Forum: pol
Page 2888
Subject: Marijuana Part II


  Posted by: Perm Dude - [313532323] Tue, Apr 24, 2007, 15:52

The earlier thread was getting too long.

Part of the difficulty in the marijuana debate, IMO, is the difficulty that many doctors have in dealing with patient pain. Here's the story of a doctor facing jail time for putting pain reduction above all else.
 
1Seattle Zen
ID: 46315247
Thu, May 10, 2007, 10:09
I read tons of "stupid stoner" stories and ignore them all, but this one is really, really funny.

Michigan cop is fired but not charged for pot brownies

Seems that this cop took home the cannabis from an arrest and had his wife bake it into brownies. They were so strong that he called 911 because he thought he was going to DIE!

"I think we're dying," he said. "We made brownies and I think we're dead, I really do."

Stupid, stupid cop, marijuana doesn't kill you. Back to mall security for you.
 
2Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Tue, Jun 26, 2007, 12:57
This was in an e-mail sent to me, I really enjoyed this letter.

NORML's open letter to Sen. Norm Coleman

Minnesota Senator Norm Coleman acknowledges on his website that he was a "campus organzizer in the '60s" when he attended Hofstra University in Hempstead, NY. His Wikipedia entry states: "He ran for student senate and opined in the school newspaper that his fellow students should vote for him because he knew that 'these conservative kids don't fučk or get high like we do... Everyone watch out, the 1950s' bobby-sox generation is about to take over.'" Several photos (reproduced here) show the then longhaired Coleman speaking through a bullhorn and unfurling an anti-war banner with other students.

Since that time, the Brooklyn, NY-born politician graduated from the University of Iowa Law School and stayed in the Midwest, where he worked as a prosecutor in Minnesota for 17 years before his two terms as mayor of St. Paul. In 1996, he switched parties - from Democrat to Republican - and in 1998 he lost the Minnesota governor's race to Jesse Ventura. In 2002, Coleman was elected senator by a 2% margin. He benefitted from the sudden death of the state's incumbant Paul Wellstone, who died in a plane crash 11 days before the election.

NORML board member Norm Kent, who is a lawyer as well, went to Hofstra with Coleman. Kent recently received a form letter from Coleman regarding his current anti-marijuana positiion. It reads, in part: "I oppose the legalization of marijuana because, as noted by the Office of National Drug Control Policy, marijuana can have serious adverse health affects on individuals. The health problems that may occur from this highly addictive drug include short-term memory loss, anxiety, respiratory illness and a risk of lung cancer that far exceeds that of tobacco products. It would also make our transportation, schools and workplaces, just as examples, more dangerous."

Offended by Coleman's comments, Kent fired of a letter to his former smoking buddy.

NORM KENT'S LETTER TO SEN. NORM COLEMAN
Dear Mr. Coleman,

My friend Norman.

Years ago, in a lifetime far away, you did not oppose the legalization of marijuana. Years ago, in our dorm rooms at Hofstra University, you, me, Billy, your future brother-in-law, Ivan, Jonathan, Peter, Janet, Nancy and a wealth of other students smoked dope.

Sure, we had to tape the doors shut, burn incense and open the windows, but we got high, and yet we grew up okay, without the help of the Office of National Drug Control Policy's advice.

We grew up to become lawyers. Our other friends, as you go down the list, are doctors, professors, parents, political consultants and professionals. No one ever got cancer from smoking pot or diabetes from using a joint. And the days of our youth we look back fondly upon as years where we stood up, were counted and made a difference, from Earth Day in 1970 to helping bring down a president and end a war in Southeast Asia a few years later.
We smoked pot when we took over Weller Hall to protest administrative abuses of students' rights. You smoked pot as you stood on the roof of the University Senate protesting faculty exclusivity. As the President of the Student Senate in 1969, you condemned the raid by Nassau County police on our dormitories, busting scores of students for pot possession.

You never said then that pot was dangerous. What was scary then, and is as frightening now, is when national leaders become voices of hypocrisy, harbingers of the status quo, and protect their own position instead of the public good. Welcome to the crowd of those who have become a likeness of which they despised. Welcome to the mindless myriad of legislators who gather in cocktail lounges to manhandle their martinis while passing laws against drunk driving.

We have seen more people die last year from spinach then pot. We have endured generations of drug addicts overdosing on a multitude of drugs, from heroin to crystal methamphetamine. In your public life, as an attorney general, mayor and United States senator, you have been in the forefront of speaking out against abuses which are harmful. You have been a noble and honorable public servant. How about not being such a dope on dope?

How about admitting that if the Rockefeller drug laws were applied to Norman Bruce Coleman on Long Island in 1968, or to me, or to our friends, and fellow students, you, I and others we knew and loved might just be getting out of jail now? How about recognizing that for too long too many have been wrongly arrested, unjustly prosecuted and illegally incarcerated for unconscionable periods of time?

How about recognizing that you have peers who have smoked pot for 25 years or more and they are successful record producers, businessmen and parents?

How about standing up and saying you have heard and witnessed countless stories of persons who have used pot medicinally, as I have, to endure the effects of chemotherapy?

You who have travelled to Africa and seen the face of AIDS so up close and personal would deny medicinal marijuana relief to those souls wasting away from malnutrition, nausea and no access to fundamental medicines?

How about not adopting the sad and sorry archaic path of our office of drug control, which this week suggested pot smokers are more likely to become gang members than others?
How about standing up and saying: "I, Norm Coleman, smoked pot in 1969." That "I am not a gang member, a drug addict or a criminal."

How about saying: "I was able to responsibly integrate my prior pot use into my life, and still succeed on my own merits."

How about standing up not only for who you are, but who you were?

How about it, Norm?

I will always love, admire and cherish what you have achieved and accomplished and the goals you have met. I will always fondly look at the remarkable success of your present.

How about you looking back at your past and saying: "What I did was not so wrong and not so bad and not so hurtful that generations of Americans should still, decades later, be going to jail for smoking pot - nearly one million arrests for possession last year."

Can't Norm Coleman come out of the closet in 2007 and say "These arrests are wrong - that there is a better way, and we need to find it."

You might find more integrity and honor in that then adopting the sad and sorry policy of our Office of National Drug Control Policy.

You might find the person you were.

Norm Kent
 
3walk
ID: 75112114
Tue, Jun 26, 2007, 14:07
Awesome. Too bad these two Norms, in the context of Norml, have grown to so far apart. Dang politicians and their need for $ (tobacco lobby) and fear of being branded "pro-drug/crime."

Getting high is so much fun, so much safer, and so non-addictive. What a joke.

SZ, if you have not yet seen "Knocked Up," it's a good one in relation to this topic. Be(e)n Stone(d) is the lead character's name.

- walk
 
4Tree
ID: 365172618
Tue, Jun 26, 2007, 21:41
Spiders on Drugs
 
5SeattleZen on Vashon
ID: 224141222
Tue, Jul 03, 2007, 14:00
New Mexico is now required by law to grow marijuana for its patients.

Under New Law, New Mexico Must Grow Its Own Medical Marijuana and Distribute It, Too

Interestingly, both stories have photos of friends of mine in Seattle who run MMJ dispensaries.
 
6Seattle Zen
ID: 86541617
Sat, Jul 21, 2007, 17:49


Sober North Dakotans Hope to Legalize Hemp
OSNABROCK, N.D. — David C. Monson seems an improbable soul to find at the leading edge of a national movement to legalize growing hemp, a plant that shares a species name, a genus type and, in many circles, a reputation, with marijuana.

David C. Monson, a farmer, high school principal and Republican state legislator in North Dakota, calls his effort to grow industrial hemp to be used in items like clothing and lotions “practical agriculture.”

As Mr. Monson rolls past his wheat, barley and shimmering yellow fields of canola, he listens to Rush Limbaugh in his tractor. When he is not farming, he is the high school principal in nearby Edinburg, population 252. When he is not teaching, he is a Republican representative in Bismarck, the state capital, where his party dominates both houses of the legislature and the governor is a Republican.

“Look at me — do I look shady?” Mr. Monson, 56, asked, as he stood in work boots and a ball cap in the rocky, black dirt that spans mile after mile of North Dakota’s nearly empty northern edge. “This is not any subversive thing like trying to legalize marijuana or whatever. This is just practical agriculture. We’re desperate for something that can make us some money.”

The Natives on the Pine Ridge Rez have been wanting to do this for years. It's time for the Congress to tell the DEA to back off and let farmers farm.
 
7holt
ID: 41512278
Sat, Jul 21, 2007, 18:24
LOL @ congress
 
8boikin
ID: 59831214
Fri, Jul 27, 2007, 16:04
new study on the dangers of pot. then again i am sure the same is probably true of caffine.
 
9holt
ID: 41512278
Fri, Jul 27, 2007, 21:35
that kind of study is ridiculous. perhaps people who are likely to develop some kind of psychoses are more likely to experiment with drugs and alcohol. does that mean the drugs and alcohol cause the psychoses? of course not.

my point of view is, regardless of supposed findings, it's up to the individual what they do with their own body. the U.S. wasn't designed to be a fascist state.
there is plenty of evidence that cars are dangerous but I don't see any outcry to outlaw those. what makes it ok for the feds to control private recreational activities?
 
10Seattle Zen
ID: 86541617
Fri, Jul 27, 2007, 22:58
I've been hearing a lot of "Reefer Madness" crap coming out of England this year and I fear that simple politics are behind it. There have been tons of news stories about "skunk", this "superweed" that causes criminals to go insane and wreak havoc upon society. The Conservatives are trying to create a groundswell of opposition to marijuana to get it reclassified with stiffer penalties.

In short, pure bunk.
 
11Pancho Villa
ID: 495272016
Fri, Jul 27, 2007, 23:21
this "superweed" that causes criminals to go insane and wreak havoc upon society.

Speaking of "superweed," when I lived on the Big Island I played with Holy Smoke and the Smokettes, the island grower's favorite band. We used to play at the Pahoa Inn in the heart of the Puna District. Now lots of people have heard of Maui Wowie and Kona Gold, but Puna Buddah is far and away the most potent pot grown in the islands.
One night on break, a local grower induced me to take a hit of his private stash - one hit. I can personally attest that after that hit I wreaked havoc on the world of saxophone playing due to a case of cottonmouth that was incureable as well as a complete memory loss as to what notes constitute an eight bar one, four, five blues scale.
I believe that was the last toke I ever took - circa 1981.
 
12holt
ID: 41512278
Sun, Jul 29, 2007, 05:42
hahahaa - there's definitely a broad range of potency. sometimes you have to wonder if the weed has been laced. there's really no way to know what you're getting unless you grow it yourself (an act that will land you prison/rape-land).
 
13Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Tue, Jul 31, 2007, 12:02
Will One Joint Really Make You Schizoid?
Watching the media cover marijuana is fascinating, offering deep insight into conventional wisdom, bias and failure to properly place science in context. The coverage of a new study claiming that marijuana increases the risk of later psychotic illnesses like schizophrenia by 40% displays many of these flaws.

What are the key questions reporters writing about such a study needs to ask? First, can the research prove causality? Most of the reporting here, to its credit, establishes at some point that it cannot,though you have to read pretty far down in some of it to understand this.

Second – and this is where virtually all of the coverage falls flat –, if marijuana produces what seems like such a large jump in risk for schizophrenia, have schizophrenia rates increased in line with marijuana use rates? A quick search of Medline shows that this is not the case-- in fact, as I noted here earlier, some experts think they may actually have fallen. Around the world, roughly 1% of the population has schizophrenia (and another 2% or so have other psychotic disorders), and this proportion doesn’t seem to change much. It is not correlated with population use rates of marijuana. By contrast, one study found that alcohol has been found to increase the risk of psychosis by 800% for men and 300% for women. Although this study was not a meta-analysis (which looks at multiple studies, as the marijuana research did), it certainly is worth citing to help readers get a sense of the magnitude of the risk in comparison with other drugs linked to psychosis.

Of course, if journalists wanted to do that, they would also cite researchers who disagree with the notion that marijuana poses a large risk of inducing psychosis at all, such as Oxford’s Leslie Iversen, author of one of the key texts on psychopharmacology, who told the Times of London that

“Despite a thorough review the authors admit that there is no conclusive evidence that cannabis use causes psychotic illness. Their prediction that 14 per cent of psychotic outcomes in young adults in the UK may be due to cannabis use is not supported by the fact that the incidence of schizophrenia has not shown any significant change in the past 30 years.”

Such comments don’t help the media stir up reefer madness, which they’ve been doing, quite successfully, for the last few decades. Perhaps covering the marijuana beat makes you crazy.
 
14boikin
ID: 59831214
Wed, Aug 01, 2007, 13:38
“Despite a thorough review the authors admit that there is no conclusive evidence that cannabis use causes psychotic illness. Their prediction that 14 per cent of psychotic outcomes in young adults in the UK may be due to cannabis use is not supported by the fact that the incidence of schizophrenia has not shown any significant change in the past 30 years.” this only means anything if drug use patterns have significantly change too.

holt makes some good pionts though it does not make the research ridicoulous just that it shows correlation not cause.
 
15Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Wed, Aug 15, 2007, 14:17
Medical marijuana user wins case against city of Merced
Judge Armando Rodriguez awarded Matthews, a medical marijuana user, $1,700 for pain and suffering stemming from an October 2006 incident when he was cited by Merced police for possessing $300 in marijuana.

Despite the decision, Matthews still faces more days ahead in court. A judge is scheduled to decide this Friday about whether to return Matthews' confiscated marijuana. Schecther said his marijuana has not been destroyed. Even though Matthews said his seized marijuana has probably lost much of its potency during the past 10 months it's been stored in a police locker, he said it would be a "double whammy" if the court returned it to him.

And he definitely wants his pot back: "I'll probably use it to cook or make some brownies."
 
16holt
ID: 41512278
Thu, Aug 16, 2007, 06:39
Schecther said his marijuana has not been destroyed.

nor has it been taken home by officers and smoked.
 
17holt
ID: 41512278
Thu, Aug 16, 2007, 06:48
Matthews was detained and cited by Merced police after he had been smoking marijuana inside the garage of his parents' Loughborough Drive home.

A bike patrol officer at the scene thought he smelled marijuana on Matthews... Matthews was then handcuffed...


What happened here? Was the garage right by a sidewalk, or maybe the garage door was open? How was Barney Fife so close to the guy that he smelled weed? You're not supposed to ride bikes on the sidewalk anyway. the cop should have been clear out in the street. just curious about the details here.
 
18Seattle Zen
ID: 86541617
Mon, Aug 27, 2007, 01:27


Sacramento News & Review: The Pot Issue.
Some may wonder why devote an entire issue to pot, why pull resources from our weekly exposure of Sacramento's baddies, and why run an entire issue now on a played-out topic that peaked with platform shoes and fros on white guys? Fair enough. Let's answer each: We are devoting an entire issue to pot because everyone on staff is stoned ... immaculate. As today's News, Opinion, Feature Stories, Scene&Heard and other sections reveal, the local baddies when it comes to cannabis are the feds, the schools, the governor, bad musicians and you—yes, you!—the voters who overwhelmingly passed our medical-marijuana law but have not demanded teeth be put into it. This issue did not die out when we tossed that old straw cowboy hat with the feathered roach clip attached to the band—it's still around big time, thus The Pot Issue.



Consider these factoids ‘munchies’
Sacramento searches for “marijuana” on the Web at an amazing rate. The most recent findings ranked Sacramento third in the world for “marijuana” searches—behind Honolulu (No. 2) and Portland. (No. 1). In the four years that Google’s been keeping stats, Sacramento has never been outside the top five.
Source: Google Trends

There are more than 200 nicknames for marijuana. Don’t just stick to pot, herb, grass, weed, Mary Jane and reefer. There’s always Aunt Mary, skunk, boom, gangster, kief, funk, bomb, chillums, tea or ganja. Then there are the “brand” names: sinsimilla, Kona, Texas tea, Indiana hay, Maui wowie, chiba chiba, Acapulco Gold and Panama Red. And don’t forget the tools and byproducts: Toklas (brownies made with pot or hash oil, named for Alice B. Toklas, lover of Gertrude Stein and chocolate-y goodness), hubbly bubbly or bong (water pipe), roach clips, pipes and stones. And everybody hates parkers and bogarts, don’t they?
Source: Office of National Drug Policy

Marijuana is the most frequently used drug in America. Almost half (47 percent) of adult Americans have smoked at least once, but only 5 percent are current users. Use is highest among teens and young adults; those aged 16 to 28 make up 60 percent of users.
Source: U.S. Department of Health and Human Services

While African-Americans make up only 13.6 percent of marijuana users, 26 percent of the people arrested for marijuana possession are black.
Source: U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency

Once again, the Golden State is tops in agriculture. The major source of American-grown marijuana, California provides one-third of the domestic dope and account for two-thirds of the pot crop that’s eradicated from national forests.
Source: U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency

The older you are, the harder it is to get: One-third of those between the ages of 13 and 17 reported that pot was difficult to find or buy, while 52 percent of users over 50 years old had a hard time finding or buying the stuff.
Source: U.S. Department of Health and Human Services

Most marijuana sales are made within a small group of acquaintances. Of 4.5 million pot sales in 2002, almost a quarter of them were made by users under the age of 17. The 24- to 34-year-old age group sold almost—but not quite—as much pot.
Source: U.S. Department of Health and Human Services

Yeah, it really is more potent: A comparative survey of the strength of seized marijuana over the past two decades found that the amount of THC present in pot has more than doubled. The average amount of THC in marijuana seized in 1973 was 1.73 percent; in 2004, it was 5.8 percent. The highest THC content ever seized was from an indoor hydroponic pot farm in Oregon in 1997: 33.12 percent. A tincture of cannabis (marijuana oil) can have a THC content as high as 40 percent. Such tinctures legally were sold over-the-counter in American drugstores until the 1930s.
Source: University of Mississippi Marijuana Potency Monitoring Project

Hemp seed is nutritious—it contains proteins and essential fatty acids. In some places, porridge similar in consistency to oatmeal is made of hemp seed. The seeds themselves do not include the psychoactive ingredient found in the leaves and buds, so a hearty breakfast of hemp-seed porridge won’t get you high. But it might work wonders for your cognitive abilities.
Source: National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws

Marijuana contains more than 400 chemicals, 66 of which are cannaboids (found in plants in the cannabis family). Marijuana contains no nicotine. It will not help you quit smoking cigarettes. But it will make you not care if you have a cigarette or not.
Source: National Academy of Science

According to weed lore, there are 800 strains of marijuana. With names like Skunk Passion, Afghanica, and Celtic Cross, varieties can be purchased from seed companies via the Internet, typically from companies located outside the U.S. Some strains grow better indoors than outdoors and vice versa, though outdoor growing carries a greater risk (interdiction, anyone?). Plus, growers need to be smart enough to weed out the male plants—if they pollinate the female plants, you get seeds instead of the happy-making leaves and buds.
Source: National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws

While it’s true that many police departments use “codes” in radio communications, “420” is not a police code referring to marijuana use. Neither is it a penal code related to marijuana—in California, penal code 420 deals with hindering access to property. April 20 (abbreviated 4/20) is Hitler’s birthday and the anniversary of the Columbine school shooting, but neither of those has anything to do with marijuana. However, for some strange reason, 420—both the number and the date—has become associated with smoking marijuana. Whether 4:20 is the perfect time to get high or not, April 20 has become a significant date in cannabis culture—so significant that it’s no longer secret.
Source: Office of National Drug Control Policy

Varieties of cannabis have been used since ancient times for medicinal, spiritual and recreational purposes. In this country, the first regulation of marijuana began in the early 1930s, and the first federal regulation was the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937. This law required the payment of a tax for the production, sale or use of marijuana for medicinal purposes. It did not make marijuana illegal, but did successfully make it expensive and inconvenient. In the early 1940s, marijuana was removed from the U.S. Pharmacopoeia, the official authority for standards for all prescription and over-the-counter medicines, probably as a result of publicity that claimed marijuana was addictive and caused psychosis. With the passage in 1970 of the Controlled Substances Act, which classified marijuana as a Class I Controlled Substance, marijuana legally was lumped with heroin and LSD as a drug with a high possibility of abuse and no legitimate medical use. And there it sits.
Source: National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws

Studies in San Francisco, Oakland and Los Angeles found that the No. 1 reason cited for the use of medical marijuana was to treat complications arising from HIV/AIDS. The second most-frequent use of medical marijuana was chronic pain. All HIV/AIDS users reported that marijuana use reduced nausea and vomiting. Roughly two-thirds of those surveyed who were using medical marijuana where men in their 40s. Most of those who were using marijuana medically had used it recreationally on prior occasions.
Source: National Academy of Science

Scientists have identified a withdrawal syndrome associated with THC, the active ingredient in marijuana—but it is described as “mild and subtle” compared to other withdrawal syndromes and it occurred only in long-term, heavy daily users. Still, the presence of a withdrawal syndrome, as well as the evidence that marijuana users develop tolerance to the effects of THC, means that it is addictive. Not as addictive as heroin or alcohol. Not even as addictive as cigarettes or coffee. But addictive, nonetheless.
Source: National Academy of Science

A 1999 review of the available research by the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Science found that there was evidence to support clinical studies in the use of marijuana to treat complications from HIV/AIDS (including wasting syndrome); as an analgesic and anti-vomiting treatment for cancer and other severe chronic-pain patients; and to treat some muscular and neurological disorders, such as multiple sclerosis. The review, published as Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base, also noted that the anti-anxiety and mood-elevating characteristics of marijuana could be beneficial for patients with these diseases. The report did not recommend use of marijuana for treatment of glaucoma because the relief of internal eye pressure was quite temporary and would require extremely high doses. In 2001, the American Medical Association also recommended “well-controlled studies of marijuana and related cannabinoids” as treatment for certain medical conditions and diseases. None of these suggested studies have been done.
Source: National Academy of Science

According to a 2005 economic study by Jeffrey A. Miron, a visiting professor at Harvard University, legalizing marijuana would save $7.7 billion per year in government-enforcement costs. It also would provide tax revenue of $6.2 billion per year if it were taxed at rates similar to alcohol and tobacco. Yep, that’s billions. In California, we’d save $22.1 million in law-enforcement expenses and gain $105 million in tax revenue (if the pot taxes were, like alcohol and tobacco taxes, distributed based on consumption).
Source: National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws

Ummm, you know all those people in prison for pot? Well, there aren’t that many of them. People incarcerated in state prisons for marijuana offenses only (which means for sale or transportation for sale, since possession isn’t usually a felony) account for .07 percent of the prison population. Those other marijuana offenders? They had other charges in addition to the weed charges.
Source: U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency

Law enforcement is seizing more marijuana than people are using! In 2000, law enforcement seizures totaled 2.7 million pounds o’ pot; estimated consumption of marijuana by U.S. users was 2.3 million pounds. In spite of these seizures, the average price of marijuana continues to decline from its all-time high in 1991. Prices for marijuana in 2002 were roughly the same (adjusted for inflation) as prices in 1983. Talk about a bargain!
Source: Office of National Drug Policy
 
19Seattle Zen
ID: 86541617
Thu, Sep 20, 2007, 14:30
Gov. Charlie Crist and the Florida Cabinet voted unanimously to grant Richard Paey a full pardon Thursday morning for his 2004 conviction on drug trafficking and possession charges.
Richard Paey is a chronic pain patient in year three of a 25-year mandatory-minimum sentence for trafficking in drugs -- his own pain medication.

But his freedom is just hours away.

"We aim to right a wrong and exercise compassion and to do it with grace," the governor said. "Congratulations ... and I state he should be released today."

What great news!
 
20Perm Dude
ID: 39858209
Thu, Sep 20, 2007, 14:32
Nice. Justice with compassion? Who would have thought it?
 
21Perm Dude
ID: 368192311
Mon, Sep 24, 2007, 12:32
Meanwhile, the Administration set a record for the fourth year in a row...
 
22Seattle Zen
ID: 86541617
Thu, Oct 04, 2007, 21:58
Now, this is a visit to the doctor I can get excited about!





Harvard Scientists Build a Device to Smoke Weed During Brain Scan
 
23Myboyjack
ID: 8216923
Thu, Oct 04, 2007, 22:18
Meanwhile, the Administration set a record for the fourth year in a row...


PD - Why would you lay the credit/blame for record MJ arrests solely with the "Administration." What does Bush have to do with whether a Boston cops busts someone for misdemeanor possession?

Pretty big stretch dontchathink?
 
24Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Oct 22, 2007, 12:53
Oregon likes cannabis and ballot initiatives.
Our ballots have carried more initiatives than any other state: 341 through last year, according to the Initiative and Referendum Institute.

And more than 1 in 8 Oregonians uses marijuana yearly, the federal government estimates, well above the 10.5 percent national average. Oregon ranks fifth in yearly marijuana use, third in use by adults older than 25. We also have one of the highest rates of people trying pot for the first time and lowest rates of residents who call monthly pot smoking very risky, the federal figures show.

This story is about a new marijuana initiative in Portland that doesn't seem to do much, but also about a very bold plan in the works for the 2010 ballot.

Other Oregon pot fanciers want to move way beyond removing penalties. They're aiming for a 2010 ballot measure to legally sell marijuana through Oregon liquor stores, taxing the sales for state revenue -- a law that, if passed, guarantees a war with the federal government.

That would be great.
 
25Myboyjack
ID: 369262211
Mon, Oct 22, 2007, 13:32
Zen - at some point your going to have to support a libertarian candidate in order to win the battle with the Feds and/or SCOTUS. The Democratic Party has never seens a federal power it would relinquish willingly.
 
26Perm Dude
ID: 55937226
Mon, Oct 22, 2007, 15:23
The Democratic Party has never seens a federal power it would relinquish willingly.

This is what scares me about Clinton. I don't think there is any doubt that she'll happily get fitted for purple robes.
 
27Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Oct 22, 2007, 18:30
Re 25

I'll vote Green long before I go Libertarian. Greens have a much better chance of winning, they are a softball-size hailstone in Hell to the Libs' ice cube.
 
28Myboyjack
ID: 8216923
Mon, Oct 22, 2007, 19:14
Better chance of winning what? A city council seat in Portland? Maybe. Nothing national though.

Anyway - I didn't capitalize libertarian on purpose. Your best shot will be a Republican/libertarian from out west or a southern Democrat/libertarian.
 
29Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Tue, Oct 23, 2007, 16:34
Marijuana patients caught in a cloud of confusion

This is an excellent article about the state of medical marijuana in Washington. It mentions Steve Sarich, who is the subject of MMJ dispensary raid I posted about in the first marijuana thread, post 337.
Of a half-dozen or so cannabis clubs in Washington, most are in Seattle because of that city's philosophy of tolerance, as expressed by Initiative 75, a measure approved by voters in 2003 that makes arresting and prosecuting individuals with less than 40 grams of marijuana the "lowest law enforcement priority."

One club in Seattle is Emerald Cross, managed by Sue Watson of Port Orchard. Watson said she wanted to locate the club in Kitsap County, but the county prosecutor's office told her the operation violated the one patient-one caregiver rule and therefore would not be welcome.

"In a co-op arrangement, where more than one patient is supplied, or a patient shares his or her 60-day supply, they are in violation of the statute," Kitsap County Prosecutor Russ Hauge confirmed in an interview.

Emerald Cross occupies the second floor of a nondescript office building in an industrial zone in the shadow of Interstate 5. About 900 people belong to the club, Watson said, all patients with doctor's notes. Staffers are patients who volunteer their time in return for medicine. The other members pay for their medicine by donation, Watson said, because selling medical marijuana is illegal.

All of these stupid rules over what is a 60-day supply, who can produce medicine for whom, how is someone supposed to get their medicine if they are too weak to grow their own, all these concerns would be gone the instant marijuana is legal for everyone.
 
30Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Wed, Nov 07, 2007, 12:27
Congratulations Denver!
More than half of Denver voters appeared to favor an initiative making marijuana the city's lowest law enforcement priority, according to early ballot returns. If the result holds, the mayor must now appoint a panel to monitor how marijuana cases are handled by the police and city prosecutors and issue a report. With most of the ballots counted Tuesday evening, 55 percent of the mail-in ballots supported the initiative and 45 percent were opposed.
 
31Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Thu, Nov 08, 2007, 12:44
NYPD arrest practices questioned again
Ferguson stepped out to get change for the bus. On her way back to work, by her account, she was stopped on Clarendon Road by three cops in plainclothes who jumped out of an unmarked car and accused her of smoking marijuana.

Ferguson said they must be mistaken. The officers - now joined by a number of others who responded to the scene - said otherwise. They searched her pockets. They even checked under her flip-flops.

Nothing.

Ferguson was let go. She went back to work, but 15 minutes later, police were banging on the door. Next they were searching her pocketbook.

Then, despite finding nothing of import, they were arresting her. Ferguson was processed at the 67th Precinct, spent the night in custody and was arraigned the next night on a charge of criminal possession of marijuana.

She's suing and I, for one, sure hopes she not only wins but blows the top off these lying ass holes!

In Ferguson's case, the charges against her will be dismissed if she stays out of trouble for a year. But, her attorney Meyerson said, the stigma of being arrested is difficult to shake because the police generally get the benefit of the doubt.

"Your response and your readers' response and the response of the people sitting in a jury box would be, 'They wouldn't make it up,'" Meyerson said. "Well, yeah, they would."
 
32Seattle Zen
ID: 529121611
Sat, Dec 08, 2007, 11:27


Got to get me one of these Marijuana Mansions they're talking about.
 
33Tosh
Leader
ID: 057721710
Sat, Dec 08, 2007, 13:28


It's the cheapest drug there is! LOL
 
34Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Tue, Dec 11, 2007, 18:02
The argument to reassign pot's drug classification
The United States is a nation governed by law at the federal, state and local levels. Sometimes these laws differ with each other. That's where the great principle of federalism comes in. Federalism permits state laws to be in conflict with each other, and even with the federal government. But that's OK. The sometimes messy business of federalism permits different locales to try different solutions to vexing problems, allowing the states to act as the "test tubes of democracy."

We see federalism in action most vividly today surrounding the controversy over medical marijuana. Ten states have either legalized cannabis for medicinal use or permit a medical purpose defense against prosecution. Their actions do not force other states to go along.

But federalism also means that the federal government can't be compelled to accede to the state's laws, either, and indeed, when federal and state laws conflict - as currently it does in states that have legalized medical marijuana - both federal and state laws may operate at the same time. Thus, the Supreme Court of the United States has twice ruled that the federal government is entitled to enforce its total ban against all marijuana possession and consumption where such use is statutorily authorized.

And that's exactly what the Drug Enforcement Administration and Department of Justice have done under Presidents Bill Clinton and Bush. People using and distributing marijuana for medicinal use have been prosecuted and convicted - even in states like California, where it is legal. The upset caused by federal law enforcement actions has made medical marijuana an issue in the current presidential campaign, with candidates increasingly being asked by reporters and medical marijuana activists whether they will promise to call off the DEA raids.

According to Granite Staters for Medical Marijuana ( www.granitestaters.com), most of the Democrats, including Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and John Edwards, have promised to call off the dogs. The leading Republican candidates, including Rudy Giuliani and Mitt Romney, have refused to so pledge, worrying, as John McCain put it in also rejecting the request, that marijuana is a "gateway drug." (Fred Thompson did not answer the question.)

This is a well written piece by an attorney and senior fellow at the Discovery Institute.

"So the time has come to put the presidential candidates on the hot seat. Merely asking whether they will halt the DEA raids allows them to expediently wiggle past the real issue, and indeed, seeks a promise from a future president to violate his or her oath of office by pledging not to enforce valid federal law.

What we really need to know is whether the next president will remove marijuana from Schedule I classification. That would help sick people, remove the issue of medicinal use from the broader debate over legalization, and bring the federal law in alignment with empirical realities."

Can I get an "Amen"?!
 
35Seattle Zen
ID: 529121611
Sun, Dec 16, 2007, 17:29
Sixth annual Oregon Medical Cannabis Awards: Oregon's medical pot gets high ratings
For the past month, 28 judges -- all medical marijuana cardholders -- have been sampling entries from Verstoppen and 12 other licensed Oregon growers. Judges rate each strain of marijuana, on a scale of 1 to 10, in six categories: appearance, aroma, smoothness, taste, potency and "medicinal effect," or how well it soothes what ails them.

I really wanted to get down to Portland for this, but had a family holiday celebration to attend. I consider Oregon's medical marijuana program a success. As the story pointed out, "As of October, 14,831 Oregonians were medical marijuana cardholders and 7,178 growers, called caregivers, were approved to supply them". That's over 20,000 people who have legal protection.
 
36holt
ID: 129202215
Mon, Dec 17, 2007, 04:13
how do you become a caregiver?
 
37Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Dec 17, 2007, 18:55
how do you become a caregiver?

Just follow these simple rules :)

Public Health Rule 333-008-0025 Marijuana Grow Site Registration
(1) A patient must register a marijuana grow site with the Department. The Department will register only one grow site per patient, and will only register grow sites in Oregon.

(2) To register a marijuana grow site, an applicant or patient must submit to the Department an application, prescribed by the Department, that includes:

(a) The name of the person responsible for the marijuana grow site;

(b) The date of birth of the person responsible for the marijuana grow site;

(c) The physical address of the marijuana grow site where marijuana is to be produced;

(d) The mailing address of the person responsible for the marijuana grow site;

(e) The registry identification card number of the registry identification cardholder, if known, for whom the marijuana is being produced; and

(f) Any other information the Department deems necessary.

(3) The Department will conduct a criminal background check on the person identified as being responsible for the grow site.

(a) If a patient is convicted of a violation of ORS 475.992(1)(a) or (b) that occurred on or after January 1, 2006, the patient is prohibited, for a period of five (5) years from the date of conviction, from producing marijuana at a location where the patient is present. The patient will be informed by registered mail if he or she is disqualified from being the person responsible for a grow site and the patient will be given the opportunity to identify another person responsible for the grow site.

(b) If a designated primary caregiver or a third party identified as the person responsible for the grow site is convicted of a violation of ORS 475.992(1)(a) or (b) that occurred on or after January 1, 2006, that person is prohibited, for a period of five (5) years from the date of conviction, from being a person responsible for a grow site. The patient will be informed by registered mail if the designated primary caregiver or third party identified as the person responsible for a grow site is disqualified from being the person responsible for a grow site and the patient will be given the opportunity to identify another person responsible for the grow site.

(c) If a designated primary caregiver or a third party identified as the person responsible for the grow site is convicted more than once of a violation of ORS 475.992(1)(a) or (b) that occurred on or after January 1, 2006, the patient will be informed by registered mail that the person is permanently prohibited from being a person responsible for a grow site and cannot be issued a marijuana grow site registration card. The patient will be given the opportunity to identify another person responsible for the grow site.

(4) The Department will issue a marijuana grow site registration card to a patient who has met the requirements of subsection (2) of this rule, unless the person responsible for a grow site is disqualified under subsection (3) of this rule.

(5) A person responsible for a marijuana grow site must display a marijuana grow site registration card for each patient for which marijuana is being produced, at the marijuana grow site at all times.

(6) All usable marijuana, plants, seedlings and seeds, associated with the production of marijuana for a registry identification cardholder by a person responsible for a marijuana grow site, are the property of the registry identification cardholder and must be provided to the registry identification cardholder upon request.

(7) All marijuana produced for a patient must be provided to the patient or primary designated caregiver when the person responsible for a marijuana grow site ceases producing marijuana for the patient.

(8) A person responsible for a marijuana grow site must return the grow site registration card to the patient to whom the card was issued when requested to do so by the patient or when the person responsible for a marijuana grow site ceases producing marijuana for the patient.

(9) A patient or the designated primary caregiver of the patient may reimburse the person responsible for a marijuana grow site for the costs of supplies and utilities associated with production of marijuana for the registry identification cardholder. No other costs associated with the production of marijuana for the patient, including the cost of labor, may be reimbursed.

(10) If marijuana used by a patient is to be produced at a grow site where the patient or designated caregiver is not present, the person responsible for the grow site may only produce marijuana for up to four (4) patients or designated primary caregivers at any time. A patient or designated caregiver will be considered to be "present" at a grow site if the patient or designated caregiver has their primary residence at the grow site. For purposes of this section, a "primary residence" is the physical location where a person lives, during any 12-month period, more than he or she lives elsewhere during that period.
 
38Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Dec 17, 2007, 18:59
Dutch police complain it is their right to smoke cannabis while off-duty
Police in Amsterdam are complaining over new rules banning them from smoking cannabis while off duty. Dutch police union chairman Hans van Duijn said: "Many of our members are opposed to this. They are not paid for 24-hours a day. What they do in their free time is up to them."
 
39Seattle Zen
ID: 529121611
Tue, Jan 15, 2008, 22:09
Marc Emery should be a free man
On Monday it was announced Mr. Emery had struck a deal with U.S. prosecutors. To avoid extradition, he will serve a five-year sentence for selling marijuana seeds by mail. He will do his time here, rather than stateside, but will be ineligible for the early release to which all other Canadian criminals generally are entitled. He will have to do his full time behind bars, no parole, no halfway houses, no statutory release.

This is really sad, not just for Marc, but for Canada.
 
40Tree
ID: 3533298
Wed, Jan 16, 2008, 08:52
i was just in the BCMP HQ last week in Vancouver. i have to say they have an outstanding vapor lounge.

damn shame that Emery is getting screwed by the U.S. government. just another victim...
 
41angryCHAIR
ID: 29955918
Fri, Feb 01, 2008, 20:42
For POT push E-4
 
42Seattle Zen
ID: 529121611
Thu, Feb 14, 2008, 00:32


Pot Legalization Goes Prime Time
The national ACLU has decided to fund a pilot effort. Beginning on Valentine's Day, television viewers in the Seattle media market will begin seeing a slick, 30-minute pot-reform infomercial.

Hosted by television travel guru Rick Steves, Marijuana: It's Time for a Conversation will initially be available on Comcast On Demand cable, says Alison Holcomb, director of the ACLU of Washington's Marijuana Education Project, which produced the show. Holcomb says the ACLU plans to spend at least $20,000 per week airing the program around the state. Three local network affiliates (KOMO, KING, and KIRO) have already received and approved copies of the script, she says. By the end of 2008, she expects the program to begin airing in more conservative regions, including Pierce County, Clark County, and greater Spokane.

Outstanding. Ms. Holcomb has promised me a copy of the movie so I may show it on Public Access here in Longview.
 
43RecycledSpinalFluid
Dude
ID: 204401122
Thu, Feb 14, 2008, 03:10
Funny thing today...I was driving somewhere with my father, when during conversation both Seattle Zen and marijuana came up. Despite what the rightwing nut jobs might think, they were completely seperate discussions. SZ was brought up regarding the local caucuses, where both my parents are delegates at the county level for their precinct (remembered SZ and his wishes to do the same... I see the thread now, where he is). The MJ was in regards to my mom finding a bag of it as she cleaned my uncle's place, after he passed away last week from esophageal cancer (unrelated to the mj, which came after the diagnosis).

Back to my regularly scheduled lurking...
 
44Seattle Zen
ID: 529121611
Fri, Feb 22, 2008, 20:54
Sure hope your mom was able to dispose of the cannabis properly, RSF. There are very important protocols to follow, not many people here in Longview know of them. If you ever know of anyone is a similar situation in the future, make sure to call me :)
 
45RecycledSpinalFluid
Dude
ID: 204401122
Fri, Feb 22, 2008, 21:29
LOL...the disposal discussion was brought up. Funny thing, I brought up using a vaporizor to my dad when he doubted she could smoke it anymore because she hates smoke smell from years of smoking cigs. See the good things you learn on these boards. :)
 
46Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Mar 10, 2008, 16:52
Outrageous Anti-Pot Lies: Media Uses Disgraceful Cancer Scare Tactics
On Tuesday, January 29 -- three days prior to the publication of a forthcoming study assessing marijuana use and cancer -- Reuters News Wire published a story under the headline: "Cannabis Bigger Cancer Risk Than Cigarettes." Mainstream media outlets across the globe immediately followed suit. "Smoking One Joint is Equivalent to 20 Cigarettes, Study Says," Fox News declared, while Australia's ABC broadcast network pronounced, "Experts Warn of Cannabis Cancer 'Epidemic.'"

If those headlines weren't attention-grabbing enough, one only had to scan the stories' inflammatory copy -- much of which was lifted directly from press statements provided by the study's lead author in advance of its publication.

"While our study covers a relatively small group, it shows clearly that long-term cannabis smoking increases lung-cancer risk," chief investigator Richard Beasley declared. Beasley went on to speculate that pot "could already be responsible for one in 20 lung cancers diagnosed in New Zealand" before warning: "In the near future we may see an 'epidemic' of lung cancers connected with this new carcinogen."

The mainstream press, always on the look out for a good pot scare story, ran blindly with Beasley's remarks. Apparently not a scribe among them felt any need to confirm whether Beasley's study -- which remained embargoed at the same time it was making worldwide headlines -- actually said what was claimed.

It didn't.

For those who actually bothered to read the study's full text, which appeared in the European Respiratory Journal days after the global feeding frenzy had ended, they would have learned the following. Among the 79 lung cancer subjects who participated in the trial, 70 of them smoked tobacco. These individuals, not surprisingly, experienced a seven-times greater risk of being diagnosed with lung cancer compared to tobacco-free controls. As for the subjects in the study who reported having used cannabis, they -- on average -- experienced no statistically significant increased cancer risk compared to non-using controls.

Lazy reporters who do not research a topic and just spit out snippets from press releases write poor stories.
In short, had the mainstream media even taken the time to consult their own prior marijuana coverage, they would have immediately begun asking the sort of probing questions that the public normally expects them to. Of course, such hard and steadfast rules governing professional journalism seldom apply to the media' coverage of pot -- where political ideology typically trumps accuracy and where slipshod reporting hardly ever even warrants a public retraction. Writing in the journal Science nearly 40 years ago, New York state university sociologist Erich Goode aptly observed: "[T]ests and experiments purporting to demonstrate the ravages of marijuana consumption receive enormous attention from the media, and their findings become accepted as fact by the public. But when careful refutations of such research are published, or when latter findings contradict the original pathological findings, they tend to be ignored or dismissed."
 
47Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Tue, Mar 18, 2008, 12:16
So, can we talk?
A College student loses his financial aid because of a youthful indiscretion. A woman coping with the ravages of ovarian cancer lives in fear of being arrested for using what best eases her suffering. Across town, a front door bursts open and police rush in to handcuff a man relaxing in his living room. These events have one thing in common: marijuana. Whether it is being kicked out of college for a youthful mistake, being denied relief from pain as a cancer patient, or getting arrested for personal use in one's home, marijuana laws have far-reaching consequences. And these consequences are often totally disproportionate to whatever societal risk or danger marijuana use may pose.

So, can we talk?

I think we should. As a nation, we spend at least $7.5 billion annually enforcing our marijuana laws. In 2006, the latest year for which we have numbers, a record 830,000 Americans were arrested for marijuana — 89 percent of them simply for possessing it.
 
48nerveclinic
ID: 105222
Tue, Mar 18, 2008, 13:21


"As of October, 14,831 Oregonians were medical marijuana cardholders and 7,178 growers,

Ah Zen, wouldn't you agree these number don't add up? A single grower's output, without much effort, could literally supply dozens of patients.

Yet we have a 2-1 ratio.

Just an observation.

 
50Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Mon, Mar 31, 2008, 12:31
The deal is OFF!
A tentative deal between Marc Emery and the U.S. government over money laundering and drug charges has been nixed by Ottawa, the marijuana crusader said Thursday. Mr. Emery says the federal Conservatives have refused to go along with a proposal that would have seen him spend five years behind bars for selling marijuana seeds through the mail. Under the defunct pact, Mr. Emery was to plead guilty on both sides of the border and accept a sentence of 10 years imprisonment on the understanding he would serve half, mostly in Canada.

The word is the deal was nixed because it required the Canadian government to guarantee that Emery serve no less than 5 years in a Canadian prison. Well, Canadian law prohibits any such guarantee, so they disallowed the agreement.

The Liberal government signed an extradition order a while ago. Now that the deal is shot, I don't know if Emery can fight extradition all over again.
 
51Seattle Zen
ID: 49112418
Fri, Apr 18, 2008, 13:29
More and more Canadians consuming cannabis



Wow, nearly as many cannabis consumers as tobacco! Amazing.
The report found that 40 per cent of those surveyed in 2005 who reported smoking pot in the previous year were between 30 and 49. In 1977, that number was just 15.4 per cent. Nearly one-third of those who used marijuana in the previous year had completed at least some post-secondary education, and 32 per cent earned more than $50,000 a year, the report said. A United Nations world drug report released last year showed that 16.8 per cent of Canadians between 15 and 64 had smoked pot in the previous year, one of the highest levels in the world.
 
53Boldwin
ID: 463471413
Sat, Apr 19, 2008, 15:36
You say that like it's a good thing. How does the mj vs hard drugs graph look?
 
54Seattle Zen
ID: 29241823
Sat, Apr 19, 2008, 17:46
You say that like it's a good thing

Well, cigarettes, when used as directed, kill you. Cannabis does not. So, yes, it is a good thing.

I looked briefly at the CAMH report: Addiction and Mental Health Indicators Among Ontario Adults, the study from which the graph above was generated. According to them, 1.3% of Ontarians used cocaine in the past 12 months and 1% has used Ecstacy. Those were the only other two substances studied.
 
56Seattle Zen
      ID: 49112418
      Mon, Apr 21, 2008, 11:27


CU’s 4/20 pot smoke-out draws crowd of 10,000. Police issue zero tickets during annual marijuana celebration

Although it's become an annual and renowned event at CU, this year's 4/20 celebration was different in some ways than in many previous years: The crowd was so large it migrated from the long-traditional site of Farrand Field to the larger Norlin Quad; festivities kicked off earlier than normal with daytime concerts; and CU police handed out zero citations.

Nice job, CU.
 
57Perm Dude
      ID: 2332219
      Mon, Apr 21, 2008, 16:37
The Onion's News in Photos: Marijuana
 
58Seattle Zen
      ID: 29241823
      Tue, Apr 29, 2008, 22:39
Michigan to vote on legalizing marijuana for medical use


Michigan, with its scheduled Nov. 4 vote, is at the forefront of the national debate that has percolated since 1996, when California voters approved medical marijuana. If voters approve it, Michigan would become the 13th state to legalize medical marijuana for the treatment of a host of health problems such as HIV/AIDS, cancer, hepatitis C and Alzheimer's disease. Sponsors say as many as 50,000 Michigan residents, would qualify for the medical pot. A poll of 600 voters in mid-March, conducted by Lansing-based Marketing Resource Group, found that two-thirds favored it.
 
59walk
      ID: 181472714
      Thu, May 01, 2008, 10:37
In the spirit...Just saw H & K Escape from Guantanamo yesterday. Not as hilarious as the first one, but a must-see for fans. Proper vapo action included, of course...!
 
60Tree
      ID: 3533298
      Thu, May 01, 2008, 10:40
it's a bong! a bong!!!!!!!
 
61walk
      ID: 181472714
      Thu, May 01, 2008, 10:44
LOL! Yeah, that was great..."It's poison gas!"
Looks like we have an Al Qaeda/North Korea connection."

The scene at the end, in the house of the "senior executive," was brilliant though....my favorite part of the movie.
 
62Perm Dude
      ID: 3943117
      Thu, May 01, 2008, 14:40
Zen, did you see this piece?
 
63biliruben
      ID: 33258140
      Thu, May 01, 2008, 15:06
Man did I move away from NYC at the right time (1993)!
 
64Boldwin
      ID: 323592819
      Mon, May 05, 2008, 21:36
ZC

Something to think about. Just cause you are in a liberal neck of the woods, I would still think long and hard...
 
65Tree
      ID: 3533298
      Wed, May 07, 2008, 13:43
Georgia Law Bans Retailers From Selling 'Pot Candy' To Minors

not really 100 percent related to the issue, but needed to be posted, if only for this paragraph:

Senator Doug Stoner pushed the bill in the senate. "I don't think that folks are aware this is going on," Stoner told Channel 2 in April. "It's mainly, from what I can tell, particularly targeted to minority communities."
 
66Seattle Zen
      ID: 49112418
      Tue, Jul 22, 2008, 13:02
This is really pathetic.

New Orleans District attorney boosts felony convictions with marijuana cases
Shortly after Keva Landrum-Johnson took over as district attorney following Eddie Jordan’s resignation Oct. 30, hundreds of new felony cases flooded the public defenders office, overwhelming the 29 defense attorneys. After New Orleans regained its title as the nation’s murder capital, the public demanded its city leaders crack down on violent crime. By filing hundreds of new felony cases each month, it appeared as if the new DA heeded their call. Unfortunately, this wasn’t the case, said Steve Singer, chief of trials for the Orleans Public Defenders Office. The flood of new felony charges didn’t target murderers, rapists or armed robbers — they targeted small-time marijuana users, sometimes caught with less than a gram of pot, and threatened them with lengthy prison sentences.

A first-time marijuana possession charge in Louisiana is a misdemeanor punishable by up to six months in prison but typically results in a small fine. A second offense is a felony that can carry up to five years in jail and a third offense up to 20 years.

Yeah, those marijuana smokers are what's wrong with the Big Easy.
 
67Perm Dude
      ID: 4574767
      Wed, Aug 06, 2008, 09:37
Charlie Lynch, who apparently carefully followed all state laws regarding his business, busted by the feds anyway.

I guess "states rights" for the federales only applies to state efforts to expand gun rights and restrict abortions.
 
68nerveclinic
      Leader
      ID: 5047110
      Sun, Aug 10, 2008, 16:26

Land of the free...

When the shooting stopped, two dogs lay dead. A mayor sat in his boxers, hands bound behind his back. His handcuffed mother-in-law was sprawled on the kitchen floor, lying beside the body of one of the family pets that police had killed before her eyes.

After the raid, Prince George's County police officials who burst into the home of Berwyn Heights' mayor last week seized the same unopened package of marijuana that an undercover officer had delivered an hour earlier.

What police left behind was a house stained with blood and a trail of questions about their conduct. No other evidence of illegal activity was found, and no one was arrested at Mayor Cheye Calvo's home in this small bedroom community near College Park.

This week Prince George's police arrested two men for orchestrating a plot to deliver marijuana to the addresses of unsuspecting recipients -- among them, Calvo's wife, Trinity Tomsic.

Yet neither county Police Chief Melvin C. High nor Sheriff Michael A. Jackson have apologized to him, his wife or her mother, Georgia Porter, for the raid that traumatized the family and killed their black Labrador retrievers, Payton and Chase.

Thursday, Calvo called on the U.S. Justice Department's civil rights division to investigate the raid and other similar actions by Prince George's law enforcement. He said officers burst into his house without knocking or announcing themselves, in violation of the warrant they had.

"Trinity was an innocent and random victim of identity theft. Apparently, so were four or five other county residents whose names and addresses were stolen and used as addresses on drug packages," Calvo said at a news conference outside his house, near a garden of tomatoes and strawberries.

"However, Trinity and our family have not been treated as victims of a crime. Instead, our home was invaded. Our two beloved Labrador retrievers are dead. My mother-in-law and I were tied up for nearly two hours," he said. "We were harmed by the very people who took an oath to protect us."

Berwyn Heights police Chief Patrick A. Murphy appeared with the mayor Thursday and said his agency was never informed of the investigation, despite an existing memorandum of understanding to work together on such operations.

He said not knowing about the raid could have led his officers to fire upon the sheriff's SWAT team because its members were wearing street clothes, masks and carrying weapons as they approached the mayor's house.

"What about the safety of my officers?" Murphy said. If consulted, he added, "We could have gotten the mayor to put the dogs away and consent to a search."

Police officials in Arizona first intercepted the package when a drug-sniffing dog alerted them to the presence of marijuana. It was addressed to Tomsic. An undercover officer in Prince George's delivered the package near 6 p.m. and was told by Calvo's mother-in-law to leave it on the porch, according to Calvo's attorney, Timothy Maloney.

Prince George's County police arrested two men involved in a scheme to transport marijuana. Once packages were dropped off by a deliveryman, a suspect would pick them up -- with the addressee oblivious to the plot. Police seized a half-dozen packages that contained about 417 pounds of marijuana, including the 32 pounds delivered to Tomsic, the Associated Press reported.

Last Tuesday, the mayor arrived home from his full-time job as an executive with SEED Foundation, which establishes urban public charter schools. He took the unopened package inside and placed it on a table near the door. He changed clothes and walked the dogs, waving to the men and women sitting in cars near his home. He did not know they were police.

He returned and went upstairs to get dressed for an event. As he changed clothes, SWAT team members darted across the fenced-in lot. Porter, 50, was cooking artichokes in the kitchen and screamed when she saw the approaching masked men with guns.

The door was kicked in and gunshots rang out, Calvo said. Police killed one dog, Payton -- named for football running back Walter Payton -- even though Porter was standing next to him.

Police have said the dogs "engaged" officers. Calvo confirmed that Payton probably moved toward the door but would have ultimately done nothing more than lick them.

"He was an aggressive licker," said Calvo.

Cheryl Compton, a neighbor, said her two sons, 5-year-old Cody and 7-year-old Ty, played with the mayor's dogs all the time, and that everyone but the Prince George's County police knew where Calvo lived.

"I would have let them stay in a yard by themselves with those dogs," Compton said. "It really upsets me to think that I don't feel safe in my home. If they were to shoot our dog, Amber, I would be outraged."

Chase was shot while running away from sheriff's deputies, Calvo said.

"He was hunted down and shot in the back while he fled," he said. "They didn't deserve to die. They don't deserve to be blamed for their deaths."

Calvo, 37, who has been mayor since 2004, was told to walk backward down the stairs with his hands in the air. He was wearing only boxers and socks. Police handcuffed him and placed him in the living room. His mother-in-law was also cuffed and made to lie on the kitchen floor next to Payton's body.

Police said they were allowed to enter the house without announcing their presence because Porter screamed and because they had a "no-knock" warrant. Calvo and his attorney, Maloney, say that is not true.

When Tomsic arrived home, she said, she thought the house had been robbed and that police had responded with an impressive show of force. But when she saw the blood and learned what had happened to her dogs, she was in shock.

"They were my kids," said Tomsic, 33, an employee with Maryland's Department of Human Resources. "All I could see was the blood and the tissue of the dogs."

Cleaning the blood, which police tracked throughout the house, was the top priority after the police left four hours after the raid, Calvo said.

"The blood was horrendous," Calvo said. "They had tracked it everywhere."

The couple bought the corner lot home nearly three years ago and asked Porter to move from Utah to live with them about 13 months ago. On the front fence, supporters have draped an American flag banner that reads, "Cheye & Trinity We Support You." Dozens of people have written personal messages to the family on the banner.

Robert Kovalchik, a neighbor and Calvo's high school history teacher at Parkdale High School, said he was shocked that county officials had not apologized.

"This smacks of something from Nazi Germany," Kovalchik said.

Calvo said he wants federal officials to examine policies that he said have led Prince George's police officials to serve warrants on wrong addresses and kill family pets before.

In once such case, Prince George's sheriff's deputies executed a warrant on the home of Frank and Pamela Myers of Accokeek in November. The Myers told sheriffs that they had the wrong address as their dog began barking from the yard. The couple asked if they could retrieve their dog, but deputies refused. Minutes later, two shots were fired and the dog was killed, according to a notice of a tort claims filed by attorney Michael J. Winkelman. The Myers were never charged and nothing was seized from their house.

"This has happened before, and without oversight, it will happen again," Calvo said.


*******************

Such a Fing joke

So sad that such a great country is so sick at times...

so very sick.

 
69Tree
      ID: 7761017
      Sun, Aug 10, 2008, 18:12
i saw this a few days ago. even more shocking is that they shot one dog that was running away.

perhaps the officer who shot that dog should be give a 3 second head start before someone levels a shot gun at him as he runs away.

about 10 years ago, my cousin was was in college, and in his apartment sitting on couch with his dog. all of a sudden, local police burst him, guns drawn, yelling whatever they were yelling, and shot his dog in the process.

my cousin was shoved face down to the floor, and cuffed. two feet away, he watched his dog bleed out, and die.

turns out that two of his roommates were low level pot dealers.

my cousin is now a veternarian, a path he chose to study because of what happened to his dog.

it is pot. it's marijuana. it's weed. this nation's continued "war" on this drug is an affront to decency and humanity, and we really need to just stop it.

then again, we live in a nation that apparently loves to wage war.

 
70Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Mon, Aug 11, 2008, 08:14
A tipping point?

The Calvo case, however, had several other factors working for it that I think help explain why it got so much media attention. Mayor Calco and his wife are white, middle class progressives, who live in a two-story, red-brick house in a Washington suburb. In addition to being a part-time mayor, Calvo works at a nonprofit foundation that runs boarding schools. His wife is a state finance officer. All of which suggests they’re in precisely the same demographic as most MSM reporters. The Washington Post or NY Times reporters look at this case and immediately think: “It could happen to me!” So the story gets saturation coverage--even in Great Britain!

Meanwhile, the MSM ignores the plight of African-American and Latino minority communities caught in the War on Drugs’ crossfire between paramilitary SWAT stormtroopers and gang thugs. How many brown and black families per year are terrorized by cops erroneously executing no knock warrants on the wrong premises? We don’t know because the media only pays attention to collateral damage from the War on Drugs when it happens to people like Mayor Calvo.

What happened to Calvo and his dogs is inexcusable. But the real tragedy is that the same sort of thing happens every day in places like South-Central Los Angeles and nobody cares.

It’s time to declare a cease fire in the failed war on drugs. It’s time for a rational program of legalization and regulation. It’s time for common sense.

 
71Perm Dude
      ID: 19751117
      Mon, Aug 11, 2008, 08:51
What happened to Calvo and his dogs is inexcusable. But the real tragedy is that the same sort of thing happens every day in places like South-Central Los Angeles and nobody cares.

Great, great point, MBJ.
 
72Tree
      ID: 3533298
      Mon, Aug 11, 2008, 09:02
amen MBJ.

all, for the record, you do hear of those sort of things happening in South-Central or maybe Bushwick. but you only hear about them when people get killed in these botched raids.

MBJ - it's good to hear you calling for common defense in this "war on drugs"...
 
73Seattle Zen
      ID: 358591721
      Thu, Nov 13, 2008, 10:52
Re: post 6

Hemp growers take case to higher authority
Two North Dakota farmers on Wednesday took their battle to grow industrial hemp to the Eighth Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals in St. Paul, where their attorney argued that hemp is so distinct from marijuana that it should not be subject to federal regulation. At stake, say hemp sellers and would-be farmers, is a potentially booming commodity that would help U.S. growers and consumers alike.
 
74Baldwin
      ID: 471049135
      Thu, Nov 13, 2008, 19:38
Re:22

That's pretty much the setup at home I thot?
 
75Seattle Zen
      ID: 358591721
      Mon, Dec 08, 2008, 02:14
Next step on pot: Grow it, tax it
Following an overwhelming victory for Nov. 4's "Ballot Question 2," some district attorneys, law enforcement officers and editorial writers have questioned the people's wisdom.In doing so, they reveal their own failure since 2000 to participate in the normal legislative process. They should have seen the tidal wave approaching and worked with advocates and the Legislature in passing reform sooner, saving thousands from criminal charges we now know the people do not want to impose upon the marijuana users among us.

What is truly criminal is that the current law provides those willing to engage in the risk of cultivating and distributing a price support that farmers of other commodities can only envy. This is why efforts to further reform marijuana laws, by those who know marijuana to be safer than alcoholic beverages and a safe and effective medicine, will not cease until production and distribution by adults and possession and use by adults is legal, regulated and taxed.

The purpose of the Constitution - being the securing of liberty and justice for all - compel it.

Smart words out there in Massachusetts.
 
76Perm Dude
      ID: 41131911
      Tue, Dec 09, 2008, 13:00
Zen, you'll love this story & video.

KopBust. You gotta love it.
 
77walk
      ID: 181472714
      Tue, Dec 09, 2008, 14:01
#70, MBJ, WORD.
 
78nerveclinic
      Leader
      ID: 05047110
      Sun, Feb 01, 2009, 22:24


Michael Phelps...gotta love it.

Vindication for the smokers of the world.

 
79Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Mon, Feb 02, 2009, 09:38
Really destroyed his lung capacity and his ambition....
 
80ChicagoTRS
      ID: 4110481415
      Mon, Feb 02, 2009, 09:50
what a shame...just think how good a swimmer he would have been if he did not partake in the evil weed...
 
81DWetzel
      ID: 278201415
      Mon, Feb 02, 2009, 10:11
Does this go here or in noteworthy tech developments?

Google Earth bust
 
82nerveclinic
      Leader
      ID: 05047110
      Mon, Feb 02, 2009, 11:42


Love 79 and 80...

 
83ChicagoTRS
      ID: 4110481415
      Mon, Feb 02, 2009, 17:47
this explains michael phelps 12,000 calorie a day diet...munchies...
 
84Seattle Zen
      ID: 37142511
      Thu, Feb 05, 2009, 20:28
DEA raids of CA medical marijuana dispensaries will end soon!
Drug Enforcement Administration agents this week raided four medical marijuana shops in California, contrary to President Obama's campaign promises to stop the raids. The White House said it expects those kinds of raids to end once Mr. Obama nominates someone to take charge of DEA, which is still run by Bush administration holdovers. “The president believes that federal resources should not be used to circumvent state laws, and as he continues to appoint senior leadership to fill out the ranks of the federal government, he expects them to review their policies with that in mind," White House spokesman Nick Shapiro said.

Glad to hear my phone calls and e-mails got my message through!
 
85Building 7
      ID: 70243116
      Thu, Feb 05, 2009, 22:15
Is the Obama administration going to legalize/decriminalize marijuana? Is that anywhere on the agenda? They should. It's really none of the federal government's business anyways.
 
86Jag
      ID: 580233023
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 10:35
Untill it is legalized, do any of you feel responsible for the 5700 deaths in Mexico, because of the drug war?
 
87Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 10:49
I don't see why anyone should. Do you use gasoline or home heating oil? If so, do you feel responsible for the 3,000 deaths on 9/11 or the 4300 American casualties in Iraq or the unknown 6 or possibly 7 figure total number of casualties in Iraq since 2003?
 
88Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 10:56
That said I always recommend getting American or Canadian grown. Much fewer entanglements getting it from the soil to the user and the quality is always better.
 
89Jag
      ID: 580233023
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:00
I do feel our country's dependence on foreign oil has contributed to terrorism and I blame environmentalists for that.
 
90Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:07
lol. figures. You use the fantasy that there is enough domestic oil to support American consumption to demonize environmentalists. The Environmentalists aer the ones who have been ignored for the past half century as they pushed for the development of alternative fuels.

Why not blame the oil lobby for suppressing the development of wind and solar? With the rapid advancements we've made in solar energy this decade, it seems pretty clear that solar could have been viable a long time ago if we'd have listened to those despicable environmentalists back in the middle of the last century.
 
91Tree
      ID: 1311551521
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:07
of course you do.

personally, i'm not sure i'd get mexican weed if you paid me. Western Canada is where its at.
 
92Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:14
75 Years of the oil Industry's suppression of alternative fuels.
 
93nerveclinic
      Leader
      ID: 05047110
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:18

Is the Obama administration going to legalize/decriminalize marijuana? Is that anywhere on the agenda? They should. It's really none of the federal government's business anyways.

I read somewhere he didn't want to use up his political capital on this but one must hope he will at least decriminalize medical marijuana to start.


 
94Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:21
Re Obama, his rhetoric has not been very consistant. I suspect it might be an initiative he'd consider in his second term, should he get reelected.
 
95Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:23
Obama and decriminalization
 
96Jag
      ID: 580233023
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:28
I was being a bit facetious. Every President, Congress, environmentalist and oil company have contributed to this problem.
 
97boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:28
With the rapid advancements we've made in solar energy this decade, it seems pretty clear that solar could have been viable a long time ago if we'd have listened to those despicable environmentalists back in the middle of the last century.

those rapid develops came about from advances in technology not associated with solar. One great thing about the world getting smaller is it gets harder and harder to suppress technology.
 
98Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 11:43
those rapid develops came about from advances in technology not associated with solar

Not nearly as much as you think. What you say might be partly true about artificial photosynthesis but most advancements in the efficiency of solar cells are simple innovations like developing concave cells with mirrored inner walls to better harness light that is not directly hitting a panel.
 
99boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Fri, Feb 06, 2009, 12:14
I dont know maybe, but i have feeling that if there had been no solar power at all till today vs solar power been fully funded for the past 20 years, the resulting solar power in the next 10-20 years would look almost identical. the amount of technology that has multiple uses is amazing and the amount that this knowledge is spread is even more amazing.
 
100boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Mon, Feb 09, 2009, 17:33
Marijuana and cancer linked in Seattle area research.
 
101Seattle Zen
      ID: 9147109
      Tue, Feb 10, 2009, 20:06
WA lawmakers consider decreasing penalty for marijuana possession

I went up to testify in favor of this bill on behalf of the Washington Defenders Association, though I was not allow to speak as the bill was brought up last with only 15 minutes left, leaving only enough time for five people to speak. Eh, no big deal, I was there to testify on behalf of the WDA on another bill in another room that morning as well.

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Sen. Adam Kline, D-Seattle, joked that marijuana was in fact a gateway drug:

“My own experience shows that marijuana is. I used to grow my own dope and now I brew my own beer.”


That was perhaps my favorite line I've ever heard from a legislator on the record, ever.

The room erupted into laughter and clapping before Kline added: “Just kidding.”

Hey, I was there, second row, and Sen. Kline most certainly did not say "just kidding".

Unfortunately, it sounds like the chairman of the committee is not interested in allowing a vote to get it out of committee. It would get out of committee if brought to the table. I'm not sure about its chances in the entire legislature.
 
102biliruben
      Leader
      ID: 589301110
      Wed, Feb 11, 2009, 09:20
Where you the guy motioning with his hands how much a Z and a quarter was? ;)
 
103walk
      ID: 181472714
      Thu, Feb 12, 2009, 13:26
Great anecdote, SC, in #101. Keep it up, bro. Cos of these boards, some have learned the world of the vaporiZer.
 
104Seattle Zen
      ID: 101321211
      Thu, Feb 12, 2009, 20:19
Sports should go green, allow pot smoking
Weed, the Breakfast of Champions. I've been waiting a long time - 11 years to be exact - for the sports world to seize on that concept, but no one's had the guts. Now, far later than I expected, we've entered pot's perfect storm. Just as the economy has tanked, strangling sponsorships all over the athletic map, a Super Bowl MVP and the most decorated Olympian of all time have emerged as partakers. Advocates for drug reform have long said that legalizing marijuana would increase tax revenue, not to mention reduce violence in the dealer population.

Amen.

Re 102 - No, I wasn't making hand motions, but Sen. Klein held his hands up in a circle a little larger than a softball, pretty accurate.
 
105Seattle Zen
      ID: 7271110
      Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 19:32


What a beautiful chart.

Americans growing kinder to bud!
Three recent polls show that Americans are more sympathetic to the idea of legalizing marijuana than ever before. That all three polls show support for legalization passing through the 40 percent barrier may be significant. I compiled a database of every past poll I could find on this subject, including a series of Gallup polls and results from the General Social Survey, and could never before find more than 36 percent of the population (Gallup in October, 2005) stating a position in favor of legalization. The pro-legalization position may have some generational momentum as well. According to an AARP poll conducted several years ago, while just 8 percent of Americans aged 70 or older had ever tried pot, lifetime usage rates grow to 58 percent among 45-49 year olds.
 
106Biliruben
      ID: 52052916
      Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 19:59
Sounds like our old chief k's deputy is an academic who has
debunked the whole abuse/adict/treatment paradigm. Check
kleiman for details...
 
107Myboyjack
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 13:35
Legalizing MJ as an economic stimulus for Kentucky
 
108Seattle Zen
      ID: 28251189
      Wed, Mar 18, 2009, 12:46
Obama Administration Likely To Review UMass Scientist's Bid To Grow Marijuana
Days before President Bush left office in January, his administration fired a parting shot at Professor Lyle Craker's eight-year quest to cultivate marijuana for medical research by abruptly denying him a federal license despite a nearly two-year old Drug Enforcement Administration law judge's recommendation that he receive one.

But the new administration led by President Obama, who has publicly backed the use of marijuana for medical purposes to stave off pain, might reverse the decision and keep Craker's license application from going up in smoke.

A source familiar with the case said the White House will likely demand that the decision be reviewed.

"Basically they want to do an autopsy of what occurred and have it go through a proper review," the source said.

Craker, who is based at the University of Massachusetts-Amherst, is cautiously optimistic Obama will do to the denial of the marijuana license what he has done to other Bush administration decisions on such hot-button cultural issues as embryonic stem-cell research and the abortion "gag rule" affecting overseas family planning groups.

It would be great news if that happened.
 
109boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Mar 18, 2009, 13:52
I just got back from canada and big news there is how the mexican drug wars are spreading to cananda.

Vancouver Beset by Gang Violence
 
111Boldwin
      ID: 392192513
      Fri, Mar 27, 2009, 07:50
You guys do realize what an enormous buzzkill it is to point out to SZ, what a horendous price his habit comes with?
 
117Mith
      Dude
      ID: 01629107
      Thu, Apr 02, 2009, 07:15
Hopefully Boxman is finished with all the fun he was having in trying to destroy this thread.

Journal of Clinical EEG & Neuroscience, January, 2009 - The Influence of Substance Use on Adolescent Brain Development
Abstract

Adolescence is a unique period in neurodevelopment. Alcohol and marijuana use are common. Recent research has indicated that adolescent substance users show abnormalities on measures of brain functioning, which is linked to changes in neurocognition over time. Abnormalities have been seen in brain structure volume, white matter quality, and activation to cognitive tasks, even in youth with as little as 1-2 years of heavy drinking and consumption levels of 20 drinks per month, especially if >4-5 drinks are consumed on a single occasion. Heavy marijuana users show some subtle anomalies too, but generally not the same degree of divergence from demographically similar non-using adolescents. This article reviews the extant literature on neurocognition, brain structure, and brain function in adolescent substance users with an emphasis on the most commonly used substances, and in the context of ongoing neuromaturational processes. Methodological and treatment implications are provided.
Sullivan: The pot-prohibitionists have no arguments any more. And at some point, even in America, that has to matter, no?
 
118Frick
      ID: 3410551012
      Thu, Apr 02, 2009, 08:20
Why did they describe alcohol use in a very specific manner, yet marijuana use was not? I'm assuming that it is in the full report, but it seems like a large inconsistancy. I understand it is the abstract and they were trying to keep it brief, but it leads me to question the prior opinions of the researchers.

And the last time I checked, both alcohol and marijuana were illegal for minors.

 
120Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Fri, Apr 03, 2009, 11:40
Glenn Greewald: The success of drug decriminalization in Portugal
 
121Mith
      ID: 2894309
      Mon, Apr 06, 2009, 10:09
From the United States Department of Agriculture: Hemp For Victory!



 
122Seattle Zen
      ID: 51640311
      Fri, Jul 03, 2009, 12:41


Re: Post 8

After Further Review, Smoking Pot Doesn't Make You Crazy -- Blimey!
Widespread marijuana use by the public has not been followed by a proportional rise in diagnoses of schizophrenia or psychosis, according to the findings of a forthcoming study to be published in the scientific journal Schizophrenia Research.
 
123Seattle Zen
      ID: 51640311
      Fri, Jul 03, 2009, 13:01
R.I. Senate approves commission to study marijuana law
Backers of the successful drive to legalize the sale of marijuana for medicinal purposes have now won Senate support for a study of what, if anything, is being accomplished by criminalizing use of the plant for any other purpose? During the General Assembly's aborted rush to adjournment Friday, the Senate approved a resolution - introduced earlier the same day - to create a nine-member special commission to study a swath of issues surrounding marijuana. Among them: "The experience of individuals and families sentenced for violating marijuana laws...The experience of states and European countries, such as California, Massachusetts and the Netherlands, which have decriminalized the sale and use of marijuana.''

Good things are happening in Rhode Island. This bill was introduced in the Senate in February. that would have decriminalized possession of up to an ounce by 18 year olds.

Here's a link to the resolution.
 
124biliruben
      Leader
      ID: 589301110
      Fri, Jul 03, 2009, 13:42
Backers of the successful drive to legalize the sale of marijuana for medicinal purposes...

Fickin' gateway laws...
 
125holt
      ID: 2463620
      Sat, Jul 04, 2009, 05:34
Was watching a show last night about the widespread weed-growing operations in the Mendocino area. Some law enforcement genius was complaining about the environmental damage caused by the diesel generators, fungicides, pesticides, etc. Here's a novel idea. Legalize the weed already! Then these people can run their operations like any normal farm.

Is everyone in congress completely lacking balls, brains, or both? When is this BS going to end? It boggles the mind.
 
126Seattle Zen
      ID: 30631210
      Tue, Jul 21, 2009, 01:31
This is a great piece in the New York Times about marijuana from five well educated points of view:

If Marijuana Is Legal, Will Addiction Rise?
 
127Seattle Zen
      ID: 4478312
      Mon, Aug 03, 2009, 13:09
Cops caught on camera planting marijuana on suspect. And this is no hidden camera, this is his own car-mounted one.

Watch it here
 
128Boldwin
      ID: 376192015
      Mon, Aug 03, 2009, 20:38
You know how dumb criminals are.
 
129Seattle Zen
      ID: 4478312
      Mon, Aug 03, 2009, 21:01
You know how dumb criminals are.

In my best Phil Hartman doing Ed McMahon impersonation, "Ha ha, Right you are, sir".
 
130Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Thu, Aug 06, 2009, 14:47
The post that Zen and I have been waiting for:

A story about both copyright and marijuana (!)
 
131Seattle Zen
      ID: 4072618
      Thu, Aug 06, 2009, 19:02
To me, it's an easy case of "fair use".
 
132biliruben
      ID: 461142511
      Fri, Aug 07, 2009, 19:55
Seattle Drug Market Initiative
 
133Seattle Zen
      ID: 4778712
      Fri, Aug 07, 2009, 20:05
Preposterous. The police don't know 5% of the drug dealers in Seattle since only a tiny percentage sell on the street.
 
134holt
      ID: 25758720
      Fri, Aug 07, 2009, 21:58
"the lack of sellers causes the market to collapse"

That kind of approach toward marijuana would be Elmer Fuddish. If the focus is on meth and crack then sure, try it. Maybe something positive comes of it.
 
135Building 7
      ID: 126371618
      Fri, Aug 07, 2009, 23:16
"Basic model: identify all the dealers in a market, make cases against them,......."

Why didn't someone think of this earlier.
Who knew it would be so easy.
That's brilliant. So we round up all the dealers. Damn. Who would of thought that would work?
 
136Seattle Zen
      ID: 5742013
      Thu, Aug 20, 2009, 19:32
Time for the Great State of Washington to decriminalize marijuana.
[The two of us], a Democratic state senator and former Republican state representative, support state Senate Bill 5615. This bill would reclassify adult possession of marijuana from a crime carrying a mandatory day in jail to a civil infraction imposing a $100 penalty payable by mail. The bill was voted out of committee with a bipartisan "do pass" recommendation and will be considered by legislators in 2010.

The bill makes a lot of sense, especially in this time of severely strapped budgets. Our state Office of Financial Management reported annual savings of $16 million and $1 million in new revenue if SB 5615 passes.
 
137biliruben
      ID: 461142511
      Thu, Aug 20, 2009, 19:43
A million in new revenue... lessee, $1,000,000 divided by, um, er $100, uh, equals. (head scratch...)

That a lot of tickets!
 
138Seattle Zen
      ID: 238441010
      Fri, Sep 11, 2009, 16:20
Hey, PD, here's another story for this thread that will interest, or concern, both of us.

Andrew Sullivan gets popped for pot.

It seems that the US Attorney wants to drop the case so Sullivan can become a citizen, but the US Magistrate wants to get his name in the paper. Kudos to the US Atty., BOO to Robert Collings.
 
139Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Fri, Sep 11, 2009, 16:32
Wow. I thought the decision to prosecute is entirely in the hands of the, you know, "prosecutor."
 
140Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Sat, Sep 12, 2009, 14:25
Petulant judge drops charge against Sullivan

Link via Sullivan' himself, who isn't saying anything specific about the charges.
 
141boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:07
You guys are pretty hypocritical to all of sudden think it is ok prosecutors to pick and choose who they feel is actually breaking the law. I have a great idea the next person who gets arrested for breaking the same law you should volunteer to pay their fine or do there community service.
 
142Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:10
Prosecutors always have discretion, boikin. And judges do not get to decide who to prosecute.
 
143boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:20
Like i said it does not make it OK.
 
144Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:34
Sure it does. Sometimes there are good reasons not to prosecute someone for a particular crime. No good comes from throwing away all context.
 
145boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:39
what is the context here? who he is? there are no mediating circumstances.
 
146Perm Dude
      ID: 154552311
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:41
How about: It shouldn't be against the law in the first place.
 
147boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 10:50
Did not seem to bother the prosecutor on his earlier prosecutions and if that was your arguement how come you link was not about the unfair law in Massachusetts?
 
148Seattle Zen
      ID: 238441010
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 13:31
boikin, you are totally missing the point.

First, in Mass., MJ possession is an infraction like a speeding ticket, not a crime. All across America prosecutors are dismissing traffic tickets for all sorts of reasons. Surely you can understand how a level headed professional can sometimes come to the conclusion that the arresting officer made a mistake.

There are other reasons why infractions get dismissed. In this case, the prosecutor recognizes that if Andrew Sullivan was found to have committed this infraction, it could mean that he could not emigrate to this country. It is in the "interest of justice" to dismiss because someone should not have one of the most important things of their entire lives, changing citizenship, be prohibited for a minor infraction. You see, the people of Mass. want to only slightly discourage people from possessing marijuana, just as they want to discourage people from speeding. If someone does either of those things, they should pay a fine, not be prohibited from becoming a US citizen.

Dismissing Sullivan's case was the right thing to do. Unfortunately, when the immigrant is not a white person, but is from Mexico or farther south, prosecutors are not as likely to agree and that sucks.
 
149boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 14:15
the prosecutor recognizes that if Andrew Sullivan was found to have committed this infraction actually judges dismiss traffic tickets not prosecutors, so get your analogy correct.

Unfortunately, when the immigrant is not a white person, but is from Mexico or farther south, prosecutors are not as likely to agree and that sucks.

this is the point you should be making then, instead you decided to focus on pointing out that white famous guys gets off and i am glad.

 
150Seattle Zen
      ID: 238441010
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 15:21
the prosecutor recognizes that if Andrew Sullivan was found to have committed this infraction - actually judges dismiss traffic tickets not prosecutors, so get your analogy correct.

Well, since you already know everything, I'll just step aside.
 
151biliruben's lawyer
      Dude
      ID: 014826271
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 20:08
actually judges dismiss traffic tickets not prosecutors, so get your analogy correct.


Actually, prosecutors dismiss traffic tickets, as well. All the time.
 
152holt
      ID: 158481619
      Wed, Sep 16, 2009, 20:48
This bill would reclassify adult possession of marijuana from a crime carrying a mandatory day in jail to a civil infraction imposing a $100 penalty payable by mail.

Plus they take your weed! Straight to the evidence room no doubt.
 
153Seattle Zen
      ID: 238441010
      Fri, Oct 09, 2009, 16:09
Want to stop billions of dollars going to Mexican drug cartels? Legalize Marijuana.
Stiff competition from thousands of America's mom-and-pop marijuana farmers threatens the bottom line for powerful Mexican drug organizations in a way that decades of arrests and seizures have not, according to law-enforcement officials and pot growers in the United States and Mexico. Almost all marijuana consumed in the multibillion-dollar U.S. market once came from Mexico or Colombia. As much as half now is produced domestically, often by small-scale operators who painstakingly tend greenhouses and indoor gardens to produce the more potent, and expensive, product that consumers now demand, according to authorities and marijuana dealers on both sides of the border.
 
154Seattle Zen
      ID: 238441010
      Mon, Oct 12, 2009, 01:56
Prince of Pot's sentence reeks of injustice and mocks our sovereignty

Emery's jail term longer than for some violent crimes

After two decades as Canada's Prince of Pot, Marc Emery will surrender himself today in B.C. Supreme Court and become the country's first Marijuana Martyr. Emery will begin serving what could be as long as five years behind bars as Uncle Sam's prisoner for a crime that in Canada would have earned him at most a month in the local hoosegow. It is a legal tragedy that in my opinion marks the capitulation of our sovereignty and underscores the hypocrisy around cannabis.
 
155Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Sat, Oct 17, 2009, 20:57


Now, THAT'S my kind of joint!

Los Angeles Prepares for Clash Over Marijuana

Can't we all just legalize this thing already?
 
156Tree
      ID: 248472317
      Mon, Oct 19, 2009, 09:03
haven't seen any larger news stories on this, as i just heard it on NY1 (man, i am really going to miss NY1 when i leave).

Obama administration says it won't target medical marijuana users in states where legal
 
157biliruben
      Leader
      ID: 589301110
      Mon, Oct 19, 2009, 09:33
Yeah, but it's still happening. He's got to figure out how to reign in the FBI.
 
158Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Sat, Jan 02, 2010, 12:52
Marijuana, on the forefront of medical technology...

 
159Mith
      ID: 43914286
      Tue, Jan 12, 2010, 07:28
NJ passess medical mj bill. Well done, Garden State.
 
160Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Wed, Mar 17, 2010, 22:06
A shooting and a beating death linked to medical marijuana have prompted new calls by law enforcement officials and marijuana advocates for Washington State to change how it regulates the drug and protects those who grow and use it.
 
161Seattle Zen
      ID: 1410391215
      Thu, Mar 25, 2010, 16:42
This could be a watershed moment for the marijuana movement.

Marijuana legalization initiative to be on November ballot in California.
The number of valid signatures reported by Los Angeles County, submitted minutes before Wednesday's 5 p.m. deadline, put the measure well beyond the 433,971 it needed to be certified. Supporters turned in 694,248 signatures, collecting them in every county except Alpine. County election officials estimated that 523,531 were valid. The measure's main advocate, Richard Lee, an Oakland marijuana entrepreneur, savored the chance to press his case with voters that the state's decades-old ban on marijuana is a failed policy. "We're one step closer to ending cannabis prohibition and the unjust laws that lock people up for cannabis while alcohol is not only sold openly but advertised on television to kids every day," he said. Lee, tapping $1.3 million from his businesses, has put together a highly organized campaign that he emphasized Wednesday would be led by a team of experienced political consultants, including Chris Lehane, a veteran operative who has worked in the White House and on presidential campaigns.
 
162walk
      Dude
      ID: 32928238
      Fri, Mar 26, 2010, 12:52
Makes some wonder if they should move back one day...
 
163Building 7
      ID: 471052128
      Fri, Mar 26, 2010, 13:52
"The measure, like the medical marijuana initiative, could put California on a collision course with the federal government. The possession and sale of marijuana remain a federal crime."

So, for marijuana, you want the state law to trump the federal law. But, for the new health care, you want the federal law to trump the state law (Requiring the purchase of health insurance).


 
164walk
      Dude
      ID: 32928238
      Fri, Mar 26, 2010, 14:59
Who is you? For me, yes, but I want the federal law to = the potentially new Cali law.
 
165Building 7
      ID: 232122716
      Sat, Mar 27, 2010, 17:20
They know who they are. They are welcome to chime in.

Even if the California initiative passes, it won't matter, because it is illegal under federal law. And we all know that the 10th amendment is no longer followed.
 
166Astade
      ID: 38542218
      Sat, Mar 27, 2010, 17:25
Good point B7. What happens when federal agencies and
state agencies are working against each other's interests?
Will it be like the movies where the fed agents have to be
followed?
 
167Mattinglyinthehall
      ID: 37838313
      Sat, Mar 27, 2010, 17:55
For the record; for the new health care, most of the modern political right also wants the federal law to trump the state law, in the form of overriding state regulations for medical treatments and procedures to allow unrestricted access to out-of-state medical insurance.
 
168Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Sat, Mar 27, 2010, 18:55
Also for the record: The Health Care Law has a provision allowing for the states to opt out of the plan, provided they set up their own plans which meets the targets of coverage, cost containment, etc.

Those state plans need not have any purchasing mandate at all.

The whole idea is that states can be incubators for alternative plans and ideas if they choose.
 
169Mith
      ID: 482583111
      Tue, Apr 20, 2010, 08:35
Origin of the code.

 
170Great One
      ID: 33326158
      Tue, Apr 20, 2010, 10:00
Happy 4/20 everyone!
 
171biliruben
      ID: 16105237
      Tue, Apr 20, 2010, 11:35
{Gurgle gurgle gurgle...}
 
172Great One
      ID: 33326158
      Tue, Apr 20, 2010, 12:32
Sounds like a Sublime song in here.
 
173biliruben
      ID: 16105237
      Wed, May 05, 2010, 00:24
My favorite drug reformer, lectures the Seattle City Council.
 
174biliruben
      ID: 16105237
      Wed, May 05, 2010, 00:32
Someone leaked the new drug strategy to Isikoff for his hit-piece on Kerlikowske.

But the strategy offers a fairly impressive list of innovations to set off against those disappointments. Of course the ones that matter most to me testing-and-sanctions programs for drug-involved offenders (which the “formidable” Bennett and McCaffrey never dared to endorse) and David Kennedy’s Drug Market Intervention program designed to eliminate problematic drug markets without mass arrests. Together, those two programs alone would radically reduce the links between drugs and crime, and yet because they’re neither “supply” or “demand” programs and have no visceral appeal to either side of the culture wars, they’ve struggled to get attention.

Rather than just promising to pump more money into the existing drug-treatment machinery, the strategy focuses on on the contribution the mainstream health-care effort could make toward dealing with substance abuse, in particular screening, brief intervention, and referral to treatment (SBIRT). The money potentially available for his purpose under the health care bill, and in particular through the community clinic system, dwarfs the formal treatment system. The strategy aims to make sure that potential gets used; if it does, the effective balance between “supply” and “demand” spending would shift radically in fact, though it wouldn’t change on paper.

Some of the innovations don’t leap off the page, but require a little bit of reading between the lines; they’re important nonetheless.


And surprise!
It was leaked to John Walters, probably by Murray, one of his disgraced lackeys.

So far, I don’t know the entire chain of leakage, but the path clearly runs through John Walters, the Bill Bennett sidekick who served as ONDCP director (“drug czar”) under Bush II. Walters’s tenure marked a low point in the non-entirely-glorious history of ONDCP. Walters and his staff behaved as if they were playing the English version of Charades and had been told to act out “epistemic closure.”

Walters seems not to have noticed that when he made a formatting change in the document on his computer that edit would be recorded in “Track Changes.” But p. 9 of the .pdf version of the document Isikoff posted has a box showing a change by “John Walters 4/29/10 3:02 PM.”

That timestamp, just one day before Isikoff’s story went up, strongly suggests that Walters was the direct source, though it’s barely possible that Walters gave it to some third party who in turn gave it to Isikoff.

A phone call to ONDCP confirms that Walters was not among the very small group of people outside the agency who had access to the document. No one I know had it, and I asked to see it and was told that I would get the executive summary only, 24 hours before the release time, under strict embargo. But it was available to everyone inside the agency on the ONDCP intranet.

So who inside ONDCP would have given the document to Walters? (The leak might have come from somewhere else in the White House – OMB, DPC, NSC – but Walters doesn’t have many friends in those places now.) The obvious suspect is David Murray, who was appointed by Walters to the job of Chief Scientist and acted as his ideological enforcer. Murray’s performance so outraged Capitol Hill that the appropriations committees made several increasingly vehement demands for his replacement, and – when Walters resisted – slashed what had been an eight-figure research budget almost to zero.

 
175Seattle Zen
      ID: 1410391215
      Thu, May 20, 2010, 19:42


Marijuana fuels new kitchen culture
“Everybody smokes dope after work,” said Anthony Bourdain, the author and chef who made his name chronicling drugs and debauchery in professional kitchens. “People you would never imagine.”

So while it should not come as a surprise that some chefs get high, it’s less often noted that drug use in the kitchen can change the experience in the dining room.
 
176Seattle Zen
      ID: 1410391215
      Tue, Jun 01, 2010, 15:17
49% in favor of Legalization in CA, 41% opposed.

California voters, by a modest margin, think they should be allowed to grow and consume marijuana, according to a new poll that also found more than 1 in 3 voters had tried pot and more than 1 in 10 had lit up in the past year.

"The good news for proponents is that they are starting off with a decent lead. The good news for the opposition is that initiatives that start off at less than 50% in the polls usually have a hard time," said Dan Schnur, director of USC's Jesse M. Unruh Institute of Politics. The poll also points to a demographic group that is likely to play a key role -- women, particularly those who are married. Men favor legalization, but women are split. Among married women, 49% reject the measure while 40% are in favor of the initiative. The measure's supporters say marijuana taxes could raise more than a billion dollars in revenue; opponents dispute that. Among voters, 42% believe that estimate and 38% think it is wildly exaggerated. The November initiative authorizes cities and counties, but not the state, to legalize and tax sales. In Los Angeles County, the epicenter of the Green Rush with more than 600 medical marijuana dispensaries, voters are most inclined to see pot taxes as a way to plug holes in local and state budgets.

Voters were also split over whether legalized marijuana would worsen social problems, such as increasing crime and triggering higher marijuana use among teenagers. Those concerns appear to have much more potency with voters than the debate over tax revenues. Among those who oppose the initiative, 83% think it would add to the state's social woes; 55% of married women also believe that. Attitudes toward legalization diverge sharply by age, with support much higher among younger voters. A 52% majority of voters 65 and older oppose legalization. Among voters between 45 and 64, 49% support it. But among those 30 to 44, 53% are in favor, and that rises to 61% among those 18 to 29. Chris Donnelly, a 25-year-old substitute teacher from San Diego, has never touched pot but strongly favors the initiative and believes it could support schools. "It wouldn't bother me one bit if marijuana were legal," the unaffiliated voter said. "I don't think it's any more harmful than alcohol."

The poll also offers an unusually detailed look at who is using marijuana in California.

Among those surveyed, 37% of voters said they had tried pot -- a figure roughly consistent with federal surveys of drug use -- and that group strongly supports the initiative. The 11% who had used marijuana in the last year favored legalization by a landslide, 82%. By contrast, the 57% of voters who said they have never used marijuana oppose the initiative.Though certain types of voters are more likely to light up, marijuana use cuts across all demographic slices, reaching beyond the cliches of skateboarders and aging hippies.

Among Democrats and voters who decline to state a party affiliation, 12% had used marijuana in the last year, as had 7% of Republicans. About a quarter of the voters in each slice of the state's electorate said they experimented with the drug in the past, but not in the last year. One of the biggest differences is between men and women. Among male voters, 45% said they had used marijuana, 14% in the past year. Among female voters, 29% said they had tried it, but just 8% in the past year. The heaviest use of marijuana skipped a generation. The youngest voters, between 18 and 29, reported the highest percentage of marijuana use in the past year, followed by voters between 45 and 64, who could be their parents or even grandparents. Most of those voters came of age in the marijuana-hazed Vietnam War era. The chance that a California voter has used marijuana is higher for college graduates than high school graduates and rises with income. Use is highest among single voters and lowest among married ones. Voters north of the Bay Area, home to the weed-raising Emerald Triangle, are most likely to have used marijuana, while voters in the Central Valley are least likely.

Full poll results
 
177Tree
      ID: 248472317
      Wed, Jun 16, 2010, 11:29
Finally, something Sarah Palin and I agree on...

“I think we need to prioritize our law enforcement efforts. And if somebody is going to smoke a joint in their house and not do anybody else any harm, then perhaps there are other things our cops should be looking at to engage in and clean up some of the other problems we have in society that are appropriate for law enforcement to do and not concentrate on such a, relatively speaking, minimal problem that we have in the country.”
 
178Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Mon, Jul 19, 2010, 22:27
Poll numbers are trending down in CA:
Prop. 19 (Marijuana Legalization)
Voter sentiment on Prop. 19 is closely divided, with more voters now opposing it (48%) than in favor (44%). Prop. 19 would allow people 21 years or older to possess, cultivate or transport marijuana for personal use and permit local governments to regulate and tax its commercial production and sales.
The three-fourths majority of voters who had some awareness of the measure prior to being surveyed are narrowly favoring its passage – 48% to 44%. However, Prop. 19 is opposed nearly two-to-one among the 23% of voters who had no prior awareness of the initiative.
There are large partisan differences in voting preferences on Prop. 19. While Democrats are backing it 53% to 38%, a two-to-one majority of Republicans (63% to 31%) are opposed. Non-partisans are evenly divided 46% to 46%.
There is majority support for Prop. 19’s passage (53% Yes vs. 38% No) among voters in the nine-county San Francisco Bay Area. Los Angeles County voters are about evenly divided (46% Yes vs. 47% No). However, in all other regions of the state sentiment is running against Prop. 19 by margins ranging from six to eighteen percentage points.
Men are split on the measure (48% Yes vs. 47% No), while women are on the No side 50% to 41%.
A small plurality of white non-Hispanics (48% to 43%) favors Prop. 19’s passage. However, each of the racial/ethnic subgroups measured in the survey – Latinos, African-Americans and Asian-Americans – are opposed to Prop. 19 by double-digit margins.
Voters age 18 – 29 age are supporting the marijuana initiative 52% to 39%. However, the survey finds that there are significant preference differences between younger voters who are white non-Hispanic and ethnic voters. While younger white non-Hispanic voters favor the initiative 53% to 35, younger ethnic voters oppose it five to four (52% to 45%).
Voters between ages 30-64 are generally divided in their preferences. However, voters age 65 and older are opposing the initiative by a big margin (57% to 33%).

Field Poll, 7/9/10
 
179The Left Behind
      ID: 66232012
      Wed, Jul 21, 2010, 13:17
If you support the legalization of marijuana and other drugs do you also support the ability of employers to fire you if you fail a drug test?
 
180biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Wed, Jul 21, 2010, 16:03
We should be firing based on performance. Are these
performance enhancing drugs? ;)

That said, if a worker is stupid enough to sign a contract with
that stipulation and an employer is fool enough to hire
someone so inept and incompetent that they can't find an
employer that trusts them to be able to do their jobs, then
that's between the crappy boss and the crappy worker.
 
181Seattle Zen
      ID: 1410391215
      Wed, Jul 21, 2010, 19:43
There are two types of employers - private and government. Government employers are ruled by a ton of different laws and regulations. Here in WA, only in certain positions of public safety is a government agency allowed to drug test.

Private employers have far fewer restrictions. Right now, they have the right to test for drugs and the only restrictions I am aware of arise from the ADA. If your disability requires that you take drug X and your employer tests you and fires you for a positive test for X, I think you have a strong claim.

This issue is not settled in all the states that allow patients to use medical marijuana. Personally, I believe an employer should not be able to fire a medical marijuana patient simply because he is using the medicine his/her doctor has suggested for him/her, but not all courts agree with me.
 
182boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Thu, Jul 22, 2010, 09:39
This issue is not settled in all the states that allow patients to use medical marijuana. Personally, I believe an employer should not be able to fire a medical marijuana patient simply because he is using the medicine his/her doctor has suggested for him/her, but not all courts agree with me.

I think the problem arises when the question is what is medical reasoning.

 
183biliruben
      ID: 16105237
      Wed, Jul 28, 2010, 07:36
Kleiman on prop 19.

As I’ve pointed out, Prop. 19, the California marijuana-legalization initiative, is nonsense: it can’t do what it purports to do, because a state can’t tax and regulate a federal felony. But I’ll probably vote for it anyway, as long as I’m sure it won’t pass. Voting “No” means providing material assistance to the drug warriors – people like Louis R. (Skip) Miller, the chairman of DARE America – and their relentless disinformation campaign.
 
184Frick
      ID: 16635287
      Wed, Jul 28, 2010, 08:35
Would an employer have the right to terminate an employee if the employee failed a drug test and they had a medical card?

If the doctor was part of their health network I think it would be tough. If it was a out-of-network doctor I feel it would be more likely.

Can we agree that anyone can get a medical marijuana card in California? No medical need is really needed.
 
185Building 7
      Leader
      ID: 171572711
      Wed, Jul 28, 2010, 09:20
I was walking along Venice Beach a year ago in March , and aome lady came up and said I needed to see the doctor. I said , Yeah right. And she said, You need to get a prescription. I didn't know what she was talking about. Later, I found out it was for medical marijuana. They were recruiting people off the sidewalk. Of course, it was Venice Beach, though.
 
186biliruben
      ID: 34435239
      Wed, Jul 28, 2010, 11:10
I don't know much about the law, but I'm pretty sure an employer can discriminate based on disability, if that disability interferes with the performing of an employee's job.

If an employee signs a contract that says he won't smoke dope and is willing to be tested, then an employee can fire him if he tests positive.

It all depends on terms of employment.
 
187Seattle Zen
      ID: 1410391215
      Thu, Jul 29, 2010, 19:30
A federal-state law inconsistency shouldn't stop Californians from legalizing marijuana
Let's think this through. If Proposition 19 passes, two important balls roll into the feds' court. The first is that the sole responsibility and expense of enforcing marijuana prohibition will be shifted to them. After Nov. 2, marijuana "offenders" could be arrested only by federal agents, prosecuted only under federal law, and sentenced only to federal detention.

If the feds undertook this, cases involving simple possession cases and small-time marijuana businesspeople, usually relegated to state courts, would flood federal courthouses. But even with a drastic increase in funding for federal enforcement, such activity would barely put a dent in California's marijuana trade, and would fail to stifle California's policy change, as the federal government has failed to do since the first medical marijuana laws were passed 14 years ago. Moreover, justifying the invasion into a state's province to undermine the will of the voters at such great expense to taxpayers would be highly questionable, especially in the current economic climate, not to mention a political climate that is at best lukewarm on prohibitionist policies.

The second ball is even more significant. Voter approval of Proposition 19 would shift to the feds the responsibility and burden of justifying marijuana prohibition in the first place. Now, the Washingtonians who have never questioned decades of anti-pot propaganda can explain to the people of California why we cannot be trusted to determine our state's marijuana policies. Let them endorse the prohibition laws' usefulness as a tool of oppressing minorities. Let them celebrate how minor marijuana violations cost people their jobs, their housing, custody of their kids, and entrap them permanently in vast criminal justice databases. Let them justify the utter hypocrisy of the legal treatment of alcohol and tobacco, as compared with the illegal treatment of marijuana. Let them tell us how many more people will have to be prosecuted and punished before marijuana is eradicated, how much that will cost, and where the money will come from.

And this new poll is dramatically different from the Field Poll linked above.

52%-36% in favor of Prop 19. Wow, we can only hope so!
 
188Building 7
      Leader
      ID: 171572711
      Fri, Jul 30, 2010, 13:35
Pot Reviewer Gets Paid To Get High

A Denver man gets paid to smoke pot and write about it as one of the first medical marijuana critics in the country.

"He has his journalism degree," a Westword editor said. "He was a good writer, and he could also punctuate and he could spell, which was very different than a lot of people who applied for the job."

Breathes has been smoking marijuana for 15 years to ease chronic stomach pains. Now his medicine is paying his mortgage.

"Load up a little bit and taste it," he said as he tested a joint he bought at a local dispensary. "Try and taste the smoke as it comes out. It has a really woody finish, almost like a mesquite finish to it. After a few hits, try to see what kind of buzz it is."
 
189Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 18:21
It's that time of year, again

Seattle Hempfest this weekend, Aug 21 & 22.

I'll be speaking on the Main Stage on Saturday at 12:40pm and on McWilliams Stage at 1:50pm on Sunday. Bring your friends, it's free!



What's going on in Seattle?

Seattle Is at the Vanguard of Legalizing Pot, So Why Are arrest levels Worse Than Ever?
These Are the Worst of Times

If you thought pot legalization in Seattle had already arrived—think again. Despite voters making pot possession the lowest law-enforcement priority in 2003, Seattle police are arresting more people on low-level marijuana charges this year than any year in the last decade.

Between January 1 and June 30, Seattle police have arrested 172 people for marijuana possession, according to records obtained from the Seattle City Attorney's Office. While that's not a lot compared to, say, New York City, that's far more than double the rate of arrests at the midpoint of last year, when cops had arrested 62 people (there were 120 arrests all year in 2009). And that's more than triple the rate in 2004, the year after Initiative 75 passed, when police had arrested 47 people for pot possession by this point in the year.

These Are the Best of Times

All those pot cases from this year that you just read about? None of them will be prosecuted.

City Attorney Pete Holmes, who took office in January, refuses to slap a misdemeanor conviction on any of those people. It was a campaign promise—a promise that helped him win the election with 64 percent of the vote—that he refuses to budge on. And he's no wild card at City Hall: The mayor wants to legalize marijuana outright.

What a joke! The police are making all these arrests KNOWING that the prosecutor will dismiss them out of hand. I can't believe the police chief is not looking for another job.

Excellent piece in Rolling Stone urging California voters to pass Prop. 19.
 
190Frick
      ID: 97321912
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 19:15
So cops in the field should decide if they should arrest someone based on their opinion of whether the person will be prosecuted, not on the laws that are in written and in effect?

 
191Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 19:30
So cops in the field should decide if they should arrest someone based on their opinion of whether the person will be prosecuted, not on the laws that are in written and in effect?

It's not the officer's "opinion" that matters here, it a known fact. Every Seattle PD officer knows that the prosecutor is not going to prosecute ANY marijuana cases.

How is it any different than a police force continuing to use a radar gun brand that has been proven unreliable and not admitted into evidence? Officers continue to pull people over and the prosecutors continue to throw those cases in the garbage. Idiocy!
 
192Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 19:41
That is not the best analogy Zen, since it isn't about how the cops catch someone breaking the law. A better one is: Should the cops ignore all speeders if they know they will just be let off?

Cops, like it or not, don't have the option of always and completely ignoring the law when they see someone breaking it. It isn't their place--that is the prosecutor's place (and rightfully so).
 
193Frick
      ID: 97321912
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 20:20
So you want police to have the power to only enforce laws that they want to?

There is a law on the books, that is the only fact.

The DA has said that he will not prosecute marijuana cases, that does not mean that he won't change his mind. Until the law is taken off the books, the police should enforce it.

As far as using radar guns, yes a few cases have been thrown out of court, but many more have held up in court. Are their technicalities that can get a case thrown out, sure.

If you don't want any marijuana arrests, remove the the marijuana rules from the books. That should be fairly simple if the majority of citizens in Seattle want the law removed.
 
194DWetzel
      ID: 33337117
      Thu, Aug 19, 2010, 20:42
"If you don't want any marijuana arrests, remove the the marijuana rules from the books. That should be fairly simple if the majority of citizens in Seattle want the law removed."

Dang it, stop making so much sense so succinctly.

It's not the police's job to decide what is and is not going to be prosecuted.
 
195bibA
      ID: 48627713
      Fri, Aug 20, 2010, 08:45
The best police officers makes use of their common sense. There are many statutes that are not followed by the letter of the law.

Oral sex is illegal in 18 states, (including Arizona lol). Should cops arrest everyone who engages in it? Of course not. Common sense.

I believe that if the arrest rates are up in Seattle even though it is pretty much public knowledge that these cases will not be filed, it is because the arresting officers are making what they believe to be a moral judgement call, which in my opinion anyway, is not using either common sense, or using their time most efficiently.

 
196Pancho Villa
      ID: 29118157
      Fri, Aug 20, 2010, 09:57
I wonder if Seattlites who smoke weed are just getting bolder about where they smoke ganja, resulting in the cops clamping down.

A lot of public parks prohibit alcohol consumption. You can be cited just for having an empty beer can in your car. Cigarette smoking is prohibited almost everywhere in most states.

I'd have to see more data on these arrests before I condemn the Seattle cops.
 
197biliruben
      ID: 34435239
      Fri, Aug 20, 2010, 10:27
I was thinking the same thing.

My guess is that a larger factor is that we lost our fairly pro-pot police chief (who went on to become Obama's drug czar - heh), in March of 2009. He was replaced (interim and now permanent) by a career, through the ranks, unimaginative Chief, who probably has had a different message to his beat cops the Kerlikowske did.
 
198Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Sep 01, 2010, 17:09
Re 179, 180 & 181

The One and Only Medical Marijuana Wrongful- Termination Lawsuit in Washington
Back in 2006, "Jane Roe" interviewed for a job at TeleTech, a Colorado-based firm with an office in Bremerton that offers customer service work for telecommunications companies. For years, Roe had suffered from crippling migraine headaches. Her lawyer, Michael Subit says that his client had tried every kind of prescription drug. They either they didn't work at all or the side effects were so bad that "the cure was worse than the disease." Eventually, however, Roe found something that kept the pain at bay: marijuana. During her interview, Roe told TeleTech that she smoked. She told them she would fail a drug test if she was forced to take one. Still, TeleTech hired her and gave her the test anyway. Subit says Roe worked for two weeks answering phones without incident. Then, one day, she was called into her boss's office and told she'd failed the drug test, just like she said she would. Roe was fired, told that TeleTech couldn't have an employee working at its offices who smoked marijuana at home. Her wrongful termination suit was dismissed by a Kitsap County trial judge, a decision which was then upheld by the Court of Appeals. The Washington Supreme Court has accepted the case and will hear arguments during its winter session.

Only one case nationally other than Roe's has made it to such a high court. California's Supreme Court decided that because the use of marijuana remains a crime under federal law, an employer there was justified in firing a person who, like Roe, had used the drug for medicinal purposes.

Stick it to them, Jane!
 
199clyde
      ID: 397332810
      Tue, Sep 07, 2010, 01:15
John McKay, former United States attorney in Seattle (Until Bush/Gonzales).............

"Congress has failed to recognize what many already know about our policy of criminal prohibition of marijuana — it has utterly failed. Listed by the U.S. government as a "Schedule One" drug alongside heroin, the demand for marijuana in this country for decades has outpaced the ability of law enforcement to eliminate it. Perhaps this is because millions of Americans smoke pot regularly and international drug cartels, violent gangs and street pushers work hard to reap the profits.

Law-enforcement agencies are simply not capable of interdicting all of this pot and despite some successes have not succeeded in thwarting criminals who traffic and sell marijuana. Brave agents and cops continue to risk their lives in a futile attempt to enforce misguided laws that do not match the realities of our society."
 
200Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Thu, Sep 16, 2010, 17:37
School administrators meet a US drug war: The perfect storm of righteous buffonery.
 
201Building 7
      Leader
      ID: 171572711
      Sat, Oct 02, 2010, 09:17
California Governor Signs Marijuana Decriminalization Bill

From stopthedrugwar.com

Interesting timing on this, 30 days before a vote on whether to make it legal.
 
202Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Oct 27, 2010, 13:12
George Soros donates a cool Million bucks to Yes on Prop 19.

I'm sure that if Baldwin lived in CA and was on the fence, this news would certainly get his attention :)

I've learned that the spokesman for the No campaign is a high school friend of mine. Sure hope to rub the win in his face! The polls are all over the map, the ones I've read recently do not seem very reliable - more like push polls. This is one race that will be a real nail biter, it could be tight or a ten point win in either direction, seriously.
 
203Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Wed, Oct 27, 2010, 13:51
#201: That action may have actually hurt the chances of Prop 19 passing, I think.
 
204Tree, not at home
      ID: 18342816
      Mon, Nov 01, 2010, 18:01
Zach Galifianakis lights up joint on live TV
 
205Boldwin
      ID: 311018917
      Tue, Nov 09, 2010, 18:18
This is your spider on drugs.

 
206Farn
      Leader
      ID: 451044109
      Sat, Nov 13, 2010, 14:22
It looks like Prop 203, medicinal marijuana, in Arizona is going to pass after trailing on election night. Provisional ballots and early ballots are overwhelming supporting the proposition. Still a bit more to count but its taken a decent lead now.


Prop 203 in Arizona
 
207Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Sat, Nov 13, 2010, 14:26
Way to go Arizona. When a reactionary state like that can support medical marijuana, it won't be long that the federal government will have to back off.
 
208Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Fri, Dec 10, 2010, 12:45
Andrew Sullivan has compiled a series of moving and compelling reader emails about marijuana use into a book.

Sounds kinda boring when I write it that way, but the many many emails are riveting reading.

 
209Boldwin
      ID: 211117110
      Sat, Dec 11, 2010, 01:25
Let them smoke. Aborted or ineffectual stoner, either way natural selection at work.
 
210biliruben
      ID: 34820210
      Sat, Dec 11, 2010, 10:13
Social Darwinism returns to vogue.

Should we sterilize those wasted breeders while we are at it?
 
212Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Sun, Dec 12, 2010, 12:29
#209: So the Christianist invokes social Darwinism as a reason not to be empathetic. Nice.
 
220Tree, not at home
      ID: 3910441615
      Mon, Dec 20, 2010, 12:10
Marijuana Legalization Billboard Greets I-5 Drivers In Washington

 
221Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Wed, Dec 22, 2010, 13:35
Montana jury stages "mutinee" and refuses to convict over small amount of marijuana

Good for them.
 
222Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Thu, Dec 23, 2010, 13:49
Now I think I have seen it all...

Pat Robertson urges the legalization of marijuana!
“I’m not exactly for the use of drugs, don’t get me wrong, but I just believe that criminalizing marijuana, criminalizing the possession of a few ounces of pot, that kinda thing it’s just, it’s costing us a fortune and it’s ruining young people,” Robertson said. “Young people go into prisons, they go in as youths and come out as hardened criminals. That’s not a good thing.”

Of course, his spokesmen have sent out press releases backspinning these statements, but still...
 
223Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Tue, Dec 28, 2010, 14:13
A moving follow-up to one of the stories in the Cannabis Closet.

If anyone knows someone close who is or did suffer from cancer, this guys reaction to the oncologist is spot on.
 
224Boldwin
      ID: 410311814
      Tue, Jan 18, 2011, 15:31
Very musical ode to chemical test dummy.
 
225biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Tue, Jan 18, 2011, 15:36
When you link directly to multimedia, could you warn us?

I only check this site from my phone anymore.
 
226Boldwin
      ID: 410311814
      Tue, Jan 18, 2011, 15:40
Musical ode wasn't helpful? Mouseover said youtube....that can't be done on Iphone perhaps?
 
227biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Tue, Jan 18, 2011, 17:17
No. Phones don't have mice.
 
228Boldwin
      ID: 410311814
      Tue, Jan 18, 2011, 17:52
Fingerover? I'll play with my son's to see why that's so undoable.
 
229Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Mar 02, 2011, 17:08
Drug Czar is not happy with The Seattle Times editorial board and he's coming to town to twist their arms.
It's... an announcement that Seattle's last bastion of drug-war defense has fallen. (All the elected officials representing Seattle who could be reached by press time, from city council members to state legislators, said they supported legalizing marijuana.) In other words, negative political ramifications for wanting to legalize pot—a radical position only 13 years ago—are now nonexistent here. At every social and political stratum, wanting legal pot is Seattle's new status quo. And the final proof is that the Seattle Times, the voice of the status quo, is publicly acknowledging this fact.

Alison Holcomb, director of the ACLU of Washington's drug policy project, sees the newspaper's shift like this: "We've moved beyond the point of all of us agreeing that prohibition is a failure to insisting that our legislatures actually craft a new solution."

But not everyone is doing triumphant bong hits. Immediately after the first pot editorial came off the press, White House Office of National Drug Control Policy director Gil Kerlikowske (also the former Seattle police chief) contacted Ryan Blethen. Kerlikowske wanted to sit down personally with the paper's full editorial board. "I drew the obvious conclusion," said Bruce Ramsey, the Seattle Times editorial writer who wrote the first unbylined piece. "He didn't like our editorial."

Or this one, either.

Expect to see quite a few of these posters around Seattle this Friday.
 
230Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Sat, Mar 05, 2011, 17:02
An Hour with the Drug Czar
As it turned out, he was cordial and almost laid-back. At one point he steered the conversation to prescription drug abuse, which had nothing to do with our editorial. When we asked him about legal marijuana he did disagree with us, but so gently that some of the attendees wondered why he had come at all.
 
231Boldwin
      ID: 50247518
      Sat, Mar 05, 2011, 19:51
You joining the tea party if they're willing to defund the drug czar?
 
232Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Sun, Mar 06, 2011, 21:39
You joining the tea party if they're willing to defund the drug czar?

I will gladly join arms with the anyone willing to defund the Drug Czar and these endless wars. I could even be talked into the eventual raising of SS retirement age to 66, what will it take for me to get you into a NEW CAR?! I'm wheeling and dealing!
 
233Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Mon, Mar 28, 2011, 20:41
"tough love" or "FU, Druggie!"?
 
234Boldwin
      ID: 16253251
      Mon, Mar 28, 2011, 22:18
Powermad sadist. Same dynamic at work as in a DCFS supervisor. The more they abuse people the more inclined to abuse they become and the bigger kick they get out of it.
 
235Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Mon, Mar 28, 2011, 23:13
I agree.
 
236Boldwin
      ID: 16253251
      Tue, Mar 29, 2011, 02:20
Hi, my name is Amanda Williams and I'm a power addict.
 
237bibA
      ID: 48627713
      Tue, Mar 29, 2011, 09:57
Huh - All this time I've had it half wrong. For some reason I had assumed Boldwin was a dude.
 
238Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Tue, Mar 29, 2011, 18:05
Small businesses have become the latest engines for medical marijuana advocacy in the U.S., "The thing that's really driving legalization is entrepreneurialism,"



Hemp kingpin ditches Amsterdam for Denver...
 
239Boldwin
      ID: 16317113
      Mon, Apr 11, 2011, 17:05
Born To Be Wasted
 
240Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Sat, May 14, 2011, 11:16
Not sure where to put this, which is a long and very engaging story of how the police spend unbelievable amounts of money chasing, well, nothing.

Throwing money at the cops sometimes means they will make up problems to throw it at themselves. And we all pay the price.

Probably worthy of another thread, perhaps, but low-level drugs are often the way the cops try to flip people into confessing for crimes the cops themselves set up.
 
241Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Fri, May 27, 2011, 20:33
Another botched raid, this one killing a former Marine.
 
242Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Thu, Jun 02, 2011, 16:29
Global Commission on Drug Policy calling drug war a "failure"

Want to save a ton of money on the budget? Stop paying police a ton of money to track down and arrest people for small amounts of drugs, the courts to prosecute them, and prisons to house them.

We have more people in our prisons on non-violent drug arrests than are in many other countries total. In 2008 we had about 251,000 people in state prisons on drug arrests, resulting in costs of about $6.3 billion/year, a large hunk of these are non-violent drug users.
 
243Khahan
      ID: 373143013
      Thu, Jun 02, 2011, 16:52
I had read that earlier PD. I like how 3 former presidents from central/south America in the heart of drug country and a business big-wig are making the decision that drugs should be legalized along with "A former British ambassador to Colombia during Cesar Gaviria's presidency (1990-1994) and a longtime advocate of the legal regulation of drugs"

I had read this on msnbc earlier. They went into a bit more detail.

I'm just making fun of the commission. It does seem like it could have a pre-disposed bent to it. However, I agree there is merit for some drugs to be legalized (or at least have drugs rescheduled).
 
244Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Thu, Jun 02, 2011, 16:57
It does sound a bit like the Irish arguing against prohibition. But Schultz and Volcker are solid American conservatives, and the arguments about organized crime are worth a look themselves.

Plus, the fact that drug use, and the associated crime, has risen rather than dropped off. The more we spend, the less effective we are at reaching whatever goal we are supposedly reaching for.

There are some issues like drugs and eminent domain for which I find myself in some solid agreement with the libertarians.
 
245Boldwin
      ID: 554211
      Thu, Jun 02, 2011, 19:23
I'd sure feel better about a massive release of MJ users than I do about the early release of violent criminals we see from cash strapped states from time to time.
 
246weykool
      ID: 343561414
      Thu, Jun 02, 2011, 20:15
I am 100% on board with taking a look at drugs and drug use.
Legalize it and tax it and then use the money for education and rehab.
At the same time we should add alcohol into the mix.
We need to take a look at advertising that tries to glamorize it.
We banned cigarette adds perhaps the time has come to do the same with alcohol.

The question is where do we draw the lines?

Oxidado
According to the story this new drug is more toxic than crack cocain, addicting after one use, and lethal after 1 year.
Yikes.
 
247Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 12:01
Huge news here in WA. City Attorney Holmes, former US Attorney McKay and others file initiative to legalize and regulate marijuana.
The initiative would regulate the recreational use of marijuana in a way similar to how the state regulates alcohol. It would legalize marijuana for people older than 21, authorize the state Liquor Control Board to regulate and tax marijuana for sale in "stand-alone stores" and extend drunken-driving laws to marijuana, with blood tests to determine how much of the substance's active ingredient is present in a driver's blood. Taxing sales would bring the state $215 million a year, conservatively estimated, Holmes said. McKay, who spent five years enforcing federal drug laws as the U.S. attorney in Seattle before he was fired by the Bush administration in early 2007, said he hopes the initiative will help "shame Congress" into ending pot prohibition.

This is it!
 
248Boldwin
      ID: 7536223
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 12:38
The Fed will bulldoze any state efforts at legalization. It's no fun sitting in a federal court arguing how legal the state feels it is.

How is that California medical MJ initiative working out? Last I heard the Feds had all but snuffed that out.
 
249Boldwin
      ID: 7536223
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 12:42
Harshing your mellow since Bill Ayers was a pup.
 
250Building 7
      Leader
      ID: 171572711
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 13:12
If it stays in your system for a month, how will they know if you got high 10 minutes ago or 10 days ago? How will they know to suspect that you are high so as to give you a blood test? You're driving too slow? You're munching on a bag of Doritos? Either one, I don't see what the problem is with driving.
 
251weykool
      ID: 343561414
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 15:25
The problem with driving is being on the raod with other drivers who are impaired.
I have no problem if you want to sit in your home and take whatever drugs you want including alcohol.
But there is an issue that arises when you go out in public.
I should have the right to not be around people who are high/impaired whether it be at a sporting event or on a public highway.
If the claim is that people who use pot are no less impaired then the burden of proof rests with those who want it legalized.

Questions: If pot use is legalized would growing your own plants also be legalized?
If not how would you stop people from growing it in their basement?
If growing pot for your personal use is legalized why would we need pot stores?
 
252boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 15:58
I am sure the rules would be similar to home made alcohol you can make up to certain amount or in the case grow up certain amount. And I am sure just like alcohol most people will choose to buy it. I guess it would be interesting if the estimated tax revenues have accounted for this?
 
253Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 16:27
Last I heard the Feds had all but snuffed that out.

Surprise, surprise, Baldwin is at the ass end of the reality spectrum. There are over 1000 medical cannabis dispensaries in operation in the Golden State.
 
254Perm Dude
      ID: 5510572522
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 16:36
I'd heard that the federales were still very heavy-handed about marijuana use--essentially saying that federal law trumps state law in this area.

However, Barney Frank & Ron Paul introduce legislation to end federal drug laws about marijuana. Essentially, they want to kick marijuana regulation to the states.

Could be a real money-saver on the federal level as a nice bonus.
 
255Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 17:11


Outstanding piece on New Approach Washington's initiative.

A Smart New Initiative Makes Washington State Ground Zero in the National Fight to End Marijuana Prohibition
 
256Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Jun 22, 2011, 17:14
For those who they appeal to, here are the Fisher-Price-like graphs from the story above.





 
257Seattle Zen
      Leader
      ID: 055343019
      Mon, Aug 01, 2011, 00:58


20th Anniversary Seattle Hempfest is three days this year!

August 19, 20 and 21!



I'm speaking again this year. Hope to see you there.
 
259Boldwin
      ID: 35615181
      Mon, Aug 01, 2011, 01:57
I missed #256 somehow. What I really like is that with the legal growers you can mostly skip the 'hack off 40,000 heads and place them on Mexican fenceposts, step.

Don't like the 'exponential growth in drug addiction' step tho.

Unless you legalize it all there just might be the chance even more dollars eventually chase the hard drugs and subsequently even more heads on fenceposts.
 
261Perm Dude
      ID: 39961218
      Thu, Oct 13, 2011, 20:28
Administration now going after those who advertise legal medical marijuana?

At what point do conservatives start getting over their old biases on this issue and start seeing it for the government instrusion it is?
 
262Boldwin
      ID: 35615181
      Thu, Oct 13, 2011, 20:36
Those are some Bush hold-overs doing that, PD? 8]
 
263Perm Dude
      ID: 39961218
      Thu, Oct 13, 2011, 20:38
Very few, I've read. Mostly this is Obama doing what Clinton did: Going fast and hard after drugs of all sorts, with no difference between pot and smack.
 
264Building 7
      Leader
      ID: 171572711
      Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 14:31
50% of the people approve of legalization.
1% of politicians approve of legalization.
Something out of whack here.

 
265Boldwin
      ID: 35615181
      Tue, Oct 25, 2011, 17:02
Something out of whack here.

The people donating to the candidates.
 
266Seattle Zen
      ID: 10732616
      Wed, Nov 23, 2011, 13:33
This is outrageous. If you aren't safe from the Drug War in Amsterdam, where possible could you go?

Amsterdam police are in the process of raiding the High Times Cannabis Cup for the first time in its 24-year history.
 
267Boldwin
      ID: 221047234
      Wed, Nov 23, 2011, 15:23
Something out of whack here.

Yeah, it is. The same people running drugs from the golden triangle forever and Columbia and Afghanistan today can afford all the politicians it takes to maintain their monopoly and maintain their price.
 
268Building 7
      ID: 541057215
      Wed, Nov 23, 2011, 16:17
I'm sure the alcohol lobby is doing their part, also.
 
269sarge33rd
      ID: 251133912
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 15:22
TX and "justice"

Headline:

Facing life in prison for a half Ounce of medical marijuana

money quote:

Moral of the story is, stay away from Texas!
 
270DWetzel
      ID: 53326279
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 15:34
Headline is kinda misleading, which is kind of a shame because otherwise there's a lot of truth to the article.

The sensible thing for him to do would, of course, have been to stay in California. Questionable law or not, there had to be some awareness that it was illegal to do it in Texas, and that there would be consequences.

Obviously, it's dumb to have those consequences be as high as what they're charging him with.
 
271sarge33rd
      ID: 251133912
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 15:44
not saying he is a bright fella, but the headline isnt wrong. The intent to deliver part, is pure BS and classic ex of
TX Justice".

He is charged with possession of a controlled substance with intent to deliver, a half ounce must be "Big Time" in Texas. Diaz was indicted by a Brown County grand jury, and now he faces up to life in prison, and without his much needed medication. He is now in jail on a $40,000 bond awaiting trial.

He is indeed, facing life in prison.
 
272boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 16:56
I can imagine how smoking marijuana helps with Asthma. Seems like the last thing you would want when you have Asthma is smoke in your lungs, but what do I know?
 
273DWetzel
      ID: 53326279
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 17:23
He is indeed facing life in prison, which I agree is laughably bogus, but he's got two different kinds of MJ with him, for one thing. Now, I admit to not being up on the various medicinal uses of marijuana and this may be like carrying around both Advil and Tylenol for your back issues, but that raises a couple additional questions.

The "intent to deliver" is obviously stupid and not worth discussing (and strikes me as a "DA throws the kitchen sink at someone trying to get a plea agreement" charge, which is dumb but happens often enough that I'm not ready to throw a fit over it). He is, however, carrying around two different kinds of marijuana in a state which he knows does not allow it for medicinal purposes. That's he is being charged with something, and something that requires some jail time, doesn't surprise me.


(If I had my way, I'd agree that most if not all of this stuff ought to be decriminalized, and I further agree that it's dumb to have a zillion different drug schedules for different substances. But on the list of things to be outraged about, a guy flouting what he knew was the law gets little sympathy from me. )
 
274sarge33rd
      ID: 251133912
      Fri, Dec 09, 2011, 17:36
That he is innocent, is not under debate,. Nobody says he is. But there is no way in hell, he should be facing LIFE, for essentially being less than the sharpest tool in the shed. And lets be honest...THATS his true crime here.
 
275Frick
      ID: 14082314
      Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:07
Stoned Driving

This is one of the major issues to get more support for legalizing marijuana IMO.
 
276DWetzel
      ID: 31111810
      Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 14:20
Meh, this seems like an issue that laws, technology and testing will catch up on pretty quickly; and until then we ought to be willing to proceed under imperfect but pretty darn good things like field "sobriety" tests and the like.

One smart thing we ought to be doing, and aren't, is testing driver's NORMAL reaction times as part of license renewals. Both because there are some people whose reactions are probably too slow to be safely driving a car (I'm looking at you, Granny), and because it provides an excellent baseline for situations like this.
 
277Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Mon, Apr 02, 2012, 23:10
Using police dogs to get false positives on drug searches.
 
278Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Tue, May 22, 2012, 13:39
Penn tells it like it is.
 
279Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Thu, Jun 21, 2012, 21:10
This is your DEA official on drugs...
 
281Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Wed, Jul 18, 2012, 18:15
California medical marijuana operation targeted by feds
The federal government is moving to shut down the nation’s largest and highest-profile medical marijuana dispensary operation, filing papers to seize properties in Oakland and San Jose where Harborside Health Center does business.

Copies of the federal Complaint for Forfeiture were taped to the front doors of the two dispensaries Tuesday, alleging that they were "operating in violation of federal law."

Medical marijuana advocates, as well as some state and local officials, decried the action, saying it hurts patients in legitimate need of the drug and breaks repeated promises by President Barack Obama’s Justice Department that it was targeting only operations near schools and parks or otherwise in violation of the state’s laws. Harborside was co-founded by outspoken marijuana activist Steve DeAngelo in 2006 and was the subject of a reality show, "Weed Wars," on the Discovery Channel last year. While other dispensary operators have sought a low profile since California’s four U.S. attorneys began cracking down on the industry in October, DeAngelo has consistently railed against the federal intervention, advocated for better state regulations and become a leader in the movement.


Feds Crack Down on California Medical Marijuana Clinics - WARNING, this link opens to Fox Business News! I don't know what is worse, Fox News or Steve DeAngelo's horrible, horrible hair.


There has been plenty of complaints from all over the political spectrum regarding federal prosecutors going after medical marijuana operations in medical marijuana states. The bottom line is this: The federal laws need to change RIGHT NOW.
 
282Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Wed, Jul 18, 2012, 18:32
Steve DeAngelo seems, well, reasonable in that short piece.

Andrew Sullivan mentioned this yesterday.
 
283Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Tue, Jul 24, 2012, 11:26
$1.25 million for WA I-502 media campaign.
An initiative to legalize and tax marijuana was buoyed this weekend by $1.25 million in new donations, allowing the campaign to place a big TV ad buy for August.

Initiative 502, the first marijuana-legalization initiative to make the state ballot, raised the money from just four donors, including $450,000 donations from Progressive Insurance founder Peter Lewis and an arm of the New York-based Drug Policy Alliance.

The donations will pay for a $1 million TV-ad blitz in August, before other campaigns saturate the airwaves, said I-502 campaign manager Alison Holcomb. Holcomb said the new contributions, which will be officially reported by the campaign early next week, included $250,000 from Edmonds travel guru Rick Steves, who previously donated $100,000; and $100,000 from the ACLU of Washington.

A new statewide poll, paid for by KING 5, finds 55 percent support for I-502 versus 32 percent opposition.
 
284Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Tue, Jul 24, 2012, 18:24


Oakland protesters call on Obama to freeze pot clinic crackdowns
OAKLAND — Hundreds of medical marijuana patients and advocates rallied here Monday in advance of an evening fundraiser by President Obama, calling on him to freeze federal crackdowns on cannabis dispensaries until he clarifies his administration's policies on operations that are following state and local laws.

The rally came two weeks after a federal forfeiture action against the Oakland-based Harborside Health Center, the nation's largest medical marijuana dispensary and one that has won acclaim as a model for the industry. In April, federal agents raided several Oakland businesses operated by prominent marijuana activist Richard Lee, forcing his dispensary — which, like Harborside, was permitted, taxed and backed by local officials — to close.

Obama and Atty. Gen. Eric Holder have separately said they would not interfere with dispensaries that are complying with state and local laws. But Melinda Haag, the U.S. attorney for the Northern District of California, has nevertheless cracked down on such operations.
 
285sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Wed, Aug 08, 2012, 01:51
Oregon ballot measure to legalize and regulate cannabis

Midway through July, Oregon joined two other states–Washington and Colorado–with a measure that would legalize cannabis use for those over the age of twenty-one.

Oregon takes it a step further than either other state, however, with unlimited possession and personal cultivation (with personal cultivation limited to six plants on the Colorado measure and strictly forbidden on Washington’s), as well as options to commercially cultivate and sell to the OCC (a regulatory agency that would be created; the Oregon Cannabis Commission). A table detailing the differences between the three measures up for voting is found here.

With medical legalization for the U.S. as a whole a possibility on October 16, the bold step by Oregon might be too soon.

But wait! Recreational use is not the only thing the initiative is trying to legalize. Also included is a measure to restore the hemp industry; the first few arguments on the initiative have nothing at all to do with the medicinal or intoxicating effects of the plant.

Whereas the people of the State of Oregon find that Cannabis hemp is an environmentally beneficial crop that:

(a) Yields several times more fiber, for paper and textiles, than any other plant;

(b) Yields cloth and paper of superior strength and durability without the application of pesticides during cultivation and without producing cancer-causing pollutants during processing;

(c) Yields more seed oil and protein, for prodigious and ecological biodiesel fuel, plastics and nutritious food, than any other plant;

(d) Yields more biomass than any other plant outside the tropics, though it grows well in the tropics too, and grows faster than any other plant on earth in the temperate and cooler climates.
 
286Boldwin
      ID: 18643169
      Wed, Aug 08, 2012, 05:18
e Yields more dead black 18-19 yr olds than any other cause.
 
287Perm D
      ID: 3210201915
      Wed, Aug 08, 2012, 05:20
The reason blacks are killed is because it is now illegal.

I suppose, when faced with the end of prohibition, you would extrapolate gangsters killed and therefore argue against it.
 
288boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Tue, Aug 28, 2012, 13:38
Not quite perfectly harmless for those under 18, or study shows what everyone has already thought pot makes you dumb.
 
289Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Tue, Sep 04, 2012, 14:47
There has been a lot of in-fighting in the movement here in WA, which is truly disappointing. Every single marijuana reform organization outside of WA is in favor of I-502. Here's a great synopsis why.

The Debate in Washington State Over Legalizing Marijuana Is Off-Track
I've recently returned to MPP's headquarters in the District of Columbia after attending the Seattle Hempfest in the other Washington. If you didn't already know, Hempfest is the largest marijuana-policy-reform event in the world, not to mention the second-largest event of any kind in Washington state. More than 150,000 people attended this year's event, which was spread out over three days.

Unlike the 20 annual Hempfests that preceded this one, this year's event included a real debate, which was whether marijuana users should vote for Initiative 502 -- the marijuana-legalization initiative that will appear on the November 6 statewide ballot.

If this seems odd to you, it should. This is the first time that Washington voters will have the chance to end marijuana prohibition, and yet some marijuana users -- although thankfully a small minority -- are screaming that voters should defeat the initiative and maintain prohibition, because the initiative isn't perfect enough.

 
290Biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Tue, Sep 04, 2012, 16:18
What is your current active thc concentration?
 
291Boldwin
      ID: 20826410
      Tue, Sep 04, 2012, 19:08
Strange but true.
In one extreme case in the United Arab Emirates, poppy seeds found on a traveler's clothes led to imprisonment.
 
292Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Tue, Sep 04, 2012, 19:17
Zilch, bili
 
293biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Wed, Sep 05, 2012, 13:45
Really? Can it really distinguish that well? I'm not being facetious, I just don't know what the test is truly measuring and how, and whether it actually reflects true impairment.

I'm mostly playing devils advocate, because this may be the best we can do in any case.
 
294Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Wed, Sep 05, 2012, 14:27
The medical studies I have read conclude that even regular users' active THC in their blood vanishes somewhere between 3-5 hours after last use and are below 5 ng/ml within 2-3 hours. The studies had people smoke or vaporize. Most people assume that if the cannabis was consumed in a baked good, the active THC would last in the blood longer, but I have not seen any study that had their subjects consume cannabis that way.

Yes, there are a lot of patients who clamor on about how they are never below 5 ng/ml in their blood. They are merely speculating since very, very few of them have actually had blood draws tested.

I'm looking through a mile and a half of people bitching to each other in a "debate" over I-502 for the site to the studies I mentioned above...
 
295Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Thu, Sep 06, 2012, 13:10
Developing Science-Based Per Se Limits for Driving under the Influence of Cannabis (DUIC)

"THC levels drop rapidly after smoking marijuana. 'THC concentrations in serum typically drop to 1–4 ng/mL within 3–4 hours after consumption," the researchers reported (the concentrations in serum are equivalent of about 0.6 to 2.5 ng/mL of THC in blood, the report says, which is obviously even lower).'"

The Stranger Slog
 
296sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Mon, Sep 24, 2012, 19:55
Cancer Patient Fired By Wal-Mart For Medical Marijuana Use Loses Appeal

Like the site or no MITH, this is just wrong.

 
297Seattle Zen
      ID: 3603123
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 11:14
Editorial: Approve Initiative 502 — It’s time to legalize, regulate and tax marijuana

On Sunday, the Seattle Times had four editorials in favor of the legalization initiative I-502. WA just might be the first state in the US since the thirties where you can legally buy and possess marijuana.
The question for voters is not whether marijuana is good. It is whether prohibition is good. It is whether the people who use marijuana shall be subject to arrest, and whether the people who supply them shall be sent to prison. The question is whether the war on marijuana is worth what it costs.

Initiative 502 says no.
 
298Boldwin
      ID: 41839254
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 12:29
What's the point of approving on the state level when the feds will ignore it and prosecute anyway?
 
299sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 12:44
I dont imagine, the civil rights movement got advanced by beginning locally and then expanding outward.
 
300Perm Dude
      ID: 56832185
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 12:47
Exactly. Forcing the issue is the way to make movements occur.

Put another way: What is the point of passing restricting abortion requirements?
 
301boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 16:24
If nothing else maybe federal law will change to make it states rights issue. If people thing that Marijuana is harmless then what better experiment to allow the local level to legalize it or not just like gambling. If it turns out being a bad decisions they will quickly make illegal again and if not more areas will legalize it.
 
302biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 17:36
I don't think anyone is advancing the idea that Marijuana is completely harmless.

I think people are starting to get an inkling of the vast harm the criminalization of Marijuana has inflicted however. The alternative doesn't look very bad in comparison.
 
303Perm Dude
      ID: 56832185
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 17:58
I think that is exactly it. It is like an automatic 90 days in federal jail for littering. Saying that this is excessive is not saying littering is harmless.
 
304Boldwin
      ID: 458102522
      Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 23:13
#300

Fair point.
 
305Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Mon, Oct 01, 2012, 17:09
New Approach Washington deposited $1 million in new contributions last week and booked nearly $700,000 in television commercials to pass Initiative 502, says campaign manager Alison Holcomb. She expects "maybe as much as another $2 million" in contributions in the coming weeks, largely for ads targeting swing key voters.
Even California's infamous pot measure, Prop 19, which failed in 2010, petered out of cash with a total haul of about $4.5 million. On the other hand, Washington State is one-seventh the size and has fewer media markets, yet these donations may put I-502 on track for a $5 million or $6 million budget.

Why the big donor support? The latest windfall of cash follows a successful trial ad campaign in August, Holcomb says. Polling research last month found that the August TV commercial—depicting a mom endorsing marijuana legalization even though "I don't like it personally"—was persuasive with an essential female bloc. Holcomb explains, "We specifically wanted to talk to women about marijuana legalization. That there are donors willing to fund a fall campaign speaks to the fact that the ads were successful." She wouldn't divulge details of the polling.

Last week, New Approach Washington received donations, according to Holcomb, from former Progressive Insurance CEO Peter Lewis ($670,000), local philanthropists James and Cody Swift ($300,000), and Washington resident Carrie Rhodes ($30,000). The campaign reserved $688,000 worth of television time for the week running up to the election, Holcomb says, adding "I would love" to run four weeks of ads around the state.
 
306Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Sat, Oct 20, 2012, 13:44
Washington is not the only state voting legalize marijuana this year.



Initiative 64 in Colorado wants to regulate marijuana like alcohol.

It looks good in the polls... 50 pro 40 against.

Univ. of Denver poll

Tom Tancredo has endorsed, as has a boatload of labor unions, over 300 physicians, 130 professors, dozens of clergy and many, many elected officials.



Oregon is voting on Measure 80. They have struggled with funds because they have not had a huge lead in polls like WA and CO, so the money is being sent to those two states.
 
307Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Sat, Oct 27, 2012, 12:57
A great piece by a judge about mandatory minimum sentencing for low-level drug offenses.
 
308sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sat, Oct 27, 2012, 13:13
Great piece is right PD. Thanks for sharing that one.
 
309Seattle Zen
      ID: 3603123
      Sat, Nov 03, 2012, 15:46
A $2.8 million TV advertising blitz in October by the campaign to legalize marijuana appears to have given Initiative 502 a critical boost just as ballots are being cast.
Support among likely voters rose from 47 to 55 percent and opposition dropped from 40 to 38 percent, with the number of undecided voters shrinking. Another poll, commissioned by KING 5, reported nearly identical results: 55 to 37 in favor, with 7 percent undecided.
 
310Pancho Villa
      ID: 59645318
      Sun, Nov 04, 2012, 10:07
Colorado poised to pass Amendment 64 with the unlikely support of Tom Tancredo.

Tancredo, who ran for governor of Colorado in 2010 as a Constitution party candiate and was defeated by Democrat John Hickenlooper, finds himself once again on opposite sides of the philosophical spectrum of Gov. Hickenlooper who came out against Amendment 64 earlier this month.

“Colorado is known for many great things –- marijuana should not be one of them," Hickenlooper said in a statement. "Amendment 64 has the potential to increase the number of children using drugs and would detract from efforts to make Colorado the healthiest state in the nation. It sends the wrong message to kids that drugs are OK."

To which Tvert had strong words for the governor. "Governor Hickenlooper's statement today ranks as one of the most hypocritical statements in the history of politics," Tvert said. "After building a personal fortune by selling alcohol to Coloradans, he is now basing his opposition to this measure on concerns about the health of his citizens and the message being sent to children. We certainly hope he is aware that alcohol actually kills people.

 
311ChicagoTRS
      ID: 149171815
      Wed, Nov 07, 2012, 09:39
Well at least a couple things good came out of the election yesterday. Will be interesting to see how the federal government reacts to Colorado and Washington. I think the feds will fight back initially but they are not going to be able to stop this. The tide has officially turned and it is only a matter of time before mj is legalized across the country.
 
312Seattle Zen
      ID: 468232814
      Wed, Nov 07, 2012, 13:04


That's me with the beard just over the outstretched red arm. What a wonderful night, Barak Obama reelected and two states make marijuana legal. 75 years of prohibition falling apart at the seams.

I-502 is a winner!
 
313Perm Dude
      ID: 3210201915
      Wed, Nov 07, 2012, 13:13
I'll avoid going for the cheap joke about how you celebrated, Zen, and just say congrats.

Good job.
 
314sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Fri, Nov 09, 2012, 20:25
Professional forums are abuzz over how to handle this re drug testing, work comp claims, liability etc etc.

Breathalyzer tests for alcohol, but what is the workplace test for "impairment" or "under the influence" for THC?

More and more, potential employers are using hair follicles in pre-employment drug screening. So, you're a recreational once in a while smoker who moves from CO to GA. Apply for work, get tested, its positive and they decline to hire you. Now what?

Dont get me wrong, I think legalization is absolutely the right thing to do, but as it happens incrementally, there will be issues to be dealt with.
 
315Mith
      ID: 98342014
      Wed, Nov 14, 2012, 21:09
Betsy Woodruff at the National Review
Much ink has been spilt in describing the precise nature of the soul-searching the GOP is undergoing in the wake of getting totally shellacked last Tuesday. There are a plethora of suggestions — of varying degrees of helpfulness — as to how the Republican party can re-brand and re-orient itself; ranging from capitulating on taxes to deciding that gay marriage isn’t a hill to die on. But there’s one easy ideological maneuver that Republicans could make that would simultaneously burnish their stance as the party of freedom and expand their base while alienating the president from his. It is a move that might also make one swing state a little easier to win in 2016. Congressional Republicans and conservative leaders could get on the weed bandwagon.
Yes, the National Review.

 
316Seattle Zen
      ID: 3603123
      Wed, Nov 14, 2012, 23:46
Congressional Republicans and conservative leaders could get on the weed bandwagon.

Our bandwagon has plush carpets and sofas. We've got a sweet leather sofa reserved for Republican leaders. What took you so long? :)
 
317Boldwin
      ID: 1210341416
      Thu, Nov 15, 2012, 06:48
Heck, I'd even be for election day opium dens. Keep them hippies down for the count.
 
318Tree
      ID: 57842011
      Thu, Nov 15, 2012, 12:04
Keep them hippies down for the count.

hi. 1969 called.
 
319Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Fri, Nov 16, 2012, 18:33
Drug dominoes begin to topple
Call it the Marijuana domino effect. Less than two weeks after Washington and Colorado voted to legalize and regulate cannabis, lawmakers in five other states say they are considering similar bills. In Latin American, Mexican President Felipe Calderon says Uncle Sam now has lost the “moral authority” to ask other nations to maintain the cannabis prohibition and combat trafficking. What didn’t seem remotely possible a fortnight ago suddenly seems inevitable.

Few would have predicted the pot prohibition could fall almost overnight like the Iron Curtain, nevertheless the two-state triumph for has set off a series of tremors that suggest the people’s will has shifted. America appears to have reached a tipping point in terms of attitudes toward cannabis and, if the weight of public opinion truly has passed the fulcrum, change could be rapid. Legalization campaigns are no longer smoky affairs financed by dime bags peddled by Cheech-and-Chong aficionados and Big Lebowski-Dude wannabes. They’re well-funded, well-organized and cross partisan lines: In swing state Colorado, pot outpolled President Barack Obama.

President Obama may be willing to go with flow. The U.S. federal government so far has refused to denounce — or accept — what has happened, even after the state governors asked this week for clarification. Obama faces 18 states that have legalized medical marijuana with a spectrum of regulatory models that range from supplying anyone with so much as a broken heart, to meting it out to only the seriously debilitated and dying. As a candidate in 2008, and again as president in 2009, Obama promised restraint when it came to enforcing federal laws against med-pot.

His record is questionable — he has been tough on states with liberal access and less aggressive with those maintaining more rigorous regimes. Regardless, many of his donors and advisers urge him to use his second term as a chance to pursue authentic drug-policy reform. He could watch as more and more states vote on legalization, or he could lead. Regardless, the dominoes have begun to topple: and Canada will follow.

 
320Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Fri, Nov 16, 2012, 18:48
Domino number three? Uruguay moved a step closer to becoming the first country to legalize marijuana, with lawmakers introducing a bill that outlines how the drug would be produced, sold and regulated.
The bill introduced Thursday in the lower house of Congress would allow citizens to grow up to six marijuana plants and to buy 1.4 ounces of marijuana every month. It would also allow for the licensing of marijuana clubs with up to 15 members, 90 plants and an annual production limit of nearly 16 pounds.
 
321biliruben
      ID: 59551120
      Sat, Nov 17, 2012, 02:15
Personally, I kinda hope the dominos don't fall too fast.

State as Laboratories for legalization

Public opinion about marijuana has moved sharply over the past few years; about half now support legalization. Tuesday voters in Washington State and Colorado took the leap of approving commercial production and sale for non-medical use, under more or less the same rules that apply to alcohol.

Ideologues on both sides are claim to know with certainty what the results of legalization would be; all good in the view of the legalization advocates, all bad in the view of those who support the current laws.

But those of us who try to study the issue scientifically find ourselves in a world of doubt. How much lower would legal prices be than current illegal prices? If there were heavy taxes, how much evasion would there be? Would buyers in a legal market favor possibly more dangerous high-potency varieties, or would lower-strength products dominate the marijuana market as beer dominates the alcohol market? Would legalization greatly increase problem marijuana use? Use among teenagers? (That might depend on the price.) Would there be an increase in auto accidents due to stoned driving? Would problem drinking decrease – or increase – as result?

All of those questions matter. None of them can be answered by abstract reasoning, or by studying small variations in marijuana policy such as decriminalization of possession for personal use. The only way to find out how legalization would work in practice is to actually try it.
 
322Boldwin
      ID: 910431619
      Sat, Nov 17, 2012, 12:15
Choom legalized, Hostess goes out of business.

Irony, sucha bitch.
 
323Tree
      ID: 5810481713
      Sat, Nov 17, 2012, 14:49
i have to admit, until Obama, i'd never heard the word Choom as a pot reference.

it was always slang for v@gina where i grew up.
 
324Seattle Zen
      ID: 3603123
      Tue, Nov 27, 2012, 11:36
"If anyone is going to have a marijuana institute, it really should be Humboldt State,"

A public university located in one of California's prime pot-growing regions has formed an academic institute devoted to marijuana.
 
325Boldwin
      ID: 1511411012
      Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 15:17
"Every time a weed smoker tells me Obama will stop DEA busts, I think, man, maybe it really does cause brain damage." - David Burge, Iowahawkblog
 
326biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 15:49
States as laboratories for drug policy
Ideologues on both sides are claim to know with certainty what the results of legalization would be; all good in the view of the legalization advocates, all bad in the view of those who support the current laws.

But those of us who try to study the issue scientifically find ourselves in a world of doubt. How much lower would legal prices be than current illegal prices? If there were heavy taxes, how much evasion would there be? Would buyers in a legal market favor possibly more dangerous high-potency varieties, or would lower-strength products dominate the marijuana market as beer dominates the alcohol market? Would legalization greatly increase problem marijuana use? Use among teenagers? (That might depend on the price.) Would there be an increase in auto accidents due to stoned driving? Would problem drinking decrease – or increase – as result?

All of those questions matter. None of them can be answered by abstract reasoning, or by studying small variations in marijuana policy such as decriminalization of possession for personal use. The only way to find out how legalization would work in practice is to actually try it.

But actually trying it on a national basis carries heavy risks. If it goes badly – if, for example, heavy use and use among teenagers quadrupled – it would be very hard to put the genie back in the bottle. All those new users would become potential customers for an expanded illicit market if the drug were re-prohibited.

So the obvious way to learn something about marijuana legalization would be to try it out one state at a time: relying on what Justice Brandeis called “the laboratories of democracy.”

...


Hopefully the DEA will mostly keep their sticky fingers off, so we can learn something.

My guess is, that unless some bean farmer plows under 20,000 acres and plants Blue Haze in it's place, the DEA isn't going to step in. They aren't going to bother with a few plants in some dude's garage, and they likely aren't going to bother with stores that stay out of school zones. We shall see, however.
 
327Boldwin
      ID: 4611521022
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 01:18
I don't recall the feds cutting the Cali weed trade any slack when it went legal at the state level.
 
328biliruben
      ID: 41431323
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 08:57
It didn't go legal. Like Washington for the last decade, it was legal for medical use.
 
329boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 09:33
Re 326: Don't we know something from Canada already? I am not sure that one state would actually give us good answers, but lets assume it is allowed to play out, I am curios to see what results are. If I had to predict results will probably be somewhere in middle with legalization winning out based on saved law enforcement, though those savings will probably be nullified else where.
 
330PV in GJ
      ID: 1010151016
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 10:11
Here in conservative Grand Junction in Western Colorado, the expectations are a lot different than in Denver and the more liberal front range.
The law allows for less than an ounce for 21+ and legal to grow up to 6 plants. Mesa County law enforcement indicates they plan to rigidly hold to those standards, so under 21 possession, a gram over an ounce, or 7 plants could land you in jail.
 
331Frick
      ID: 2193319
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 12:35
Didn't Portugal decriminalize drugs pretty much across the board? The results have been fairly positive from what I have seen. It will be interesting to see if similar results occur in CO.
 
332Mith
      ID: 4310402110
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 12:58
327 - I'd think that these dispensaries are able to openly operate out of public storefronts is pretty considerable slack.

Sure they haven't enjoyed total impunity but prior to legalized medical mj in CA and elsewhere, those proprietors would surely have been dealing with much bigger problems than we see.
 
333biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 13:04
What we have seen here, at least when it came to medical, is they have been a bit overzealous with regards to proximity (250 ft?) to schools and parks. For example, the feds were sending cease and desist orders for storefronts that were near a regional bike trail, defining it as a park.

They'll focus on the kids with total legalization as well, is my guess.
 
334boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 14:21
That seems pretty standard since most states have laws that restrict sales and advertisements of alcohol near schools, parks, and churches already.
 
335Boldwin
      ID: 3211181118
      Tue, Dec 11, 2012, 19:30
I still am pretty sanguine about the chances the state moves will persuade the feds to play along.

The only things that nudge me that direction is the number of states where drug use is breaking out, and the very very careful and clever Colorado legislation language. They crossed a lotta t's and dotted a lotta I's. Fed's just might say they will have to swallow it.
 
336Mith
      ID: 4310402110
      Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 11:52
Pat Leahy steps up.
 
337biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Fri, Dec 14, 2012, 12:43
Obama: Pot not a high priority

"We've got bigger fish to fry," Obama said of pot users in Colorado and Washington during an exclusive interview with ABC News' Barbara Walters.

"It would not make sense for us to see a top priority as going after recreational users in states that have determined that it's legal," he said, invoking the same approach taken toward users of medicinal marijuana in 18 states where it's legal.
 
338Seattle Zen
      ID: 3310162612
      Fri, Dec 14, 2012, 14:15
Avoided the real question: Are you going to target the marijuana stores? The marijuana producers? If the state licenses Joe Greenthumb to produce hundreds of pounds of marijuana to sell to retailers, are you going to come after him and seek 100 years jail sentences?

Of course you are not going to arrest individual users...
 
339Biliruben
      ID: 358252515
      Fri, Dec 14, 2012, 15:26
Yeah, sounds like holder is still mulling, citing kids and international agreements.
 
340Boldwin
      ID: 1611461416
      Fri, Dec 14, 2012, 17:54
Did I miss the discussion about finally lowering the prison sentences of low priority personal use, first time users with these ridiculously harsh sentences?
 
341Boldwin
      ID: 41148209
      Thu, Dec 20, 2012, 12:24
Potential brand names in Colorado:

Choom, Rocky Mountain High, Opiate of the Masses, Soma, cartel no 5, White-out, Cripple Creek, H. R. Puffinstuff, Mile Highs, rocky mountain stimulus

LMAO commenters
 
342Boldwin
      ID: 320391116
      Fri, Jan 11, 2013, 18:45
And pass the Cheetos.
 
343Seattle Zen
      ID: 3310162612
      Mon, Jan 14, 2013, 14:51
Feds Admit There's No Proof Mexican Drug Cartels Link to California Marijuana Grows
Recently, a federal Drug War official recently admitted what some growers and activists have been saying for years: if it really is the Mexican drug cartels operating in the forests, there is scant evidence.

The official in question is Tommy Lanier, director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy's National Marijuana Initiative. Buried in a Los Angeles Times story that ran over the holidays are Lanier's doubts about the reality of Sinaloas, Zetas, and other narcotrafficos in Mendocino and Humboldt counties.

"Based on our intelligence, which includes thousands of cellphone numbers and wiretaps, we haven't been able to connect anyone to a major cartel," he said.

Lanier said authorities have long mislabeled marijuana grown on public land as "cartel grows" because Mexican nationals are arrested in the majority of cases, and the narrative of fighting drug cartels helps them secure federal funding.
 
344Seattle Zen
      ID: 3310162612
      Thu, Jan 31, 2013, 12:22
As Washington state tries to figure out how to regulate its newly legal marijuana, officials are hiring an adviser on all things weed: how it's best grown, dried, tested, labeled, packaged and cooked into brownies.
Sporting a mix of flannel, ponytails and suits, dozens of those angling for the job turned out Wednesday for a forum in Tacoma, several of them from out of state. The Liquor Control Board, the agency charged with developing rules for the marijuana industry, reserved a convention center hall for a state bidding expert to take questions about the position and the hiring process. Washington and Colorado this fall became the first states to pass laws legalizing the recreational use of marijuana and setting up systems of state-licensed growers, processors and retail stores where adults over 21 can walk in and buy up to an ounce of heavily taxed cannabis.

Both states are working to develop rules for the emerging pot industry. Up in the air is everything from how many growers and stores there should be, to how the marijuana should be tested to ensure people don't get sick.

Exciting times...
 
345sarge33rd
      ID: 4609710
      Sun, Feb 03, 2013, 15:49
The cost of a nation of incarceration

But nothing came close to the impact of the war on drugs. When it was announced in 1971, fewer than 40,000 people were incarcerated for drug offenses; now, it's more than half a million.

And here's the elephant in the room: Blacks use drugs at the same rate as whites, but go to prison more - nearly 3 out of 4 people incarcerated for drug possession are African-American.


(that from the top of page two in the article.)
 
346Boldwin
      ID: 30137817
      Fri, Feb 08, 2013, 18:37
From Breitbart's crew: a good conservative should want DC to butt the hell out.

Take us to the bridge, Peter Tosh.


The censor from hell will love this one.
 
347Boldwin
      ID: 30137817
      Fri, Feb 08, 2013, 18:40
I personally am curious whether the tax they set for it ends up being equal to the cigarette taxes.
 
348Boldwin
      ID: 581501018
      Mon, Feb 11, 2013, 01:25
Just once I wonder if we couldn't find something we all can agree on. This just might be it:
PRISON NATION: The United States is leading the world in the percentage of population behind bars. Is this right for a free country? Probably not -- especially as so many prisoners go in for things (like simple drug possession) that just shouldn't be crimes to begin with. But, as this story in Mother Jones points out, the prisoners who go in for minor offenses often come out trained to commit far more serious ones. The Mother Jones website also has a page featuring links to all sorts of useful information on incarceration rates, prison costs, etc.

I believe that today's mass incarceration, together with authorities' often open approval (as in Calif. Atty. General Bill Lockyer's remarks recently) of prisoner rape, will be viewed the same way in the future that we view crimes like slavery today. Lockyer has apologized under pressure for his remarks, but he will no doubt hear them over and over again in prisoner lawsuits alleging -- correctly -- that tolerance for prison rape has official sanction.

Under Clinton much of the left soft-pedaled these concerns lest they be seen as piling on Janet Reno. Now the left is raising them -- but will the Right, usually an opponent of Big Government programs that don't work, step up to the plate? (I mean besides the libertarians, who can always be counted on to speak up, bless 'em, regardless of the political constellation of the moment). I regard this as a bigger moral test than stem cell research. - Glenn Reynolds, world's greatest blogger at Instapundit
 
349Mith
      ID: 4310402110
      Mon, Feb 11, 2013, 10:56
something we all can agree on. This just might be it

Interesting. With the apparent go-ahead from at least some sectors of the GOP, we just might be witnessing the first Boldwin position change of his Rotoguru career. Nice to see after all these years of squatting decisively on the other side of the fence.

That said, the increasing frequency of Boldy's memory lapses (such as the notion that he just learned about accessing deleted threads) has me wondering whether he recalls his former position on this issue.
 
350Boldwin
      ID: 551521120
      Mon, Feb 11, 2013, 21:58
Feel free to find the Boldwin post in which I supported the drug war ever on this board. You can find many where I disparage drugs and drug use, however my position on the drug war changed 15-20 years ago when William F. Buckley convinced me it was not producing the most good of all the options.

Another lesson in how hard it is to keep track of everyone else's positions, or perhaps a lesson in how little some people care anymore to do so.
 
351Boldwin
      ID: 36114188
      Mon, Feb 18, 2013, 11:41
Getting high.
 
352Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 08:50
Its like the Institute for Creation Science being in charge of approving paleontology digs and the science of human evolution.”
 
353boikin
      ID: 430211013
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 10:03
That is bit of stretch, there is plenty of research being done in other countries.
 
354Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 10:06
Is there any other medical research you would stop here because other countries are also doing medical research?
 
355boikin
      ID: 430211013
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 10:58
There is all kinds of research that is banned in the US but not in other countries, mostly on ethical reasons, but sometimes it can be rather trivial. I remember reading a study on placebo/alcohol experiment out of Australia, that would not have been allowed in the USA. PD, this is just one example out of many where something controlled more here then other places.
 
356Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 11:08
The point is that it shouldn't be controlled. Researchers are in a catch-22: In order to prove that the ban is necessary, they need to do research which is banned in this country.

And, without in-country research, the DEA is unlikely to even consider allowing research-only work in the first place.
 
357boikin
      ID: 430211013
      Thu, Feb 28, 2013, 15:45
even if more research was allowed, what test do you think they would be able to do? They would not be able to do human trials. Like I was saying even doing human trials on alcohol are not really allowed. If you wanted to give THC to rats, you can do that now.
 
359Seattle Zen
      ID: 3603123
      Thu, Jul 04, 2013, 13:16
So, you want to be a legal marijuana grower or maven, here are the rules. First, you have to live here in WA.

Proposed rules for legal marijuana in WA

There may not be more than 500 parts per million of residual solvents or gas in your marijuana extract. There will be a test, so pay attention!
 
360biliruben
      ID: 59551120
      Thu, Jul 04, 2013, 13:20
Advice for Cannibis regulators

Kleiman is some sort of pot guru here in Washington now. I've been reading him for a decade on other stuff, so this was nice synergy. Smart guy, and not co-opted.

I wonder if he can post how the meeting went?