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Subject: Survivor Season 14 - Fiji

Posted by: JeffG - [146591911] Thu, Jan 25, 2007, 12:12

Official CBS Survivor Fiji site

Probst talks about season 14 Fiji

Here are the basics:

- 19 contestants (one dropped out he night before filming began). Changed CBS plan where one episode where they hoped to have 2 people voted off. Also forced tribes to start off uneven.

- Everyone works together to build a luxury camp from blueprints and supplies provided. Then one person is chosen to divide tribes, who then compete for the luxury site.

- Other camp is a bare bones area where they have to work and scrape to get by.

- 2 hidden immunity idols, but to use it, it must be played before votes are read.

Season starts 2/8/2007.

Bond, James Bond
ID: 35011317
Thu, Feb 01, 2007, 00:37

Looking forward to this latest edition of Survivor. They certainly need to do something different with the Immunity Idol IMHO. One season, Terry didn't use at all; the next it was just used as a pawn to get nobody to vote against Yul even though it would have been in everybody's interest to get the Idol out of Yul's hand ASAP.

Does anybody know if Survivor will have all seasons on DVD anytime soon? Definitely would like to buy all of them.

boikin
ID: 59831214
Fri, Feb 02, 2007, 11:58

i wonder why the 20th person dropped before filming even started. i am not sure what influence the new idols will have since they have to be played before the vote is made, i guess it is better to have it than not have it but i would not be surprised it they never get used becuase they get voted off when they least expected or wasted when they where not going to get voted off anyways.

katietx
ID: 3810431417
Fri, Feb 02, 2007, 15:32

If you read the second link in Jeff's original post, that will give you the info on why she quit.

JeffG
ID: 146591911
Fri, Mar 09, 2007, 15:45

Not alot of Survivor conversation yet. Pretty slow start IMO this season. I'm pretty sure the 'haves' and 'have nots' idea is the reason 1 tribe won all their challenges so far and put the others at a disadvantage, but I do not think it really added value to the early story lines. No real stand out personalities, except for Yau-Man and Rocky we are 5 episodes in and I can not really tell one other survivor from the next wihout their name on the screen. So far the immunity idol has not come into play which is good because it was too big a factor in prior seasons.

Looks like they are shuffling tribes next episode.

GoatLocker
Sustainer
ID: 060151121
Fri, Mar 09, 2007, 16:20

Rocky is an ex Second Class Petty Officer in the Navy.
My Son-in-Law was stationed with him and says he really is that big of a jerk.
Has nothing at all good to say about him.

Agreed with the fact that this thing is slow and going no where quick.

Guess we'll see what happens next week.
They sure do need to shake things up.

Cliff

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Sat, Mar 10, 2007, 15:37

They need to do away with exile island. It was neat for a season or two but now it's really pointless. Also, it really puts a huge disadvantage on whoever goes there early in the season.

The luxury tribe isn't very likable. Edgardo and Alex are the only two that seem to have a clue what they are doing.

Earl and Yao Man definitely seemed to be the most leveled headed survivors on the other tribe. Last episodes editing definitely seemed to point towards these two going far.

I hate how the have not tribe was left high and dry. They were given a huge disadvantage and never really given the chance to improve it. I think the winner of each immunity challenge should've went back to the luxury campsite. Granted, they never won a challenge but it would've at least given them a little more incentive at each challenge.

Skidazl
ID: 189142212
Sun, Mar 11, 2007, 14:11

I thought the same thing BMD, but since they never did win a challenge, we never found out if that is what the show had planned.

I really am enjoying the season the least of them so far this year because of the huge disadvantage the one team has.

C1-NRB
ID: 17348117
Sun, Mar 11, 2007, 14:32

This "underdog" scenario has happened before. In Palau, Bobby Jon and Stephanie's tribe couldn't win squat, either. (They did snag a couple of rewards, but never gained immunity.) Stephanie then went 2 deep after the "merge," such as it was, before being voted off.

Way, way back there (Season 4, I think) the tribe that was up by 3 threw an immunity challenge to get rid of the tribe annoyance. They went on a losing streak from that point and didn't recover, even after the merge. I think Alex and Edgardo remember that and don't want it to happen again.

My oldest kid said, "I don't say this to be mean, but I hate Moto."

Skidazl
ID: 189142212
Sun, Mar 11, 2007, 22:28

I agree the underdog thing has happened before, but never has the show put one team at such an unfair disadvantage. It really makes it not much fun to watch. I used to really look forward to Thursday night TV, but not this season so far.

I'm glad they are mixing things up next week....

threespleens
Leader
ID: 00795541
Mon, Mar 12, 2007, 11:16

i hope everyone enjoyed lisi taking a faceplant

with all the food she's bragging about eating, gravity must be having some extra effect on her

highlight of the (terrible) season

ChicagoTRS
ID: 4110481415
Mon, Mar 12, 2007, 14:05

I agree with everyone...least interesting survivor to date. Just too many variable this year...two immunity idols...use them before the vote...rich/poor tribe...I am not really feeling this season yet...who knows...could change.

I think we are ready for another all-star cast.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Thu, Apr 19, 2007, 22:15

Best Tribal Council I think I have ever seen. Its a shame people arent watching this show like they used to. I dont remember a crazier tribal council where everyone thought they were pulling the wool over everyone else's eyes. Classic.

Bond, James Bond
Donor
ID: 04352469
Thu, Apr 19, 2007, 23:23

Absolutely one of the best strategic moments in any of the Survivors of late. I loved how they made Alex waste the immunity idol..and then for him NOT to get a single vote. LOL

Species
Dude
ID: 07724916
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 01:18

Yeah, that was pretty cool. EVERYBODY with a smirk on their face...only to have everyone but Earl/Yao/Cassandra/Stacy with the last laugh.

Dreams is such a loose cannon though.....I wonder how he reacts to being kept in the dark on that last little swerve of theirs.

Weykool
Leader
ID: 41750315
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 09:47

I have to agree.
One of the best survivor moments of all-time.
You had the one group smirking and then to see the expressions on thier faces when Edgardo gets all the votes......Classic.
Dreamz is pretty much toast as far as winning anything.
Just a matter if someone can keep him in the game for the fianls.
It looks like there will be another 3-player final again.

WiddleAvi
ID: 910351314
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 15:35

One of the best survivor moments of all time. But I am not so sure that Dreams screwed himself. Remember they told dreams that they are all voting for Mookie and never told him they changed. Dreams went ahead and voted for Mookie. Dreams definitly has issues but I think he still has time to sort himself out. Alex, Mookie, & Boo are probably the next 3 gone. That does give dreams a little time. After those 3 it would probably come down to Dreams or Stacy. What remains to be seen is who will re-find the immunity idol.

katietx
ID: 323472012
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 17:09

Would kinda hate to see Boo go - he's the easiest to look at. ;-)

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 17:37

I agree with Widdle, I cant see Dreamz in any sort of trouble over the next few. He wasnt trusted by Earl and Yau Mans faction, now he proves he can be trusted. Not only did he tell them Mookie had the idol, but he passed it off to Alex and to vote Mookie and then he voted Mookie. Alex and Mookie still need dreamz if they want any chance to move forward.

Dreamz has actually played the game with great instincts, I just dont think he is thinking ahead much. But voting off Michelle was a great move for him as Earl and Yau and Cassandra then needed him. He proved himself valuable and that should save him for the time being.

That being said i cant see him getting to final 3 since he is on the outside of both alliances. If he can pull cassandra and stacy away from Earl and Yau Man at 5 would be his only chance, but because Dreamz has been so unreliable I cant see either of them defecting to Dreamz. He will probably need a few immunity wins at the end to save him. And even then he will lose because he already has too many enemies on the jury.

Species
Dude
ID: 07724916
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 18:08

I don't think he thinks ahead AT ALL. He's too off the cuff with everything, and doesn't keep his mouth shut. While admittedly he did fool "The Four Horseman" (who should have realized he would be more loyal to Cassandra) I just don't think he's a very skillful player.

KnicksFan
ID: 551391816
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 18:25

I hope Yau Man wins, he's probably my favorite survivor ever.

Bond, James Bond
Donor
ID: 04352469
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 23:05

Ever???? That's huge KnicksFan! Granted, Yau Man has been a major surprise at nearly every challenge but for him to be someone's favorite of all of the Survivors???? Unreal!

Give me Rupert or Ozzie or even maybe as far back as fireman Tom.

But this does lead to an interesting question: Who is everybody's favorite Survivor EVER and why? Also, who is everybody's least favorite?

For the record, I couldn't stand Clay...and he ended up 2nd to Brian.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Fri, Apr 20, 2007, 23:13

only season i never watched was thailand. No one seemed worthwhile. Favorite ever is Rob Cesternino. He came to play and really made that season fun. Aside from Lex in season 3 and the big switch of power in season 4 there hadnt been much strategic play going on. Rob C really changed all that. Definitely the best.

And boy did I hate rupert. The guy felt he deserved the game without fighting for it. "im a great guy, i should win" And then when someone dared try to vote for him he starts crying and bullying. Ugh.

JeffG
Leader
ID: 01584348
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 00:08

No doubt this was the best TC in 14 seasons. With this one episode, a boring season is picking up. The only thing that can one-up this week is if someone finds Yao's decoy idol. May have saved the season.

My favorite Survivor ever?
Probably Stephanie (Palau) was a great competitor and total package. My fav among the winners are Brian H (Thialand) and Fireman Tom (Palau) because they had game plans and were able to carry them out to win and were never in danger, and each successfully carried patsies along for the ride. There were great 'characters' like Ruppert (Pearl Isl) and Cao Boi (Cook Islands) and Boston Rob (Marquesas) who was good for sound bytes. Cirie (Panama: Exile Isl) was great as an underdog worth rooting for, as is Yao Man (Fiji).

My fav from a Survivor-babe point of view is Dolly (Vanuatu) in a run away. With honorable mentions to Heidi & Jenna & Shawna (Amazon), Elizabeth (Outback), Colleen (Borneo), Pavarti (Cook Islands), and the aformentioned Stephanie. Amber (Outback) would be on this list but loses points for hooking up with Boston Rob. Danni (Guatamala) gets points for ID'ing Hogaboom.

Least fav: Fairplay (Pearl Islands) although he was memorable, Shane (Panama) was scary, Kimmie (Outback) and Clay (Tailand) were both very irritating, Dr Sean (Borneo) bothered me because of his cluelessness, Jerri (Outback) was annoying.

BTW, Survivor 15 will be in China.

ChicagoTRS
ID: 249542719
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 02:02

I loved Johnny Fairplay...just because of the pure evil of some of his moves...pure entertainment...the "your grandma died" play is so classic.

Stephanie was another fav...just because she was so dominant physically.

Boston Rob...another player. Richard Hatch...first real player. Rudy the Navy Seal...no one more real.

I love players who will mix it up and play "dirty"...even though personally I do not think anything truly is dirty.

Players I hate...Rupert...lovable idiot. Host of others...anyone who goes on the game and uses it as a pulpit that somehow they are righteous and pure good and manage to relate the game to real life. It is just a game! Play it!

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 02:48

My favs include: Fairplay, Shane, Colleen, Rob C, Big Tom, Earl, Twila, Kathy, and Jeff from Season 2. I'm warming up to Dreamz as this season wouldn't be nearly as entertaining without him.

Least favs: That chic from Boston that lost to Aras, Lill, Lex(I liked him before all stars), Rupert, and Stacy from this season.

Favorite lookers: Colleen, Elizabeth, and Dolly.

katietx
ID: 323472012
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 10:22

I thought Terry (the pilot) was pretty hot. ;-)

Weykool
Leader
ID: 41750315
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 11:39

Favorite was stephanie.
Good looks, great personality.
She never gave up and made the best out of a bad situation.

Least fave was Fairplay.
Have no clue why someone would like him.
You lie about your gradma dying?.....for what?
To spend a romantic night with a buddie from H.S.?
If it had been for something important like getting further in the game, then I could see giving him props.
But just to be able to drink beers and swap spit with a buddy while keeping other players from spending time with a loved one is about a low as it gets.

KnicksFan
ID: 551391816
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 14:13

42% like Yau Man the best for this season.

Survivor Popularity Poll Results

Boxman
ID: 571114225
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 14:23

My favorite Survivor is Johnny Fairplay, what a classic heel. I want him back on the next All Stars.

Honorable mentions are Rudy, Rob (not the tool that married Amber, the other guy that gawked at Heidi the whole time) and Tom the fireman.

Skidazl
ID: 189142212
Sat, Apr 21, 2007, 17:42

re 28

lisi being the least liked is no surprise to me..

threespleens
Leader
ID: 00795541
Sun, Apr 22, 2007, 13:19

don't think i've seen a smile disappear as fast as ed's after just the first vote.

fav: ozzie
least fav: billy
babe: elizabeth

threespleens
Leader
ID: 00795541
Sun, Apr 22, 2007, 14:11

i had to watch the last part again just so i got it all.

"this is brilliant!" -alex

hahaha

C1-NRB
ID: 17348117
Sun, Apr 22, 2007, 22:04

I just got a chance to watch the tape. The whole family was laughing and high-fiving when they flipped on Dreamz.

That whole tribal council was one for the ages. Did anyone catch that the idol would be re-hidden with a new set of clues? That could mix things up.

The only thing that can one-up this week is if someone finds Yao's decoy idol.
They showed the Three Horsemen rooting through Yau-Man's stuff and finding the real thing. No one has any reason to look for his fake one and even if they did, it's SOOOO obviously fake now that they know what the real thing looks like.

They need to do a All-Heel All Stars. That would be great- Jeri, Clay, Johnny Fairplay, Sue, Shane, etc. I'd throw Dreamz in there just because he so flip-floppy/ can't be trusted.

My favorites include Big Tom, Rupert, Brian (Thailand), Rob C, Yau-Man, and Christy (Amazon, called Heidi and Jenna her "wicked step-sisters").

Least favorites would be Neleh (who?), Janu (quitter, but the inspiration for Exile Island), Shii Ann, and Boston Rob.

Trip
Leader
ID: 13961611
Wed, Apr 25, 2007, 09:29

Way behind on the Tivo, saw this thread keep getting bumped and watched it. I have to agree, that was the best tribal council ever, this season just unjumped the shark. The look on Edgardo's face was priceless, I rewound it three times and couldn't quit laughing. They made the right decision, as it was obvious from the last tribal council that Dreamz was a wildcard. Perfectly played by the "good" alliance. I almost expected Mookie to play the idol, as Dreamz had already told them who they were voting off previously.

Alex and Mookie reached a new low when they went through Yau-man's stuff. They now have no shot whatsoever.

ChicagoTRS
ID: 249542719
Thu, Apr 26, 2007, 20:39

wow these guys need a primer in battleship...don't blow up your own square...duh?

J
Leader
ID: 049346417
Thu, Apr 26, 2007, 23:37

Interesting that alex voted for mookie tonight...it probably saved him. Now he's gotta take advantage somehow.

Bond, James Bond
ID: 153222617
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 00:11

Alex was just saving his own skin for another week. He knew that it was down to either him or Mookie, so why not take a chance and figure "better him than me". At least he's playing the game...

Meanwhile, Mookie will go down in Survivor history as one of its biggest losers. Think about it....He sat in on all Tribal Councils but one, never won an individual immunity challenge, was a part of only one reward victory and never lived on the isle of luxury while it was still there. Also, he will be remembered for his unwise and faulty decision to look for the immunity idol in Yau-Man's bag. (Dude, if you're gonna look for it and actually find it, you might as well steal it and lie about it while hoping to cause dissension within the ranks.) ;)

Not sorry to see Mookie go. Here's hoping that Alex can survive another week while they finally rid themselves of Stacy. But then again, the final two (or three) would probably do themselves a favor if they kept her in the game as long as possible. Don't think anybody would vote for to win.

ChicagoTRS
ID: 249542719
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 01:12

I think Alex has a chance of surviving (though the immunity idol thing might have hurt him)...he has to get the six thinking ahead...he can be a key swing vote.

C1-NRB
ID: 5932328
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 09:34

Alex seems smart enough to do just that, too. That was a smooth move he pulled on Mookie.

Remember Chris and the Amazon Women? He was dead in the water until they all started back-stabbing each other, thereby gift wrapping the whole thing for him.

katietx
ID: 323472012
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 09:35

Thot it was pretty strange when Mookie said "I'm glad to be out of the game," or something similar.

Weykool
Leader
ID: 41750315
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 09:57

Mookie and Alex should rename themselves Dumb and Dumber.
What did they think the would gain by going to Yao-man and confessing to going through his personal belongings.
Seems to me going through other peoples things should be against the rules.
Dreamz excuse was pretty lame as well.
"Sure I wrote your name down.....but I didnt betray the alliance."

boikin
ID: 59831214
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 12:25

Dreamz has to be the lamest competitor ever, with that said trusting him with the knowllege the idol was a complete mistake they guy is so flaky it is amazing he is made it this far. I am not sure why everyone is so up in arms about mookie and alex going through Yau's stuff. seems pretty fair to me if they should make a rule that you can not go through others stuff then you should make a rule that you are not allowed to lie. I acctually like mookie not sure why, though i can totally understand him wanted to be gone i mean there is no reason to be suffering on the island if you got no chance of winning when you could be enjoying your self luxury resort waiting for the show to end.

Species
Dude
ID: 07724916
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 13:18

Dreamz does not get the big picture and is not very strategic. I do give him credit for duping the "Four Horseman" and giving that mission critical info (Mookie with the Idol, giving it to Alex) to the Earl/Yao clan......but outside of that I think he's pretty lame.

Jeff Probst of course put the thought in everyone's mind at Tribal: "I see a strong group of 6...and Alex......which makes him (Alex) pretty valuable"

Alex' obvious move is to find out which sets of 3 are together, and lobby one set of 3 to join them to get a 4 to 3 majority and "guarantee" themselves a spot in the final 4.

If I were him I'd look at Boo and Stacy as part of his original tribe and see if they have 1 more person they can bring over to a new majority. Problem is, Earl and Yao are rock-tight and I think Cassandra is with Earl as well....so you either try to bring Dreamz (which is frought with danger) or you try to cuddle up to Earl/Yao/Cassandra.

boikin
ID: 59831214
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 13:26

Jeff Probst of course put the thought in everyone's mind at Tribal: "I see a strong group of 6...and Alex......which makes him (Alex) pretty valuable"

i like how he does that to try help the game allong know that no wants to watch a show with out drama. i think in general the show tries to break up alliances as strong alliances cuase for weaker audiences. they have to love dreamz he is like a total wild card has no stratagy will do whatever takes the pressure off him at a given time. they must be some how helping him to stay on the show.

JeffG
Leader
ID: 01584348
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 13:57

I did not think much of Alex before this last episode, but he was smart in writing Mookie's name down and trying to shake the alliance of 6 for cracks. You can consider that another of many mistakes Mookie made in the game in not picking up that he may help his cause by putting Alex's name down.

The strategic move for any of the members of the six now would be to get Alex to vote along with them right away. Try to get him on board before the immunity challenge just in case Alex wins or in case someone else gets to him first. If they vote him off next, they'd have to worry about a 3 against 3 situation the following week.

Dreamz is too much of a variable to trust. But I think Yau and Earl and Cassandra have him in their pocket and as Species says seem to be the tightest trio right now.

Another variable that usually effects late tribals as the number diminishes...everyone left in camp has to start thinking if Yau is among the finalists he will win the majority vote. I think everone also has tosee Dreamz as someone they want to go to the finals with. That could play out the next few episodes.

BTW, they really did not do much with the new immunity idol clue. "It is not somewhere hard". Perhaps in soft ground like the beach.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 15:24

I thought what alex and mookie did was totally legit. They are not allowed to steal the idol so at least they knew he had it and tried to shake things up.

I dont know why everyone thinks dreamz is so dumb. He has kept Lisi over Rocky despite hating Lisi for strategic purposes. He took out Michelle over Stacy because he realized during Tribal Council that Michelle didnt know him so why should he keep her in the game. Voting out Michelle was his in to Earl's alliance while still showing Alex and Edgardo that he was loyal.

He backstabbed at the best opportunity as he knew he was a 4th wheel in the 4 horsemen and turned spy and looked even more trustworthy when he gave them good info and voted for Mookie.

He has put himself in a solid position. If he makes one more jump to Alex, and he will only do it if it makes sense he could be in front of a jury playing the best strategic game of all these players. The guy may not be eloquent and has a deer in the headlights look sometimes but even if he is not planning ahead, he has made all the right decisions so far.

Trip
Leader
ID: 13961611
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 15:43

Sinking your own ship in Battleship = Dumb

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 15:58

Mookie talked a big game but when it came down to playing he was horrible. Vowing to take out Cassandra because she sent him to exile was pretty ridiculous. Also, him telling Dreamz about the idol ultimately led to the destruction of their alliance. If he wouldn't have done that I think Dreamz would've stuck with them.

Earl has played the game flawlessly so far but he's relying on Dreamz not to jump ship. He's also going to run into the problem of being the guy that nobody can win against.

I can't wait til Stacy is gone. Her line about Mookie and Alex might not get fed was pretty disgusting.

KnicksFan
ID: 551391816
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 21:09

Stacy is such a despicable person. She and Lisi early in the season wouldn't even talk to Dreams and Cassandra, treating them in a sub-human way. Then once they became part of her alliance she's nice to them and instead gave the same treatment to Mookie and Alex.

Okay, lets say the final three includes Yau Man and Earl...who wins? Who would you vote for?

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Fri, Apr 27, 2007, 23:56

I think Earl wins easily. Yao man is fun to root for but I don't think he'll get the young guy vote, Mookie, Alex, Edgardo, or Rocky.

C1-NRB
ID: 5932328
Mon, Apr 30, 2007, 10:48

I think Alex respects YauMan's play. I could see him voting for him. He could probably get Edgardo's vote, too.
Earl might be seen as too much of a manipulator. Some people resent that, but it's built into the game design.

WiddleAvi
ID: 25102616
Fri, May 04, 2007, 09:43

I was surprised by the strategy that Alex used. It is pretty obvious that Yau, Cassandra and Earl are the tightest. So he tries to break that up. Does it not make a lot more sense to try and get Stacy, Boo, & Dreamz ?

ChicagoTRS
ID: 4110481415
Fri, May 04, 2007, 12:05

seemed like his strategy almost worked (or that could just be editing)...actually I do not think it is a bad idea to try to break up the strongest players...or the players you observe are really playing the game as they may actually think about future strategy and may consider alternatives...sometimes I think the dumb players are more worried about today and do not even consider future implications...one track minds...

best to probably attack it from multiple angles...you never know with this show...they could edit the program to only show a limited amount of what he did to try and turn the game in his favor...Alex could have tried to sway multiple people.

C1-NRB
ID: 5932328
Fri, May 04, 2007, 12:40

Alex played it right by "letting the game come to him." By being alone, whoever approached him must've been open to what he had to say on some level, otherwise they wouldn't have sought him out. It's just too bad for him that it was a stronger (alliance-wise) player that came to him.

I believe there is a lot of editing that goes into shows like Survivor.

For example: The whole point of the tower on Exile Island is to get away from the snakes, yet there's always a cut-away to a snake in the tower. You never do see an exile and a snake in the tower in the same shot, though. I think production techs wrangle snakes into the tower to shoot stock footage and then take them back down.

The same is true for the conversation edits. A million different discussions can take place but we only get to see what the producers put in to "keep it interesting." It wouldn't have been much of a Tribal Council if there wasn't a hint of doubt that the vote wouldn't go according to the plan (even though it almost always does.)

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Fri, May 04, 2007, 17:23

I agree with Widdle Avi. As soon as people started talking about Boo, instead of piling on I probably wouldve went right to Boo and said if I win immunity you're gone. Maybe we should make a final 2 pact. Follow that with telling stacey that she is unliked, tell dreamz if he comes over he is guaranteed final 3 and you have the majority. stacey has proven she will sell her vote as long as it isnt her as will Dreamz. Going to Cassandra is a much harder sell as she would be seen as the traitor and if she ever made it to final 3 or 2 she wouldnt get a vote. I dont think lying in the weeds and being a ninja was the way to go. Take 4 outcasts and you beat a 3 person coalition every time.

WiddleAvi
ID: 25102616
Fri, May 04, 2007, 17:54

It's pretty obvious that Dreamz, Boo, & Stacey are on the outside looking in of the alliance. It should not have been that hard to convince those 3 that if they join Alex they are the final 4. If they stay with Earl, Yau etc then only one of them make the final 4.

You are playing for a million bucks. You can stay on the side and wait for someone to come to you or you can be aggressive. And it really should not have been that hard of a sell.

Yes, you can try and break up Cassandra, Earl, & Yau but thats a tough sell. Getting the 3 outcasts to join you should not be a hard sell.

Skidazl
ID: 189142212
Fri, May 04, 2007, 21:55

Totally agree. But have the surviviors ever done what we think the best strategy is? Ususlly not, remember they don't see most of what we see. As C1 pointed out, there is a lot of editing involved.

Especially with casting doubt when the vote is so obvious.

weykool
ID: 34350285
Fri, May 04, 2007, 22:20

I agree with skidazl.
The veiwers have the entire picture (at least the picture the producers want you to see).
Alex may not have known how strong the alliance of 3 was so he took his best shot with what cards he had to play.
Also when the producers start focusing on the "alternative plan" (voting out Yau) you can bet the farm on the "original plan".

One thing that hasnt been discussed was the decision last week by the alliance of 3 to split their votes.
Dreamz could have gone to Boo and talked him into voting with Mookie/Alex and blind-sided the alliance.
And why did they split the vote?....out of fear that Mookie/Alex "stumbled" on the immunity idol without the benefit of a clue.
Just a silly move if you ask me.

C1-NRB
ID: 17348117
Fri, May 04, 2007, 22:58

I didn't have a problem with them splitting the vote. By doing so, they all had plausible deniability to whomever ended up leaving, "It was split. Half of us voted for you, but you can't 'prove' who it was." Even the way it ended up, Alex had no clue who put his name down and Mookie knows Alex did. The thing Alex had going for him was he would've received Mookie's million dollar vote, regardless.

Dreamz is a follower- he wouldn't have taken the initiative to go to Boo.

Boo has been a relatively quiet player so far in my opinion. I was surprised he went all yappy on the reward trip. I think most of them don't like him because he's a little standoff-ish. He'll go as soon as he doesn't have immunity.

The Earl, Yau, Cassandra triumvirate will crumble at the four-player mark because the best thing two of them could do will be to keep either Stacy or Dreamz in the final three because neither of those two would get a vote. I think a final three of EYC would split the vote. Question is, which of the two will drop the other one? It's a complete toss-up at this point.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Sat, May 05, 2007, 16:09

Re 58: This is what alex shouldve known, with or without editing. Dreamz told him if he won immunity Boo was gone. He was told flat out that Boo was annoying. He knew through the popularity challenge that stacy is seen as most annoying and no one likes, (or at least least liked). He knows Dreamz has to be on the outskirts of the alliance since he was a horseman and only recently joined the majority alliance. That alone shouldve told him who to hook up with to vote out someone else.

Re 59: I havent seen dreamz as a follower. There is no reason for dreamz to back alex if there is no majority. Im sure what editing didnt show was Cassandra telling Dreamz that she wasnt going with Alex's plan. What can Dreamz do at that point but to stick with the alliance. If Dreamz was a follower he wouldve stuck with the original alliance of the haves or at worst stuck with the 4 horsemen. He has sensed when he was in trouble and made the necessary moves to the point where he is looking at final 4 with someone having his back (Cassandra).

Regarding the split vote, I too thought it was a bad move. It opens them up for a chance for just 1 person to switch it up. That is overconfidence and usually comes back to bite them, this one didnt. But all it wouldve taken was Dreamz to go back to Mookie and Alex and suddenly Yau is tied with Mookie for votes and who knows how a tiebreaker works.

Bond, James Bond
ID: 4454718
Fri, May 11, 2007, 01:10

Yau-Man...WTF???? ;)

Giving away a brand new 2008 Ford truck just so Dreams MIGHT grant you immunity IF he wins it in the final four??? What have you been smoking in Fiji my man?

Of course this whole scenerio almost blew up in his face when he had to use his "hidden" immunity idol to save his skinny arse. LOL

Now we're down to five:
Yau-Man
Earl
Cassandra
Dreams
Boo

Has there ever been such a disheartening group of five? Let me go on record and state that I hope NONE of them win the million dollars. ;) Here's why?

Yau-Man: Gives off a likeability factor but down inside he's a heartless schemer.

Earl: Too damn bossy for my taste. And smug!

Cassandra: Talk about riding someone's coattails.

Dreams: How in the world did he last this long with all his backstabbing?

Boo: Ok, I hope he wins. He's a solid competitor; is pretty savvy in strategy and has recovered nicely from almost severing part of his body. Of course, he's probably got too many enemies on the jury so............

Who's the favorite? If Yau-man is in the final three, it'd seem that most would favor him. Cassandra hasn't really offended anyone but hasn't really done anything either. Earl is seen as the Big Kahuna of the group but the Four Horseman are sure to NOT vote for him. Dreams???
I get the feeling that he's been way to wishy washy for some people but that may work to his advantage since some might believe he needs the million dollars more than any of the others. Boo is not favored by any stretch of the imagination and I can't see him garnering too many votes from the jury.

So, to recap: I think if Yau-Man is in the Finals, he wins---handily. If he's not there and Dreams is, Dreams wins. Anybody but Earl please!!!

Species
Dude
ID: 07724916
Fri, May 11, 2007, 01:21

Gotta give props to Yao Man for sniffing out a rat. Don't these people have ANY clue at Tribal Council to NOT take Jeff's bait and give away their thoughts about the vote?!? Yao might have only *thought* he smelled a rat, but after Dreamz and Stacy's comments about Yao's immunity deal, I'm sure that was the final straw that forced him to play it.

Bond - what's wrong with Yao being a schemer? I think he's played a smart game, and certainly one of great integrity with his closest partner, Earl. He had NO real reason to give Earl that final clue.....unless there is something in the rules that says that 1 player can't hold more than 1 idol. I half expected Yao to go find it for himself, play the idols at both this vote and the next to guarantee himself a spot in the final 4. Then, if Dreamz was in there too - assuming Dreamz would stick to his word - he is guaranteed a spot in the Final 3.

Methinks Cassandra has some 'splainin to do!! Should be interested to see the reactions of Dreamz and Cassandra to the inquiries of Earl and Yao!

And if you're Boo - what's your next move? Obviously the other 4 are split - which 2 do you hook your wagon to? I'd assume Cassandra and Dreamz, figuring you'd have a hard time beating Yao and Earl.

While perhaps the characters themselves haven't been as entertaining or likable, but the strategy lately has been pretty sweet.....the huge swerves at Tribal (the Edgardo vote wiping the smiles off their faces, and now Yao's perfect idol play) have been the best.

JeffG
Leader
ID: 01584348
Fri, May 11, 2007, 09:43

Another very ineresting tribal council with Yao playing the idol and nulifying all votes with his name on it. Not a stellar season, but a few good tribals.

One thing Yao has going for him if he makes it to the final-3 is that he has always been strategic without being deceptive, and giving the car away could play in his favor. Historically, that is what jury seems to go for with final votes. He also 'gave' Earl the other hidden idol, again playing the nice guy angle. I also give him points for sniffing out that he was on the chopping block. That is what he has to bank on. Of course, the other players have to realize that sitting next to Yao as a finalist is not a good position to be in. If they can pull that off then giving away the car was a high price for Yao to pay. If so and if the final vote comes down to Dreams, Cassandra ane Earl, it becomes a crap-shoot. If Boo ends up in there and it is a 3-way final without Yao, then the other possibility is that the other 2 split some votes and Boo can depend on his base.

Earl now holds a big edge going into the Sunday finale with the other immunity idol in his pocket which must be played next TC, if he wins immunity, he can pass that off to whomever he wants. I am not so sure about the 2-2 split with Boo being safe as the swing man, I think Boo has to win immunity to survive. I was kind of surprised that Dreamz and Stacy were able to get Cassandra's vote. I disagree that Cassandra is riding any coat-tails. There have just been bigger targets each week.

As for Dreams, he can also be credited with playing a strategic game, and if he is in the finals, he could play the 'life changing' angle one more time time, and this time instead of getting a car handed to him like last night, walks away with $1M.

After a slow start, the show finally got interesting.

Balrog
Dude
ID: 02856618
Fri, May 11, 2007, 11:39

I think Earl will stick with Yau to the final three. He needs someone he trusts on his side, and the only one who hasn't screwed him in tribal is Yau. Also, if Yau leaves at the next tribal, Earl is probably next and won't make the final three without Yau's vote or immunity. Earl has to either take his chances against Yau on the final vote or not make the final three.

That being said, Earl can easily use the idol to get himself and Yau through to the final four.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Fri, May 11, 2007, 18:02

Dumb move by Yau. What did he have to gain by making that move? Yau was so sure he was untouchable at 6 could use the idol at 5 and thought he had a problem at 4, thinking Cassandra and Dreamz would team up and force a 2-2 tie against Earl and Yau or Earl joining Dreamz and Cassandra to vote him out. Did he forget there are 2 other people still playing? He basically isolated himself, solidified a new alliance (Cassandra, Boo, Dreamz) wasted his idol (without the deal he would not have been a target to Dreamz) and lost a truck. Had he not made this deal, stacey would be the target at 6, Boo at 5, (if not Dreamz) Yau uses his idol at 5 anyway.

But this deal Yau only made Dreamz realize he was the target at 4. This also gives dreamz no incentive to even try for immunity (assuming he keeps his word). Why would you try to win immunity for someone else who would in turn vote you out. Yau like many have totally underestimated Dreamz. Arrogance and overconfidence by Yau thinking this strategic manuever was not transparent was laughable. If the others are smart, they now team up on Yau and get him out, as Yau would probably win if he gets to final 3. Without an idol he now has to depend on Earl helping him out in the event he doesnt win immunity. Lets see if Earl learned anything from the Mookie-Alex-Edgardo vote out fiasco. If he did, he holds onto the idol for himself and all 4 vote out Yau. Earl is then in position to win the game no matter who he brings to the end.

Go Dreamz

threespleens
Leader
ID: 00795541
Sun, May 13, 2007, 06:42

nice touch by boo with the jack knife into the water after the challenge

ChicagoTRS
ID: 49147619
Sun, May 13, 2007, 21:23

Earl said WOOOHOOOO! when Dreamz did not keep his word...this should be the most one sided jury in the history of this game...Earl 9-0?

katietx
ID: 11430613
Sun, May 13, 2007, 22:52

this may have been the most boring season yet. *yawn*

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Sun, May 13, 2007, 23:05

wow katie, thats pretty harsh. Aside from the stupid concept of haves vs have nots i thought this was a very entertaining season. You had great characters, even if they werent liked (Rocky, Lisi) and liked (Yau-Man, Dreamz) you had hidden immunity idols being played 3 times, one of the best if not the best tribal council ever (edgardo being knocked off), a deal of truck for immunity that was reneged on. And overall pretty good strategy. What more did you want?

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Sun, May 13, 2007, 23:14

How awful were Alex and Lisi in TC. I expected it from Lisi, trying to humiliate dreamz by asking him how many 0s in a million and asking Cassandra about her shoes, but Alex just going off on cassandra. What was he even talking about...he said she used stacy until she was of no use to her anymore but Cassandra voted for Yau the night stacy went home. You would think as a lawyer with a few days to prepare one question, he would get his facts straight.

I did figure it would be a 9-0 vote for Earl but I am still surprised that no one tipped their cap to dreamz for outwitting basically all of them. Earl was so wishy washy at TC, saying how he played the game with integrity in his opening and then later saying he was manipulative every step of the way.

As for yau, how does he not, after dreamz won immunity at least tell him, if you give me immunity I will not vote for you. You may as well sweeten the deal for Dreamz since he wouldve beaten him anyway at the final vote. To do nothing, sealed his fate.

WiddleAvi
ID: 25102616
Sun, May 13, 2007, 23:28

Thank god I DVR'd the show. I had to fast forward through those stupid questions at the final tribal.

J
Leader
ID: 049346417
Mon, May 14, 2007, 00:05

Did anyone believe that Dreamz was "playing the game" when he accepted the deal? The way he was talking to the camera about showing his son about being a man of his word, I just never would've guessed that he would go back on the deal. I am also surprised Yau didn't tell Dreamz he wouldn't vote him out.

So who gets the 2nd place 100k prize?

a flaw in dreamz plan - did he really think he'd have a shot at winning after telling the 2nd biggest lie ever (behind Johnny Fairplay's not-so-dead grandmother)? Still surprised he kept that immunity. Poor Yau.

ChicagoTRS
ID: 4110481415
Mon, May 14, 2007, 09:32

I do not believe Dreamz ever had a clue as to what he was doing. If he had a clue he would have campaigned with Yau to keep him around if he gave him the immunity...that was really his only chance in the final three vote was to actually keep his word...to think he had any chance after backstabbing Yau. I am not a big fan of integrity in this game but he probably should have kept his word in this case as he was done either way. Earl should pay Dreamz as he won him a million. Was kind of to bad as I thought Yau did play a good game and was surprisingly adept at challenges for an old guy.

JeffG
Leader
ID: 01584348
Mon, May 14, 2007, 11:18

I don't care what Dreamz said, he flew the whole time by the seat of his pants. I do not think he was calculated at all. He may have been sincere when he made the deal and talked to the camera about teaching his son a lesson about keeping his word, but he flip flopped. The lesson is he has a $60K car to show for it. Once he went back on his word, he had to be fooling himself if he thought he'd get any votes for the million. He would have been better off not winning the final challenge. He should take those mirrors off the vehicle because I do not know how he can look at himself. But then again, he had it all rationalized.

Usually, I say don't these people know it is a game, especially during the big blustery speaches the jury feel they have to make at the final TC, so I do not think people should get so upset for being deceived, mislead, or hit with something they did not see coming. But somehow, I still was surprised that Dreamz went back on the deal. Maybe it is because these final episodes are filled with such epiphanies or self realization segments about the experience, what people learned about themselves, and how Survivor is such a life changing experience.

Yao knew he was a target because he would have won the mil under any final-2 or final-3 scenario and knew his end-game was to keep getting immunity. He really had his gameplan all mapped out. He had the hidden idol for the final-6 (which ended up saving him), was hoping Earl would hook him up final-5, and then hoped between him and Dreamz in the final challenge, he could get final-4. It turned out, they were the two remaining players in the final immunity challenge. Without the deal with Dreamz, he knew he had a target on his back and would have been voted out in the final-4 so the car was all it cost him.

I think Yao is a very up and up person, and no doubt a good guy, but I wonder what part of the editing this season went into increasing Yao's popularity and like-ablility to make the way he got screwed so much more dramatic for television.

tastethewaste
ID: 239161113
Mon, May 14, 2007, 11:34

I think yau said it best at the reunion show, Dreamz is brilliant but undisciplined. He had great instincts for the game. I definitely think as soon as he got the truck he was aiming for Yau so he wouldnt have to live up to his end of the bargain and once it was time for him to do it he knew he had to be a "snake" and reneg. Dreamz was in a no win situation. Dreamz could not alter the deal and tell yau he would give up immunity if he promised to vote someone else out. This really would not have helped Dreamz, he needed Yau out as that was his only chance to win. Yau wouldve just won 9-0 or 8-1.

You are right, he was done either way but he does get more prize money for finishing 2nd or 3rd as opposed to 4th.

The only shot dreamz had was to convince people he was smarter than perceived. He was not Verbal Kent but Kaizer Soze. A pretty tough sell to people who believed he didnt know how many 0s are in a million.

Species
Dude
ID: 07724916
Mon, May 14, 2007, 11:53

I feel the truth with Dreamz is somewhere in the middle. He was a lot smarter than I ever gave him credit for, but also half the time he was flying by the seat of his pants. Perhaps Yao said it well, saying that Dreamz IS indeed pretty smart, but he gets so jumbled - mostly in his haphazard ability to communicate - that he looks like he has no idea what he's doing.

Yao's a pretty cool dude. I was rooting for him. He played the best game and deserved to win. Out of the three that made it, Earl deserved the landslide victory.

Just goes to show you how important it is to find that relatively undeserving leech to bring with you to the final tribal.....and how absolutely critical that is to winning the game.

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Mon, May 14, 2007, 16:06

I thought Earl was more deserving of a victory than Yau. Yau was fun to root for but Earl controlled the alliance. If Earl wasn't there I doubt Yau would've gone as far as he did.

I can't believe all the flack that Dreamz received. Survivor is a game and giving the idol to Yau would be admitting defeat. Maybe he wasn't "playing" when he accepted the car but Yau put him on the spot. There's no way anybody in their right mind would turn down a truck when they don't have a vehicle.

Dreamz shot himself in the foot with his opening statement at tribal. He probably didn't have a shot since the jury was all sour grapes but he still should've emphasized his gameplay rather than his lifestory.

Also, do people on the jury not realize how dumb they sound when they berate the finalists?

KnicksFan
Sustainer
ID: 030815418
Mon, May 14, 2007, 16:24

Alex and Lisi were so condescending at the Tribal Council. It was sickening.

I am disappointed Yau didn't get the win, but Dreamz was in a tough position and had to do what he had to do. I guess the fact that he is still keeping the car makes it seem slimier than if it was just a simple Survivor betrayal.

beastiemiked
ID: 3101646
Mon, May 14, 2007, 19:47

I didn't see the reunion. Anything of worth in it? Are they doing the popularity contest for a car?

weykool
ID: 34350285
Tue, May 15, 2007, 10:14

I thought the season was pretty decent.
I was happy that Earl won, thought he played a good game.
The pontifications by the jury have always bothered me.
I call it the "No fair you stabbed me in the back before I could stab you in the back" episode.

I was really disappointed in Dreamz.
It is one thing to break an alliance because that is accepted as part of the game.
It just seems different to not keep your promise in this situation.
It would have been very easy for either Yau or Dreamz to propose that Dreamz give Yau the immunity idol and they both vote for Casandra and let their fate be decided by chance.

boikin
ID: 59831214
Tue, May 15, 2007, 14:29

i just read though a good chuck of the posts here today, i have been out of the country for a bit and just finished up watching all the missed episodes. First off i have to say i am glad dreamz sold out yao, i would have been unhappy with him winning. he seemed like just sat around camp while everyone else worked. He pretty much got where he was becuase of earl. I was also thinking about it and it seems that most surviors have 3 smiliar kind of people in the final 4 or 5. you allways get the leader (planner) , the under the radar supporter, and back stapper(dirty player). I still do not know what to make of dreamz.

I was reading through peoples posts on there favorite surviors and what not. i am not sure i really have a favorite surviore though the airforce guy was great winning every single immuity challenge but the last one. The Africa season was my favorite i was rewatching on OLN the other week and i was thinking this season is so great, it was so funny people acted so stupid at times it was great. they did allot of things that peopel would never do on later shows. I am not sure why it is not like by more survior fans maybe the the whole fact it is the only survior with out a water lacal. the first season was allso great just because it was so new at the time. i can still remeber reading about survior in time magazine and telling my cousin that it was going to be guaranteed hit.

JeffG
Leader
ID: 01584348
Tue, May 15, 2007, 15:46

I just realized - I believe this was the first season without the 'visit from a loved one' reward challenge (I'm counting Africa where they did it by Internet).

It could have had something to do with the political unrest and coup that took place in Fiji and maybe not wanting to have more people travel to the country in the midddle of it, but I thought that happened when the show was wrapping up. Perhaps they they just decided that idea was too played out and needed a season off.

tastethewaste
ID: 81492019
Tue, May 15, 2007, 17:31

i noticed that too, though they did have the 3 who won the reward challenge, Dreamz Boo and Yau receiving letters from home. Maybe none of these people had family members that love them, who knows.

As for the truck deal. Dreamz really had no choice but to accept the deal at that time. If he says yes he knows he is pretty much clear to final 4 and then may have to stay to his word. If he refuses, he loses all protection from his alliance. Why would Yau want him there if he is not willing to take a truck just to help Yau out at 4. To put Dreamz on the spot like that by dangling something that he wanted desperately in order to give up the game was such a bad move. I dont know how one can blame dreamz for doing what he did.

Beastie, you didnt miss much. Pretty much congrats Earl, Dreamz did you plan the truck thing from the start..."um, yeah, but no but yeah it was all planned but i had to change plans when plans didnt go my way, so i guess it was all planned." Rocky not being funny and picking on Anthony a little more. Lisi just being herself, stacys learned a lot. Sylvia has a new home building show somewhere, yau isnt upset at dreamz, alex really lawyered up at Tribal, Edgardo loves his family, Rita loves her kids, Erica wishes she spent more time, Jessica made a lot of friends, Michelle loves to smile, mookie shouldnt have told dreamz about the idol and Cassandra didnt say anything except mmmm hmmmm. mmmmm hmmmm.

Cassandra
ID: 551391816
Wed, May 16, 2007, 20:49

Mmmm hmmmmm. Vote for me because I was a good listener. Mmm hmmmmm.

Forum: gentPage 190Subject: Survivor Season 14 - Fiji

Forum: gent
Page 190
Subject: Survivor Season 14 - Fiji