Self Editor

Forum: foot
Page 4230
Subject: G24 Preseason Discussion

Posted by: Ref - Donor [539581218] Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 12:28

Again, the reason we are so premature on the Football stuff this year is because of the early date to save the league a buck a piece and renew our site. We will continue the talk about our three new managers in the last thread until they have a team so they can join in here.

For the most part, we are not in any hurry to get anything done until the site is open for business for this year. Even after we pay for it, I think the site is still in last year's mode until they put in the "upgrades" and open it up. We can't make any changes to anything other than rules and team owners until then.

I guess we need to decide if we will continue with pick'ems or not. Perhaps the reason for the attrition was because those managers fell out of contention. Before we do anything as far as changing anything though, we will add these three new managers, bmd, bj21 and TB to their new franchises.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 16:26

Ref-
I also have a new CBS account and will need the league invitation to be sent there instead.

E-mail address andrewwilson_2009@depauw.edu
Username: DSW12
----
Next up:
I am ready to package any combo of the following for an upgrade at RB or WR:

Foster, Stallworth, Watts, Steve Smith, #5 draft pick overall

THK/Minn Vikes

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 17:08

thk, sent. Man you're going a long way from home it appears if you're heading all the way to Greencastle, IN. Congratulations!

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 22:44

Thanks Ref. They have a great Media Program, so I will see what I can do...

THK

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 22:57

Uh...Looks like my other name stayed in the league as well. Anyway you can delete that Ref?

Thanks,
THK

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Jun 23, 2005, 23:07

Couldn't delete it until you claimed it with your other addy.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jun 24, 2005, 20:31

OK all 24 teams are in so we can talk about preseason things whenever you're ready.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jun 24, 2005, 20:40

Since people have already started sending in $22, looks like we're in for the pick'ems for another year. I thought that was kind of fun as we were picking which of our managers would win from week to week. There are also some other things like having to pick against the spread or whatever. I thought it was pretty tough the way it way. Skinneej and stl cards beat us pretty good. I came in 3rd and think I was way back.

beastiemiked
ID: 262411016
Fri, Jun 24, 2005, 20:54

What does the Guru column stand for on the roster page?

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jun 24, 2005, 20:56

They have a computer that analyzes your team each week and predicts how much each person will score based on our scoring system. It's whack at times.

Perm Dude
ID: 165591315
Fri, Jun 24, 2005, 21:56

How many keepers?

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Sat, Jun 25, 2005, 03:36

9 keepers

Perm Dude
ID: 165591315
Sat, Jun 25, 2005, 03:36

thanks

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Sun, Jun 26, 2005, 04:27

Where can I find this upcoming season's complete draft order?
If I decide to keep less than 9 players, do I get additional draft picks and are they at the very end of the draft like supplemental picks?
Any chance that the three new teams can make one drop/one free agent claim from players who played in the NFL last year and were available to all owners at the free agent dead-line last season?

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sun, Jun 26, 2005, 09:53

Fair questions, TB. The rules are pretty clear on this, but in a nutshell:

You may keep less than nine, but you don't receive any more draft picks. You may trade and go over 9, once everyone has declared their keepers. You may not add a player except by draft until the league's waivers are turned on after the draft. Once you hit a full roster, your draft is over. So if you've traded for extra picks/players, you'd forfeit extra picks at the end of the draft. If you're short, you'd have to fill your team after waivers are turned on to begin the season.

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 14:45

Thanks for the answer, Ref. I can't see any benefit for me to not keep less than all nine keepers.

What about the draft order and the chance to claim a free agent?

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 14:55

Any chance that the three new teams can make one drop/one free agent claim from players who played in the NFL last year and were available to all owners at the free agent dead-line last season?

no. The status of all those players has changed considerably since that time period and it would be unfair to other teams to allow someone that option.

I am working on the complete draft order and it should be up soon. Need to double check it and then have ref check it as well.

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 15:16

Okay, but there are not many "good" players available who have had significant changes in their status since last season ended. I was just looking at dumping someone like Jamel White for the SF def or a better 2nd TE so that I could shop Heap around.

Being the new guy, I don't want to ruffle feathers, but I was looking at if from the perspective of an abandoned team who didn't get the chance to tidy up before the previous season ended. That is what I had in mind when thinking about what was fair. =)

Does anyone have any interest in Heap? I am looking for a RB or high draft pick.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 15:37

I understand TB. Actuallly our rosters were frozen as of week 13. We do not allow waiver moves during the playoffs, so that is something to keep in mind. I promise I won't take the SF D. Been there, done that ;)

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 15:42

FTR TB, your team wasn't abandoned at all last year. He didn't abandon us until after hoops started. The picture will look a little brighter when we have to announce keepers.

TB
ID: 5809511
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 16:26

LOL, on the SF defense.

I believe you, Ref, but I can also see that the pickings are still pretty slim with 216 keepers. I looked at every team and only see a couple that have to make a real decision on their 9th keeper. Most seem pretty cut and dry. I love the team grid option at the site. Makes it a lot easier to go in and try to find teams that match up for trades.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 16:36

TB, keep in mind that the rookies that come into the NFL will also be an option once they are added to the database.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 17:32

Here is a preliminary draft grid. Any team not making the playoffs is ranked in reverse order of regular season standing. Playoff teams are ranked in reverse order of playoff finish in the 17-24 draft spots. All trades throughout the year have hopefully been incorporated. A yellow box indicates a traded draft spot and the superscript(s) references the trade comments. Please check it over and let us know if you see any errors. Thanks.

		G24 2005 Draft Grid
Team		Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5
Chiefs		Chiefs	Chiefs	Chiefs	Chiefs	Chiefs
Browns		Browns	Browns	Browns	Browns	49ers ¹²
Jaguars		Saints ¹¹	Jaguars	Jaguars	Jaguars	Jaguars
Eagles		Eagles	Eagles	Eagles	Eagles	Eagles
Vikings		Vikings	Vikings	Packers ^2,7	Steelers ¹⁰	Vikings
Seahawks		Seahawks	Seahawks	Bills ^6,9	Seahawks	Seahawks
Chargers		Chargers	Chargers	Chargers	Chargers	Chargers
Ravens		Ravens	Ravens	Ravens	Ravens	Ravens
Saints		Saints	Saints	Saints	Saints	Saints
Cardinals		Cowboys ⁸	Cardinals	Cardinals	Cowboys ⁸	Cardinals
Falcons		Falcons	Falcons	Falcons	Falcons	Falcons
Packers		Packers	Packers	Packers	Packers	49ers ⁷
Texans		Texans	Texans	Texans	Texans	Texans
Bills		Bills	Steelers ⁹	Bills	Bills	Bills
49ers		49ers	49ers	Browns ¹²	49ers	Vikings ²
Bengals		Bengals	Bengals	Bengals	Bengals	Bengals
Rams		Rams	Rams	Rams	Rams	Rams
Colts		Colts	Steelers ⁵	Colts	Colts	Colts
Raiders		Raiders	Raiders	Raiders	Bears ¹	Raiders
Giants		Giants	Giants	Colts ^3,5	Giants	Giants
Bears		Bears	Bears	Bears	Steelers ⁴	Raiders ¹
Broncos		Broncos	Broncos	Broncos	Broncos	Broncos
Cowboys		Cowboys	Cardinals ⁸	Cardinals ⁸	Cowboys	Cowboys
Steelers		Steelers	Vikings ¹⁰	Bills ⁹	Seahawks ⁶	Bears ⁴

Traded Draft Picks:
1	*8/25/04 Doug's Raiders receives 2005 5th round pick from CC Rider's Bears for his 2005 4th round pick.
2	*9/6/05 Minn Vikes give up their 3rd round pick next year for SF's 5th round pick as part of the Couch/Henson trade.
3	*10/1/04 Twarpy's Giants trade their 3rd round pick to RFS for Jonathan Quinn.
4	*10/5/04 CC Rider's Bears trades his 4th round pick next year for RFS' 5th round pick & Anderson.
5	*10/6/04 Colts get highest of Steelers two 3rd round picks and Steelers get the Colts 2nd round pick. (as part of Grossman for Testeverde)
6	*10/10/04 Seattle Seahawks give up #3 Draft Pick / Steelers give up lowest of two #4 Draft picks. - Supplemental for the Warner for Johnson trade.
7	*10/12/04 Green Bay Packers receive the higher of the 49ers' two 3rd rounders (decided at the end of the year between MN/SF) for the Packers' 5th rounder. Supplemental for the Gramatica trade.
8	*10/15/04 Arizona Cardinals receive the 2nd and 3rd rounders from the Cowboys in exchange for the Cardinals' 1st and 4th rounders as part of the trade for the Rams' DST.
9	*11/2/04 Bills receive Promize's 3rd and the lowest of either rfs' 3rd and Twarpy's 3rd and Steelers receive Bills' 2nd rounder - as part ot the Krenzel trade.
10	*11/4/04 Vikings receive Pitt's lowest 2nd round pick for A-train and Minnesota's 4th round pick in the Thomas deal.
11	*11/17/04 Saints receive Jax 1st round pick as part of the Robinson/Dunn deal.
12	*12/3/04 Cleveland Browns acquire 3rd pick from 49ers for Cleveland's 5th pick as part of the Moss/Davis deal.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Mon, Jun 27, 2005, 18:21

Great grid StL! Is it sad I am happy I have the last pick in the 2nd round for A-train when I took him at #21 overall in the orginal draft? I had targeted Duece in that spot from the beginning but was happy when A-train fell...oh the irony (I now have Duece)!

That said, you can add 2.05 and 2.24 to that list of things ready to be packaged for an upgrade at RB or WR.

THK

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 14:41

StL, that rocks!

I've started to work on cleaning up the rules and get the new teams corrected. I've already made the change that we've made in all other leagues that the waiver order is the same as the draft order like we discussed last year. If anyone has an issue with that, please let me know.

Also, I've allowed new owners of franchises to change their team affiliation in the past. Even though this will create a little work, I feel that the new owners should be able to change to a team not in use, but it HAS to fit in to our divisional lineups. AFC must stay AFC and NFC must stay NFC. There isn't much to choose from, but in case any of you three absolutely hate the rams, ravens or texans, there may be an alternative or two. Warning that your new franchise may have been owned in the past--but really will only come into play in the past year's standings and our record books.

Speaking of record books, Twarpy and I still have some work to do to get all the empty records filled in. If anyone wants to assist or has some suggestions for new ones,e tc. let me know. The complete history of every game is in a SS on our Gurupie Leagues web site here. Just click on Game History. Again thanks to Twarpy for this compilation.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 14:44

Btw, if we did make any changes to franchise nicknames, we would not do it on the site (except for rules) until the league is launched for this year.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 15:04

Twarpy, indeed thanks for putting that spread sheet together.

One question - Are the points for and points agains columns reversed? It seems like the team to the far left in the column "Team" should be associated with "Pts for" and the "team against" should be "Pts against" , but the two teams I checked for week 1 of year 3 seems to have that reversed?
thanks.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 15:15

Here is what I think I am seeing in the spreadsheet. If the team was the "home" team, then the "Pts For" and "Pts Against" show up correctly. It the team was the "away" team, then the scores are reversed. Not sure if this hold for all years, but it seems to be true in year 3 week 1 anyway.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 16:01

Pete-
What do you want to switch team names?!?! ANYTHING! ;-)

I guess I'll convert into an Indy fan...living so close now...

THK

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 18:53

RFS-
Money sent via paypal? I put the ? because this is my first paypal transaction...let me know if and when you receive the $22.

Thanks,
THK

Twarpy
ID: 49321191
Tue, Jun 28, 2005, 23:52

Stl, yeah I see what you're saying I got really sick of doing these, and thought I had an automated way for year 3 (did years 1-2 all by hand), but I obviously didnt account for something, I'll go back later next week and fix it as I'm too busy right now to deal with it:)

Thanks for pointing it out though, it seems simple enough to fix and I have all my old spreadsheets which are sorted by year, and I'm a lot better than Im at excel then I was a year ago, even this looks kinda ugly to me:)

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Wed, Jun 29, 2005, 18:15

Update on payments. Besides what I posted that was carried over from last year, I have payments from the following:

Twarpy (pay on the way from hoops money winnings)
Turley $22
THK $22
StL $23
AF $23
BJ $23
TB $30 (sent extra to cover misc esxpenses, thanks)
PD $7 (entry only - no prize pool)
e-mail from Roy letting me know check in mail.

I may have some checks back home in the mail, but I am on the road, so I cannot check until Friday.

Also, I'll have the website paid for in a few minutes.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Thu, Jun 30, 2005, 04:37

Why these $23s? Tips or what? Was I being an a$$ only sending $22?!?! LOL

6 + 15 + 1 = 22...at least I hope or I should not be going to DPU next year...

THK

Myboyjack
ID: 121159118
Thu, Jun 30, 2005, 07:05

I think the extra dollar is to cover PayPal expense.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Thu, Jun 30, 2005, 10:16

Paypal charges a transaction fee to the person receiving the money. Last year the cost was $.94 for $22 sent. Total transaction fees last year amounted to $10.19 from 11 teams that used paypal. Two of those teams weren't in the prize pool and one was from Canada which cost a little more.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Thu, Jun 30, 2005, 13:52

Oh man...wish I had known that. Rfs-should I send over $2 more to cover expenses?

THK

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Thu, Jun 30, 2005, 20:39

THK. No worries.

League has been sucessfully renewed.

rockafellerskank
Dude
ID: 27652109
Sun, Jul 03, 2005, 18:36

Update.

I have recieved $22 each from

coldwater
Deepsnapper
myboyjack

Thanks.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 08:37

For those of you that play hoops, you might remember that we will have our first draft lottery for non playoff/payout (top 6 in that league) winners. Guru has replicated the NBA draft and has shown us how to do it with two more teams for our football league. Would you be interested in looking at that for this league? In hoops, the worst team can pick no lower than 4th overall with a very high percentage chance (250 out of 1001) from picking first. (Best team has a 5 in 1001 chance). Perhaps in football you'd like it to be no worse than 5th? Anyhow, we have the statistics and we can run a mock lottery of this years teams to show you what the draft order would have looked like this year if we were using the system now. Then you can see what it would look like. Don't have it ready to go yet or I'd have already posted it for entertainment purposes.

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 14:09

I'm not sure if everyone got this message, or just me since I paid for the site:

********************************************
From: "CBS SportsLine.com" Add to Address BookAdd to Address Book
To: rockafellerskank007@yahoo.com
Subject: Gurupies Is Online And Ready For 2005!
Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 13:35:02 -0400 (EDT)
**********************************************************
**************** Your League Is Online for 2005 ****************
**********************************************************
CBS SportsLine.com officially kicks off the 2005 Fantasy Football season by announcing that your league is back online and ready for action.

We received many suggestions from you, our fantasy players, and dedicated this off-season to making the top Fantasy Football league manager even better! Visit your league today and check out the new and exciting features that will make this season’s fantasy experience the best ever.

•Record Book – Year over year stats and standings. Relive the glory and the embarrassments.
•New tools to help you maximize your lineup - An entirely new group of features will make it easier than ever to dominate your league.
•Roster limits on reserves by position - If you choose this for your league, you can prevent teams from stock-piling their reserves with one position.

Log on today and begin you draft preparation using the most comprehensive tools available - including cheat sheets, player rankings, mock drafts, draft averages and up-to-date injury information. Everything you need is available via your league’s homepage.

It is now time to get ready, implement your off-season strategies and gameplans - and get ready to win your league!

To visit your league now, go to:
http://rfsrfs.football.sportsline.com

**********************************************************
YOUR PERSONAL INFO

Your League Name: Gurupies
Your League Abbreviation: rfsrfs
Your League Home Page:
http://rfsrfs.football.sportsline.com

**********************************************************
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
You are receiving this email as a one time communication related to your Fantasy Football league on CBS SportsLine.com

You may also reach SportsLine.com by sending a letter to: Email Department c/o SportsLine.com, Inc. 2200 West Cypress Creek Road, Fort Lauderdale, FL 33309

SportsLine.com takes your privacy seriously. To learn more about SportsLine.com' use of personal information, please read our Privacy Statement at: http://cbs.sportsline.com/info/about/privacy

Promize
ID: 17444510
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 14:49

We all did :)

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 15:01

I think I got two if someone didn't get one...

:)

Promize
ID: 17444510
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 16:32

Not sure if this has been posted, but CBS now has a record book of the league :)

Look under Standings - Record Book

Record Book
Record Year Team Value
Most Points Scored, Season 2002 Indianapolis Colts 1539.0
Highest Average Game Score, Season 2002 Indianapolis Colts 96.19
Most Points Allowed, Season 2002 NY Giants 1276.1
Least Points Scored, Season 2002 Kansas City Chiefs 678.8
Lowest Average Game Score, Season 2002 Kansas City Chiefs 48.49
Least Points Allowed, Season 2004 Houston Texans 847.8
Most Points Scored, Game 2002 Oakland Raiders 168.75
Most Points Allowed, Game 2002 San Francisco 49ers 168.75
Least Points Scored, Game 2003 Buffalo Bills 17.9800
Least Points Allowed, Game 2003 Cleveland Browns 17.9800
Highest Winning Percentage, Season 2003 Indianapolis Colts 0.875
Most Wins, Season 2003 Indianapolis Colts 14
Lowest Winning Percentage, Season 2003 Green Bay Packers 0.143
Least Wins, Season 2003 Green Bay Packers 2
Most High Week Scores, Season 2002 Indianapolis Colts 4.0
Best Margin of Victory, Game 2004 Chicago Bears 100.385
Worst Margin of Defeat, Game 2004 New Orleans Saints -100.385
Best Average Point Differential, Season 2004 Pittsburgh Steelers 23.44
Worst Average Point Differential, Season 2004 Cleveland Browns -22.51
Longest Winning Streak, Season 2003 Atlanta Falcons 9
Longest Losing Streak, Season 2002 Atlanta Falcons 9
Best Power Ranking, Season 2003 Indianapolis Colts 72
Worst Power Ranking, Season 2002 Kansas City Chiefs 3

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jul 08, 2005, 22:34

Promize, they stole my idea!!!

The biggest problem with that is that there is a discrepency in week 2 of 2002 that is corrected in our record book on the site. Also we list the top 5 on most records and very detailed. I haven't been to the site yet, but seems like they've done some good things from reading that email we all received.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Jul 09, 2005, 20:15

For more info on the lottery system, please check out Guru's thread about here.

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Sun, Jul 10, 2005, 13:00

I voted yes on it. I like it.

I had a trade offer in my email so I went to the site, but I can't see it. Is there somehwere I have to click to see trade offers other than on my own team or on the block?

Also, it looks like everyone's "on the block" was reset.

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Sun, Jul 10, 2005, 13:47

The Baltimore Ravens have been very busy today and have sent trade offers to a handful of teams. If you click on Teams/Teams & Owners I have my toll free (in the USA) cell number listed. Feel free to call me and discuss the deal I have offered or better yet, click on accept. =) My real name is Tom and I hope everyone is as excited as I am about the upcoming season. I dug real hard and tried to make offers that would help both teams. If you are outside of the USA or too shy to call (just kidding) you can email me at tbraiders@gmail.com

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sun, Jul 10, 2005, 14:52

If you have an offer, you can click on it on the trade announcement at the top of your main page. Or you can simply go to transactions/trade to see it or one you've offered.

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Sun, Jul 10, 2005, 15:34

I see that now. The previous offer I had pending was gone along with the offer someone sent me. It looks like the league reset itself.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sun, Jul 10, 2005, 17:51

CBS launched the 2005 game a few days ago.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Jul 12, 2005, 17:35

We already have a trade! Az needs to drop a player before this can go through. Not sure how often he checks the boards so may need to send him an email.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Jul 12, 2005, 17:59

Trade approved. Also, Arizona sends the Jaguars their 2nd round pick (34th overall) in 2005 draft.

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Tue, Jul 12, 2005, 23:58

I like that deal a lot for the Jags; either way, glad to see some people are thinking football already!

THK

deepsnapper
Sustainer
ID: 017103420
Wed, Jul 13, 2005, 14:34

You guys will need to be patient with me for a while if you send me any corresponsence. I had eye surgery a little over a week ago and they poked a couple of holes in my left eye & the stitches are killing me ATM. I can't check in very often because of the strain for the next couple of weeks.

The vitrectomy was a sucess and I'm looking forward to being able to see again with both eyes in a few weeks.

ds

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Wed, Jul 13, 2005, 20:53

I am going on vacation tomorrow night and won't be checking into the league for about a week. Just leaving this message as a courtesy.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Jul 13, 2005, 21:58

God Speed DS!!!

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Fri, Jul 15, 2005, 17:32

skank, rather than being charged Paypal's fee, can I just send the money to you via Party Poker?

TaRhEElKiD
ID: 5555582
Fri, Jul 15, 2005, 17:42

bmd-
The $$$ is suppossed to go back into rfs' pocket for paying for the league, not to another player on PokerStars! ;-)

THK

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Fri, Jul 15, 2005, 18:47

beastiemiked - sure. Can you do that?

beastiemiked
ID: 262411016
Sat, Jul 16, 2005, 15:07

Yes, what's your screename on Party?

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Sat, Jul 16, 2005, 15:12

skankboy

beastiemiked
ID: 262411016
Sat, Jul 16, 2005, 15:17

Seems the minimum transfer amount is $50. All just go the old fashioned snail mail route.

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Sat, Jul 16, 2005, 15:19

.. or transfer me $100, and I'll transfer back chnage.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 13:18

Here is the breakdown of the NFL scheduling to start the year. Opening Night is Thurs., Sept 8.

Preseason:
American Bowl is Aug 6
Hall of Fame Game is Aug 8

Week 1 is Aug 11-15
Week 2 is Aug 18-22
Week 3 is Aug 25-29
Week 4 is Sept 1-2

Week 4 doesn't tell us much as most starters sit or play very limited. We've never drafted before the end of the second week of exhibition. My guess is that we'd want to start on Aug 23rd for our supplemental draft but am open to suggestions. Remember though, if we start on the 23rd, keepers would be due a week before that and undoubtedly, people would want to start drafting as early as the Friday before when the thread goes up. We could make keepers due on the 23rd and start drafting on the 30th at the absolute latest. We also need a couple days for the end of the draft if possible for waivers.

So, to recap, my recommendation based on these dates are for keepers due on the 16th and drafting to commence on the 23rd. Comments, opinions, or other ideas?

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 13:19

For comparison, last year we began on Aug 24th and concluded on Sept 1.

smallwhirled
ID: 324361621
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 15:55

I like the later date suggestion. The more time to see what roles players are going to have in a deep league, the better.

Doug
ID: 57352917
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 16:08

Ditto 65

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 16:19

We can start on Aug 30th, but in order to get one cycle through the waiver wire, we'd need two full days before the 8th. So we'd need an aggressive draft to get done around the 4th or 5th. Can we do a 6 day draft? Of course we can. but the time limits per pick and cumulative times are going to have to be aggressive. I agree, later is better. I'm simply concerned about people getting skipped.

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 16:21

I would prefer to start on the 30th.
I'm sure we could make the time work.

Cliff

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Mon, Jul 18, 2005, 17:40

I'm on vacation until 8/23, but any day after that s fine for me...

Peter N.
ID: 76451412
Thu, Jul 21, 2005, 18:04

I'm cool with the later date as well as long as everyone thinks that they can be around often enough to get the draft completed in a week. It wont be a problem for me personally.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jul 22, 2005, 11:01

I'd still like to have more input before making this difinitive. StL and I are going to work on the schedule soon.

Doug
ID: 57352917
Fri, Jul 22, 2005, 15:28

If we're worried about cutting it too close, I think we could probably start the draft a couple days earlier on the 28th or 29th... all but one of the week 3 preseason games will have completed through the night of the 27th (all except for the St. Louis vs. Detroit game on the 29th).

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Jul 22, 2005, 17:59

So everyone is not going to have a problem witha 2 hour draft window on Labor Day Weekend?

Not only do we have to get the draft in, but StL and I have to go through all of the lineups and make sure all of the settings are right before we can even set up the waivers. Then waivers have to go through at least once, preferably twice. Just not sure how smoothly this would work. I, too, like the latest possible draft, but unless we're going to get in over a round and a half or more per day, there will be some issues.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Jul 23, 2005, 15:25

Also, not to get away from the drafting schedule, but there has been very good success in hoops and bases as we've went from commish decisions on trading to a league vote.

Now, this is a little different animanl in football, but I'm open to this here as well. I know it would render the arbitration process moot, and would take away the "instant" trades that people like so well, but could be good for the league. If we did this. we'd use the 1/3 objection policy. So no more than 7 could object or the trade goes to the commishs to veto. This would not be a majority rules thing. But if a third of the league votes against the trade--there's probably something that doesn't look quite right about it. Be that as it may, not one trade in hoops or baseball has been vetoed--though a couple came close.

Also, think the lottery for this league actually fits better than our other leagues. Again, I'd propose that we don't use it until next year though since the last season has already finished. Also, with 16 eligible teams, there would be four that could get into the top four. The worst overall team could never pick lower than 5th. Also, he'd have over a 50% chance of picking in the top 4. Actually, need to confer with Guru, but it might be closer to 60%. Guru would set this up for us. There is a poll on the main page of our site for this.

If you'd like for us to look at any scoring area or add something or tweak a rule, let us know and who knows, maybe like Doug's yards against idea, the league will go for it.

StLCards
ID: 166511910
Mon, Jul 25, 2005, 16:27

Whenever we start, I think it is imperative that we finish no later than Thursday night Sept 1st. Most likely a lot of people will be traveling starting Friday the 2nd for Labor Day weekend. Ref and I also need some time to get things set up and to let waivers run for at least two days, to allow people to make last minute roster changes prior to the start of the season.

THK @ families bsmt
ID: 556572522
Tue, Jul 26, 2005, 00:04

Agree...I will be out of town Labor Day wkend and won't have any access.

THK

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Tue, Jul 26, 2005, 00:06

I think my schedule is good to draft on any date with a couple days advance notice.

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Tue, Jul 26, 2005, 09:19

I should also be around pre-Labor Day weekend and would be fine with a fairly short fuse. I can probably make Labor Day weekend work if need be.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Jul 30, 2005, 12:03

I can't imagine having a two day draft. It will likely be the original date I recommended unless the league absolutely wants to start on the 30th and be done on the 31st or early on the 1st. And before we can even announce a keeper date we at least have to have some discussions about rule proposals, etc.

Promize
ID: 396261211
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 09:01

Labor Day Weekend I think will be a problem for me ... I think...

cEHp @ home
ID: 6646310
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 13:47

I say we start yesterday. Training camp rarely affects more than 1 or 2 teams depth charts and I think is being given way too much weight. If we put it off too long then we won't finish and we will have a bigger problem then the fact that the Packers have promoted their WR5 to WR4 and assigned their backup QB to the practice squad.

Let's atleast get out keepers in so that once we are ready to start the draft it won't be delayed any further.

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 13:54

I still would like to hold off as long as possible.
A lot of rookies are still unsigned.
Some that could have a realatively big impact.
I really look like to avoid having another Rivers on my team.

Just my $.02

Cliff

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 13:54

Lots of changes happened last year. Remember, it was August 2nd of last year that Ricky Williams "retired." There were a lot of changes in key positions last training camp as well (starting Browns RB, Giants QB, etc).

In a league as deep as this one, with a short schedule and the crapshoot nature of this game, the more information the better as far as I'm concerned.

THK @ families bsmt
ID: 556572522
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 15:08

The first mentioned August 23rd is late enough to start the draft in my opinion. That is a full 3 wks to see how things are shaking out..

THK

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 15:26

You're in the basement? Should I alert the authorities? Good thing you still have your priorities....

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Sun, Jul 31, 2005, 22:18

;-)

Guru
ID: 330592710
Mon, Aug 01, 2005, 22:09

cEHp - we are trying to reach you regarding the RIFC AAA Qualifying league. If you check in here, please send me an email.

Meanwhile, if anyone else has a current email addy for him, please let me know.

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Aug 02, 2005, 12:11

I checked last year's keeper thread and we started it on Aug 10th and required all keepers to be declared by Tues. Aug 17th. Looks like the draft started on Tuesday Aug 24th and concluded on Sept 1st. Opening day is basically the same this year as last year, so I agree on going with the same dates (adjusted by one day of course). That would be Tues. the 16th keepers are due, Tues the 23rd draft would start. If it ran into Labor Day Weekend people would have to leave queue's. At least by then it should be in the later rounds.

deepsnapper
Sustainer
ID: 017103420
Tue, Aug 02, 2005, 16:47

Man, I flipped my DCC calendar and Miss August is a real letdown from Miss July....

Action Figure
ID: 130173010
Tue, Aug 02, 2005, 17:59

I'll go with the general consensus, let me know. I will vote if I have a deciding vote, otherwise just email me with the dates or I'll check in periodically.

I got a very interesting trade proposal from someone , I'm not much for making deals but this one makes me think...

AF

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 02, 2005, 18:14

ds, good to know your eyes are better!

Dan
ID: 516372313
Wed, Aug 03, 2005, 12:02

Sorry guys have been extremely busy with work but a late August draft date would work for me. I'm away on vacation from the 18th until the 25th but could possibly get internet access while I'm gone if need be. Otherwise any time after the 25th would be even better! I'm getting excited to say the least! RFS I'll have the payment sent to you within the next couple days, sorry about the delay, just been real tied up.

Peter N.
ID: 27602422
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 13:02

Breaking news out of Dallas. The Cowboys and Rams have agreed to a trade. Details to come soon. ;-)

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 13:13

LOL, at first I thought you meant a trade in the NFL and I was thinking what could that possible be? Now I realize you mean G24! A division trade no less. This should be interesting.

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 13:29

Heck, I was headed for the training camp to check it out.

Cliff

Peter N.
ID: 27602422
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 13:54

HAHA, sry guys.....should've said breaking fantasy news. Anyway, here's the finalized deal.

Dallas Cowboys trade Randy Moss, William Green, Jeff Reed and the rights to pick 1.10(originally AZ's) to the St. Louis Rams for Clinton Portis, Jerry Rice, Itula Mili, and pick 3.18

When can we post keepers? ;-)

Myboyjack
ID: 27651610
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 14:04

Wow. Moss and a #1 for Portis and a #3. Wow.

Curtis Martin, you know, the NFL's leading rusher and a TD machine, is very, very available for the right draft pick(s) or package.

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 14:31

Definitely a blockbuster! Portis' hurt knee seems to be temporary. This deal could make or break either team or both teams. who knows. I like to see teams have the guts to make blockbuster moves. Grats to both! We will be approving the trade shortly.

I still am calling for discussion on rules proposals. It seems that the lottery is a good idea and the majority, 80%, have approved it thus far on the site. The trade approval process is tricky in this league. With teams playing once per week the 2 days (one full day plus) to get a trade through could hurt some teams. Yet I like the league vote to remove and complaints during the season (will still ask that preseason trades or trades during the draft be able to be approved right away to assist drafting, but we can prob work around that too by having teams draft each other's picks.) We have taken a little grief from annonymous objectors, but no trade in hoops or baseball has been objected to by 1/3 of the league so far so basically the only thing the league vote has done is to delay trades (but taking the onus off the commishs--which we REALLY like). Any other proposals need to come out asap!

Talking to several people and with Labor Day Weekend Sept 2nd-4th, we feel that it's nec. to use the same schedule we used last year and originally proposed. This means we'd have keepers due late on the 16th (maybe 6:00 EST or even as late as Noon on the 17th to give guys a chance to look at the stats from the Monday's game) and have the draft start officially at Noon EST on Aug 23rd. That way we could make that first round 4 hours time limit at least. Last year I believe it was so slow we had to hurry it up quickly. I need to talk to StL about the cumulative time.

Once the schedule is finalized, we can announce when the league payments are officially due. Remember you are either in the prize pool or out every year starting with this year. If you have not put anything in for the prize pool and just paid the league fee then you still can get into the prize pool up until the deadline. If you have an issue, please contact rfs. The league thanks him for acting as our tresurer. He's also an emergency commish should stl or myself be unavailable.

100

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 15:44

Yet another thought...what if... if the lottery system comes in for 4 teams to ahve the opportunity for the top 4 spots, what if we expanded the Wanne Be and Toilet Bowls like we do the Super Bowl so that every team plays all 16 weeks? That way our records would also be better as no one would miss out on the last two weeks of games. Then we could have a top 8 in all three bowls (1-8, 9-16 and 17-24) and rank them including all 16 games instead of the first 13 for most of the teams 9-24. I didn't want to do this initially as obviously teams could tank (or not try their hardest during) the playoffs and fall from 9 to 16 or 17-24 and help their draft order, but with the lottery, that could backfire anyhow. This is just a thought and a way to let everyone play all 16 weeks and accrue stats and more importantly continue to participate. Thoughts?

101

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 15:52

The reason we added the consolation bowls in the first place was to give 16 teams an extra week to participate. I think this is an extension of that.

102

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 16:01

Threw something your way, MBJ. Don't know what you're looking for, but I certainly have the draft position that might be attractive.

103

deepsnapper
ID: 49339512
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 16:55

Thanks Ref, Yeah I got a great report on my left eye yesterday from the 4 week post surgery checkup. Not sure, but it think I read 20/40.

Now it's time to treat the cataract & 20/200 vision in my right eye with another Opthamologist. Not quite so dicey surgery I hope. I'll find out the last week of August about that. (one eye at a time.) :)

104

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:04

Good to hear DS! You take care of those eyes. You're still in our prayers!

Btw, another alternative may be to let everyone play all 16 weeks and still leave the draft positions based on the regular season for teams 9-24. Just thinking out loud here. Just ready for some football!!!

105

THK @ families bsmt
ID: 556572522
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:08

I do not like the idea of having the playoffs count toward the ranking/# of balls for the lottery. I think regular season should be the only determining factor for the cellar dwelling teams. I don't mind them having their own little bowls or whatever as the Wanna Be and Toilet bowls give people a reason to stay active (ie my team finished on a 4 gm win streak last yr I believe), BUT I don't think that should count towards the lottery. Regular season only IMO.

THK

106

Doug
ID: 21716317
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:25

Wow, great trade for the Rams. Nicely done. Who's Andy C?

And it is with both great shock and humility that I must say I agree with THK (re: lottery and playoffs). ;-)

107

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:36

Sorry for the confusion Doug - Owner name has been anonymized. ;)

108

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:38

LOL Doug, do we normally not agree around here? Didn't know I clashed heads to make you go into "shock" when we agree!

Man, I like baseball, but I LOVE football. Can't wait for the season.

THK

109

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 17:56

PD - Exactly what I was looking for to rebuild. I accepted. After you got shafted by com. problems in our orginal draft -you've needed someone like CMart to build around. i hate to ley him go - but my teams getting too old and is not going to get it done with my current draft position. Good trade.

Browns get: Curtis Martin and pick 2.16

Bengals get: LaBrandon Toefield and picks 1.2 and 2.2

110

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 18:01

Confirmed.

Thought that might be about what you were looking for. And Toefield is actually listed as the starter in Jacksonville, so you might find a bonus. I was going to use the first pick for a rb anyway, so it works for me.

111

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 18:07

Wow, football season is coming with another big trade! Sweet. Can't get here fast enough. The First presason game is upon us too.

As far as proposals go, I really don't mind the way it is as far as the playoffs, just threw that out there to see if we could get all 24 teams to play all 16 weeks.

112

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 19:36

Wow. That just doesn't make sense to me for PD.

He could have gotten a top flight rookie RB to build around as opposed to Martin who is near the end of the road. PD is building too...not exactly 1 piece away from winning it all.

I like that deal a lot for MBJ....

THK

113

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 20:01

It's tough to pass up one of the top RBs in the game when your backs are Toefield, Wheatly, Rhodes, Fisher, and Burns. If Martin has half the season he had last year (and there's no indication of that), he'll still have outrushed my entire RB corps of last season.

Martin might, indeed, be old, but he hasn't missed a game in 5 seasons.

114

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 20:18

Well my thought is, in a year or two he will miss every NFL game for the rest of his life! ;-) Either way, he will provide a productive back to your team...that is true.

THK

115

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 20:22

Heh. Yeah, but in a couple of years how many games will Fisher or Burns be playing?

:)

I shouldn't put them down, I know. I should be announcing my surplus of backs and let people know to go ahead and send me trade offers for anyone except Martin....

116

Doug
ID: 57352917
Thu, Aug 04, 2005, 20:42

Speaking of trades... I've been talking to a couple of guys on-and-off for a few weeks, but need to call two guys out...

Beastiemiked - 3 emails sent since July 11 (most recently yesterday)... 0 replies

CCRider - At least you replied to my initial email and said you'd get back to me that night... but that was 3 weeks ago, bro! ;-)

117

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Fri, Aug 05, 2005, 11:57

I approved the trade between PD and MBJ
Here are the three modifiers to the table listed in post 22 that I am aware of so far.
*7/12/05 Arizona sends the Jaguars their 2nd round pick (34th overall) in 2005 draft as part of the Bruce,Losman/Brooks deal.
*8/4 Rams get Cowboys (via Az Cards) 1.10 pick Cowboys receive Rams' 3.18 pick.
*8/5/05 Bengals get Browns 1.2 and 2.2 picks. Browns get Bengals 2.16. (part of Martin/Toefield trade).

118

deepsnapper
Sustainer
ID: 017103420
Sun, Aug 07, 2005, 15:20

Cards - Trip needs an email addy for you in the AAA thread. We're moving services for #1.

119

Peter N.
ID: 27602422
Sun, Aug 07, 2005, 23:52

Figure that I should go ahead and give my thoughts on my trade with bj21.

Going into this offseason, I really liked my WR situation with Reggie Wayne, Roy Williams and Reggie Williams so the main goal was to deal Moss for a stud RB....mission accomplished. William Green is a WC and I likely would've taken a WR with that 1st round pick(like I need another one ;-)) Anyway, so the deal for me was basically Moss for Portis. Maybe this a stretch, but I feel like I now have 2 top 10 keeper RBs and that is what I wanted. I really did not want to trade Moss within the division, but cant always get exactly what we want. BJ21 now has a sick 3-headed monster of McNabb, Lewis and Moss so I think this deal works out well for both of us. Now I'll just have to see if my sleeper makes it to me at #23. ;-) I'm definitely ready for some football!!!

120

blackjackis21
ID: 45315168
Mon, Aug 08, 2005, 03:10

While I don't expect a whole lot from William Green, I'd hardly call him a Water Closet!

Sorry, it's late.

I would guess Portis slightly outperforms Moss (this year and years to come), but maybe not. Getting the draft pick, an upgrade at Kicker, and W. Green sealed the deal. Another factor was that Portis and Lewis had the same bye week for me. I hate to improve a division-mate's team, which I think I did slightly, but I like what I got.

121

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 08, 2005, 10:46

OK men, I would like to get the keeper thread up this week, but we need to settle any and all proposals. Not that any of the proposals would make a difference on who you were going to keep, but just need to get our house in order. Last call for any new proposals...even a dicussion about how something works can lead to an improvement that I or others may have forgotten about.

122

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 08, 2005, 14:26

While tentatively planning my keeper and draft strategy, I just realized how huge the draft picks and not having a 2nd might be in my plans.

123

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 08, 2005, 17:22

I've talked to several managers in the last week about our league and the status quo. From what I've gathered, most people are supportive of the lottery and the tweak to the FG yardage that we made to get it inline with what we had before the one yard mistake last year. Most people are indifferent whether or not to make 57 yard FG worth 5.5 or 6 points. Last year's longest FG was 55 yards so it's probably irrellevent.

I asked StL Cards about what he thought about our FG missed scoring. Currently it's negative two points for the shorter misses and you gain a point for 35-40 and don't lose any points at all for 41+. Here is his reply...

I might question giving +1 pt for a missed fg of 35-40yds and +2 for 41yds+. Seems like a 35-40 yd fg "should" be made, so why not the full penalty there. I would maybe say it would be better to have a +1 for a mfg of 40-49yds and a +2 for a mfg of 49+. Looking at some statistics last year using ESPN and lots of adding, it looks like there were 213/258 fgs between 30-39yds (81%), 185/257 between 40-49yds (72%), and 52/88 at 50yds+ (59%). So it seems that 40-49 yd fgs are tried as often as 30-39yd fgs, but have a lower success rate as you would expect, while the 50yd + attempts are much rarer and the success rate is again much lower.

Except for a question here and there though, most everyone seems to be very happy with the status quo. We don't think it's broken, but if there are tweaks that the league agrees can make us better, I think we're silly for not investigating it. We're obviously very pleased that the league is pleased. The lottery question will not even need an e-mail vote if a few more of you will vote on the home page of the cbs web site.

124

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 11:13

Dang. I've got a trade offer I just can't make up my mind on.

Where do you go to get advice on a trade in a 24-man league ;) ?

Toral

125

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 11:21

Doug, CBS had an email address I rarely check. I've fixed the problem and I'll see if I can still remember my password to check on your emails.

126

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 11:23

That's easy Toral. Since you are in my division I would be glad to assist you in your decision making ;)

127

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 12:00

Toral-
Also feel free to ask me about the deal! ;-)

128

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 21:42

Toral are you a used car salesman? :-(

THK

129

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:04

Another huge deal was just agreed upon...we both feel we are getting screwed but the deal was still made. Haha...guess there are just a lot of uncertainties on each side with a deal of this magnitude.

Looking forward to hearing thoughts...

by the way...I am now looking for a late 1st or 2nd round pick or WRs...dsw827@aol.com with offers...

THK

130

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:04

Trade announcement:

Toral (Saints) trades:
Kevin Jones
Toral's 3rd round draft pick

to

ThK (Vikings)for:
DeShaun Foster
Steve Smith
Donte Stallworth
ThK's 1st round draft pick (#5 overall)
ThK's 2nd round draft pick
ThK's 2006 (next year) 1st round draft pick

Toral

131

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:10

Geezus. That's unbefreakinlievable. Especially considering certain posts in this thread.

132

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:12

Holy crap!

133

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:16

Toral - what was the trade you were having trouble making up your mind on. Not this one.

134

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:17

Holy Jumpin Jeehozaphats

Whooooooooooooooooo

135

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:18

Yes this one. I got some additions and -- I not not BSing you -- I'm still conflicted about the trade.

It all depends on what you think of a stud like Kevin Jones of course. I know various offerers thing pretty damn highly of him in a keeper league, and so do I.

Toral

136

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:18

Toral has 3 of the first 9 picks and 2 more in the early 2nd round.

Wanna move up a spot, Toral.

137

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:21

In a keeper league, Jones is prolly one of the 5 best RB available in this draft. No less - no more.

Congrats Toral.

138

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:22

Skimmed this thread and have no clue what MBJ is speaking of???

This is a big one...I think most will think I overpaid, but I will post my thoughts after hearing some thoughts.

THK

139

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:33

MBJ-
One of the 5 best backs in this year's rookie/fa draft?! Or do you mean re-draft?

My thoughts...

*Foster is a RB I have liked since he came into the league, but I am sick of sitting in the bottom half of the league. I wanted more of a sure thing and Foster isn't that. Tons of potential, but injuries are a concern and so are GL carries with Shelton and SD on the squad. So I tried to block out the fact Foster was in this deal at all...all I was focusing on was adding a top 10 keeper league RB to go with Duece and CJ.

*I really don't like the #5 pick this year. You will have to pick between 2 top prospects. 1 of which I don't like his situation. 1 of which I just don't like. So I didn't value this as a top pick like with a normal draft class. Not to mention I don't even think I deserved this pick. My team was injured and underpreformed last year. So I just think of it as an extra...

*Steve Smith was the man of substance in this deal. Hate to lose him as he would have made for an outstanding #2 WR for me; however, you have to give to get. Not worried too much about Foster and #5 (trying to block it out); I am thinking Steve Smith + what will it take to get the great Kevin Jones.

*1st round pick next year. Ewwww...THK hates this part. However, it had to be done. I think I have one of the best cores in the entire league now with 2 top keeper league RBs, QB and WR. So I am hoping the pick is outside the lottery and I am not missing out on too much.

*2nd round pick this year. Well...I have an extra 2nd anyway and this is a drop in the bucket to everything else...fine...let's finish it.

So yea, I overpaid but I did it on purpose.

Palmer
Duece
Kevin Jones
Chad Johnson

The Vikings are rising...

THK

140

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 22:39

Lastly...the entire thread I mentioned I wanted to deal #5, Foster, Smith and Stallworth for an upgrade at RB. Those 4 weren't viewed as 4 good pieces to me, but just 1 huge piece that could turn into a stud RB.

I consider KJ one of the very top keeper league RBs. I did have to add that 1st rounder which hurt, but I love my top 4 now and will make moves to the playoffs this year.

THK

141

Peter N.
ID: 27602422
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 23:14

From talking with THK alot on AIM, I know how much he loves KJ(especially in a keeper league). We were talking the other night and he said he'd end up overpaying for him. Well, he was right. ;-) He clearly overpayed for him, but I think thats what you have to do to aquire stud RBs in this league. Do I think THK paid way too much for KJ? Yes, but I can still see why he did it.

142

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 23:30

Because he loves him so much?

KJ's a good young player. Good receiver, too. But if the Lions don't spend more time in the red zone this year, he's going to be a guy who gets a lot of touches, lots of yards, and few scores.

143

blackjackis21
ID: 45315168
Tue, Aug 09, 2005, 23:58

Wow - a big'un. Nice work guys.

144

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:15

but I think thats what you have to do to aquire stud RBs in this league.

Exactly. KJ will be a 1,600+ yard and double digit TD RB for many years to come. Not only that...but I have 2 top keeper RBs now, to go with my top 5 WR.

Overpaid for a reason people...

Ref-
Why do I always get so much scrutiny for my deals?! ;-) Maybe because they are always blockbusters...

THK

145

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:22

Well, I was going to say, don't ask me, I'm not touching this one with a 10' pole...but then I remembered that we have to approve it. It's huge but at first glance there is absolutely nothing that would lead me to believe it wouldn't be approved. My brain is fried tonight. I'll digest it tomorrow (Wednesday)w/StL if you don't mind.

146

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:23

In the meantime, will there be any further discussions on any of the proposals? Does this league still want the commishs to approve all trades during the season?

147

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:29

That is a blockbuster trade. Congrats to both teams for making it happen.

148

Toral
ID: 53422511
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:30

Don't forget, the controversial trade, only one disapproved in this league, was basically Ashley Lelie for Eli Manning and Josh Reed.

Does that trade look so bad now?

Toral

149

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:31

I will say that there is absolutely nothing wrong with "overpaying" at times to get what you think will make your team better.

150

Toral
ID: 53422511
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:49

Just for a laugh, Rotowire's "expert" opinion. (If you're a subscriber you can ask for their opinion on individual deals). Yes I told them it was a 24-player league with 9 keepers, etc:

I wouldn't do the deal. Kevin Jones has the chance to be a top five player for the
next four to five years; of the group of players you'd be getting in return, I don't
see anyone in that group being first round talent, with the exception of maybe the
rookie you'd get with that pick. Foster is so injury-prone and now has competition
in the form of Eric Shelton. Smith is the best player in the group for this year,
but at best he's second round talent. I'd rather stick with what you have and rebuild
with the #3 and #9 picks, and build around Jones.

You know, I've only been playing roto anything for 4 years. I knew I would like it when I was confident enuf to ignore Rotowire's experts' opinions, which I always have, and it worked out OK....

Toral

151

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:54

Toral...

We added picks after that though...

My only regret is either Stallworth/1st next year is in there. I wish there was a way to have kept 1 of them, but I wanted KJ and I paid to do it...

I am very thin and lacking picks, but I love my team and will use some shrewd deals, picks and FA pickups to continue to improve my team.

Palmer, KJ and CJ are untouchable. Duece could be had for something large if anybody wants to offer...

Outside of Duece I am looking for WRs or 2nd round picks and beyond for whatever you see that interests you...

THK

THK

152

Toral
ID: 53422511
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 00:57

Sure, I think Deuce is underrated. I'd give you...Kevin Jones!

Oh wait! Whoops, never mind.

Toral

153

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 01:04

;-)

I'll always have 2 stud RBs now, until the wheels fall off one of these boys...to go with CJ too.

Overpaid? Yes
Worried about the 1 extra piece? Yes
Happy about the deal? Yes

THK

154

Myboyjack
ID: 27651610
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 11:06

I'll be out of town until Saturday. I have a few offers out - if you respond - I'm not ignoring you.

;)

155

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 11:24

Hey THK, how do you really feel about the deal?? ;)

Been on vac and still getting my feet wet in all things football since I have two keeper leagues to declare by this week. Looking at my team I don't see how I nearly made the playoffs last year because it sucks. Well, it has some nice pieces, but I need to fill some glaring holes. I need a solid QB and will consider moving a WR (Driver/Gardner) plus a draft pick. Will listen to all offers on any player, but Dillon/Fitzgerald will be hard to come by.

156

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 11:41

I did a once over on both teams and studied all the players briefly and the makeup of both teams. KJ could in fact be a stud this year. But will the Lions O afford him enough scores to get him enough points to be a top 5 RB this year? Questionable. Could be in the future though if not this year. I really like the guy but there's more to a team than one guy. Look what Payton was mired in for years with the hapless Bears.

Foster from what I can tell is in a contract year and I'm expecting his best year ever. Smith is one of the top WRs in the game. Stallworth is looking to have a breakout year.

Now looking at the teams, Toral is in dire need of depth. THK looks like he was just a couple pieces away from a playoff-type team. The question I'd be asking myself if I were proposed this trade would be is the sum of the parts greater than the whole. I think it is. Let's say KJ is a top 5 RB this year. Still, the points that Toral is going to get from those three alone should more than makeup for that week in and week out even with the replacemtnts thk picks up. What's more, when you add in the draft picks, I really like Toral's side better. What happens the week KJ is on bye, or worse yet, injured? I doubt that all of Toral's pickups are on bye or injured at the same time. And remember it's essentially a 4th player too with the draft pick. And on top of that, if thk doesn't make the playoffs that pick next year could be the first pick overall. I can see why Toral was hessitant to trade such a potential star in KJ, but he got some stars back of his own and in this league depth can be so key.

For thk's side of it, in his mind Foster has done nothing. Who is to say this year will be any different? Smith was great before he got hurt and Stallworth has shown flashes of brilliance--but will he or won't he break out this year? He loved KJ and paid heavily for him. It may turn out that he will end up getting the better end of the deal at some point. But IMO, this is a deal Toral had to make and is instantly a contending team. THK has some work to do to get deep yet he's traded away most of his assets and his future high picks already. It will be interesting to hear from both of these managers during the season.

From a commish perspective, this deal will be approved once I get all of the details recorded in our league rules.

Also, there were no objections to the WW starting in the same order as the draft as we've made it in both of our other leagues (worst team has highest waiver prioirty instead of the other way around). 79% have voted in favor of the lottery system as proposed. There were objections to changing the playoffs for the non Championship teams so those are being shelved. No discussion thus far on the Kickers--esp FG Missed--though no formal proposal made.

157

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 11:50

Toral, I should have asked you to drop two players before doing the deal but I need you to drop them now. Actually there appears to be one not in db so let me know who the other one is.

158

Toral
ID: 53422511
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 11:54

Freddie Jones to be dropped.

(The blank space on my lineup represents Chris Chandler, retired.)

Toral

159

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 12:14

Foster's contract year? Yea, he may be a decent RB. But truthfully he isn't even a top 20 RB in this league with his injury concerns and situation. He has Shelton taking GL carries and more in general. Under 20th back....not that valueable to me. I wanted to add a 2nd stud, which is hard to do...

Stallworth...I already said I hated adding in Stallworth/my 1st next year...1 I wanted to keep. However, will Stallworth ever break out? Even so, having him on the same squad as my top RB is risky. ~30-35 WR

Smith...The man of substance. WRs aren't great in a league without PPR but still I hated to give him up. We was obviously a necessity in the deal. 15-30 WR

#5...believe it or not I hate this pick this year. HATE it. You are likely going to get 1 guy in a decent situation I don't like...or 1 guy in a terrible situation. Wasn't even thinking about it... Draft class is weak this yr outside a few players...

1st next year sucks, but whatever. I am hoping this is the deal to start getting me toward the top half and more of our league.

Kevin Jones won't be a top 5 RB this year. He will be my 2nd top 10 RB this year however, and that will make him one of the top keeper RBs in the league. Well, now I have 2 with Duece. This was about getting me set at RB for many years to come. I now have 3 guys, inside the top 10 at their position instead of more depth of decent talent. Well guess what? I have faith that I can build back some decent talent with good scouting, shrewd trades and picks...to combat my lack of depth at this time.

I am definitely make Toral better, no doubt. I am taking on some risk in a lot of your minds too. However, I have faith these top 4 can be the core to carry me to powerhouse status next year and possibly a WC this year.

Anyway, all done trying to explain this from my side. Have fun re-evaluating this one along the way! ;-)

THK

160

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 12:30

Staley will be out at least a month, FYI, because of the knee surgery.

161

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 12:37

Btw, I also applaud thk and Toral for having the guts to pull off a blockbuster. A lot of people get shy when talking about top notch players. Another negative for thk's team is that he doesn't have 9 quality keepers now. It appears that he's going to either have to keep players that shouldn't be kept or keep less than 9. But I'm sure he will work that WW and will be fine.

I'm trying to get our "house" in order before launching the Keepers thread. I know most won't announce keepers right away anyhow, but am giving the league every chance to pipe up and let their input be heard.

There have been various comments made to me in the past year or more about certain scoring procedures but almost nil now so I'm going to rattle off a few of these that the league as a whole can monitor and if there is something they'd like to discuss, we will add them to the future proposals list.

When we came up with the scoring, we wanted to make team Ds and Ks be valuable. Hence we added more postive points than negatives. That's why the aggressive bonus points for Kicking and D. Then, for year two when we modified his proposal to account for yards against we made it a perfect Bell Curve with the average being larger.

There has been comments that the PA Ds are top heavy. Well that's by design. However, if tweaking something makes it more even or making more of a penalty for worse Ds works that all good, but my suggestion is to leave it alone. If someone wants to study it and make a proposal for next year, have at it.

Ks are also important. Like QBs and Ds and sometimes TE's there are typically only one per team per game and are limited. However, with all the bonuses they get and based on StL's research, what if instead of changing it to -3 for 0-29, -2 for 30-39 and -1 for 40-49, we went -3 for 0-29, -2 30-39 and -1 40-44? Currently it is -2 for 0-34 and -1 for 35-40. The reason for a change would be to make the top kickers more valuable not to dumb down the Ks as a whole. I am indifferent to whether this comes in or not. So if there is no positive discussion on this, it will NOT be coming in.

Also, things to watch for next year, bonuses for rushing/passing. I think it's Twarpy who complains about this every year. Can't remember if he thought the threshold was too high or what.

Currently it's .1 points for rush/rec for the first 150 yards and .125 for yards starting at 151 and up. Passing is .04/yd for the first 400 and .06/yd thereafter. I would like to keep it where it is.

I'm thinking the 57 yard FG should be lumped with the 55 and 56 for 5.5 points. Otherwise, we go from 54 being 5 points to 57 being 6 points. Again, it likely won't matter as 55 was the longest one made last year. By trend, we would go to 60 to get 6 points anyhow, but a 58 yarder is good enough for 6 as it's a HUGE play and make those big kickers extra valuable.

162

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 12:43

thk, if you're happy with it and toral's happy with it, the league should be happy with it... well can't speak for toral's division-mates or even conference-mates at this point, but it never crossed my mind as a commish not to approve it as I studied it. thk's team had started to turn the corner last year and was winning, so let's have faith that thk has a plan. I don't think you need to sell the league on it. You're sold on it and that's what's important. You obviously have a plan and this is just the beginning.

163

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 14:01

Keeper thread is up. Pete told me he self-edited to add his dropped players.

164

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 10, 2005, 16:00

I asked CBS again about negative yards automation and once again they said it is not an option. I don't understand how CBS is so good on some things yet so bad on some basic things. Fortunately, their football game doesn't have many bad things about it. We will once again have to manually subtract guys who have neagtively gained yards more than 1.

165

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 11, 2005, 10:17

Don't forget to drop your own players.

166

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 10:12

The delhomme for mason deal also included: In addition, Oakland's 1st, 3rd, and 5th round picks for KC's 2nd, 3rd, and 4th

167

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 10:50

Is it too late to trade for players that managers are cutting in the keeper thread?

168

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 11:39

Deepsnapper, offer sent.

To all, still looking for a QB and willing to trade my 1st or 2nd rounder depending on the player.

169

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 12:24

If they are cut, they are already free agents.

170

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 12:31

That blows. There are a couple of guys that I would've loved on my team.

I'm looking for a 9th keeper if anyone thinks they are cutting a decent player, preferably a WR. In exchange we could work out a draft swap of some sorts. I'm going out of town this weekend but will be back Sunday afternoon to negotiate.

171

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 13:27

We hope to have the schedule done shortly for this year's matchups. The process is spelled out in our rules. Also want to run a mock lottery of what our draft order would be this year had the lottery been in place immediately instead of waiting until next year.

172

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 16:03

I think the mock lottery exercise would be revealing and
give us a good concrete idea of what to expect. When
do we actually run the lottery? Just curious for draft
pick trading purposes.

173

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 20:46

We would probably run it before keepers are due I guess.

174

Doug
ID: 21716317
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 21:59

At least a couple weeks before I would hope. I've been discussing trades on and off with a couple people for weeks... not knowing their draft positions would have made those conversations very muddy. Maybe by/on August 1 each year?

175

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 22:36

Yeah it would need to be done before people started announcing keepers, so we can do it right after we announce the league and all 24 managers (hopefully all returning). Would be best to do it after the site opens up so it may even be done before August 1st.

176

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 12, 2005, 23:15

I've added AFC and NFC to the conference names so when the computer put them in A-B order, the AFC's two conferences would be together this year instead of split by the two NFC divisions. That always bothered me and fortunately it worked. Helps to try and figure out schedule and playoff teams.

Getting ready to do the schedule so once again thought I'd tell you once again how the schedule is assembled. First from the rules:

*11 games VS teams in your conference (each team 1 time)
*2 games VS teams (determined by Strength of Schedule from the previous year) in the opposite conference. These games will take place in weeks 5 and 9 and will use this schedule based on the separate conference standings from each league 1 vs 6 & 7, 12 vs 7 & 6, 2 vs 5 & 8, 11 vs 8 & 5, 3 vs 4 & 9, 10 vs 9 & 4.

First I use a random round robin scheduler on a web site (I didn't save it so gotta go find another one) and list them out. If someone is good with XL perhaps they can get the names of teams to automatically replace the numbers to save us a step. Usually have one person naming teams off via IM while I enter them into the CBS scheduler. We go straight from 1-13, skipping weeks 5 and 9. Then we go down the list from teams 1-12 from last year and figure out those two weeks. Highest seed from last year is home in week 5 and lowest team is home in week 9. Not that the home team matters in our league, but I try to have all teams to end up with 6 or 7 home games of the 13 games so you're not always listed first or second.

178

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 09:58

Btw, before doing the scheuling, we assign teams 1-12, then randomize the teams and re-assign them a number of 1-12. In this way, the top team from last year won't play the #12 team then #11 team then #10 team in order week by week. Going to try and get this moving today.

179

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 16:58

Oh the irony... first the Raiders make a deal with the Chiefs, now the Broncos. Goatlocker, I guess that means you and your Chargers are next. Wanna deal? =-p

180

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 19:58

StL Cards and myself spent over two hours on this schedule. We checked and rechecked it (and checked each others') and we can't find any errors. We also did a separate randomization of both afc and nfc so the corresponding ranked teams in each conference wouldn't have the same schedules. After the pairings for the interconference games for weeks 5 and 9, every game is purely at random. Remember, you will play every team in your conference once and your opponents in weeks 5 and 9 are based on your placement last year. Please check your teams to be sure we didn't make any mistakes.

I think this is the 4th straight year that I've had to play Twarpy in an interconference game. UGH!!!

The trade sent to our desk for approval is:
Oakland Raiders
·Taylor, Jamaar WR NYG

-For-

Denver Broncos
·Moore, Mewelde RB MIN

Offer: Oakland trades 4.01 for Denver's 4.22 in exchange for Moore... Jamaar is included just to balance the rosters for now, he'll be dropped anyway.

My brain is fried, but will take a look at this in a few mins.

181

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 20:05

Also, I forgot that it was impossible to have a home and an away game for everyone for the two interconfernce games. And since some teams are going to get 5 home or away games, the home and visitor are not going to be either 6 or 7 for everyone like we hoped. Again, it makes no difference in our league as we don't use the home team as a tie breaker, it's just mainly for aesthetics.

Full Schedule

Schedule Grid

Individual Schedule

182

cEHp
ID: 49750716
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 22:54

Mewelde Moore for an upgrade in the 4th round -- wow.....

183

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Sat, Aug 13, 2005, 23:29

You are up in this thread Pride, RIFC AAA

184

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 00:07

Ok...went back and looked at my initial draft and it makes me even more proud of my squad!

1: A-train ---scrub
2: Fragile Fred ---1 solid yr, dealt for Barlow and Stallworth (both later dealt for Duece and KJ)
3: Foster ---havent broke out yet due to injuries (dealt for KJ)
4: Coles ---pretty good, worse in Wash though (dealt for CJ)
5: Carr ---solid QB, forgot where he went but miss him
6: Chargers D ---OUCH
7: Terrell ---OUCH
8: Weinke ---OUCH
9: Bengals D ---OUCH
10: Nedney
11: Branch ---best value pick here! (had to deal to get Barlow??? ewww)
12: Holmes, K
13: Pouchman, K

WOW! Memorable draft picks:
Palmer mid 1st round
Chris Brown (packaged with Barlow to get Duece) 4th or 5th round

So for all those with scrutiny over my managing and deal making...just look at the old days! THK/Vikings are in the right direction baby!!! ;-)

Good luck everyone this season. I am ready for some football!

THK

185

Peter N.
ID: 27602422
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 00:33

Yeah, always fun to go back and check things out. For me, I had my 1st 5 picks auto'd. LOL, damn HS football practice ran overtime!!!

1: Moss - Good.
2: Bledsoe - Ugh
3: Jimmy Smith - Ugh
4: Booker - Ugh
5: Vanderjagt - Has been great, but kicker in the 5th round...Ugh
6: Stacey Mack - Ugh
7: Dorsey Levens - Ugh
8: Brad Johnson - Ugh
9: Randy Michael - Good, although he might be about to go to jail.
10: Seahawks D/ST - Could be worse considering how late I picked a d/st
11: Reggie Wayne - Best pick in the draft for me.
12: David Patten - Ugh
13: J.R. Redmond - Ugh

Top 5 moves I've made since the inaugural draft.

1 - Picking Domanick Davis up as a free agent
2 - Trading Stacey Mack for a 1st round pick which ended up being Roy Williams.
3 - Trading Booker and Smith for Green which ended up being involved in the Moss deal.
4 - Trading Moss for Portis
5 - Trading Drew Bledsoe for 1st round pick which ended up being Reggie Williams.

Definitely interesting to look back on. I'm looking forward to competiting this year and many years to come. Ready for some football!!!!

186

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 11:18

As a reminder, here was our original draft. Instead of picking out my own draft, I simple bolded mine. It's fuuny, I still have my top four picks with Priest at 1.12, Tiki at 2.13, Plax at 3.12 and Tommer at 4.13. I had to trade my other good players mainly due to QB injury.

Here is the link

Some of our franchises have changed, but all of the history is here.

So our draft went like this:

1 Houston Texans Faulk, Marshall (RB STL)
2 Arizona Cardinals Alexander, Shaun (RB SEA)
3 Baltimore Ravens Green, Ahman (RB GB)
4 Pittsburgh Steelers Warner, Kurt (QB STL)
5 Chicago Bears James, Edgerrin (RB IND)
6 Green Bay Packers Martin, Curtis (RB NYJ)
7 Atlanta Falcons Tomlinson, LaDainian (RB SD)
8 Cincinnati Bengals Dillon, Corey (RB CIN)
9 Dallas Cowboys Moss, Randy (WR MIN)
10 Cleveland Browns Buccaneers (DT TB)
11 Jacksonville Jaguars Manning, Peyton (QB IND)
12 Indianapolis Colts Holmes, Priest (RB KC)
13 NY Giants Culpepper, Daunte (QB MIN)
14 Oakland Raiders Garcia, Jeff (QB SF)
15 St Louis Rams McNabb, Donovan (QB PHI)
16 Kansas City Chiefs Davis, Stephen (RB WAS)
17 Seattle Seahawks Williams, Ricky (RB MIA)
18 San Diego Chargers Owens, Terrell (WR SF)
19 Buffalo Bills Favre, Brett (QB GB)
20 San Francisco 49ers McAllister, Deuce (RB NO)
21 Minnesota Vikings Thomas, Anthony (RB CHI)
22 Denver Broncos Brooks, Aaron (QB NO)
23 Tampa Bay Bucs Vick, Michael (QB ATL)
24 Washington Redskins George, Eddie (RB TEN)
25 Washington Redskins Harrison, Marvin (WR IND)
26 Tampa Bay Bucs Smith, Rod (WR DEN)
27 Denver Broncos Bennett, Michael (RB MIN)
28 Minnesota Vikings Taylor, Fred (RB JAC)
29 San Francisco 49ers Plummer, Jake (QB ARI)
30 Buffalo Bills Boston, David (WR ARI)
31 San Diego Chargers Bettis, Jerome (RB PIT)
32 Seattle Seahawks Gannon, Rich (QB OAK)
33 Kansas City Chiefs McNair, Steve (QB TEN)
34 St Louis Rams Lewis, Jamal (RB BAL)
35 Oakland Raiders Johnson, Keyshawn (WR TB)
36 NY Giants Holt, Torry (WR STL)
37 Indianapolis Colts Barber, Tiki (RB NYG)
38 Jacksonville Jaguars Bruce, Isaac (WR STL)
39 Cleveland Browns Dunn, Warrick (RB ATL)
40 Dallas Cowboys Bledsoe, Drew (QB BUF)
41 Cincinnati Bengals Stewart, Kordell (QB PIT)
42 Atlanta Falcons Hearst, Garrison (RB SF)
43 Green Bay Packers Griese, Brian (QB DEN)
44 Chicago Bears Horn, Joe (WR NO)
45 Pittsburgh Steelers Staley, Duce (RB PHI)
46 Baltimore Ravens Smith, Antowain (RB NE)
47 Arizona Cardinals Moulds, Eric (WR BUF)
48 Houston Texans Brown, Tim (WR OAK)
49 Houston Texans Johnson, Kevin (WR CLE)
50 Arizona Cardinals Brees, Drew (QB SD)
51 Baltimore Ravens Garner, Charlie (RB OAK)
52 Pittsburgh Steelers Chambers, Chris (WR MIA)
53 Chicago Bears Green, Trent (QB KC)
54 Green Bay Packers Gonzalez, Tony (TE KC)
55 Atlanta Falcons Pittman, Michael (RB TB)
56 Cincinnati Bengals Glenn, Terry (WR GB)
57 Dallas Cowboys Smith, Jimmy (WR JAC)
58 Cleveland Browns Stewart, James (RB DET)
59 Jacksonville Jaguars Green, William (RB CLE)
60 Indianapolis Colts Burress, Plaxico (WR PIT)
61 NY Giants Henry, Travis (RB BUF)
62 Oakland Raiders Jones, Thomas (RB ARI)
63 St Louis Rams Portis, Clinton (RB DEN)
64 Kansas City Chiefs Gary, Olandis (RB DEN)
65 Seattle Seahawks McCaffrey, Ed (WR DEN)
66 San Diego Chargers Collins, Kerry (QB NYG)
67 Buffalo Bills Smith, Emmitt (RB DAL)
68 San Francisco 49ers Shockey, Jeremy (TE NYG)
69 Minnesota Vikings Coles, Laveranues (WR NYJ)
70 Denver Broncos Brown, Troy (WR NE)
71 Tampa Bay Bucs Thrash, James (WR PHI)
72 Washington Redskins Mason, Derrick (WR TEN)
73 Washington Redskins Couch, Tim (QB CLE)
74 Tampa Bay Bucs Smith, Lamar (RB CAR)
75 Denver Broncos Jackson, Darrell (WR SEA)
76 Minnesota Vikings Foster, DeShaun (RB CAR)
77 San Francisco 49ers Galloway, Joey (WR DAL)
78 Buffalo Bills Rice, Jerry (WR OAK)
79 San Diego Chargers Allen, James (RB HOU)
80 Seattle Seahawks Pollard, Marcus (TE IND)
81 Kansas City Chiefs Hambrick, Troy (RB DAL)
82 St Louis Rams Morton, Johnnie (WR KC)
83 Oakland Raiders Ismail, Qadry (WR IND)
84 NY Giants Alstott, Mike (RB TB)
85 Indianapolis Colts Toomer, Amani (WR NYG)
86 Jacksonville Jaguars Price, Peerless (WR BUF)
87 Cleveland Browns Wheatley, Tyrone (RB OAK)
88 Dallas Cowboys Booker, Marty (WR CHI)
89 Cincinnati Bengals Gardner, Rod (WR WAS)
90 Atlanta Falcons Titans (DT TEN)
91 Green Bay Packers Duckett, T.J. (RB ATL)
92 Chicago Bears Steelers (DT PIT)
93 Pittsburgh Steelers Dolphins (DT MIA)
94 Baltimore Ravens Sharpe, Shannon (TE DEN)
95 Arizona Cardinals Freeman, Antonio (WR PHI)
96 Houston Texans Brady, Tom (QB NE)
97 Houston Texans Rams (DT STL)
98 Arizona Cardinals Barlow, Kevan (RB SF)
99 Baltimore Ravens Brunell, Mark (QB JAC)
100 Pittsburgh Steelers Muhammad, Muhsin (WR CAR)
101 Chicago Bears McCardell, Keenan (WR TB)
102 Green Bay Packers Robinson, Marcus (WR CHI)
103 Atlanta Falcons Jackson, Willie (WR ATL)
104 Cincinnati Bengals Wells, Jonathan (RB HOU)
105 Dallas Cowboys Vanderjagt, Mike (K IND)
106 Cleveland Browns Schroeder, Bill (WR DET)
107 Jacksonville Jaguars Warrick, Peter (WR CIN)
108 Indianapolis Colts Bears (DT CHI)
109 NY Giants Dyson, Kevin (WR TEN)
110 Oakland Raiders Eagles (DT PHI)
111 St Louis Rams Anderson, Mike (RB DEN)
112 Kansas City Chiefs Green, Jacquez (WR WAS)
113 Seattle Seahawks Ward, Hines (WR PIT)
114 San Diego Chargers Cowboys (DT DAL)
115 Buffalo Bills Packers (DT GB)
116 San Francisco 49ers Redskins (DT WAS)
117 Minnesota Vikings Carr, David (QB HOU)
118 Denver Broncos Patriots (DT NE)
119 Tampa Bay Bucs Raiders (DT OAK)
120 Washington Redskins Saints (DT NO)
121 Washington Redskins Alexander, Derrick (WR MIN)
122 Tampa Bay Bucs Jones, Freddie (TE ARI)
123 Denver Broncos Wilkins, Jeff (K STL)
124 Minnesota Vikings Chargers (DT SD)
125 San Francisco 49ers Mare, Olindo (K MIA)
126 Buffalo Bills Franks, Bubba (TE GB)
127 San Diego Chargers Walls, Wesley (TE CAR)
128 Seattle Seahawks Jets (DT NYJ)
129 Kansas City Chiefs Browns (DT CLE)
130 St Louis Rams Conway, Curtis (WR SD)
131 Oakland Raiders Sloan, David (TE NO)
132 NY Giants Chamberlain, Byron (TE MIN)
133 Indianapolis Colts Fiedler, Jay (QB MIA)
134 Jacksonville Jaguars 49ers (DT SF)
135 Cleveland Browns Finneran, Brian (WR ATL)
136 Dallas Cowboys Mack, Stacey (RB JAC)
137 Cincinnati Bengals Ravens (DT BAL)
138 Atlanta Falcons Gramatica, Martin (K TB)
139 Green Bay Packers Chrebet, Wayne (WR NYJ)
140 Chicago Bears Robinson, Koren (WR SEA)
141 Pittsburgh Steelers Bradford, Corey (WR HOU)
142 Baltimore Ravens Heap, Todd (TE BAL)
143 Arizona Cardinals Stallworth, Donte' (WR NO)
144 Houston Texans Longwell, Ryan (K GB)
145 Houston Texans Hakim, Az-Zahir (WR DET)
146 Arizona Cardinals Giants (DT NYG)
147 Baltimore Ravens Wycheck, Frank (TE TEN)
148 Pittsburgh Steelers Lewis, Chad (TE PHI)
149 Chicago Bears Watters, Ricky (RB SEA)
150 Green Bay Packers Pathon, Jerome (WR NO)
151 Atlanta Falcons Westbrook, Michael (WR CIN)
152 Cincinnati Bengals Richardson, Tony (RB KC)
153 Dallas Cowboys Levens, Dorsey (RB PHI)
154 Cleveland Browns Elam, Jason (K DEN)
155 Jacksonville Jaguars McMahon, Mike (QB DET)
156 Indianapolis Colts Hilliard, Ike (WR NYG)
157 NY Giants Broncos (DT DEN)
158 Oakland Raiders Zereoue, Amos (RB PIT)
159 St Louis Rams White, Dez (WR CHI)
160 Kansas City Chiefs Carter, Quincy (QB DAL)
161 Seattle Seahawks Akers, David (K PHI)
162 San Diego Chargers Dayne, Ron (RB NYG)
163 Buffalo Bills Bryant, Antonio (WR DAL)
164 San Francisco 49ers Jenkins, MarTay (WR ARI)
165 Minnesota Vikings Terrell, David (WR CHI)
166 Denver Broncos Edwards, Robert (RB MIA)
167 Tampa Bay Bucs Canidate, Trung (RB STL)
168 Washington Redskins Johnson, Eric (TE SF)
169 Washington Redskins White, Jamel (RB CLE)
170 Tampa Bay Bucs Gadsden, Oronde (WR MIA)
171 Denver Broncos Holcombe, Robert (RB TEN)
172 Minnesota Vikings Weinke, Chris (QB CAR)
173 San Francisco 49ers Dilfer, Trent (QB SEA)
174 Buffalo Bills Janikowski, Sebastian (K OAK)
175 San Diego Chargers Conway, Brett (K WAS)
176 Seattle Seahawks Testaverde, Vinny (QB NYJ)
177 Kansas City Chiefs Scott, Darnay (WR JAC)
178 St Louis Rams Driver, Donald (WR GB)
179 Oakland Raiders Carney, John (K NO)
180 NY Giants Taylor, Travis (WR BAL)
181 Indianapolis Colts Chandler, Jeff (K SF)
182 Jacksonville Jaguars Riemersma, Jay (TE BUF)
183 Cleveland Browns Proehl, Ricky (WR STL)
184 Dallas Cowboys Johnson, Brad (QB TB)
185 Cincinnati Bengals Moss, Santana (WR NYJ)
186 Atlanta Falcons Graham, Jeff (WR ATL)
187 Green Bay Packers El, Antwaan Randle (WR PIT)
188 Chicago Bears Becht, Anthony (TE NYJ)
189 Pittsburgh Steelers Miller, Jim (QB CHI)
190 Baltimore Ravens Pinkston, Todd (WR PHI)
191 Arizona Cardinals Hasselbeck, Matt (QB SEA)
192 Houston Texans Allen, Terry (RB NO)
193 Houston Texans Frerotte, Gus (QB CIN)
194 Arizona Cardinals Conwell, Ernie (TE STL)
195 Baltimore Ravens Matthews, Shane (QB WAS)
196 Pittsburgh Steelers Vinatieri, Adam (K NE)
197 Chicago Bears Brady, Kyle (TE JAC)
198 Green Bay Packers Gaffney, Jabar (WR HOU)
199 Atlanta Falcons Chiefs (DT KC)
200 Cincinnati Bengals Crumpler, Alge (TE ATL)
201 Dallas Cowboys McMichael, Randy (TE MIA)
202 Cleveland Browns Jaguars (DT JAC)
203 Jacksonville Jaguars Edinger, Paul (K CHI)
204 Indianapolis Colts Panthers (DT CAR)
205 NY Giants Falcons (DT ATL)
206 Oakland Raiders Centers, Larry (RB BUF)
207 St Louis Rams Sanders, Frank (WR ARI)
208 Kansas City Chiefs Alexander, Stephen (TE SD)
209 Seattle Seahawks Stokes, J.J. (WR SF)
210 San Diego Chargers Hayes, Donald (WR NE)
211 Buffalo Bills Jordan, LaMont (RB NYJ)
212 San Francisco 49ers Edwards, Troy (WR PIT)
213 Minnesota Vikings Bengals (DT CIN)
214 Denver Broncos Bryson, Shawn (RB BUF)
215 Tampa Bay Bucs Peterson, Todd (K PIT)
216 Washington Redskins Harrington, Joey (QB DET)
217 Washington Redskins Ferguson, Robert (WR GB)
218 Tampa Bay Bucs Lelie, Ashley (WR DEN)
219 Denver Broncos Jefferson, Shawn (WR ATL)
220 Minnesota Vikings Nedney, Joe (K TEN)
221 San Francisco 49ers Smith, Steve (WR CAR)
222 Buffalo Bills Colts (DT IND)
223 San Diego Chargers Bates, D'Wayne (WR MIN)
224 Seattle Seahawks Jackson, James (RB CLE)
225 Kansas City Chiefs Dwight, Tim (WR SD)
226 St Louis Rams Johnson, Rob (QB TB)
227 Oakland Raiders Crowell, Germane (WR DET)
228 NY Giants Redman, Chris (QB BAL)
229 Indianapolis Colts Clark, Desmond (TE DEN)
230 Jacksonville Jaguars Mathis, Terance (WR PIT)
231 Cleveland Browns Lions (DT DET)
232 Dallas Cowboys Seahawks (DT SEA)
233 Cincinnati Bengals Feely, Jay (K ATL)
234 Atlanta Falcons Stover, Matt (K BAL)
235 Green Bay Packers Hanson, Jason (K DET)
236 Chicago Bears Brien, Doug (K MIN)
237 Pittsburgh Steelers Lewis, Jermaine (WR HOU)
238 Baltimore Ravens Anderson, Richie (RB NYJ)
239 Arizona Cardinals Morgan, Quincy (WR CLE)
240 Houston Texans Anderson, Jamal (RB ATL)
241 Houston Texans Bruener, Mark (TE PIT)
242 Arizona Cardinals Taylor, Chester (RB BAL)
243 Baltimore Ravens Texans (DT HOU)
244 Pittsburgh Steelers Bulger, Marc (QB STL)
245 Chicago Bears Fuamatu-Ma'afala, Chris (RB PIT)
246 Green Bay Packers Hollis, Mike (K BUF)
247 Atlanta Falcons Seder, Tim (K DAL)
248 Cincinnati Bengals Stokley, Brandon (WR BAL)
249 Dallas Cowboys Wayne, Reggie (WR IND)
250 Cleveland Browns Hall, John (K NYJ)
251 Jacksonville Jaguars Huntley, Richard (RB BUF)
252 Indianapolis Colts Ricks, Mikhael (TE DET)
253 NY Giants Dawson, Phil (K CLE)
254 Oakland Raiders Cardinals (DT ARI)
255 St Louis Rams Bills (DT BUF)
256 Kansas City Chiefs Wilkins, Terrence (WR STL)
257 Seattle Seahawks Vikings (DT MIN)
258 San Diego Chargers Byrd, Isaac (WR CAR)
259 Buffalo Bills Andersen, Morten (K KC)
260 San Francisco 49ers Gordon, Lamar (RB STL)
261 Minnesota Vikings Branch, Deion (WR NE)
262 Denver Broncos Dilger, Ken (TE TB)
263 Tampa Bay Bucs Christie, Steve (K SD)
264 Washington Redskins Rhodes, Dominic (RB IND)
265 Washington Redskins Ismail, Raghib (WR DAL)
266 Tampa Bay Bucs Chandler, Chris (QB CHI)
267 Denver Broncos Shaw, Bobby (WR JAC)
268 Minnesota Vikings Holmes, Jaret (K CAR)
269 San Francisco 49ers Crockett, Zack (RB OAK)
270 Buffalo Bills Fletcher, Terrell (RB SD)
271 San Diego Chargers Stevens, Jerramy (TE SEA)
272 Seattle Seahawks Kitna, Jon (QB CIN)
273 Kansas City Chiefs Rambo, Ken-Yon (WR DAL)
274 St Louis Rams Cortez, Jose (K SF)
275 Oakland Raiders Graham, Daniel (TE NE)
276 NY Giants Williams, Roland (TE OAK)
277 Indianapolis Colts Minor, Travis (RB MIA)
278 Jacksonville Jaguars Christian, Bob (RB ATL)
279 Cleveland Browns Epstein, Hayden (K JAC)
280 Dallas Cowboys Patten, David (WR NE)
281 Cincinnati Bengals Wuerffel, Danny (QB WAS)
282 Atlanta Falcons Flutie, Doug (QB SD)
283 Green Bay Packers Blake, Jeff (QB BAL)
284 Chicago Bears Pennington, Chad (QB NYJ)
285 Pittsburgh Steelers Shipp, Marcel (RB ARI)
286 Baltimore Ravens Dawkins, Sean (WR MIN)
287 Arizona Cardinals Brown, Kris (K HOU)
288 Houston Texans Dudley, Rickey (TE CLE)
289 Houston Texans Mitchell, Freddie (WR PHI)
290 Arizona Cardinals Martin, Jamie (QB STL)
291 Baltimore Ravens McKnight, James (WR MIA)
292 Pittsburgh Steelers Stith, Shyrone (RB IND)
293 Chicago Bears Hicks, Skip (RB TEN)
294 Green Bay Packers Faulk, Kevin (RB NE)
295 Atlanta Falcons Kirby, Terry (RB OAK)
296 Cincinnati Bengals Minnis, Snoop (WR KC)
297 Dallas Cowboys Redmond, J.R. (RB NE)
298 Cleveland Browns Beuerlein, Steve (QB DEN)
299 Jacksonville Jaguars Streets, Tai (WR SF)
300 Indianapolis Colts Jeffers, Patrick (WR CAR)
301 NY Giants Lindell, Rian (K SEA)
302 Oakland Raiders Gramatica, Bill (K ARI)
303 St Louis Rams Brewer, Sean (TE CIN)
304 Kansas City Chiefs Kasay, John (K CAR)
305 Seattle Seahawks Jurevicius, Joe (WR TB)
306 San Diego Chargers Kennison, Eddie (WR KC)
307 Buffalo Bills Carswell, Dwayne (TE DEN)
308 San Francisco 49ers Goings, Nick (RB CAR)
309 Minnesota Vikings Pochman, Owen (K NYG)
310 Denver Broncos Moore, Dave (TE BUF)
311 Tampa Bay Bucs Schlesinger, Cory (RB DET)
312 Washington Redskins Williams, Boo (TE NO)

187

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 12:09

Ref, StLCards and Peter N. - I just noticed when Pete and I made our trade, I mistakenly thought I had 18th pick in each round - turns out its the 17th. So, instead of Pete receiving 3.18, he gets 3.17.

Sorry for the mix-up.

188

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 12:52

bmd and I have agreed to a trade:

bmd gets David Boston and bj21's 4.17 and 5.17.
bj21 gets bmd's 4.13 and 5.13.

If anyone is interested in K. McCardell for some sort of 2nd rounder, it might make my keeper decisions a little easier.

189

coldwater coyotes
ID: 31528613
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 13:22

Anybody interested in J. Wilkins, K ???

191

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 13:34

Made an offer on site.

192

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:01

Confirm trade. Went ahead and proposed the trade on CBS to update our rosters.

I think my roster is now set. Thanks to all for the offers.

193

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:06

Reche Caldwell is now available as a keeper for any upgrade from pick 2.22 (previously Coldwater Coyote's; pending approval of Wilkins trade.)

Toral

194

coldwater coyotes
ID: 31528613
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:08

Toral....I accepted the trade.

195

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:09

Thanx. Just waiting for commish's final approval.

Toral

196

Myboyjack
ID: 27651610
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:13

Toral - I'm interested in Reche. I've already posted my keepers but I assume I can still trade for him, just so I drop someone?

If that assumption's correct, I might have a 2nd round upgrade for you.

197

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:15

I'm not sure you can do that. You could always delete your keepers real fast ;)

Toral

198

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:16

Not that I would counsel or recommend any such action.

199

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:21

Thinking it over, I believe you would have to trade one of your keepers -- the one you would be dropping -- to me for Caldwell, plus the exchange of draft choices. That would work. So, I would look forward to a proposal. On site, or by e-mail and I would propose on site.

Toral

200

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:25

Looking at transaction requests now on the site. bmd/bj21, your accepted trade does NOT have any indication of draft picks with it. Everyone, please make sure when you accept a trade it has all of the details included as that is the trade. Since there are posts here, I am sure the deal accepted is supposed to include draft picks, so will allow it with the ammended picks.

I need to get all details of picks copied over to our rules before I can approve those trades.

mbj you are correct, you may not go over 9 keepers until everyone has posted their keepers. But you are free to make trades after you have posted your keepers but before the deadline, you just can't go over 9 players.

201

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:26

bmd/bj21 trade DOES indeed include the picks mentioned. Sorry for the oversight.

202

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:33

Here, ref, you can copy this text over to thr Rules re the Wilkins trade, a little clearer than the on-site explanation:

Denver receives pick 2.05 (via Minnesota) from New Orleans for pick 2.22 per Wilkins deal.

Toral

203

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:35

Sorry, offered the trade after it was posted and accepted.

204

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 14:37

Too late Toral, but thanks anyhow. bj21, it's not a big deal here as I read the posts before I checked email, but it could be an issue during the season--esp. if there is ever a misunderstanding between trade partners.

205

Myboyjack
Dude
ID: 014826271
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 16:44

Toral - I sent you an offer for one of your Broncos. I decided against trading down in the 2nd for Caldwell.

206

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 16:49

You did? I thot that would have been a helluva trade for you. Ah well. I guess Perry and Toefield have their keeper merits too.

Reche Caldwell still available for any upgrade from pick 2.22.

Toral

207

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Mon, Aug 15, 2005, 17:30

Still need a starting QB. Gardner and Driver available as well as Pinner and Fargas.

208

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 10:48

if i wouldn't have nearly every rb or wr one bye in week 5, i'd have posted my keeps already. but was thinking of moving toomer because of it. he was hurt last year and doubled on every snap when he did play. this year he's 100% and plax will be the one getting doubled. but, i'm gonna have bye week players in my lineup vs twarpy unless i figure something out. i'll prob just keep him and figure something out by week 5.

209

THK @ families bsmt
ID: 556572522
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 11:45

If you want to move him you know I would be interested. :-)

THK

210

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 11:48

thk, i got your offer, but why would you offer me kj for toomer straight up when you just paid so much for him?

211

Doug
ID: 21716317
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 11:56

LOL... KJ for Toomer... now THERE is a trade that would need to be vetoed! =-)

212

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 12:05

Come on Doug, Toomer is good, but KJ has a lot of upside! ;)

213

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 12:37

Haha Ref! That was a good one...

THK

214

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 14:15

I've made my fair share of bad trades in this league and I've overpaid many times for players here, but the Pollard for McGahee trade looks even worse now that Pollard wasn't even kept.

215

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 14:27

Can we get an updated draft pick chart? With all the swaps that have occurred thae last couple weeks, it is confusing. I'm trying to work a few trade offers and I'm having a hard time figuring who has what picks.

PD, I sent you an offer and e-mail. I hope you have time to respond before the deadline.

216

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 15:00

I'm going to have to post my keeps soon. The offers I've gotten in no way reflect his value so I'm still planning on keeping Toomer.

217

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 15:23

Ref-
I told you that deal was terrible from the beginning! ;-) Of course many think that about my recent deal too, but I guaruntee to keep KJ for the next 5 years at least! ;-)

THK

218

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 15:24

As a start I am just going to organize all the trades mentioned in this thread and not yet reflected in the chart. Will compare these to that posted in the rules to make sure they are all here.

*7/12/05 Arizona sends the Jaguars their 2nd round pick (34th overall) in 2005 draft as part of the Bruce,Losman/Brooks deal.
*8/4 Rams get Cowboys (via Az Cards) 1.10 pick Cowboys receive Rams' 3.17 pick.
*8/5/05 Bengals get Browns 1.2 and 2.2 picks. Browns get Bengals 2.16. (part of Martin/Toefield trade).

Toral (Saints) trades Toral's 3rd round draft pick to ThK (Vikings)for ThK's 1st round draft pick (#5 overall); ThK's 2nd round draft pick;
ThK's 2006 (next year) 1st round draft pick

The delhomme for mason deal also included: In addition, Oakland's 1st, 3rd, and 5th round picks for KC's 2nd, 3rd, and 4th

Offer: Oakland trades 4.01 for Denver's 4.22 in exchange for Moore...

bmd gets David Boston and bj21's 4.17 and 5.17.
bj21 gets bmd's 4.13 and 5.13.

Denver receives pick 2.05 (via Minnesota) from New Orleans for pick 2.22 per Wilkins deal.

219

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 15:53

If anyone is looking me, I'll be on vacation 8/17 to 8/22. Limited Internet access, but should be able to retrive e-mails.

221

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:07

Trade announcement: Browns trade Gus "Backup" Frerotte to the Packers for Rod "Don't Call Me Ron" Gardner.

No picks involved. If allowed, I'll adjust my keeper list to reflect keeping Gardner instead of Frerotte.

222

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:11

Trade confirmed. Thanks PD, and to the other managers that I have been in discussions with the last couple days. I appreciate the feedback, offers, and counters.

223

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:14

I have this on my desk. I had been offering toomer for a backup QB, guess i should have offered it to PD. I shouldn't have been surprised Gus was kept since he will start, but kinda hoped he'd be there in the draft at 17, but that's a stretch. No draft picks involved so it's pretty easy to approve--though I'm not high on Gardner, personally.

224

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:16

The thing that tipped it for me is that Frerotte is not yet a starter (though it's looking that way). If I was going to get a backup QB, I'd rather draft one!

225

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:20

Yeah, if he isn't going to start, that would be one thing, but Gardner likely won't help you much either. Who knows what will happen with injuries though. Gardner is 3rd on his depth chart now. But stranger things have happened. I've gotten valuable players off the FA wire who weren't even drafted and Gardner could turn out to be just that.

226

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:35

PD, you don't need to bother restating keepers.

227

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 16:50

Do the Rams own 2.22? If so, I got gypped.

Toral

228

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:01

Word is Gardner is taking over the #2 spot ahead of Colbert by preformance in camp. Not official yet, but I think thats a good trade for both sides.

THK

229

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:03

The site I use updates daily and Garder has moved ahead of Colbert there as well. I did not really want to trade him, but had to make a move.

230

blackjackis21
Leader
ID: 034837521
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:08

Rams do not have 2.22 (but do need to use 5.13).

231

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:11

Lord knows that I've made some horrible trades and horrible moves in this league, so one man's opinion shouldn't be worth much more than anyone else's. I think skinneej had to have a QB. That he was in position that he may have needed to overpay. But instead got rid of a WR who perhaps isnt' as good as others. If he's up to #2 now, he's already better than I thought he was. That's why the individual teams that make moves know more about the trades typically than any outsider. I still like sj's deal better from his team's perspective though.

232

Doug
ID: 21716317
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:33

LOL, I told you there might be mistakes... so if 2.22 belongs to the Saints, does that mean they have 7 picks, or is something else messed up?

233

Doug
ID: 21716317
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:45

Same deal as before, with 2.22 corrected.

G24 2005 Draft Grid
	Round 1	Round 2	Round 3	Round 4	Round 5
1	Chiefs	Raiders	Raiders	Broncos	Chiefs
2	Bengals	Bengals	Browns	Browns	49ers
3	Saints	Jaguars	Jaguars	Jaguars	Jaguars
4	Eagles	Eagles	Eagles	Eagles	Eagles
5	Saints	Broncos	Packers	Steelers	Vikings
6	Seahawks	Seahawks	Bills	Seahawks	Seahawks
7	Chargers	Chargers	Chargers	Chargers	Chargers
8	Ravens	Ravens	Ravens	Ravens	Ravens
9	Saints	Saints	Vikings	Saints	Saints
10	Rams	Jaguars	Cardinals	Cowboys	Cardinals
11	Falcons	Falcons	Falcons	Falcons	Falcons
12	Packers	Packers	Packers	Packers	49ers
13	Texans	Texans	Texans	Rams	Rams
14	Bills	Steelers	Bills	Bills	Bills
15	49ers	49ers	Browns	49ers	Vikings
16	Bengals	Browns	Bengals	Bengals	Bengals
17	Rams	Rams	Cowboys	Texans	Texans
18	Colts	Steelers	Colts	Colts	Colts
19	Chiefs	Raiders	Chiefs	Bears	Chiefs
20	Giants	Giants	Colts	Giants	Giants
21	Bears	Bears	Bears	Steelers	Raiders
22	Broncos	Saints	Broncos	Raiders	Broncos
23	Cowboys	Cardinals	Cardinals	Cowboys	Cowboys
24	Steelers	Vikings	Bills	Seahawks	Bears

234

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:55

Is the 23rd the official start date for the draft?

235

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 17:59

Yes, we have 7 picks. Anybody who wants them in a keeper-for-keeper exchange, just speak up.

Toral

236

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 18:16

Everyone has declared their keepers except Dan's Buffalo Bills. Anybody have any word from him?

237

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 18:20

I show two teams haven't declared.

Dan's Buffalo Bills
Twarpy's New York Giants

Only show 22 as having declared.

Cliff

238

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 18:29

I know Dan has been actively preparing because we have agreed a trade to be announced when the draft starts.

Twarp is working hideously long hours this summer.

While the commisshes can pick their keepers for them, is there any real need to do it until tomorrow morning? Might as well give them the evening.

Toral

239

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 18:48

D'oh! Forgot about Twarpy. I sure don't want to pick someone's keepers, but if anyone knows how to get hold of either of them it would sure be helpful if they can get them in ASAP.

240

Toral
ID: 53422511
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 19:01

If it turns out to be of any help, I know Dan's keeping Putzier (cuz he's going to trade hime to me.)

Toral

241

cEHp
ID: 15521916
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 22:02

I will try and call Twarpy tomorrow.

242

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 22:05

I just returned home. It is unfair to the people who have turned their keepers in to give a late manager another evening to find more info about their players. We are now over 4 hours passed the deadline and we will be forced to select their keepers for them. Even if they had made a preliminary or something in the discussion we'd have something to go by. I've got to talk to stl cards but I assume the keepers will be selected for them as promised. This is one of the worst parts about being a commish, but fair is fair and it's not like there wasn't plenty of notice.

243

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 22:37

Please dont send me any more messages!!! We are not giving anyone more time. And even though I wouldn't have held putzier, i've seen toral's post and gotten a message from someone else imploring me to keep him for Dan. StL's list has to match mine or we have to discuss our disagreements. I think based on what I'm getting from two different people, there is a 3-way trade in the works and putzier is part of it. Now if I hold this guy for Dan, a perhaps 2nd TE and the deal falls through, he's gonna feel the sting. Anyhow, please don't send us any more messages regarding this, stl and I will have their keeps posted asap.

244

cEHp
ID: 15521916
Tue, Aug 16, 2005, 23:39

"Even if they had made a preliminary or something in the discussion we'd have something to go by."

I have a long email where dan gives us "something to go by" in regards to two of his picks. Its simple, agreeing to a trade implicitly declared both Putzier and Keyshawn Johnson as two of his keepers. Please don't ruin a great trade because dan is a PUTZ.

245

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:07

Them dropping Keyshawn or Putz would be ludicrious. Putz is ranked a top 15 TE by footballguys.com. Keyshawn is a #1 WR in Dallas. I wouldn't worry about either.

That said, they should determine his keepers since he is past due.

THK

246

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:28

Keepers are posted and final. First, I'm not going to feel bad or made to feel bad about someone's 9th keeper. Twarpy came on and apparently the 9th keeper could have gone another way but he was too busy falling over himself apologizing and thanking us for helping him and he said don't worry about it, etc. and we did a good job.

Neither stl nor I originally had Putzier as a keeper. Who is keeping two TEs? We both had Q over Putz. But because we were alerted of his plan to keep and trade him, we had to decide is Q better than Franks? Well if he's trading Putz, he prob. wants Franks. We saw that Franks is having contract problems, but Q is no higher than 2nd on depth chart and is battling dayne and clarett and someone else for that. So we kept putz for him ONLY BECAUSE we were told by several people that he did intend to keep him. I don't care to read that we're crazy not to keep a top 15 TE. Nor were we happy to get messages from disgrunteled managers that it is BS that we didn't declare Twarpy's and Dan's keepers right after they missed the deadline. Not that we don't appreciate their opinions, but I think it may have been assumed that since we didn't post already we were letting them have more time.

We're going to try and do a little research and pick who we think might be the best 9 players, but we can't mind read. Then stl and I had to get together. It seems every year and every sport there is at least one manager that can't manage to get their keepers in. Things happen at times, but it's not fair for the people that get their lineups in on time to let them get an extension. We hope that whatever mistake we have made when we make these keepers are perhaps the 9th keeper and the mistake won't hurt their teams.

OK, that's behind us. Now let's get ready to draft! ;)

247

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:44

Who said crazy?!?! I respectfully disagree with your initial thoughts of Q over Putz, but oh well!

THK

248

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:47

thk, you can disagree all you want and you may be right, but unfortunately, we got stuck having to make choices for someone else. Hopefully we picked the same guys Dan would have wanted. But if not, we did the best we could given the circumstances.

249

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:51

The picks look fine.

250

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 00:56

THK, who said crazy??? Just for the record, you did!!! =-p

"Them dropping Keyshawn or Putz would be ludicrious."

251

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 01:02

Please, for the record show me where I called anyone crazy. You can't.

Ref, if you read past that...I agree on the fact of you picking keepers for the people that are over due.

THK

253

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 01:38

*sigh*

Ref said: "I don't care to read that we're crazy not to keep a top 15 TE."

This was clearly in reference to your statement of: "Them dropping Keyshawn or Putz would be ludicrious. Putz is ranked a top 15 TE by footballguys.com."

I'm not sure why you're confused about this, but it really doesn't matter. Let's move on to the draft, eh? =-)

254

TB
Sherpa
ID: 031811922
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 01:58

I projected each teams keepers just for kicks and had him keeping Griffin over Putzier. Sure, if all the Denver backs stay healthy this year, Putz will probably score more, but he is a TE. FWIW, I had Gafney ranked higher than Putz too. It's all good, though, I let go two WR I had rated higher than two I kept. Not that any of the four I am talking about are going to be top 50 WR's this year anyway.

255

Doug
ID: 21716317
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 02:15

FWIW, I projected keepers too, but had Putz ahead of Franks, so I had Franks as the player getting dropped. I'd say about half the teams I got exact matches on keepers, half I got 1 or even 2 players different. I was a bit surprised by the number of team defenses that were kept at the lower end of the spectrum, but I guess it makes sense, because it allows you to play matchups. As opposed to kicker, where weekly production is much tougher to predict, so playing matchup is less advantageous, hence fewer teams keeping 2 (actually, only one team did so).

256

Dan
ID: 516372313
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 10:49

Hey guys I just want to let everyone know I'm still here. I want to apologize for yesterday, I was reminding myself all mornign yesterday to have my keepers in I still had one thing I was debating. Then as the deadline approched I had a work issue where I had to go in early and it just totally slipped my mind. I can't apologize nor thank you guys enough! You guys did exaclty what I probably would've done, I was debating that last keeper earlier so I guess you guys just ended up doing it for me :) So I thank you for that! Sorry again though, I feel so bad.

Now on top of that...since I kept Putz, Toral/EH that trade better still be going on ;) :P

257

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 13:05

Here is our draft thread from last year. Draft thread may go up end of this week or the weekend for any early pickers.

Just a note: if that 3-way trade is going to be complicated, you might want to give us a sneak peak so we can have it approved quickly once officially accepted by all parties w/o holding up anyone's pick. You can send it to us via email.

258

THK @ families
ID: 356432421
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 14:41

I was really concerned with my kicker last year I can see! 3 kickers, wow! Didn't have a first last year either...

THK

259

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 15:45

Just an update, I haven't heard back from Guru about the mock lottery draft and frankly not sure we will before the draft. He is on vacation and doing the RIFC draft and several other things going on. Since it's not going in until next year and this year is a more of a just for fun anyhow, hope no one minds if it is completed after the draft has begun. For those of you that don't know, Guru has wrote the program for our G20 hoops and baseball leagues and he needs to modify it just a smidge for our g24 league.

260

Dan
Sustainer
ID: 054747823
Wed, Aug 17, 2005, 21:10

Hey just thought I'd let everyone know I'm gone to Calgary for a week. I'm hoping I can get access during the draft period while I'm away, but if not I'm definitely going to get into contact with a couple people to make sure I don't miss my pick. See you all next week, and good luck with the start of the draft, hopefully a couple guys fall to me!

261

rfs on vacation
ID: 27331811
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 13:18

To all:

I'm away on vacation and do not have my spreadsheet with me, but to the best of my ability, here is an update of payments recieved.

*** PLEASE SPEAK UP IF I MISSED ANYONE ***

1. Skineej has a total of $10.50 owed from baseball -so he owes the balance for football.
2. Twarpy won $15 -- so he owes a balance
3. Doug was owed $12.50 last year (?) -- so he owes a small balance.

[#'s 1,2,3 were from balances Stl Cards transferred to me when I agred to be treasurer)

4. Turley $22
5. THK $22
6. StL $23
7. AF $23
8. BJ21 $23
9. TB $30 (sent extra to cover misc esxpenses, thanks)
10. PD $7 (no prize pool)
11. coldwater $22
12. Deepsnapper $22
13. myboyjack $22
14. Dan $22
15. bmd $23
16. sw $23
17. RFS $22
18. Toral - $7 (no prize pool)

Twarpy (pay on the way from hoops money winnings)- we still need to finalize this. I mailed your placque 2 days ago.

I've heard from 19. Ref, 20. CCRider and 21. Promize as to payments on the way.

skinnej, Twarpy, and Doug, please make sure I have your balances owed as correct?

Please correct me if I am wrong, but that leaves the following folks unaccounted for:

22. CEHP
23. Peter N
24. GL

Please e-mail me if you have corrections as I can check e-mail easier than the boards.

PS -- Are we doing weekly pick'ems for sure?

262

rfs on vacation
ID: 27331811
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 13:55

Update: GL paid $25.

263

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 17:46

Got your message, rfs, and I'm still awaiting word from Twarpy as well.

264

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 18:18

I think PD may not have gotten all the messages Twarpy was sending. For some reason he was CCing me and I looked and I still have it for some reason. Anyhow, here is the relevent part of the that email dated June 26th:

With that being said I think the best thing to do is
to do this: When you pay your football fee to rfs,
include $15 for shipping/engraving and $5 for the
balance of my football fees.

Then just send me whatever is leftover, minus any fees
you may to pay or whatever. I've also never received
money through paypal so if theres anything I have to
do let me know, the email address I use is the one I'm
sending you this from.

265

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 18:25

Since Twarpy wants in everything, that's $22 or $7 +$1 paypal fee to rfs to settle up for football. Then he wants to pay for the shipping from rfs to him (dont know what that is but like he said $15 should cover it). So that's around $23 to rfs and send Twarpy the balance. Hope I got it right, but Twarpy has not been home a lot all summer and I know he wants to get this taken care of.

266

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 18:42

Based on feedback from SW, our first up to draft, he's ready to go now, so may get the draft thread put up later tonight in the football standings thread. The clock will not start until next tuesday at noon, however, so don't feel pressured to pick, but there seems to be some obvious choices and some others may be ready to go. Besides that, we'd like to keep the per pick draft at 4 hrs each (8 hrs cumulative)if we can.

267

StLCards
Leader
ID: 31010716
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 18:52

I verified that the table posted in #233 is accurate based on trades made up to this point. There is always room for error so please speak up if anyone thinks it is not accurate.

268

Perm Dude
Dude
ID: 030792616
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 20:03

I didn't know whether he was in on the prize pool or not, ref. That's what I'm still awaiting a response from him on. I'll email him again in a minute.

pd

269

skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 21:52

re: post 261 - I sent the balance owed ($12.50) on 7/1 thru paypal and got your response that you received it. I should be all square.

270

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Aug 18, 2005, 23:13

Our draft thread and draft discussion thread is up in the football standings forum. Last year we started the clock on Monday, but we already said Tuesday, so that's where we left it. Clocks will start on Tuesday at Noon ET. There is a dark time of Midnight to 8 a.m. where clocks will be suspended. Clocks will go on through the weekends. We will now mostly use the draft discussion thread. But lets use this one to finish any odds and ends like payments etc.

271

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Fri, Aug 19, 2005, 19:39

We need to get the outstanding league fees/prize pools in by next week. If there are any issues, please let us know.

272

Dan in Calgary
ID: 1875201
Sat, Aug 20, 2005, 02:06

EH/Toral if you need to get a hold of me re: trade discussions please reach me at the above e-mail.

273

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Sat, Aug 20, 2005, 09:28

Just me, or a little odd that Dan posted in this forum without posting his pick in the other? Or was he just not ready to pick yet?

274

Toral
ID: 53422511
Sat, Aug 20, 2005, 09:29

I suspect from his reference to trade discussions that he's not aware the trade went through. I've e-mailed him with the news and a list of who's been picked.

Toral

275

Doug
ID: 267342015
Sat, Aug 20, 2005, 16:37

Right... just odd since Ref posted the approval in the draft thread prior to his post above. I guess he just didn't check the draft thread. No worries.

276

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 13:00

Has Dan responded to anyone's emails? Twarpy has even called and sent text messages to him. My concern is this: if he's not planning on returning until the 25th or so we will have some problems. He didn't leave a q and didn't read the posts that the draft thread was up--nor eany of his emails beforehand. I don't think he knows--but again, if he's gone on vacation for a week, he should have at least known to have someone ready to make his pick for him. Maybe he will be checking in today.

277

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 13:04

Dan: in case you don't know...

Here is the draft thread (we started (pre)drafting on Thursday--clocks don't start until Tuesday) You are up.

Here is the discussion thread.

278

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 13:04

He hasn't responded to me. He did say he would get into contact with someone to make sure he didn't miss his pick (260). The trade only altered his draft position by 5 picks so he must know that he has to get into contact with someone by tomorrow afternoon to be safe from timing out.

279

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 13:50

Yeah, my point is when Dan said this:

I'm away on vacation from the 18th until the 25th but could possibly get internet access while I'm gone if need be.

So he knew he wasn't going to be around for the start of the draft yet no q or anything. So I'm hopeful, he's able to check in today (or no later than early tomorrow) to see the status of the league, etc.

280

Toral
ID: 53422511
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 14:01

Don't forget, Dan's in Calgary. They may be under four feet of snow with dogsled as the only means of communication ;)

Toral

281

beastiemiked
Sustainer
ID: 03531815
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 17:23

Dan has been online today. Not sure why he isn't picking.

282

Dan In Calgary
ID: 217392011
Mon, Aug 22, 2005, 17:24

Hey guys I'm extremely sorry for not picking yet, I was unaware the draft had started when I posted last. I just came on quickly to let Toral/EH know they could get a hold of me through that e-mail and didn't even get a chance to read the thread. I sincerely apologize, I'm on now and will have a pick up very shortly, once agian sorry for the delay.

283

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Thu, Aug 25, 2005, 18:50

Payment update:

Since post 261

GL is paid in full.

Ref, CCRider, Promize, PeterN have all made pay arrangements with or the "check is in the mail" :)

I still need PD to forward Twarpy's fees (and prize pool etc..). I belive we are waiting on Twarpy to instruct PD?

cEHp -- I haven't herad a word from you. can you get in touch withme please.

To all: Please understand I'd like to put this to bed ASAP as keeping track of 24 people isn't really what I want to do.

284

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Thu, Aug 25, 2005, 18:56

oh... and Doug still owes a baalnce but he contacted me and it is on the way.

285

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Thu, Aug 25, 2005, 19:12

update: Promize paid in full

286

Doug
Leader
ID: 02730280
Thu, Aug 25, 2005, 19:24

Doh. I don't send much mail, and don't have an outgoing mailbox here at the building... so the envelope is still sitting in the outgoing slot by the door. *blush* My apologies. I'll drop it off at a mailbox tonight. Pinky swear.

287

rockafellerskank
ID: 180352016
Tue, Aug 30, 2005, 10:34

Updates:

Ref paid in full.
Doug paid balance in full.

288

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Sep 01, 2005, 14:24

We are getting ready to start waivers and with that a new thread, but wanted to clear up a question about the prize pool that came up in our baseball thread about this (G24) league's prize pool.

Last year Expansion this, Toral, Baldwin, CC Rider, and Smallwhirled didn't participate. Two of those managers are not back. For this year everyone has paid or pledged to be in the prize pool except PD and Toral.

Remember that because managers were picking and choosing in the various leagues about when to be in the prize pool because how they thought there team would be, many managers were calling for a requirement to be in the prize pool in order to play. RFS and myself came up with a compromise that said that from now on it is still voluntary but starting with this year you would either be in or out every year. We don't want anyone to have to drop out due to finances. It's obviously not a money thing. I will also take this one step farther. If anyone is in this year and subsequently for some reason don't feel like they can be in it in the future due to finances, we will work with them and perhaps let them opt out depending on what is involved on a case by case basis. (Need to confer with rfs on this as he's the treasurer in all of our leagues now and I am a co-commish in every league).

With that said, Toral and PD are not in the prize pool at this time. There have been 3 or 4 managers that met the requirement of asking for an extension of fees with rfs before the due date. They have all committed to the prize pool and have assured rfs they would be able to take care of business before the NFL season starts. So if Toral or PD would like to be added to the prize pool, all they need to do is inform rfs of their decision and tell him when they'll send in that money and for him to approve it.

289

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Sep 01, 2005, 14:35

Also there is a separate pick ems contest. That is $1 entry fee.

Did everyone like the way that was setup last year? There is also other ways to set it up. Each game can be weigted from 1-12 each week and you get points based on the number it assigns (I think the harder/closer matchups are worth more points as CBS Sportsline's computer guru assigns probable points for each player in the lineup). There is also a points spread based on the same thing and you have to win by points to get it right. Remember pick'ems is based on our games--not NFL games. So it's me against rfs' team not real Colts vs. Steelers. You are guessing who will win in our league.

290

Ref
Donor
ID: 539581218
Thu, Sep 01, 2005, 15:19

OK last act before our season gets underway (once i start waivers).

Here is a list of all draft pick trades for '05 that I am nuking now...

*8/25/04 Doug's Raiders receives 2005 5th round pick from CC Rider's Bears for his 2005 4th round pick.
*9/6/05 Minn Vikes give up their 3rd round pick next year for SF's 5th round pick as part of the Couch/Henson trade.
*10/1/04 Twarpy's Giants trade their 3rd round pick to RFS for Jonathan Quinn.
*10/5/04 CC Rider's Bears trades his 4th round pick next year for RFS' 5th round pick & Anderson.
*10/6/04 Colts get highest of Steelers two 3rd round picks and Steelers get the Colts 2nd round pick. (as part of Grossman for Testeverde)
*10/10/04 Seattle Seahawks give up #3 Draft Pick / Steelers give up lowest of two #4 Draft picks. - Supplemental for the Warner for Johnson trade.
*10/12/04 Green Bay Packers receive the higher of the 49ers' two 3rd rounders (decided at the end of the year between MN/SF) for the Packers' 5th rounder. Supplemental for the Gramatica trade.
*10/15/04 Arizona Cardinals receive the 2nd and 3rd rounders from the Cowboys in exchange for the Cardinals' 1st and 4th rounders as part of the trade for the Rams' DST.
*11/2/04 Bills receive Promize's 3rd and the lowest of either rfs' 3rd and Twarpy's 3rd and Steelers receive Bills' 2nd rounder - as part ot the Krenzel trade.
*11/4/04 Vikings receive Pitt's lowest 2nd round pick for A-train and Minnesota's 4th round pick in the Thomas deal.
*11/17/04 Saints receive Jax 1st round pick as part of the Robinson/Dunn deal.
*12/3/04 Cleveland Browns acquire 3rd pick from 49ers for Cleveland's 5th pick as part of the Moss/Davis deal.
*7/12/05 Arizona sends the Jaguars their 2nd round pick (34th overall) in 2005 draft as part of the Bruce,Loseman/Brooks deal.
*8/4 Rams get Cowboys (via Az Cards) 1.10 pick Cowboys receive Rams' 3.18 pick.
*8/5/05 Bengals get Browns 1.2 and 2.2 picks. Browns get Bengals 2.16. (part of Martin/Toefield trade).
*8/10/05 Saints receives Vikings #5 overall and #29 overall this year, and the 1st round pick next year for Saints' 3rd round pick this year in the Foster/Smith/Stallworth for K.Jones deal.
*8/12/05 KC gets Oakland's 1st, 3rd, and 5th round picks for KC's 2nd, 3rd, and 4th in the Delhomme/Mason deal.
*8/13/05 Denver gets 4.01 from Oakland for Denver's 4.22 in the Moore/Taylor deal.
*8/15/05 Denver gets 2.05 for Toral's 2.22 in the Wilkins/Hall deal
*8/15/05 Texans get Ram's 4.17 and 5.17 and Rams get Texan's 4.13 and 5.13 in the Boston/Brown deal.
*8/26/05 Skinneej trades pick 3.12 for TB's pick 4.08 in this year's draft and his 2nd rounder next season (see 2006).
*THK gets my (rfs) 4.21 this year (2005). I (rfs) get his (thk's) 4.xx NEXT year in 2006. (see 2006)

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Subject: G24 Preseason Discussion