review in the coming week.

597

Judy
ID: 35493114
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 18:52

Hey it's not my fault Franco got hurt and too many of my guys hit their HR while sitting on my bench! I bet I'd have 15 more HR and at least as many RBI if I could look into the future...

598

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 20:58

I'll take that bet.

599

GO
ID: 39727167
Tue, Oct 06, 2015, 19:10

Well I have a lot of guys under 30 with numbers next to them, so that's a good problem I guess.

600

Meatwads
ID: 544371712
Tue, Oct 06, 2015, 22:06

I'm probably gonna be looking to upgrade my offense before next season. So anyone with extra hitters or someone who wants to trade me hitting for pitching, keep me in mind.

601

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Wed, Oct 07, 2015, 12:18

I'm not sure I agree with that list of potential keepers. I have a few guys who weren't touted prospects that had good first full or partial seasons - Justin Bour, Matt Duffy, Travis Shaw.

My downfall, as with every team I had this season, was pitching. I kept six pitchers and every one but Scherzer was disappointing - Bailey and Doolittle were hurt, Cashner and Shoemaker were bad, Shields under-performed but had good K numbers. Then the idea was to draft hitters in the first 5 spots of the draft, and even that went horribly. Four of those five were off the team before the all star break. Napoli was the last one standing, and he barely played in the last two months as I got Bour and later Shaw to fill in.

602

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Oct 07, 2015, 13:16

Bour was a great pickup. When Miggy was hurt, I kept going to the waiver wire to see if he was available and every time I was reminded that you had him.

603

Species
ID: 11730119
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 16:42

Congratulations blue hen.

Standings

1. Blue Hen 194 +0
2. Wazaaap Guy 161 +0.5
3. Khahans Keepers 149 -0.5
4. Roto Guru 136 +1.5
5. Team Tosh 131.5 +0
6. Slizzy Slizz 128.5 -2
7. darkside of the moon 124 -0.5
8. youngroman's Luschen 121 -4
9. Endangered Species 116 +0
10. beastiemike d 99 -2
10. Mighty Meatwads 99 -1.5
10. Niner's Niners 99 +5
13. Team mjd 90 +0
14. Giancarlo Inc 85.5 -4.5
15. Sam n Max G 81 +7
16. Jay Dog 72.5 -1
17. ScruffyLookin' Nerfherders 68 -0.5
18. Red Crosses of Doom 56.5 +3
19. GO's Gaslight Anthem 54 -1
20. Bean's Rockies 34.5 +0.5
Updated Tuesday, October 6, 2015

604

Species
ID: 11730119
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 16:42

These managers have had their 2016 Supplemental Draft selections altered via trade:
7-1-13 Species receives WG's 4th rounder for his 7th (Lackey)
3-6-14 Species receives Ref's 2nd, 4th and 7th for his 10th, 11th and 12th (2014 picks)
6-3-14 blue hen receives GO's 4th for his 14th (Fielder)
6-25-14 mjd receives GoatLocker's 6th for his 14th (Melancon)
1-28-15 blue hen receives Tosh's 2nd for his 13th (Cabrera/Sale/Arrieta/Rosenthal)
2-9-15 Slizz receives Judy's 6th for his 13th (Carter)
3-25-15 GreatOne receives Khahan's 6th for his 14th ('14 pick swap)
5-5-15 Bean receives Species' 5th for his 10th (Colon)
5-11-15 mjd receives WG's 4th (via Species) for his 14th (Uehara)
5-11-15 mjd receives WG's 5th for his 13th (Casilla)
5-21-15 darkside receives WG's 5th for his 14th (Ramos)
Note: The trade will be technically completed 72 hours before the keeper deadline. The pick given up by WG does not have to be his own. It can be a pick from any manager. If WG does not have a pick in that round, the pick will be the next highest pick available WG owns.
5-16-15 bmd receives Judy's 8th for his 14th (Papelbon, Axford)
5-23-15 bmd receives WG's 3rd for whatever last round pick is in his possession (Samardzjia)
8-21-15 Meatwads receives Tosh's 5th for his 10th (Morales / Hunter)

The following managers have had their 2016 Prospect Draft selections altered via trade:

3-22-15 Great One receives Pete's 1st (2015 pick swap)
5-16-15 bmd receives Judy's 1st (Papelbon, Axford)
1-28-15 blue hen receives Tosh's 1st (Arrieta/Sale/Rosenthal)

605

Species
ID: 11730119
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 17:53

Okay......the season is fresh in our minds, and I would like to put some of our open rules items to bed. I am putting the following proposals up for votes:

Proposal #1: Minimums for GP and IP:

A team must accumulate a minimum of 1375 GP by hitters over the course of a season. For each 15 games of shortfall, a team is assigned one demerit. Demerits will be integer values only. Thus, a team with 1-15 games of shortfall will receive one demerit, 16-30 will receive 2 demerits, etc.

A team must accumulate a minimum of 1200 IP over the course of a season. For every shortfall of 15 IP, a team is assigned one demerit. Demerits will be integer values only. Thus, a team with 1-15 IP of shortfall will receive one demerit, 16-30 will receive 2 demerits, etc.

GP and IP demerits will be combined for each team.

If a team finishes “in the money” for prize pool purposes (ranked 1-6), then demerits will be ignored.

For lottery teams, the following penalties will be applied to every pick in the next year’s supplement draft:

If a team accumulates more than 10 demerits, then it will be removed from the lottery and assigned the 14th pick in all rounds (i.e., behind all lottery teams, but ahead of any prize pool teams.)

For teams with less than 10 demerits, that team is pushed forward one place in the supplemental draft rankings for each demerit. For example, if a team finishes in last place (20th) and has 5 demerits, then that team will be treated in the draft rankings as though it finished in 15th place (and the teams actually finishing in places 16-20 will each move down one place.)

If more than one lottery team has a demerit, then the lottery rankings will be successively applied starting with the worst finisher and then moving up to the next worst finisher, etc.

Rationale: the primary incentive for a team to fall short of GP or IP minimums is to improve draft standing for the following year.

Proposal #2: Complete lineup
There will no longer be a requirement to field a complete, healthy lineup for each game day.

Rationale: GP and IP limits should be a sufficient motivation for ample activity. The current rule cannot be automatically enforced anyway.

Proposal #3: Trade deadline:
Two-part question:
a) Do you want a trade deadline -- YES or NO
b) If yes, choose a date -- NOTE: the trade deadline would be the closest date available in ESPN no later than the following date:
1 - August 15th
2 - August 31st

606

Species
ID: 11730119
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 18:00

Some additional thought to my GP and IP proposals.

I wanted enough teams to be pushed to increase their activity, but wanted the levels to not be too out of whack. Based upon our 2015 activity, 8 teams needed to increase their GP and 9 teams needed to increase their IP. I wanted less than 10, but more than 4 or 5. In many cases, teams were not very far at all from these levels.

I also tweaked the number of GP and IP required to get a demerit from 20 to 15. 10 seemed too tight......20 seemed too loose so I went in between.

I like the idea of a permanent penalty for each demerit --- not just a draft lottery penalty.

There were divergent opinions on the need for a trade deadline. Either way, we need a rule.

607

Nerfherders
ID: 2211442615
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 18:17

#1 No

#2 Yes (I personally don't like either rule.)

#3 Yes, August 15th.

608

Guru
ID: 330592710
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 18:28

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes - latest date in August

609

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 19:51

1. Yes
2. No
3. Yes, August 31st

610

Species
ID: 11730119
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 20:34

So, we have a couple of conflicts with trades this year:

6-25-14 mjd receives GoatLocker's 6th for his 14th (Melancon)
5-11-15 mjd receives WG's 4th (via Species) for his 14th (Uehara)
5-11-15 mjd receives WG's 5th for his 13th (Casilla)

So: mjd already traded his 14th when he traded me his 14th. Thus, I get his 13th instead.

Then, later the same day, he traded his 13th to WG. Since he needed to give it to me to satisfy my trade, mjd gives up his 12th instead.

5-21-15 darkside receives WG's 5th for his 14th (Ramos)
Note: The trade will be technically completed 72 hours before the keeper deadline. The pick given up by WG does not have to be his own. It can be a pick from any manager. If WG does not have a pick in that round, the pick will be the next highest pick available WG owns.

A reminder: WG does not own a 5th. He has until just before the draft to acquire something to satisfy this trade.

611

Judy
ID: 35493114
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 21:49

#1. Yes
#2. Yes
#3. Yes - later date

612

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 23:21

1. No
2. Yes
3. August 31

613

GO
ID: 39727167
Thu, Oct 08, 2015, 23:22

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes - latest date in August

614

R9
ID: 692290
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 01:51

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes, Aug 31 seems fine.

Grats Hen!

615

Bean
ID: 14147911
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 02:55

1 YES
2 YES
3 YES AUG 31

616

youngroman
ID: 57047243
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 07:25

1. YES
2. YES
3. NO

617

Meatwads
ID: 544371712
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 07:48

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. No

618

Khahan
ID: 4493398
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 09:33

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. No

619

Tosh
ID: 307102122
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 10:18

1. Yes
2. No
3. Yes, August 31st

620

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 10:23

From Species - for 2016 season

	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5	Round 6	Round 7
1	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean
2	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	blue hen	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne
3	Ref	Species	Ref	Species	Ref	Ref	Species
4	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders
5	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog
6	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Slizz	Judy
7	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.
8	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd
9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9
10	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	mjd	Meatwads
11	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd
12	Species	Species	Species	Species	Bean	Species	WG
13	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman
14	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside
15	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz
16	Tosh	blue hen	Tosh	Tosh	Meatwads	Tosh	Tosh
17	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru
18	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	GreatOne	Khahan
19	WG	WG	bmd	mjd	mjd	WG	WG
20	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen

	Round 8	Round 9	Round 10	Round 11	Round 12	Round 13	Round 14
1	Bean	Bean	Species	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean
2	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	Khahan
3	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref
4	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders
5	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog
6	bmd	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy
7	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.
8	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	WG	Species	Meatwads
9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9
10	Meatwads	Meatwads	Tosh	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads
11	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	WG	Judy
12	Species	Species	Ref	Ref	Ref	Species	Species
13	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman
14	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	WG
15	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	Judy	slizz
16	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh
17	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru
18	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan
19	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG
20	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	Tosh	GreatOne

621

slizz
ID: 3556212
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 12:55

1. Yes
2. No
3. Yes - Latest Date

622

Tree
ID: 161036918
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 13:14

i was told if i'm interested in joining, i should post my intention here.

i'm interested. here's my intention. :D

623

slizz
ID: 3556212
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 13:23

Nerf - my apologies. I did not own Matt Duffy in any leagues as I tend to avoid SF players on offense. Duffy is #236 and is definitely a better option than some of your pitching. It was a quick overview of each team while I had some free time. My goal by posting it was to give the entire league transparency of where Cockroft ranks the the players and, perhaps, encourage trading.

That said, I was able to stream Travis Shaw multiple times in September. I don't see him as anything more than waiver wire fodder. If you feel Bour is a keeper and believe, go with it. I respectfully disagree.

624

darkside
ID: 81492120
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 16:47

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. No

Congrats, Blue hen. That was a dominating season.

Thanks to Species, Guru, and the others who helped move these rule changes forward!

625

mjd
ID: 23182817
Fri, Oct 09, 2015, 17:06

1-yes
2-no
3-no

626

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sun, Oct 11, 2015, 21:20

Yes
Yes
No

627

Species
ID: 54740122
Sun, Oct 11, 2015, 21:32

1 - Yes
2 - Yes
3 - Yes - August 31

628

Species
ID: 54740122
Sun, Oct 11, 2015, 21:40

Rule change update:

Proposal 1 passes. 15 to 2 right now.

Proposal 2 passes. 13 to 4 right now.

Proposal 3 passes. 11 to 6 right now.
The latest date available in August leads 10 to 1. I guess we need one more affirmative vote to make it official. Anyone? Bueller??

I will incorporate into our rules when I have a few.....

631

Khahan
ID: 28934129
Mon, Oct 12, 2015, 10:34

If rule 3 is passing and we're having a firm trade deadline then I'll gladly vote for the latest possible.

632

Species
ID: 11730119
Mon, Oct 12, 2015, 16:26

Done. Latest deadline in August passes.

633

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Tue, Oct 13, 2015, 14:51

Can I propose a rule?

Starting in 2017, if you call up a prospect(s) before the season but after the keeper declaration(10th keeper loophole) then you lose your last available prospect pick?

634

Species
ID: 11730119
Tue, Oct 13, 2015, 18:25

633: of course you can. Anyone can.

Some of this was discussed in posts 528 and then 531 through 535. The questions I propose back to you are:

- Why? How is our current process different than our previous process from when the P-draft was at the ASB? (as discussed in the posts quoted)

- Is it only ONE pick lost, no matter how many prospects are called up? I will likely be calling up and renouncing 3 prospects this year -- do I 'lose' all 3 prospect picks?

- How come there is no 'penalty' or loss of pick if you call up a prospect at any other time?

I recognize that it seems like such an immediate "double benefit" - you get both the call up and, days later, you get a fresh prospect pick. But again, back when we had the P-draft at the ASB, it was no different. You drafted.......you called up (and renounced)........you got a fresh pick in the next draft. They just happened to be a few months apart.

635

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Tue, Oct 13, 2015, 19:13

I agree with Species

636

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Tue, Oct 13, 2015, 23:14

I support 633- down with the double benefit. And we probably should have done away with it before the draft moved.

637

beastiemiked
ID: 34951411
Wed, Oct 14, 2015, 12:05

You call up 3 prospects you lose 3 picks. It's a HUGE benefit to get those extra keepers. When you call up a prospect at a different time then you have to use one of your keeper spots to keep them.

When we changed it to the beginning of the season I assumed there would not be this double benefit. I assumed you would declare your 9 keepers, declare prospects and declare who you are renouncing then start the p-draft. I don't think we ever discussed call ups being allowed in between declarations and the P-draft. It really doesn't make sense why this should e allowed.

638

Bean
ID: 14147911
Wed, Oct 14, 2015, 14:24

We simultaneously declare prospects and regular keepers to thwart the rule lawyers in the Poli league. Why would you do it any other way?

639

Species
ID: 11730119
Wed, Oct 14, 2015, 22:38

637: I will articulate my counter-argument one last time and stay out of it from here.

What is the difference from when we did the P-draft at the ASB???

The old way:
1) I draft Corey Seager in July of 2014
2) In March of 2015 I keep my normal 9 keepers and do not have to designate Seager as a keeper
3) I call up Seager when I feel like it - say June 2015
4) I renounce Seager at the July 2015 Prospect Draft and get a shiny new Prospect Pick in the very next draft.

The new way:
1) I draft Corey Seager in March of 2014
2) In March of 2015 I keep my normal 9 keepers and do not have to designate Seager as a keeper.
3) I call up and renounce Seager in March of 2015 and get a shiny new prospect pick in the very next draft.

The ONLY difference is one draft was in July.....and now it is in March. The benefits are the same. Why was it ok before and virtually the same process is not okay or some unfair benefit now?

bmd: Please formulate the exact wording / mechanisms within your rule proposal and we can put it to a vote.

640

beastiemiked
ID: 5911312710
Wed, Oct 14, 2015, 23:24

Just because something was broke before doesn't mean it still isn't broke. There's absolutely no reason to be doing it the way we are currently doing it other than that is how we've always done it. Now that it's at the beginning of the season it's even more amplified as it's essentially an extra keeper. During the ASB it was was essentially a free keeper for half a season.

I'll formulate my rule when more people speak up.

641

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 09:47

The difference is in the #3's. In the old way, the next draft was 8 months away. In the new way, it's 3 days away. That gives Seager's stock plenty of time to change, or to accumulate some of his 300 AB (still too high), etc. The current way puts far too much value on prospects - if you find one that pulls a Schwarber, it's significant value. Pretty sure the people in this league have pushed for prospects to be LESS valuable.

642

GO
ID: 432341310
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 09:57

It sounds like the debate is more around the use of the extra keeper slots. Versus if they got called up and were kept as part of regular 9 keepers and then getting new prospect picks.

I personally like the extra slots as I think it speeds up and offers an extra avenue for rebuilding.

643

Slizz
ID: 325491823
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 10:10

I think it's shrewd management if you are able to identify and develop players to qualify as 10th keeps.

I get what bmd is saying where he feels those managers shouldn't get the extra picks. It's a prospect pick that would be most likely added at the end. It's a calculated crap shoot that can only help a team rebuild faster or stay on top longer...I don't see how that takes away from the league at all.

Only thing I would like to change is the 1 day window of declarations. Agree with bean that they should be submitted on the same day.

644

mjd
ID: 23182817
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 18:53

I kinda feel the same as slizz.

That and they seem to be bringing up the young guys earlier than in the past. And many have shown to be ready.

645

GO
ID: 39727167
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 23:17

Yeah if I only had the choice of add Swihart for example - as a regular 9th keeper - I don't think I can do it. But I think its a nice feature for a rebuilding squad to have to option to carry these guys one time and gives a little more time to evaluate if they are part of my long term plan. From there on out they are sink or swim.

646

GO
ID: 39727167
Thu, Oct 15, 2015, 23:20

Puig!

647

slizz
ID: 3556212
Fri, Oct 16, 2015, 10:38

Attached below you will find the actual vs projected standings (preseason). Enjoy!

1. Blue Hen 194 152.2 +27.5%
2. Wazaaap Guy 161 102.5 +57.0%
3. Khahan 149 138.5 +7.6%
4. Roto Guru 136 126.0 +7.9%
5. Team Tosh 131.5 73.5 +79.0%
6. Slizzy Slizz 128.5 116.5 +10.3%
7. darkside 124 92.5 +34%
8. youngroman 121 82.5 +46.7%
9. Species 116 152.2 (23.8%)
10. beastiemike d 99 100.5 (1.5%)
10. Meatwads 99 68.0 +45.5%
10. Niner's Niners 99 145.5 (32.0%)
13. Team mjd 90 101.5 (11.3%)
14. Giancarlo Inc 85.5 119.5 (28.5%)
15. Judy 81 67.5 +20.0%
16. Jay Dog 72.5 94.5 (23.3%)
17. Nerfherders 68 111.0 (38.7%)
18. Ref 56.5 140.0 (59.6%)
19. GO 54 31.5 +71.4%
20. Bean 34.5 83.5 (58.7%)

Please excuse the formatting...but its the actual standing, projected point total, and the % difference. No matter how i try and cut it, it won't let me format it the way I want to.

648

slizz
ID: 3556212
Fri, Oct 16, 2015, 12:01

Team Slizz 2015 Season Review

I came into this season with high expectations of finishing within the top 5 despite my preseason projection of 9th place. I knew my window of contending wouldn't open until the 2016 season when Carlos Correa was projected to start for the Astros and I would **crossing fingers** have Jose Fernandez healthy for a whole season. I felt, despite that handicap, I could compete for the Top 5!

As stated in my review, I had a nice core of infielders and really needed a couple things with respect to hitting to break my way. That said, the season started off terribly for me:

-Getting jabbed by my wife for the first month for not taking Familia despite her telling me to (Took Watson instead. BH and WG will vouch for that)
-Rendon getting hurt and doing nothing for me the first half of the season
-Rusney crashing into the wall in spring training and never making it out of AAA until after the ASB.
-Stupidly taking McGee 1.10 (he's great, but I should've listened to my gut and took Pollock at 3 like I told Pete to at 1 -- he will vouch for that).
-Jose DL until July.
-O's toying with Gausman's service time

5 of my 1st 10 players ineffective for half the season!

To make matters worse, only one team had worse pitching then me to start the year! (I was 2 ERA / 2 WHIP and couldn't buy a quality start). Gradually, my team rose up the rankings and hit their stride in July:

-Jose was back and dealing
-Rendon finally off the DL
-McGee closing some games
-Rusney giving me his two cents
-O's giving Gausman starts
-Capps just killing it for my ratios

For the first time the entire season, my team was healthy and producing. The high water mark for my team was 3rd place with 152 points and I was closing in on BH in strikeouts and ERA. (18 K, 19 ERA, 20 WHIP).

Then the wheels fell off in August (in no particular order):

-Jose went down with an arm injury
-Pineda DL
-Capps done for the season
-McGee down with elbow surgery until the last week
-Gausman DL
-Trevor Bauer & Drew Storen imploding
-Maybin / Hicks down with injuries

My ERA / WHIP proceeded to go from 39 / 40 points to 19 / 40 points. Despite that, I maintained my hitting and I think I had the best power month in terms of HR's...then in September Teixeria goes down while he was on pace for a 40 home run season! The trade market was rather dry because most, if not all teams, had conceded first place to BH and there wasn't any motivation to try and finish higher which speaks volume to the awesome job he did.

That being said, I am hopeful for the future. As stated above in the Cockroft 250 keepers, I have a nice core with plenty to offer:

1B - Eric Hosmer: Under 26 and is a safe bet for a Top 50 finish next season with the outside chance of Top 25.
2B/3B - Anthony Rendon: Under 26 and the only reason he is down on Cockroft's ranking is health. If he can give me at least 150 games, he is a safe bet for a top 30 finish.
3B - Nolan Arenado: He's just awesome. Didn't expect this kind of power, but in Coors anything is possible. Hopefully he can get that OB% up a tad.
SS - Carlos Correa: When I selected him, I didn't imagine I would be sitting on arguably the most valuable real estate in G20 (Reason? His position). While I was hoping he would be a 10th keeper, he's still awesome to have.
OF - Adam Jones: Mr. Reliable. Stat line is almost identical year after year
SP - Jose Fernandez: Just give me a full season and he's in the cy young discussion

My goal next season: Top 3 finish. Anything less will be considered a disappointment. I know the competition is going to be tough, but that is what makes this league great.

BH - I appreciate the recognition of my hard work in making chicken salad out of chicken sh*t to finish 6th. It wasn't ideal having to stream daily, but that was the hand I dealt myself with the players I took on. Also a reason why I like the unlimited moves. Allows teams to re-tool and try for stats daily rather than worry about the moves limits.

Here's to a healthy 2016! Also a little disappointed you don't consider the fighting Slizz or Species a threat in 2016 with my stocked cupboard.

Takeaways

BH - team to beat in 2016 and also will have Schwarber and Gallo as 10th-11th keeps. Yikes!
WG - just need an ace to anchor that staff. Your hitting is awesome, get that pitching right and watch out BH!
Khahan - Winning never gets stale. With your core, you'll always be a contender.
Guru - worked hard to get back to the top. Will be a threat.
Tosh - heck of a job. You took a big risk in trading Miguel, but it paid off in a big way. Contender from here on out.
darkside - when looking over your team, I was surprised by the amount of high quality talent you have. Darkhorse (no pun intended) contender 2016
youngroman - BH is right about how underrated of a member you are. Love reading your stat posts. That said, your team has the makings of a contender, but need a lot to break right for you.
Species - 12 really good keepers, high draft picks, and awesome pitching. Your plan is right on track.
BMD - solid team as always...curious to see what he does to take it to the next level.
Meatwads - Pitching wont be an issue for him. Thats for sure! I know he has the rep of a tough manager, so I expect this team to exceed whatever projections are thrown in front of him.
R9 - Is next year the year?
MJD - Shrewdly saw he wasn't contending and sold for 2016. Wise move in hindsight, but a shame he wasted Polanco and Soler as 10th and 11th keepers.
Pete - As Stanton went, he went. Pete had some significant losses: Mesoraco, Stanton, and Smyly. Those are tough to recover from. Watch out in 2016.
Judy - I am really impressed with Judy's patience. She was upset she got burned for Polanco, but turned out to get the better player with Franco. Her babies are finally grown up and if Garcia or Ozuna live up to potential, she will find herself as one of the hunted rather than a hunter. Will she make the in-season moves like she did on the last day to stay in the top half?
Jay Dog - this is a rebuild. He tried for one last hurrah and it didn't work out.
Nerf - has some tools there and Buxton as a 10th. With some bounce back seasons, he could find himself in the top half.
Ref - Another rebuild. Ref usually prides himself on winning in the draft and in-season management. Just didn't happen this year. Puig fell off a cliff, Strasburg forgot how to pitch, wainwright went down week 1, Hanley is now OF only and not nearly what he once was. Combine that with a draft that didn't meet expectations and here you are. The tools are there to make this a great team again, but its likely to be a threat in 2017 rather than 2016.
GO - GO collected young talent and while it might not bloom in 2016, hes a lot closer than he was yesterday. Reminds me of my 2014 team in preseason. High upside players and he might just find himself back in the money with shrewd management.
Bean - Bean is doing it his way. Whenever a new manager takes over a team, I imagine they want to put their stamp on it. Some (Khahan) don't have much to tinker with...curious to see what the offseason brings to him.

Good luck and godspeed to all.

649

beastiemiked
ID: 34951411
Fri, Oct 16, 2015, 15:29

Judging by the responses I'm not going to propose a rule.

650

Species
ID: 54740122
Sat, Oct 17, 2015, 13:15

640 / 649:

I would like to encourage bmd and other managers to continue to explore the prospect rules. Admittedly my vehement opposition assumed that bmd was arguing that the new P-draft date created a "new loophole" (my words)....which I disagree with.

That said, we should always be exploring ways to improve our league. Everyone has a vote.....everyone gets their opinion. I'm not sure if it is easier or harder to get a rule change in immediately following the season.....but with the playoffs going, hopefully people are still paying attention.

651

mjd
ID: 23182817
Sat, Oct 17, 2015, 13:31

I still hate all the MLB called up prospects (but not called up by their G20 team) clogging up the free agent pool during the season.

Any support to change that?

652

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sat, Oct 17, 2015, 20:32

MJD, I support that but don't have a viable solution.

Definitely in favor of cutting the prospect keeper limits in half (or less).

653

Species
ID: 11730119
Sat, Oct 17, 2015, 23:23

Reminder: last season we passed a rule requiring both the Supplemental and Prospect Draft lotteries to be run within 30 days of the end of the season. I will work with Guru to run said lotteries.

Note: both lotteries are done with no regard to traded picks. The "slot" will remain with the original team and trades are applied thereafter. As it happens this year, no 1st round supplemental picks got traded -- but this will have an effect on the Prospect Draft.

The non-money teams eligible for the lottery start with Bean in the #1 spot and go down to darkside in the 14th spot.

654

Species
ID: 11730119
Sat, Oct 17, 2015, 23:34

I am wondering if we need to have a clarifying rule in regards to traded draft picks. As commissioner, when someone trades "their 2nd" for "their 10th" -- it means EXACTLY their 2nd or their 10th. If you traded away YOUR 10th, even if you have another 10th, my interpretation is that you would then be required to give up YOUR next highest pick.

WG made a trade where it was specified in the verbiage that the pick to be traded - in this case a 5th - did not have go be his own pick. That's great.

My interpretation is, without any clarifying language:

"The lowest pick in his/her possession"
"The highest 4th rounder they own"
etc

.....I will assume that the pick is intended/required to be "their" pick in that round.

Question: do we need a rule to this effect, or is the understanding sufficient?

655

Blue hen
ID: 410452818
Sun, Oct 18, 2015, 18:49

I don't think we need much clarity. A traded pick is that particular slot, and nothing after that changes it. If you trade me 3.14, you can't do anything to change that.

656

Species
ID: 11730119
Mon, Oct 19, 2015, 18:28

But when a trade is made in-season (or for a future year) you don't know what the draft grid looks like yet -- so it is rare that the actual slot is identified in a trade.

657

Species
ID: 11730119
Mon, Oct 19, 2015, 20:37

Team Species offseason trade commercial:

As I had feared, without my prospects being ready for prime time in 2015, my rebuild will have to bear fruit in 2016 and beyond. Considering I have eleven of the top 156 keepers - as ranked by ESPN's Tristan Cockroft - PLUS three prospects on my prospect list that are all ML-ready, I have some trading to do this offseason.

Highly unlikely to go anywhere:
Jose Abreu - a cornerstone 1b. Top 6 or 7 in the league.
Miguel Sano - hit 18 HR in under half a season. 22 years old and a '10th keeper'. Next.
Corey Seager - with the trade of Bogaerts, Seager becomes my SS and is an '11th keeper'.
Mookie Betts - a cornerstone OF. Young, with power and speed in an area of need.

Unlikely to go anywhere, but I could listen:
Matt Harvey - lets hope he doesn't blow his arm out winning the Mets the World Series.
Jacob DeGrom - lets hope he doesn't blow his arm out winning the Mets the World Series.
Felix Hernandez - not slowing down. Still under 30 years old.
Roberto Osuna - stud 20 year old closer. Next.

All keeper-worthy (top 156 keepers):
Evan Longoria (105): still a stalwart in Tampa
Wil Myers (117): ripped the ball upon his return from injury. .360 OBP, 3 HR, 10 run, 10 RBI in 71 AB
Brett Gardner (132): 94 runs, 16 HR, 20 steals and a tidy .343 obp
Carlos Santana (133): A pretty quiet .357 obp, 19 hr, 85 rbi, 19 hr and 11 SB!
Jay Bruce (156): 26 hr and 87 rbi and still only 28 years old.

Young studs ready to take the next step:
Jose Peraza (126): High average, 80-speed middle infielder ready to lead off for a ML team. A possible Dee Gordon type who is on my Prospect List to boot!
Eduardo Rodriguez: Ranked 196th by Cockroft, which I think sells him short. Stud LHP. Only 22 years old and got all of the rookie kinks out last year.
Orlando Arcia: Stud SS-in-waiting for the Brewers. A top 15 prospect.
Lewis Brinson: The OF Texas refused to give up in the Cole Hamels trade. Better tools than Nomar Mazara in the eyes of some. A top 20 prospect.
Blake Snell: TB LHP was the minor league pitcher of the year according to Keith Law and others. Ready for prime time.
Alex Reyes: Fireballing, 100-mph stud for St. Louis. You know how well the Cards develop pitchers.

There are a half dozen teams with lots of holes in their rosters who could use more than a couple of these names. I also have up to three Prospect Picks to trade for the right deal.

It's never too early!!

658

darkside
ID: 81492120
Mon, Oct 19, 2015, 20:46

Thanks for the good thoughts, Slizz...the draft will determine if I have any shot of even being in the money. Hopefully.

Also, I'm not sure if you're talking about the 2014 draft or the 2015 draft, but I kept AJ Pollock last year, so he wasn't available to be drafted this year. Drafted him in the 9th round in 2014 and held him through his injury since I knew I might want to keep him. Glad I did.

659

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 09:23

Per vote last year, the draft lotteries are to be run within 30 days of the close of the season.

I plan to run the lotteries later today - both for the supplemental draft and the prospect draft.

660

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 14:11

Lottery results:

Supplemental Draft
1. Nerfherders
2. Youngroman
3. Jaydog

Prospect Draft
1. Great One
2. Jaydog
3. Bean

Detailed results are posted in this spreadsheet:
http://rotoguru1.com/base/G20/G20-Oct15-14x4_balls.xls

Teams in the lottery (team 14 finished 7th, team 1 finished last):
14 darkside of the moon
13 youngroman's Luschen
12 Endangered Species
11 Niner's Niners
10 beastiemike d
9 Mighty Meatwads
8 Team mjd
7 Giancarlo Inc
6 Sam n Max G
5 Jay Dog
4 ScruffyLookin' Nerfherders
3 Red Crosses of Doom
2 GO's Gaslight Anthem
1 Bean's Rockies

661

Species
ID: 11730119
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 14:26

Our last place finishers sure are cursed. I am seriously wondering if we need to up the odds in our lottery.......I know we don't need to, but geeeeez.

Congrats to the lottery winners. Trade offers sent. ;)

662

Species
ID: 11730119
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 14:39

Prospect list:

MGR: #, Name,Pos,Team,(# Call-ups)
Bean: 34.09 Nick Gordon, SS, MIN; 35.02 Raul Mondesi, SS, KC
bmd: 31.05 DJ Peterson, 3b, SEA; 34.03 Matt Olson, 1b, OAK
Blue Hen: 30.18 Joey Gallo, 3b, TEX; 33.01 Yoan Moncada, 2b, BOS; 33.07 Kyle Schwarber, OF, CHC; 33.17 Rafael Devers, 3b, BOS; 34.12 Tyler Kolek, SP, MIA
Darkside: 31.04 Alexander Guerrero, 2b, LAD (1); 34.08 Jake Lamb, 3b, ARI (1)
Meatwads: 31.06 Austin Hedges, C, SD; 33.10 Brian Johnson, SP, BOS; 34.06 Hector Olivera, 2b, ATL
Great One: 28.07 David Dahl, OF, COL; 31.02 Alex Meyer, P, MIN; 33.16 Blake Swihart, C, BOS; 34.01 Greg Bird, 1b, NYY
Guru: 25.03 Albert Almora,OF,CHC
Jaydog: 28.08 Kyle Zimmer, SP, KC 31.08 Austin Meadows, OF, PIT; 33.19 Dilson Herrera, 2b, NYM
Judy: 33.13 Robert Stephenson, SP, CIN
mjd: 24.04 Mark Appel, SP, HOU; 33.08 Dalton Pompey, OF, TOR (1);
Nerfherders: 24.01 Byron Buxton, MIN, OF; 27.04 Jameson Taillon, SP, PIT; 30.07 Clint Frazier, OF, CLE
Peter N: 30.05 Jonathan Gray, P, COL (1); 31.03 Tyler Glasnow, P, PIT; 33.03 Hunter Harvey, SP, BAL
Ref: 32.05 Julio Urias, P, LAD; 33.18 Jesse Winker, OF, CIN; 34.11 Braden Shipley, SP, ARI
R9: 33.09 Henry Owens, SP, BOS; 34.05 Trea Turner, SS, WAS/SD; 35.01 Raisel Iglesias, SP, CIN
Slizz: 30.17 Lucas Gioloto, P, WAS; 33.05 Aaron Judge, OF, NYY
Species: 21.13 Miguel Sano,3b,MIN (1); 30.06 Corey Seager, SS/3b, LAD; 33.06 Jose Peraza, 2b, LAD
Khahan: 33.15 Nomar Mazara, OF, TEX; 34.10 Alex Jackson, OF, SEA; 35.03 Josh Bell, OF, PIT
Tosh: 23.01 Dylan Bundy,P,BAL; 33.04 Daniel Norris, SP, DET (1); 34.02 Brandon Finnegan, SP, KC
wg: 32.03 JP Crawford, SS, PHI;
youngroman: 33.11 Michael Taylor, OF, WAS (1); 34.07 Luis Severino, SP, NYY (1)

663

Guru
ID: 330592710
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 15:31

Supplemental Draft
	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5	Round 6	Round 7
1	Nerfherders	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean
2	youngroman	GreatOne	GreatOne	blue hen	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne
3	Jaydog	Species	Ref	Species	Ref	Ref	Species
4	Bean	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders
5	GreatOne	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog
6	Ref	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Slizz	Judy
7	Judy	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.
8	Pete N.	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd
9	mjd	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9
10	R9	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	mjd	Meatwads
11	Meatwads	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd
12	bmd	Species	Species	Species	Bean	Species	WG
13	Species	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman
14	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside
15	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz
16	Tosh	blue hen	Tosh	Tosh	Meatwads	Tosh	Tosh
17	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru
18	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	GreatOne	Khahan
19	WG	WG	bmd	mjd	mjd	WG	WG
20	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen

	Round 8	Round 9	Round 10	Round 11	Round 12	Round 13	Round 14
1	Bean	Bean	Species	Bean	Bean	Bean	Bean
2	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	GreatOne	Khahan
3	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref	Ref
4	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders	Nerfherders
5	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog	Jaydog
6	bmd	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy	Judy
7	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.	Pete N.
8	mjd	mjd	mjd	mjd	WG	Species	Meatwads
9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9	R9
10	Meatwads	Meatwads	Tosh	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads
11	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	bmd	WG	Judy
12	Species	Species	Ref	Ref	Ref	Species	Species
13	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman
14	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	darkside	WG
15	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	slizz	Judy	slizz
16	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh	Tosh
17	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru	Guru
18	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan
19	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG	WG
20	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen	Tosh	GreatOne

Prospect Draft
	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3
1	GreatOne	Bean	Bean
2	Jaydog	GreatOne	GreatOne
3	Bean	Ref	Ref
4	Ref	Nerfherders	Nerfherders
5	Nerfherders	Jaydog	Jaydog
6	bmd	Judy	Judy
7	GreatOne	Pete N.	Pete N.
8	mjd	mjd	mjd
9	R9	R9	R9
10	Meatwads	Meatwads	Meatwads
11	bmd	bmd	bmd
12	Species	Species	Species
13	youngroman	youngroman	youngroman
14	darkside	darkside	darkside
15	slizz	slizz	slizz
16	blue hen	Tosh	Tosh
17	Guru	Guru	Guru
18	Khahan	Khahan	Khahan
19	WG	WG	WG
20	blue hen	blue hen	blue hen

664

Species
ID: 11730119
Fri, Oct 30, 2015, 18:13

A reminder to all teams (and pertinent to our 2 new owners as well):

We have the Prospect Draft grid as things stand now, post-lottery. This will help all teams assess where they would possibly stand if they end up with prospect draft picks.

Of course, no picks are awarded until the Prospect Keeper deadline. Great One won the lottery and is slotted to have the first pick. However, he has FOUR prospects. By rule, he may not have more than 3 at the keeper deadline. Further, in order to be awarded his 1st round pick, he must have LESS than 3 prospects on his roster. To get both his 1st and 2nd round picks awarded to him, he would have to have only 1 prospect.

This can be accomplished by trade, release or calling them up and renouncing their rights (the '10th keeper' move).

PLEASE reach out to me to discuss and review the prospect rules at any time.

665

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sat, Oct 31, 2015, 09:55

Why is Yasmany Tomas not listed as a prospect for me, and therefore eligible to be my 10th keeper?

666

Species
ID: 54740122
Sat, Oct 31, 2015, 12:27

Bean -- similar to Carlos Correa.....all prospects that exceed limits lose prospect eligibility. If they are on your active roster when they exceed limits, they are removed from the prospect list.

A few guys - like youngroman's Michael Taylor - exceeded prospect limits while NOT on an active roster. Those players remain on that list during the rest of the season if never called up. The manager can only call that player up before the season and retain him in their 9 keepers. All prospects that exceed limits are ineligible to be used as '10th keepers'.

667

Bean
ID: 14147911
Sun, Nov 01, 2015, 08:53

So, because I was brow beaten to call him up and succumbed to this public shaming, I now cannot use the guy as my 10th keeper. Whereas, since youngroman avoided the public shaming, he can use his keeper. Write this nonsense down somewhere please.

668

PeteN.
ID: 8550318
Sun, Nov 01, 2015, 10:38

Bean, you are incorrect. You wouldn't have been able to keep Tomas as 10th keep either way. He went over the prospect threshold.

669

Guru
ID: 330592710
Sun, Nov 01, 2015, 17:52

There's no disparity here. Both Correa and Taylor can be kept this season - but only as a 9th "regular" keeper, in each case. Neither can be retained as a "prospect keeper".

670

Bean
ID: 14147911
Mon, Nov 02, 2015, 10:38

OK I think i get it. Sorry for my confusion.

671

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Nov 05, 2015, 11:00

BH Trade Commercial

Like most commercials, there may be other versions for this product later.

I have picks 1.16 and 1.20 in the draft. Looking to move those a little higher, packaging some players with the existing pick. For example, pick 1.20 + Curtis Granderson to Jaydog for pick 1.02. Looking for something of that nature, and can part with Granderson, Brad Boxberger, Tom Wilhelmsen, Welington Castillo, Drew Hutchison, Stephen Piscotty, or World Champion Mike Moustakas.

Let me know if you have any interest thereabouts.

672

Species
ID: 54740122
Thu, Nov 05, 2015, 17:19

671: Please review post 633. You don't have Tosh's 1st.....the Cabrera traded netted you his 1st round PROSPECT pick and 2nd round supplemental.

673

beastiemiked
ID: 481162721
Sat, Nov 07, 2015, 23:29

Ugh, I'm so disappointed I didn't pick up Zunino the last day of the season and counter any bh offer with Zunino for Schwarber.

674

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Nov 09, 2015, 10:32

Ha! I actually meant PROSPECT pick. Just fill that in and the rest makes sense.

675

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Nov 18, 2015, 12:40

Again, looking to move up in the prospect draft so I can land Jose Berrios or Trevor Story.

Also now offering up the new Rangers closer Tom "The Bartender" Wilhelmson.

676

Judy
ID: 35493114
Wed, Nov 18, 2015, 21:44

Blue

We are doing football now...🏈🏈🏈

677

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Thu, Nov 19, 2015, 09:28

Thanks for taking the time to let me know. Also, my name is Blue Hen - I'm sure it was an honest mistake.

678

GO
ID: 39727167
Thu, Nov 19, 2015, 21:04

Blue!

679

Judy
ID: 35493114
Sat, Nov 21, 2015, 19:14

Nah, I just abbreviate things:

YR
Nerf

680

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Nov 23, 2015, 09:51

That's truncating, not abbreviating. Abbreviating would be BH, which is what everyone else says.

681

Voice of Reason
ID: 3210132310
Mon, Nov 23, 2015, 11:13

Lighten up Francis...

682

Nerfherders
ID: 161121811
Mon, Nov 23, 2015, 16:18

LOL

683

Species
ID: 11730119
Fri, Dec 04, 2015, 13:07

Stoked for the Hot Stove to heat up!!

684

GO
ID: 39727167
Fri, Dec 04, 2015, 23:26

Listening to offers for prospect pick 1.01

685

GO
ID: 1311391312
Thu, Dec 24, 2015, 08:58

I've got a guy looking for a deep prospect league if an opening arises.

686

Slizz
ID: 2611402412
Thu, Dec 24, 2015, 13:40

Just to recap the people interested should a spot open up:

-Tree
-Fosten
-GO's guy - have him post/make an introduction.

687

Species
ID: 1311531116
Thu, Dec 24, 2015, 15:40

I will have a prospect pick/picks available for post-keeper trades.

688

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Mon, Jan 04, 2016, 13:46

Happy New Year, folks. Here's to a BH three peat in 2016.

Looking to get younger - I want to package Jose Bautista and David Price for the best player I can get. Obviously, a move like that turns you into an instant contender.

Let me know if you have any offers.

689

WG
ID: 552431321
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 16:51

TRADE

WG gets Jose Bautista and David Price
BH gets Josh Donaldson

690

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 16:59

Confirmed.

691

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 17:12

And by the way, Price was my longest standing player, inherited as a prospect from Trip. And vastly underrated for the last 7 years or so. Worried about him in Boston, but he's still an easy keeper for years.

And Bautista was my longest standing draft pick, only taken because I missed out on Chase Headley (thanks Ref!). I guess that one worked out.

Will miss both guys, who were part of all three championship teams.

Welcome, AL MVP!

692

Species
ID: 1311531116
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 17:38

Great trade guys.

It's never too early, my league mates. And now with Football behind us, it is time to start to turn one's attention onto Baseball!

Also goes to show you how you need to pay attention to people's trade posts. You snooze, you lose.

693

Species
ID: 1311531116
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 18:15

In my cursory review of rostered prospects, I found two prospects that were on rosters at the end of the year that still have prospect eligibility:

Miguel Sano, DH
Luis Severino, SP

By rule, those players are to be dropped from their respective rosters and returned to the prospect list (i.e. - sent down). They can be retained on the prospect list or called up via the '10th keeper' move.

694

Species
ID: 1311531116
Tue, Jan 05, 2016, 18:33

Jake Lamb and Michael Taylor exceeded prospect limits and have been removed from the prospect list.

695

blue hen
ID: 10354414
Wed, Jan 06, 2016, 16:59

Ok, now that we've cleared some of the chaff from the roster, three more contributors I'm looking to move, probably for picks: Brad Boxberger, Dellin Betances, and Curtis Granderson.

Let me know if you have interest in those guys.

Forum: basePage 20325Subject: Gurupie 20 - 2015 Regular Season Discussion

Forum: base
Page 20325
Subject: Gurupie 20 - 2015 Regular Season Discussion