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| Posted by: Gator
- [19323103] Mon, May 12, 2014, 15:43
I see Liberals on this forum post about being tolerant because they support gay marriage and immigrant rights ( still not sure if they mean legal or illegals ones). Why is supporting gay marriage a sign of one's tolerance? Only a small minority of the populous is gay, even fewer of those want to get married and even fewer cannot travel to state where gay marriage is legal. I thought tolerance was a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward opinions and practices that differ from one's own. I see no hint of tolerance with any opinion other than the talking points of the far left. It would seem to me that the Liberals champion these issues in order to give a false sense on tolerance. "Hey, look at me, I support gay marriage, I am tolerant of others! |
| | | 1 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 12, 2014, 16:26
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Excellent point.
What is the difference between turning a blind eye and tolerance?
Can you say what you can tolerate and what you cannot and still be considered tolerant?
What is the difference between shielding someone from their detractors and being the perpetrator of a cover up?
How can someone be a good judge of character, know how to read people, know when someone is making a good first impression without having some form of prejudice?
How does a lazy dog become a human only to evolve into a greedy pig? Is it possible to be both a pig and a dog simultaneously, or is it only a sequential thing? Ask my Jewish German forebearers why they think the insult Schweinhund is the biggest insult, and to use it takes a lot of chutzpah. Perhaps they have captured both margins in society that we all believe we can easily identify and seek to not tolerate either of them. Maybe it should be an unspoken word, because, afterall, "you don't know me".
Its all a slippery slope. Want to set some rules for proper behavior for this forum, for this country? Or do we already have those, just dont know how to enforce them without revisiting the whole thing repeatedly?
So, before we go "over the top", lets make sure we "have seen the enemy" and are certain it is not "the man in the mirror".
Let's try not to "fly off the handle", and "bury the hatchet" along with its severed head, but let's not "throw the baby out with the bathwater". Let the games begin!!
Wanna shake on it?
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| | | 2 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 12, 2014, 16:30
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You still got an axe to grind?
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| | | 3 | Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Mon, May 12, 2014, 16:51
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Tolerance with the issue of gay marriage means allowing those who are gay to have the choice. This is opposed to not giving those who are gay the choice.
The first is tolerant. The second is intolerant.
You seem to be reacting more to the perceived self-congratulations than to the actual meanings.
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| | | 4 | Tree
ID: 438482411
Mon, May 12, 2014, 18:42
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Only a small minority of the populous is gay...
there are less Muslims in the United States than homosexuals, yet conservatives seem preoccupied with followers of Islam.
what's your point?
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| | | 5 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Mon, May 12, 2014, 19:10
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The Right Wings insistence on simultaneously persecuting gays, Muslims, the poor, and immigrants, ALL while claiming THEY are being persecuted for being Christian AND raising false cries of the Lefts "intolerance" would be comic genius, were it not so destructive.
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| | | 6 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Mon, May 12, 2014, 19:55
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My point is how can you consider yourself tolerant when the ONLY things you are tolerant about are far left talking points.
Are you champions of the Muslim religion now or any religion except Christianity?
I still would like to know if you are referring to legal or illegal immigrants or both.
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| | | 7 | Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Mon, May 12, 2014, 21:10
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I'm not sure that the points you bring up are "far left" (or even left, for that matter). What "far right talking points" are we being intolerant of that we should not be?
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| | | 8 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Mon, May 12, 2014, 21:36
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I still would like to know if you are referring to legal or illegal immigrants or both.
Who and what are you talking about? Perhaps if you coherently used quotes from a poster on this forum, as opposed to:
Liberals on this forum post about being tolerant because they support.... immigrant rights ( still not sure if they mean legal or illegals ones)
you would be more apt to get an intelligent response. As it stands, I'm still not sure if you're trolling or serious about discussing politics.
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| | | 9 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Mon, May 12, 2014, 22:45
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I have seen posts by both Sarge and Tree talking about immigrants and immigrant rights. You can search for them, but I doubt it will help you make an intelligent response.
PD- I see an obvious intolerance for the Christian religion, yet support for Muslims. I am not a religious person but have a huge respect for many Christian organizations and the work they do for charities with money from their own pockets.
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| | | 10 | Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Tue, May 13, 2014, 00:08
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There's a difference between "intolerance for the Christian religion" and intolerance for Christianists. In my opinion, there are lots and lots of people who consider themselves "Christian" and yet openly demonstrate anti-Christian attitudes and behaviors (while mocking those who do not). I have little patience for those Christianists; if this is perceived as intolerance I'm not really of the mind to care. Tolerance isn't the same as "support" or "respect."
I agree that many Christian organizations do good work (particularly Catholic organizations here in the US). Sarah Palin and Bill Donahue are still asshöles despite that, however.
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| | | 11 | Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Tue, May 13, 2014, 00:11
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I should add that I do see a lot of intolerance on the Left (particularly those who really are on the Far Left). For example, there seems to be little tolerance on the Far Left for those who have only recently come to support gay marriage rights (apparently, if you didn't support it all along then you don't deserve to say you support it at all).
And, of course, as a pro-lifer in the Democratic Party, I can tell you a thing or two about intolerance among the Left (real, in-your-face intolerance, not the "he supports Muslims so he must be intolerant of Christians" that sounds like a poorly worded attempt at a gotcha).
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| | | 12 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 13, 2014, 02:09
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This country has not been able to reconcile the Jewish belief in a monogamous for life heterosexual society and its need to adhere to the Christian Golden Rule. What makes you think that we can do much more?
Though I was raised with the same beliefs of many of my Christian brethren, I find myself in a different place politically and in faith due to my life experiences. Its funny where life can take you.
My American Indian ancestors tried to sell My English and Scotch-Irish ancestors that diverse American Indian religions could co-exist with diverse Christian sects. The missionaries were unrelentless especially when backed by Spanish soldiers as you know. So, anyway, we all know how well that went. The Mormons experimented with polygomy and found they couldn't reconcile it with mainstream Christian views either. Perhaps a bridge too far.
This experiment of conquering diversity is not over yet. If you want soldiers in your army, you've got to pay them though. So if you want us to stick our noses in the business of the rest of the world, then keep being do-gooders and we can just watch each others sons and now daughters die for our "cause". That is, as soon as we figure out what that is. Meanwhile we all get ONE vote right?
To me, today's battle seems to be one of empire vs one of common good. I still contend, that we dont need anybody else's help (immigration), we dont need anybody else's opinion (whats with all the british commentators on our news nowadays i thought we already kicked those dicks out?). And most of all we need to keep our noses out of other people's business and focus on OUR common welfare.
We aren't the good examples we like to believe we are. Let's just hope we havent pissed EVERYONE off driving our crap down their throats. We still have each other in any case, you see how well that's working.
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| | | 13 | Boldwin
ID: 3461221
Tue, May 13, 2014, 05:33
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In decades past conservatives could actually appeal to Dems on the basis of a shared sense of fairness.
Those days are long gone. Todays libs actually delight in unfairly savaging people, the better to terrorize their neighbors into toeing the politically correct line.
There is zero sense of proportionality. They aren't arguing in a common marketplace of ideas. They are out to find a victim to make an example of and ruin his entire life over every tiny violation of liberal orthodox religion.
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| | | 14 | Boldwin
ID: 3461221
Tue, May 13, 2014, 05:51
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So Magic Johnson has been coveting ownership of Sterling's team and he found the perfect crowbar for the heist.
I fully expect half the owners of the NBA to end up hanging by their balls in the media and a dozen other greenhorn owners of NBA teams.
And no liberal would object! That would be the perfect outcome of their wet-dreams.
No interest in fairness. No fair trial. The competent replaced by incompetents whose only skill is knowing how to play the political correctness game.
A model libs want to extend to all areas of life.
You built a thriving business? For shame. There is surely a deserving member of the downtrodden we can hand it over to.
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| | | 15 | Tree
ID: 438482411
Tue, May 13, 2014, 08:33
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My point is how can you consider yourself tolerant when the ONLY things you are tolerant about are far left talking points.
baffling.
how is gay marriage a far left talking point? it's legal in 18 states plus DC right now, and the rest of the dominoes will follow. it's not a far left talking point to let love rule.
as for being a "champion" of various religions, the point is that, on a personal level, i'm not a champion of any particular religion, but rather all religions, or even lack of religion.
we are free to choose what religious beliefs we adhere to. or to have none at all. BUT WE HAVE THESE RIGHTS AS INDIVIDUALS and it should have no bearing on legal or political decisions.
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| | | 16 | Frick
ID: 29235107
Tue, May 13, 2014, 08:56
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I used to consider myself an independent with a Republican lean, but since I'm not wanted and I can't stand the religious takeover of the far right I've been voting for Democrats more and more. Instead of courting moderates, the Republican party has seems content to drive everyone except hardliners away. That is a strategy that isn't going to work all that well over the long term. More and more people are realizing that religion the states should not be combined when it comes to marriage. If you support a gay marriage ban, you are essentially saying that gays are not full citizens or even human beings. People used to feel the same way about the differences in races. To be fair, many probably still feel that way, they have just learned they need to hide it.
Gator, are you arguing that I should be tolerant of a racist? Define tolerance? If I simply to do business with them and shun them, is that tolerant?
Why should any couple have to travel to a state to get married? And some states are attempting to refuse to recognize their marriages from other states. Indiana recognizes one gay marriage, by Federal court order. link
Is it tolerant that instead of spending their remaining time together as a family, they are instead fighting in courts for rights that are granted to most couples automatically?
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| | | 17 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 13, 2014, 12:13
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My response to 14 and to this whole thread's direction is including in my rant in <12>. I would think its a lesson we need to learn in our neighborhoods, our politics and our international affairs.
most of all we need to keep our noses out of other people's business and focus on OUR common welfare.
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| | | 18 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Tue, May 13, 2014, 12:18
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In decades past conservatives could actually appeal to Dems on the basis of a shared sense of fairness.
Those days are long gone.
That part of what you said, is precisely correct. The next sentence, is typical RW bias garbage. It isnt the Dems in Congress, who swore to oppose everything Boehner put forth in order to make him a 1 term Speaker. You are blaming the wrong party, for the recalcitrance found in DC today. NOt that the Dems dont hold SOME of the blame, but the lions share? Is at the feet of the GOP.
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| | | 19 | GO
ID: 292502110
Tue, May 13, 2014, 12:25
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I could write something here but it would essentially just be copying Frick in #16. So Ditto.
And yeah Boldwin... Magic Johnson is the downtrodden we should just give the Clippers too and drive out Sterling. He doesn't have any successful business or give away millions of dollars. "what has Magic Johnson done?!" - Sterling All together, Johnson's business empire is estimated at $500 million.
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| | | 21 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 13, 2014, 14:07
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Turning the team over to a person just because he is black is a racist act. I hope they find the most qualified person to take ownership, unfortunately white america now owes a fig leaf because this guy couldnt keep it in his pants. They'll have their justice. Here come the apologetics.
Sterling did a great job of keeping his mouth shut until his goomah found her moment to start judgement day. Mrs Sterling is doing her best at damage control now, but its a losing battle.
Hope we all learned a few things about human nature when this is done.
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| | | 22 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Tue, May 13, 2014, 22:50
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The idea for this thread came when I saw Tree post this..."The reason I call BS is:
#1. Conservatives are far more tolerant of opposing points of views.
since when?????? have you looked at those leading the battle against gay equality, rights for immigrants, and so forth. wow. just...wow."
I use this for an example but this is the view I see many on the Left take. I can search through other threads and google 1000s of quotes by Liberals on how they are more tolerant but it is obvious to any unbiased person the Left consider themselves more tolerant then the Right.
Personally, I would like to see more intolerance. Intolerance for Obama's complete lack of economic common sense.
Who is more intolerant, the Left or the Right is subjective, but don't pound your chest and say you are tolerant because you support gay marriages, a religion that encourages domestic violence against women and people who enter the country illegally.
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| | | 23 | Tree
ID: 438482411
Wed, May 14, 2014, 09:22
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don't pound your chest and say you are tolerant because you support gay marriages, a religion that encourages domestic violence against women and people who enter the country illegally.
so, you're equating gay marriage with illegal acts such as domestic violence and illegal immigration?
just checking, because, yea, that kind of defines intolerance right there.
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| | | 24 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Wed, May 14, 2014, 11:07
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The idea for this thread
The idea for this thread was simply to make a generic swipe at liberals. That's why it started,
I see Liberals on this forum
Only after some prodding, sarge and Tree are identified as the liberals in question. Sarge and Tree are individuals, with individual opinions on subjects. I don't know who are all the other liberals on this forum, or why it would even matter, since every person who posts here has distinctive variations in political viewpoints.
it is obvious to any unbiased person
Since you're obviously a biased person, hopefully you're not including yourself in that equation. An unbiased person wouldn't make such a feeble attempt to lump numerous persons with numerous opinions into one collective. Respect for the individual used to be a solid conservative principle, a principle that has long been abandoned in favor of intolerant voices that dominate the current definition of conservatism. And, yes, it's true that intolerance on numerous issues is a staple for those who subscribe to liberalism, but as with conservatism, there is a huge spectrum of opinions depending on the issue.
Personally, I subscribe to the philosophy of my former governor and 2012 presidential candidate,
Jon Huntsman and his No Label movement,
which is committed to working together to solve problems, which begins with open and honest communication, as opposed to the commitment to vilify, be it by liberal, conservative and all those in between.
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| | | 25 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Wed, May 14, 2014, 13:35
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You may be right on several points.
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| | | 26 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:09
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Used to be if you were a homely girl or a sissy boy you could go to the catholic church and get a job. This generation's misfit culture doesn't want the church, but still want to have children, and sex. We've got to reconcile that somehow.
So lets ask the pope what he is going to do about it? He cant replenish his ranks from the US population, and we arent sending him money to take care of all the misfits anymore.
So who is minding the pedophiles now?
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| | | 27 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:14
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What is the source of the word apologetic anyway?
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| | | 28 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:26
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What is the difference between a cover up and shielding someone from their detractors?
What is the difference between a religion and a cult?
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| | | 29 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:29
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Religion for profit. The confession.
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| | | 30 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:30
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and dont forget the absolution too
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| | | 31 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:34
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Why did Henry create the Anglican Church. Why did the English Monarchy use the Lutheran printing press to give everyone bibles so that they could read it for themselves and know a hypocrite when they saw one.
Why did we leave England and want to set up our own way of ruling, away from both the Catholic and the Anglican Church? Follow history and it may reveal many things if you pay enough attention.
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| | | 32 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 14:49
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Imagine an alliance between the holier than though evangelist and the greedy capitalist. The sky is the limit!
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| | | 33 | Boldwin
ID: 53401414
Wed, May 14, 2014, 15:07
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Tie that into a knot. I dare you. Or did you plan on just random ramblings of a crank?
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| | | 34 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 15:08
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So, why would I be wary of allowing a whole bunch of the followers of Rome, uneducated and against birth control into a country founded on leaving that archaic religion behind?
I dont know. I am a fool living in a state that allows marijuana to be legal and guns too. As long as we dont shoot ourselves when we are high, all is good.
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| | | 36 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 15:54
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thanks for the education sarge. Got any more like that?
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| | | 37 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 16:07
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When a high teenager gets a gun out of his dad's collection and goes to school and shoots all of the bullies at school for austricizing him ( i know, only in Colorado) We should:
A) lock up the dad
B) lock up the drug dealer
C) lock up the bullies
D) lock up the teacher
E) lock up the sunday school teacher
F) lock up the social worker
G) ALL of the above
H) None of the above
that is the pop quiz. There will be an essay final however. The essay will earn you more points if you chose H and only if you choose H will you be allowed to write an essay. Furthermore if you write an essay you are authorized to help construct the next multiple choice question. Fair enough?
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| | | 38 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 16:09
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What is the source of the word apologetics anyway?
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| | | 39 | Boldwin
ID: 53401414
Wed, May 14, 2014, 16:21
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Consistent control of the bullying, and no more inquisition style reaction to every kid who bites a cookie into the shape of a gun.
You can't tell me bullies can drive some kid crazy and the teacher couldn't see it happening.
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| | | 40 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 16:29
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umm did u just choose D?
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| | | 41 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 16:38
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When we get all of the multiple guess questions together we can submit them to congress and insist they all take the multiple choice quiz and if they dont pass it with flying colors they aren't sworn in. Deal?
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| | | 42 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 17:20
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Ok, I cant help but resist this, as the answer is H. The essay is Lock up the gun.
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| | | 43 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 17:56
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How is a concealed weapon a deterrent?
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| | | 44 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 17:59
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If you rob a bank with a finger pistol and the finger is considered a part of an arm, does that make the crime armed roberry?
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| | | 45 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 14, 2014, 18:00
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If you use your finger on a keyboard to rob a bank, is that armed robbery?
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| | | 46 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Thu, May 15, 2014, 01:42
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If you dont lift a finger to punish when you know who the criminal is. Are you an accomplise?
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| | | 47 | Tree
ID: 438482411
Thu, May 15, 2014, 08:20
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Tree are identified as the liberals in question.
considering my stance on Israel, guns, and possibly abortion, liberals won't have me.
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| | | 48 | Boldwin
ID: 224331522
Thu, May 15, 2014, 23:37
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“We have slipped into an age of un-enlightenment where you fall in line behind the mob or face the consequences. How ironic that the persecutors this time around are the so-called intellectuals. They claim to be liberal while behaving as anything but. The touchstone of liberalism is tolerance of differing ideas. Yet this mob exists to enforce conformity of thought and to delegitimize any dissent from its sanctioned worldview. Intolerance is its calling card.” - Kirsten Powers: Liberals' Dark Ages
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| | | 49 | sarge33rd
ID: 390471112
Fri, May 16, 2014, 00:17
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Simply inaccurate B.
Liberals, think that critical thinking skills, are essential. Many Conservatives in modern America, see them as a threat.
Liberals think equal rights for all, is as it should be. Conservatives, think favored rights for fundamentalist Christians, is as it should be and other groups should see more and more and more restrictions, depending on how "far" from the fundie tree their apples have fallen.
Liberals think conservation is a good thing. Ironically, conservatives think it costs too much, so it shouldnt be bothered with.
Liberals are concerned with the world we leave our children and grandchildren. Conservatives are concerned with next quarters ROI.
Ms Powers premise is faulty, and she is writing TO her premise, not on fact.
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| | | 50 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 00:25
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You guys inspire me...thank god we can think for ourselves and not just leave links to other peoples thoughts. Thank you
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| | | 51 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 00:36
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BTW , the redneck is the swing vote
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| | | 53 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Fri, May 16, 2014, 08:54
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We have slipped into an age of un-enlightenment where you fall in line behind the mob or face the consequences.
That sounds eerily similar to Operation American Spring.
A group of self-described revolutionary-style patriots with a million mobilized militia members are heading to downtown Washington, D.C., this week to bring a simple message to political leadership, from President Obama to House Speaker John Boehner: Get out.
They’re called the Operation American Spring — and they’re vowing to oust the likes of Mr. Obama, Mr. Boehner, Attorney General Eric Holder, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Sen. Mitch McConnell, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and Vice President Joseph R. Biden
We are calling for [their] removal … as a start toward constitutional restoration,” said retired Army Col. Harry Riley, the leader of the group, Raw Story reported. “They have all abandoned the U.S. Constitution, are unworthy to be retained in a position that calls for servant status.”
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| | | 54 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 11:35
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Out of curiosity, are there any laws Obama and Eric Holder actually believe they are obligated to enforce and obey themselves? I mean, other than their own whim that day?
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| | | 55 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 12:12
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<49> That was a great article that forces you to question where we are heading. Seems to me that we should all consider researching India's history to see how this whole thing plays out. I for one wouldn't mind seeing more than two parties in this country, I disagree with both parties on many things. Like the flaw in the Keynesian economic model, there is no free market for ideas when you have pwerful monopolies.
Of course I dont want to live in a cast system society where the only way up is through reincarnation.
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| | | 56 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 12:29
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Of course monopolies are the inevitable end to the free market.
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| | | 57 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 12:59
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53and they’re vowing to oust the likes of Mr. Obama, Mr. Boehner, Attorney General Eric Holder, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Sen. Mitch McConnell, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and Vice President Joseph R. Biden
At least its a bi-partisan coalition, they've got one Republican in their sights. Hehe
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| | | 58 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 13:18
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The problem I have Bean with a truly viable 3rd party, 35% of the vote could win elections, despite 65% of the people voting for someone else. A 4th party and 28% can win, a 5th, and 21% can win. There are legitimate reasons, for a 2-party system.
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| | | 59 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 13:19
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We could do elections using the American Idol system of eliminating one per week. Hehe wouldnt it be fitting?
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| | | 60 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 13:28
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#57
More than one.
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| | | 61 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 13:30
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it doesnt matter who or how many they have 'in their sights'. This is a couple thousand loons. They wont top 100,000 in their gathering, let alone their claimed "millions".
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| | | 62 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 14:11
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Hey! Where is everybody?
It was to be a great day, a day where the “real” Americans took “their” country back. A day to celebrate liberty and freedom, the start of the Second American Revolution. President Obama was to be chased out of office by a horde of 30 million angry white people who had come from every trailer park in the country to fight for their God-given right to be poor and stupid.
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| | | 63 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 14:33
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As I said in another post, there are good leaders and bad leaders and there are good and bad followers. I will preface the next paragraph with this is just how I feel today:
Every political leader is only as good as his ability to remain squeaky clean and not accumulate vocal followers that embarass him. It's not all that hard to navigate the issues and research the polls to know which side of an issue you should fall on. Nobody is ever really following any principals in politics, its just a tool to succeed however you might define success.
This American Spring effort was doomed to fail from its inception. Guess the good Colonel is once again retired. Just remember, he is a true American even if there werent enough ambitious unemployed or on vacation people to show up.
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| | | 64 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 14:41
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As I said before, the red-neck poor white trailer-trash is the swing vote. Decide if you want to court him or he presents too much baggage.
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| | | 65 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 14:50
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Pretty sure, that demographic is fairly solid in the red category. (The red neck, pretty much assures that IMHO)
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| | | 66 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 15:16
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Yeah, but if the democrats go back to being the Labor Party they might be able to make more progress. Right now they are seen as the welfare party.
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| | | 67 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 15:21
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I will readily grant, the GOP marketing arm is far and away, better than the DNCs.
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| | | 68 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 15:35
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There's a little redneck in all of us. It is what we call the American Spirit, its a desire to fight the establishment. It results in all of us "getting too big for our britches". Next thing that happens is we find ourselves apologizing saying "I didn't mean to be mean".
That a tight enough knot for ya Boldwin?
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| | | 69 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 15:47
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BTW, dont know if you know the Redneck expression "bless his/her/your/their heart". It is code when gossiping about someone, pointing out their failings, then realizing you need absolution.
She's a flirting hussie, bless her heart.
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| | | 70 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 15:52
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My brother is a pussy hound, he calls the strippers saints....not sure where the genesis of that was, but I have my theories.
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| | | 71 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 16:25
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It never ceases to amaze me how often the 'sharing and caring' folks descend to ad hominem attacks against the poor they claim to care about.
How dare those trailer trash realize how little we care about them and revolt against our plan to take all their money and spend it for them.
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| | | 72 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 16:47
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B? Its the GOP, who robbed everyones home values and 401ks. You keep placing blame, at the wrong feet.
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| | | 73 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 17:17
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Not the Tea Party segment of the GOP.
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| | | 74 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 17:19
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<71> Boldy, I am pretty sure we have some semblance of an idea of the people we are now talking about, our individual experiences will define them slightly differently for each of us. I've already told you that I identify with Rednecks, so if I am being insulting to them then its just a form of self-loathing. And, BTW, you are not allowed to call us trailer trash, consider it the TT word. We can call each other that, because we know its in jest, we aren't certain if you use the word. If I feel like I am talking about someone other than my people, I'll throw in the Bless their Heart line so you can absolve me. Just kidding.
Anyway, Not an endorsement, but this may prove useful
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| | | 75 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 17:26
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I think that stuff was from PHI 201 Logic class.
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| | | 76 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 17:28
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Come to think of it, no part of the GOP was responsible for the urgency to hand home loans to every unqualified person in the country. That is ALL on the Dems.
I don't know who to pin the lack of oversight of the derivative market on but it still hasn't been fixed so...
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| | | 77 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 17:55
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How bout the a$$hole$ that sold them
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| | | 78 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 18:05
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76 btw its the GOP who wants less oversight of business from every angle you can imagine. Go ahead refute that so we can all laugh.
We repeatedly find that we have to limit businesses authority, secrecy, corrupt practices and abuse of workers and the environment. If not for those make believe people that business law has created to avoid any responsibility or need to deal with people face to face, we might all get along pretty well.
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| | | 79 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 18:40
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What exactly is market confidence?
I was shocked to learn in business college that the SEC and IRS rely on certified financial statements from CPAs. These CPAs are chosen, hired and paid by the company that is being audited/certified. Of course most of my classmates did not see this an obvious conflict of interest. I dont know why i couldnt wrap my head around that.
I think all corporations should be audited by a government accountant and that should be the basis for taxation and publication of financial reports. But what the heck would a guy who was certified back in 1980 know about those things.
I've never invested in the stock market, call it a lack of market confidence if you wish.
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| | | 80 | Boldwin
ID: 54351610
Fri, May 16, 2014, 20:07
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76 btw its the GOP who wants less oversight of business from every angle you can imagine. Go ahead refute that so we can all laugh. - Bean
I've been pushing for clearinghouses for the derivatives market since before the crash, and you'll have to prove to me the GOP [outside the inner circle at the top hierarchy in constant war with the base] felt any differently.
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| | | 81 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Fri, May 16, 2014, 20:18
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Did you really just say that B? That it has to be "PROVEN TO YOU", that the GOP seeks further deregulation?????????
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| | | 82 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 16, 2014, 20:25
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Boldy, I am sure that there are nuances to all of what happened, i dont delve into the details anymore. I am also certain that many Republicans are just as upset with those crooks as the rest of us. My oldest brother is a computer programmer in the banking industry, (mostly car loans) a Republican, Elder of his Lutheran Church, the whole nine yards, you'd get along with him well.
Anyway, like you he blames the Democrats for insisting on loans to less qualified, I believe he doesnt just blame the Dems though saying that it is the fault of the loan officers for loaning too much and creating too many ARMs. The whole thing could have been avoided and there is lots of blame to go around.
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| | | 84 | Khahan
ID: 16341313
Sun, May 18, 2014, 20:13
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This is a very intelligent person who cuts right to the heart of the matter of American politics. A lot of the discussion on this board is a microcosm of the left vs right extremes.
Warning, this is a long read. But its very well done and very much spot on.
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| | | 85 | Boldwin
ID: 134181819
Sun, May 18, 2014, 20:58
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Some well put points but it attempts to gloss over some big points.
1) We ARE a broken country as long as half the country wants to transform the country. We risked nuclear annihilation for 5 decades to avoid the government we are now getting.
There is a valid reason for the partisanship. It is not some misperception that some eye-salve will cure.
2) The true supporters of ever wider wealth disparity are getting both halves of their agenda handed to them by both sides, each getting their assignments respectively.
3) Experts are trading away their fidelity to the truth for power.
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| | | 86 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 02:47
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84 Unfortunately the guy posted anonymously so you cant see some of his other stuff. However, he mentioned he is an instructor in War College. Anyway, War college is for O-5s and above (Lt Col, Colonels and Generals; Commanders Capts and Admirals).
I can attest that this is generally the view we are taught in leadership schools at every level. Its up to the military and the State Dept to be willing to die for the beliefs of we the people, of course we all want to know what we are dying for. CNN used to play in all of our command posts, chow halls, and public areas around the clock, I assume that Fox News hasn't replaced it. We are the first to feel the world's anger with us, and also the first to say WTF-Over when we are told to go get into someone else's business again.
Your military is not just Gomer Pyle and Private Benjamin guys, I hope you know that. Most (90%+) officers 0-4 and above have Masters degrees in something, on top of that we have extensive leadership training. Our NCOs have pretty impressive credentials as well. In the Air Force our top two enlisted ranks generally have Bachelor degrees. Far greater than your average "blue collar" worker.
And we are all teachers/mentors by trade, so we benefit from the insights of one another unlike any other industry I know.
You equip and train us well, and you reward us when we are done. We thank you for that.
Let's not over reach please. Your guts our blood.
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| | | 87 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 02:58
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85-3 Its kind of funny that there are so few scientists who are arguing that there is no climate change. What are they thinking?
Since clearly the supply and demand analysis would tell you that they would be able to garner far more money for arguing that there is no climate change than to argue that there is climate change.
Of course now we see that the pro-climate change ones are obviously the dumber ones. Its all clearer to me now, thanks for that insight Boldwin.
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| | | 88 | Boldwin
ID: 134181819
Mon, May 19, 2014, 09:44
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Really, Bean? The cash is all on the alarmist side. You can barely stay employed if you are a scientist and you happen to notice the numbers don't add up to hair-on-fire alarmism. You can get a BIG grant to study the climate change emergency and _____________.
Just fill in the blank. Three legged stools. Apple bobbing. Static electricity. "Would you like a new lab with that order?"
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| | | 89 | sarge33rd
ID: 390471112
Mon, May 19, 2014, 10:16
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The Oil industry is not spending billions, supporting the idea of climate change Boldwin.
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| | | 90 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 11:28
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88 Has it occurred to you that the climate scientists that believe there is an issue with the climate might actually be telling you about it because they believe it? Or is everything about money?
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| | | 91 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 11:35
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1) Mount soapbox
2) British citizens delivering the news on American Networks because we all like the accent
3) Dismount
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| | | 92 | Boldwin
ID: 134181819
Mon, May 19, 2014, 15:07
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I know exactly why they 'believe' it.
1) Scientists in unrelated fields believe it out of professional courtesy and because they don't have a clue about the field. But they like the shiny mathmatical model, nevermind whether it works.
2) Scientists in related fields know the peer review system is compromised, rigged by the alarmists and they won't get published, get co-authored, get grants if they don't play the game.
3) Some scientists may believe it because of putting undue weight on mathmatical modelling, however that is one of the best reasons NOT to put any faith in AGW. THE MODELLING IS NOT MATCHING REALITY. Not to mention that the modelling doesn't survive 4 days, let alone 4 decades of reality. Talk about soft science.
4) Scientists have a built in leaning to see other scientists as fellow members of a priesthood who need to band together to prevent the mere pedestrians from pointing out the man behind the curtain isn't always all that. "Let's not remind people about Piltdown Man." "No one break ranks, OK?"
5) Scientists are well aware of the beating in the back alley the last scientist got for pointing out flaws in the theory, asking for the data, etc.
6) Scientists aren't yet aware just how bad of a hoax the purported 97% consensus figure is. As if consensus was what science was about.
Plenty more...
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| | | 93 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Mon, May 19, 2014, 15:19
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92...classic example of fingers in the ears and screaming la-la-la-la-la-I-Cant-Hear-you
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| | | 94 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 15:43
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92 So what is wrong with this view?:
If the 97% is wrong and we are over-reacting what will happen?
1) We will move toward more renewable sources of energy, preserving our fossil fuels for another day.
2) Some growing pains will occur in the transition.
2A) Some gigantic companies, foreign governments, and overly rich people stand to lose some profit if they dont go to renewable investments.
2B) Some people will have to retrain and move into other fields, and perhaps re-locate.
3) We'll all feel better about ourselves, our environment, and our legacy and wont have to worry about this scenario that so many are predicting when it is done.
Consider if the 97% are right.
Something I am missing?
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| | | 95 | Perm Dude
ID: 294531914
Mon, May 19, 2014, 15:53
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Less pollution? I guess we wouldn't want that...
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| | | 96 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 16:13
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Hehe, maybe we should do an occupy texas campaign and call ourselves the 97%ers. Wouldnt that be a hoot.
I am what they like to call down there a "winter-texan". See you guys in South Padre Island with all my Canadian friends.
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| | | 97 | Boldwin
ID: 134181819
Mon, May 19, 2014, 16:36
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1) It empowers globalists.
2) It furthers the cause of the de-industrialization of America.
3) It furthers the cause of de-industrialization to the massive competitive advantage of China.
4) It is a monumental waste of money right when America [and the west] is waaaaay overextended and vulnerable. House of cards, meets wrecking ball.
5) More Solyndras, that's all we need. Just wait until the green tech becomes effective and efficient before investing. Right now it's like stringing telegraph wire on the cusp of optical cable development.
6) It's stupid, wrong, pointless and even counter-productive. Sure, why don't we stop making things in relatively green American factories and encourage more highly polluting Chinese manufacturing. Why don't we make more electric cars which are [taking into consideration their manufacture] far more polluting. Brilliant.
7) It's a highly regressive penalty on a basic need of the poor. It is a deliberate crime against their humanity by self-righteous elites who can't be bothered who they are hurting and can't be bothered to check the math and see if it makes any sense at all.
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| | | 98 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Mon, May 19, 2014, 16:41
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The math has been checked, you just dont like the result.
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| | | 99 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Mon, May 19, 2014, 17:02
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97 Finally we are getting somewhere Boldy. The intelligent conversation is exactly what should we do since both some economic sacrifice and green technology is the answer.
The ignorant foolish and devisive discussion is calling each other idiots.
What should we do, how fast should we do it is the question of the day. Not should we do it at all and is it a problem at all. We've been waiting for you to catch up.
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| | | 100 | Boldwin
ID: 134181819
Mon, May 19, 2014, 17:16
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"It" isn't happening at all.
I'm all for green tech that works.
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| | | 105 | Khahan
ID: 314142010
Tue, May 20, 2014, 11:33
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Wow Boldwin you couldn't be more wrong in 92. And keep in mind, Im on your side of the man-made global warming debate. But your reasoning is just so out of whack with reality:
1) Scientists in unrelated fields believe it out of professional courtesy and because they don't have a clue about the field. But they like the shiny mathmatical model, nevermind whether it works.
Scientists that don't have a clue about the field...stay out of the field. My wife has never looked at global warming thru her job. Or thru her volunteer work doing peer reviews for NHI grants.
Scientists don't really cross specialties.
2) Scientists in related fields know the peer review system is compromised, rigged by the alarmists and they won't get published, get co-authored, get grants if they don't play the game.
The peer review system for grant money is a) volunteers. The reviewers get nothing for doing their reviews. B) anonymous - the reviewers are not known to the party being reviewed. C) not involved. While they are in the same field, they wont review for competing money. For example when my wife reviews studies for microbiology she does not review any requests for grant money that her own company is competing for.
3) Some scientists may believe it because of putting undue weight on mathmatical modelling, however that is one of the best reasons NOT to put any faith in AGW. THE MODELLING IS NOT MATCHING REALITY. Not to mention that the modelling doesn't survive 4 days, let alone 4 decades of reality. Talk about soft science.
Ok, this one I agree with you on. The modelling being used is horrible, does not match reality and there IS a sub-group of scientists in this field being suppressed. However I doubt there any grand conspiracy by the 'globalists' involved as that happens in EVERY FIELD. As usual, its not nearly as nefarious as you make it out to be.
4) Scientists have a built in leaning to see other scientists as fellow members of a priesthood who need to band together to prevent the mere pedestrians from pointing out the man behind the curtain isn't always all that. "Let's not remind people about Piltdown Man." "No one break ranks, OK?"
rofl. How many scientists do you know? I promise you for so many reasons this is wrong. Scientists like and dislike each other, agree and disagree with each other, and walk lock-step and out of step with each other just as much as in any other field. There is just as much in-fighting and outfighting as there is harmonious agreement.
Scientists generally have a desire to see THEIR OWN ideas advanced. Those who happen to agree will flock together and promote each other. Those who don't will flock together and promote themselves.
Is there money in perpetuating global warming? Sure. Can grant money be had? Sure. Are there some people pulling the strings and manipulating others who are benefiting? Wouldn't be surprised. But is this some giant globalists conspiracy to control our lives and make us slaves to the global bankers? There is no evidence that its happening anymore than in any other field.
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| | | 106 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 20, 2014, 12:22
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The fundamental problem with your arguments Boldy is that they are the same arguments that the oil companies are making. AND NOBODY TRUSTS THEM!!!!!!
1) they brought us OPEC
2) they brought us Fake shortages
3) they brought us Oil Spills
4) they brought us .......
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| | | 107 | Perm Dude
ID: 294531914
Tue, May 20, 2014, 15:00
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#105: Spot on. Well put.
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| | | 108 | Boldwin
ID: 44292015
Tue, May 20, 2014, 16:50
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Khahan
1) Scientists that don't have a clue about the field...stay out of the field.
Not the IPCC report. No nothing climate ninnies who couldn't tell you if it was raining with the indian weather stone, have their names all over that report.
2) Read the climategate hacked emails. The culprits spelled out their peer review fraudulent tricks in great detail explicitly. They well and truly had that whole field's peer review rigged, damaging any publication that wouldn't play along.
4) I am intimately aware of how careful evolutionists are to avoid the weak spots [which I know well] in their own and other evolutionists arguments so as to not give the other side any ammunition. Same thing in this field.
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| | | 109 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 20, 2014, 19:17
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108-2 Do you or your sources have names to report? Have you reported them? What has been the outcome? Got a link?
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| | | 110 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 20, 2014, 19:27
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Report abuse
I'm guessing unfair competition?
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| | | 111 | Boldwin
ID: 44292015
Tue, May 20, 2014, 19:42
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Let me tell you a story of how the sausage is made. After the first part [the science part] of the IPCC report [which was full of hedging] was completed @ 100 non-climate scientists and IPCC functionaries stood in front of ONE climate scientist and insisted he sign off on every one of their points because the report wasn't useful unless each actionable item appeared to have his full consent and each nation's advisor scored the part he wanted in there.
No hedging or caution allowed in the policy prescription portion allowed whatsoever.
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| | | 113 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 20, 2014, 21:57
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OK lets make sure we all truly understand the facts here:
1) Was the Exxon Valdez an avoidable disaster or was it a conspiracy by the left to make it happen, then overexagerate the impact to the environment then excessively punishing the oil companies by making them clean it up?
2) Was the British Petroleum oil spill an avoidable disaster or was it a conspiracy by the left to make it happen, then overexagerate the impact to the environment then excessively punishing the oil by making them clean it up?
Be very careful in answering these questions Boldy, because your response will let us all know exactly what your position is. If you cannot acknowledge this then you have nothing more to say that is credible.
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| | | 114 | Boldwin
ID: 44292015
Tue, May 20, 2014, 23:09
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A) Stick yer red pencil where the sun don't shine.
B) Of course a drunken captain is an avoidable problem.
C) The resultant hysteria was ridiculously over the top and amounted to terrorism against businessmen.
D) BP looked like irresponsible rushed operation on the surface of it, but I'd like to leave that open to a more in depth examination if I was actually on the jury.
E) The response was ridiculous over the top terrorism against businessmen.
F) The ecosystem has billions of years preparation handling hydrocarbon emissions on the floor of the gulf of Mexico. Anyone telling you different is exaggerating the damage for political reasons.
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| | | 115 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Tue, May 20, 2014, 23:20
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Thank you for your to the point discussion. You'll excuse me if I over react to the lack of a sincere apology and reparations from the oil companies.
My personal opinion is if they want to blame it on the guy they hired, and not take responsibility for their hiring of that guy, or their inability to recognize his weakneses, then maybe I expect to much from our business leaders.
So, unless you want to tell me how a business man does not have any leadership responsibility we have nothing more to discuss.
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| | | 116 | Boldwin
ID: 44292015
Wed, May 21, 2014, 00:04
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It's not that there is no responsibility. My issue is that there is likely NO PUNISHMENT that you would have deemed excessive. The point for liberals is never fairness. It is always how much power they can wring from the 'crisis'.
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| | | 117 | sarge33rd
ID: 390471112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 00:22
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What a load of condescending mularkey. What I be just as accurate then Boldwin to say;
The point for liberalsconservatives is never fairness. It is always how much powerliability they can wringavoid from the 'crisis'.
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| | | 120 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Wed, May 21, 2014, 01:54
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Boldwin, your exaggerations are over the top, but entertaining and many are based on the truth. Sarge, I would like you to pick 47 numbers for me in the next powerball lottery, so I can play the other 6. You have never been right on any post at any time and if this can carry over to the lottery we can split the 11 million dollars.
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| | | 121 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 02:25
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116 Actually I think that the CEO of the company should step down, I think that the owners of the company (stockholders) should take no profit for the rest of their lives on their investment, and I think that anyone with more than 1% of the company should be held to trial.
Of course I am a guy that thinks that their should be absolutely zero mineral rights in this country.
But what do I know of justice, and how to share OUR assets.
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| | | 122 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 02:28
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You do have your concealed weapon permit dont you?
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| | | 123 | sarge33rd
ID: 390471112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 02:29
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Gator, could you possibly be more mistaken?
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| | | 124 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 02:32
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1 MAN - 1 VOTE
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| | | 125 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 04:44
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Conservatives really don't understand how deeply liberals don't empathize with individuals. The objects of their two minutes of hate are truly unpeople to them.
Conservatives think if they just explained better how unfair liberals were being they could reach them. I don't make that mistake anymore.
Liberals don't love people. They think they love 'the people', but control freaks really don't love anything other than power.
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| | | 126 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 05:26
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How much damage are they willing to do to the family running Hobby Lobby? They could be in the soup line tomorrow and liberals would spit on them as they passed by. Not a trace of human compassion or mercy. No sense of proportionality.
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| | | 127 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 05:54
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“You can’t get good chinese takeout in China and cuban cigars are rationed in Cuba. That’s all you need to know about communism.” – P.J. O’Rourke
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| | | 128 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Wed, May 21, 2014, 09:58
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#126
Exactly what kind of damage has been done to the Green family?
They could be in the soup line tomorrow and liberals would spit on them as they passed by. Not a trace of human compassion or mercy. No sense of proportionality.
It is you who have no sense of proportionality. Not only is Steven Green in absolutely no danger of being in a soup line tomorrow, he's active in promoting his religious views as part of public school curriculum.
link
I find it especially ironic that someone who claims to be concerned with the status of the 'individual', turns around and claims liberals have not a trace of human capacity or mercy, which strips millions of any sense of individuality.
The critical thinking skills you boast as a personal attribute are, in fact, sorely lacking.
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| | | 129 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:13
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Liberals are very compassionate...with other people's money.
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| | | 130 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:21
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Exactly what kind of damage has been done to the Green family? - PV
Liberals are trying to fine the Green family into poverty to force them into violating their faith. If the Supreme court hadn't stepped in and temporarily stopped those 1.3 million dollar per day fines Obama was levying [$475 million a year] it wouldn't have been long before they'd have been in the soup line.
You have seen Sarge salivating at the thot of throwing pharmacists of conscience out of work.
You will be happy when some gay sues me into poverty for not working for him/her.
I don't think you'll shed tear one for me.
Brother.
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| | | 131 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:38
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which strips millions of any sense of individuality - PV
Exactly! They choose to have no choice. They are merely ciphers in the collective by their own philosophy. Unworthy of any individual justice.
The ideological construct of 'social justice' is precisely the elimination of individual fair and equal treatment and the elimination of the freedom to choose.
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| | | 132 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:40
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Lets see...
Crime - destroy an entire ecosystem resulting in the loss of a vital food source, recreational paradise, a regional economy. This by a foreign entity, yet nobody declares an attack on our sovereignty?
Punishment - A negotiated inadequate settlement holding NOBODY responsible, followed by new opportunites to repeat the above ad infinitum.
Lets see...
Crime - possession of marijuana
Penalty - Imprisonment, followed by a lifetime of unemployment and low paying jobs
Is it me? Really?
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| | | 133 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:49
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One Man - One Vote
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| | | 134 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:51
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Got that concealed weapon permit yet?
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| | | 135 | Boldwin
ID: 13436213
Wed, May 21, 2014, 12:55
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Bean
Is the only way you can debate, by putting words in other people's mouths? For your own self-respect, leave that tactic to Tree and Sarge.
I am for preservation of the environment, but not by a marxist EPA.
I think it fair for BP to reimburse fishermen if they truly have to suspend fishing. Tho I'd have to have it explained to me why they can't just cruise elsewhere for the week.
I'm for legalizing MJ, very reluctantly. I'm not in favor of drugs, but I'm less in favor of giving drug lords an unfair monopoly and paying 60K a year per to feed and house our most foolish children. I love Robert Downey Jr. and don't feel better when our Robert Downey Jr.s are in jail.
Please stop making up crap to put in my mouth.
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| | | 136 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 13:00
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One Man - One Bullet (preferably in the shirt pocket, Opie).
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| | | 137 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 13:05
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BTW, Sheriff Andy told Otis where the key to the jail was and told him he was welcome to check himself in anytime he wanted to sleep it off.
If you dont like the Andy of Mayberry references, sorry, best I can do.
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| | | 138 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 13:19
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I think it fair for the British Government to get the hell out of our country...just so you know where I am coming from.
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| | | 139 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 13:21
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I think it fair that we pull our forces out of England and let them defend themselves
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| | | 140 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 15:14
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I am sorry I omitted this ref in in my post 132.
I know I must appear to be an idiot. Sorry I'll try to do better.
126 No sense of proportionality.
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| | | 141 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 17:04
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Sorry, the point of #133, #134, #136-#140 eludes me. Cranky yet without the clever fun.
For once I detect someone who can debate me a bit and have fun in the process, but these lapses...IDK.
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| | | 142 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 17:19
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133 Argument through repetition of an undying theme.
134 Argument through asking the same question repeatedly until a response is given
136 A funny joke with reference to other innane posts for your entertainment
140 Isnt it obvious, I point out that you wanted a sense of proportionality with your justice, I show you one of the worst possible examples of lack of proportionality demonstrated by the right. I then jab you one more time with I am an idiot etc, and of course you should be realizing that I am just saying what BP said. I mock you with combinations dancing past you then putting you against the ropes.
Work on your game Boldy....tired of taking you to school. hehe
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| | | 143 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 17:22
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Dean: Republicans have sold the country and aren’t Americans. Obama: Republicans aren’t patriotic.
Obama’s and Dean’s messages are too consistent with each other to be considered slips of the tongue or cases of either man just getting carried away. They are talking from the same set of ideas, for the same purpose.
The comments come from two consequential figures who should not be ignored.
While their consistent message betrays desperation, as the Democrats are set to lose the Senate this fall, it also betrays vindictiveness.
This is a kind of othering that precedes pogroms. Dehumanize. Separate. Villify. And then…what?
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| | | 144 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Wed, May 21, 2014, 17:25
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Liberals are trying to fine the Green family into poverty to force them into violating their faith.
How are they violating their faith? No one in the Green family is being forced to use birth control. No one who works for Hobby Lobby is being forced to use birth control. Hobby Lobby isn't a religious organization. No one believes that if the Green family decides to break the current law, for whatever reason, that they'd be forced into poverty and soup lines.
Personally, I don't agree with birth control being a required element in health insurance policies, but I'm not female. 15 states, including red ones, have laws requiring insurers to cover the diagnosis and treatment of infertility. I don't agree with those laws either, but I don't see any employers pleading certain poverty if they decide to break those laws that may violate their faith.
You will be happy when some gay sues me into poverty for not working for him/her.
If, by you, you're referring to me, let me remind you that one of the reasons I left the radio business is that a gay man that I fired threatened to sue the company, and the company capitulated by offering him a settlement, even though the firing was well deserved and within company policy. As part of the settlement, I was required to take a harassment class, which I refused. So I have no idea why you would make yourself look so foolish for making that statement.
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| | | 145 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 17:34
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And yet you always take the gay mafia side. It sure seems like that to me.
Yes it's hard to keep track of everyone's position on every issue. As rare as it is for me to have an ally around here, you'd think that would stand out.
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| | | 146 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 18:21
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143 Dean rants that the Republicans have “sold out” the country, and then rails against voter ID law"
First of all, My view on voter ID...of course its appropriate. You could have access to the photo ID database alternatively, so that someone who recently lost theirs isnt refused to execute their voting right. Anyway, if you cant make the effort to have your ID ready for the vote, perhaps it doesnt mean that much to you. Democrats are way out of line here.
Colorado does much of their elections in advance of the Poll Days through the mail. A little scary maybe, but they do.
As to whether I agree with Dean on Republicans selling out the country. BP owns our oil reserves because Reagan sold them to them. Nothing more to say.
Preston's quote traced back to the previous article reveals this statement from Obama in its entirity (prolly still a bit out of context but here it is anyway):
We’ve got one party in Congress right now that has been captured by ideologues whose core premise is “no” — who fundamentally believe that the problem is government; who don’t believe that we as a community, as a country have any serious role to play in giving people a hand up; whose budget reflects an interest in cutting back commitments to the most vulnerable and freeing the most powerful from any constraints; and whose principal focus at any given point in the day is trying to figure out how can they make people sufficiently cynical, sufficiently angry, sufficiently suspicious that they can win the next election.
I hate to be blunt about it, but that’s the play. And, by the way, when I say a party has been captured, it’s because I actually want an effective, serious, patriotic, capable, sober-minded Republican Party. And we’ve had that in the past.
I'll say this, the president should use more guarded words, but it sounds alot like something I might say. The president isnt a Crank on rotoguru though.
My view is that if you want free markets and free thought and free speech, then the only way to ensure them all is to limit the power and authority of any one individual or group either in the market, religious thought, or politics/government.
Unfortunately, this is a world where there are borders, where the majority isnt always right, where we all operate from limited knowledge, where economies of scale are essential for competition and where some projects require many resources to implement them. Reality just gets in the way of ideology sometimes.
Here's my final view of who should run the country.
Not the businessman because he is only in charge because he has accumulated the most power through personal wealth that he refuses to share.
Not the military because the top general can use the chain of command concept to impose his personal will.
Not the organized church, because its head could use his moral authority to justify anything.
Not a foreign entity, because they absolutely do not have YOUR best interest at heart.
That leaves the government/politicians.
This country has yet to heal from the hanging chad fiasco. You have to admit that seen from an outsider there was a Governor of FL who was the brother of a Presidential candidate whose questionable election process barely won the presidency. You need not look anywhere else to explain cynicism in this country, though there are many other reasons for it.
Anyway, the common man has two choices each election, a Democrat or a Republican. Most of us can see pros and cons with either choice, but we MUST make a choice. We tend to go with the guy we trust in our gut often for our own self-serving reasons. We are inevitably manipulated by those who deliver messages to us. Some get more audience than others for all sorts of reasons.
Moral of the story:
As my forebearers taught me, nobody wins a popularity contest fighting for the powerful. Often the only way to gather a following is to declare a powerful enemy. Both sides use the tactic, but attacking the government that was duly elected is just self-loathing, so I do not understand how this treasonous behavior should be considered an option.
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| | | 147 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 18:43
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I don't call anyone depending on winning elections by including every illegal alien they can bus to the ballot box, 'duly elected'.
I also don't call marxism American.
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| | | 148 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 18:51
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148 Yeah, the illegal alien issue and to a lesser degree the correct amount and skill mix of legal aliens with a path to citizenship is of great concern to me. Are you saying you think that there were illegals voting in the FL election back then?
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| | | 149 | Pancho Villa
ID: 2131916
Wed, May 21, 2014, 19:21
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And yet you always take the gay mafia side
I am in favor of gay marriage because it's a basic right. Other than that the statement is false.
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| | | 150 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 19:23
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Of course. They are encouraged to vote. They are not asked about their citizenship. Many of them are not even aware they aren't eligible. They just except the encouragement to vote at face value. Did you think FLA didn't have more than their fair share of illegal aliens?
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| | | 151 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 19:44
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I'm sure they did, especially Carribean islanders, question is did Jeb let them vote?
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| | | 152 | Tree
ID: 438482411
Wed, May 21, 2014, 19:47
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And yet you always take the gay mafia side. It sure seems like that to me.
what the hell does that even mean? the gay mafia?? jesus, what an idiotic comment.
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| | | 153 | Boldwin
ID: 424532112
Wed, May 21, 2014, 20:03
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"gay mafia", 1/4 million google hits and it's own wiki entry.
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| | | 154 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Wed, May 21, 2014, 20:08
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If the gay mafia makes me an offer, I am refusing it.
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| | | 155 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Wed, May 21, 2014, 20:11
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Gator...that was pretty funny, original?
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| | | 156 | sarge33rd
ID: 593111219
Thu, May 22, 2014, 16:33
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150...you have factual evidence and supporting links for this? Not the same links as claimed 147% of the registered voters in St Lucie county voted, when they were using a 4 page ballot, and the number of PAGES was 147% of the nr of registered voters.
Out of 175,554 registered voters, 247,713 vote cards were cast -
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| | | 157 | Boldwin
ID: 25441225
Thu, May 22, 2014, 20:20
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Oh! Oh! Oh! Sarge! Tell them about that time the Bar Assn proved there were only 8 illegal alien votes cast in that election that one time. That's always good for a laff!
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| | | 158 | sarge33rd
ID: 390471112
Thu, May 22, 2014, 22:01
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IOW, no...you dont have any such evidence.
TY for playing our game.
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| | | 159 | Boldwin
ID: 164262222
Fri, May 23, 2014, 09:22
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Don't forget that tho the 'culture war' is just a day at the beach for liberals, it's a real war with real casualties for the right.
Because we have different rules in the media and in the Justice Dept.
For context remember Obama's view of campaign finance laws.
How much less complicated life is for liberals. Excused from Obamacare. Excused from the law. Excused from personal responsibility. Excused from caring about individuals. Excused from morality.
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| | | 160 | Boldwin
ID: 164262222
Fri, May 23, 2014, 09:33
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And they specifically asked him to donate the exact dollar amount that would keep him under the legal requirement to identify the country of origin for the donation.
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| | | 161 | biliruben
ID: 81382416
Fri, May 23, 2014, 10:13
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I can assure you I hate Wall Street scum more than you do.
But, it sounds like you are advocating for making it an offense punishable by jail time for running a company into bankruptcy.
Is that right? A yes or no response will suffice.
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| | | 162 | Boldwin
ID: 164262222
Fri, May 23, 2014, 10:36
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for running a company into bankruptcy
That is not the crime Corzine committed nor is that a crime per se.
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| | | 163 | Boldwin
ID: 164262222
Fri, May 23, 2014, 10:40
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That the media underperformed to the extent that you don't know what Corzine did...now that is criminal misconduct of the highest order.
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| | | 164 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:05
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159 I know it has a small effect, but I just want to remind you all of my recommendation of doing away with the itemized deduction. We could do it slowly by increasing the standard deduction over lets say 10 years.
People could still donate, but they wouldnt promote their politics at the expense of the taxpayer.
One man, one vote.
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| | | 165 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:06
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164 and expensing organizational donations should be outlawed as well.
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| | | 166 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:25
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159 As to D'Souza's crime and punishment. Brilliant man, I have seen him on talk shows, many interesting ideas.
Perfect guy to make an example of. Highly visible. Sends a message to other law breaking conspirators that it will not be tolerated.
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| | | 167 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:38
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159 It should be law that internet donations may only come from verified US citizens, and we should do a better job of tying documentation of donations to IRS databases, hows that?
How would you control all anonymous donations?
$5 donations is the issue? Or is it millions of those donations that is an issue? Or is it just that Obama is getting donations and some Republican isnt?
Proportionality is the word you used am I mistaken? If you were king for a day, how would you handle it?
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| | | 168 | Boldwin
ID: 164262222
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:48
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There is a system in place. Romney had no problem disallowing foreign donors. Obama's website was deliberately designed NOT to disallow them. Democrat presidential candidates take them in by the shipping container from China, Indonesia, wherever they happen to come from.
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| | | 169 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 11:57
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168 Deliberately is the operative word. If it can be proven, then we have a real issue.
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| | | 170 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Fri, May 23, 2014, 12:33
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Boldy,
Why does the victim of a bully run to his big brother? Why does the victim get a big dog or join a gang if they dont have a big brother?
Why does the wimp go work out? Why do NRA members want to keep their guns?
These are questions you should have already known the answer to, but we'll wait for you to catch up. Thank god for public education Boldy, or I wouldnt have any chance to tell you what I think. Thank a teacher.
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| | | 171 | Boldwin
ID: 23430254
Sun, May 25, 2014, 17:39
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Washington Redskins drop 'Washington' from their name as offensive to most Americans - The People's Cube
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| | | 172 | Boldwin
ID: 14572611
Mon, May 26, 2014, 16:09
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Here is what you get when you spend decades thotlessly dismissing the majority opinion as something only racist nutters would embrace.
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| | | 173 | Perm Dude
ID: 431013412
Mon, May 26, 2014, 23:33
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UKIP won 27.5% of the vote...
Only among Right Wing Americans is 27.5% a majority.
Math? Who needs it?
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| | | 174 | Boldwin
ID: 114512621
Mon, May 26, 2014, 23:54
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Do you understand the parliamentary form of government?
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| | | 175 | Boldwin
ID: 114512621
Tue, May 27, 2014, 00:05
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Before the election just saying this got you dismissed out of hand as a racist.
I just can't get enuff you-tube watching those BBC/Guardian/Tory/Labor prigs backing away from their previous statements calling every UKIP supporter a racist.
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| | | 176 | Boldwin
ID: 14532818
Thu, May 29, 2014, 15:12
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For some reason I will never understand, they put Skooter Libby in prison over Plame.
Can someone explain why exposing the CIA station chief is on the otherhand just a big shoulder shrug?
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| | | 178 | Gator
ID: 19323103
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 09:40
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Boldwin,I cannot understand how the left can justify Scooter Libby. They will fight for a pedophile's rights with the ACLU, but if your views are to the right of them "Off with their heads!"
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| | | 179 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 09:52
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If you want to stay out of jail, stay out of politics
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| | | 180 | Boldwin
ID: 50546712
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 13:57
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You are fine with one party literally free to break any law without penalties and their opposition being checked off the enemies list one ruined life at a time?
If you believe that you have never been an American.
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| | | 181 | bibA
ID: 204511510
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 14:35
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180 - Who is that addressed to? Who is this "you"?
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| | | 182 | Boldwin
ID: 50546712
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 15:02
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Directed at #179, but if the shoe fits...
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| | | 183 | Bean
ID: 5292191
Sat, Jun 07, 2014, 15:50
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Those in power prosecute those who are not for their crimes. That's not subject to debate it is a historical fact. Read a book or two.
Pardoning people for their crimes also happens all the time. It's usually with political strings attached. What did happen with Nixon and this Libby guy anyway?
Couple these indisputable facts with my, albeit cynical, perspective that those who go into politics only do so to steal. Throw in a pinch of "if you cant do the time dont do the crime".
You get: "If you want to stay out of jail, stay out of politics"
So, I stand by my statement.
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| | | 184 | Boldwin
ID: 50546712
Sun, Jun 08, 2014, 15:04
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Ok, tell me you think Americans should stand for it if that is Nixon's excuse.
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| | | 185 | Boldwin
ID: 1455124
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 05:51
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Holiday from historical pattern is over for Jews. Back to endemic ubiquitous persecution.
It's a shame.
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| | | 186 | Bean
ID: 14147911
Tue, Jun 02, 2015, 14:52
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We all have our crosses to bear...quit whining and get back in line
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