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Subject: Free Agency 2010
Posted by: Farn
- Leader [451044109] Mon, Jun 28, 2010, 09:39
Time to get this thread open. The week is finally here.
I can only pray these guys all sign asap because I am not sure I can stomach too many more articles.
Predictions? |
| Only the 50 most recent replies are currently shown. Click on this text to display hidden posts as well. |
| 48 | Tree
ID: 248472317
Fri, Jul 09, 2010, 16:13
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No matter what, LeBron left money on the table when he left Cleveland.
i wouldn't be so sure of that. it likely depends on the salary differential.
he pays almost 6 percent state income tax in Ohio. In Florida, he pays nothing.
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| 49 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Fri, Jul 09, 2010, 16:21
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Heh. Good point. Of course, expenses are higher in Miami.
The exact amounts are to be determined based on the next CBA, but Cleveland was able to offer a little over 10% of an increase over his last salary. All other teams were limited to a little over 6% (providing they have cap room).
In addition, Cleveland was able to offer a longer term contract (6 years max vs 5 years).
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| 50 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Sat, Jul 10, 2010, 16:07
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Cavs don't get left empty handed--they get a handful of draft picks and a cap exemption of $16 million
Time to start making some lemonade...
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| 51 | Tree
ID: 248472317
Sat, Jul 10, 2010, 18:27
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Of course, expenses are higher in Miami.
not nearly as much as you'd expect. homeprices are within 10K of each other, and things like energy costs, doctor visits, and food tend to be more expensive in Cleveland.
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| 52 | barilko6
ID: 47613108
Sat, Jul 10, 2010, 18:32
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According to reports Lebron left $15 million on the table.
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| 53 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Sat, Jul 10, 2010, 19:01
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#51: That's a wash for someone like LeBron. Entertainment costs are way higher in Miami.
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| 54 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Sun, Jul 11, 2010, 09:15
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52#
Over 6 years...I really had to give this input here.....These guys in their money world...really does this really make a dent in their finances? I mean C'mon James has to have thought "that is chunk change to what I will make in winning over the years versus staying in Cleveland and Not winning"
Whaaaaa Whaaaaa I think the money is just a cover for what a stink this all has been. These guys have Known they were joining in Miami for sometime. Hardly any comments through all of this from James about Cleveland and staying there. I remember Pat Riley making statements about Not worried about Bosh and Wade playing around in Chi Town......He was not even worried....cause he knew he was already getting these three. So James really is at fault for not just telling Cleveland ALOT sooner he was leaning leaving.
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| 55 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Sun, Jul 11, 2010, 09:39
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I heard that he had made the decision weeks ago, but still went through the charade of taking more offers and so on. He should have quietly told the Cleveland owner, at the very least.
I think he can count on a sharp drop in his jersey sales among Cleveland fans with the move, however...
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| 56 | barilko6
ID: 47613108
Sun, Jul 11, 2010, 13:12
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re: 54 I totally agree that the amount James left on the table is probably the equivalent of $100 to me, but there were a number of posts in this thread citing incorrect figures, so I just posted the actual number.
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| 57 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Sun, Jul 11, 2010, 14:11
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55 I am with you.....but this will all blow over at some point and a championship will greatly diminish that....but again he could have told Cleveland and they could have gone after a few players...now who do they have and they held out for James ACING like he was actually leaning toward CLE ? ? ? Who will really know but for me I think this guy played so bad in a few games int eh playoffs....As if he was laying off...Even Barkley said this is weird as James did not even have any passion to try in that game against Boston....so as bad as Owner Gilbert said things....Some of it might be true as this all unfolds.
Either way all if for a frenzy of a summer of NBA...ha ha ha It is almost more frenzy in the off season than it is when they are playing games. In the end I do not see them winning a ring for years.....they do nto have enough Cap space...real simple. Get Bosh in Foul trouble and the rest of the league scrambles to sign all of the big men left to sign...leaving a major Hole for Miami...Bosh can not do it all by himself and he is not a get down and dirty big man doing all of the hard work like guys JNoah in Chi town. Maybe they get a Ben Wallace? better sign all shooters and big men they can....I guess I did hear one argument of getting NON-NBA guys that are shooters and re-bounders...lol I can not see this being better than Boston, Chicago, Orlando, Haws, and LA.
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| 58 | Da Bomb
Donor
ID: 487112814
Sun, Jul 11, 2010, 14:16
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Some believe that they all had a pact to play together since the Olympics in 2008. I wonder what James would have done if Cleveland had won a championship this past year.
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| 59 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 09:38
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That is why he played like crap in playoffs....Can not leave clevland if they win a championship.....you think it is bad now...LOL
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| 60 | Great One
ID: 3265018
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 09:48
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I've heard it the other way, at least if he won then people would feel like he completed his job there and now could move on. Thats what my friend who is a cleveland sports fan told me.
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| 61 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 10:58
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You know I got thinking back to this whole Salary Sacrifice. With all of the talk of who the Heat need to get...Shaq, Miller, Stackhouse, Juan Howard...all of these guys are going to have to play around 75% less than if they went else where.....ha ha ha Really who will be making the salary sacrifices...The Trio really did not leave much left on the books to get other guys...I am confused at how they are going to fill it out.
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| 62 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:11
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I understand the rules but how do you prove it. I am sure they and possibly many others in past have small talked about joining forces. NBA has some real funny Shhh Shhh rules Like Ilgauskas coming back to Cleveland after the trade to Washington...ha ha ha
Cleveland and Toronto
Cuban still bitter for losing after a 2 game lead in Finals?
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| 63 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:18
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Nate Silver estimates LeBron will lose $150 million, in the end
If he doesn't win multiple championships in Miami, he's likely to lost a lot more than that.
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| 64 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:21
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60
I can see the thought of that view...but to leave a team after winning the MVP ...now take it a step closer...He left why? To win a championship....LOL so I guess he would have to change why he left then huh? He has known he was leaving to me there is no doubt. They should not have talked about how much they are friends...cause you will not convince me they(Friends) have not talked about this for sometime. Even if it over lunch and someone says WOW it woudl be great to all be on the same team. League has some Shady rules.
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| 65 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:26
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63
I agree with parts of the story, but remember his reputation now will not be near what it is after opening day and he is playing again. People will move on....and right now Yes Reputation is taking a hit but even as the heat WIN games as I am sure they do...this will all be in the past and he will be on the endorsements High. I did like reading how Jordan woudl be worth double James was last year...WOW and we never called him the king huh?
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| 66 | Great One
ID: 3265018
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:27
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But to me, its like - who cares? Why can't a trio of guys want to play together and want to have fun and dominate? Good for them.
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| 67 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:29
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After just drafted....didn't James get a 100 Million deal with Nike...HA HA HA I am nto buying he loses that much money.
Bottom line these guys needed to take more of a salary pay cut to help get other guys at their playing worth salaries. I mean they are going to ask Shaq to play for what 1.5 Mil. What would a Ben Wallace get?
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| 68 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 11:30
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66 I agree.....and why can't they talk about it all they want and especially in the privacy of their home. But league says NO they can not have those talks before July 1ST. I think that is so laughable.
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| 69 | Great One
ID: 3265018
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 12:27
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Yeah, what are they gonna do - track all their emails and texts and phone conversations?! lol...
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| 70 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 15:06
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Exactly and that is why Neither CLE or TOR are going to do anything about it. But I can say this for sure....much talk and traction on this one guys....
Wade wants us to get it straight...LOL
LINK
Read the article too.....really just shows how many levels this NBA rule is a joke...Guys should and can talk all they want."I know the Cavs have thought this was in the works for a long time," an NBA general manager said.
But you won't hear this GM offering sympathy or expressing outrage.
"Indignation? Really?" he said. "Do teams actually talk to agents before July 1? I'm shocked. It's Claude Rains, shocked that gambling is going on in Rick's Café."
"We know that's going on. It's reality. And we're all big boys. If you have an attractive wife, guys are gonna be hitting on her. It comes with the territory."
Is anyone naive enough to think that players don't share mutual daydreams about joining forces? I once even acted as a middleman, taking a note from one player to another, requesting that Player B go to the management to request a trade to get Player A. When players talk do you think they're brainstorming ways to plug the oil leak in the Gulf? Not exactly. They're tabulating how many games they could win if they played together.
"That's going on every day," the GM said. "Players are always talking to each other. That's nothing new."
Same with the notion that some combination of Wade, James and Bosh would get together this summer. It probably was more a matter of where than if and when. Two years ago, someone who was with the 2008 Olympic team told me he expected James and Wade to play together in New York for Knicks coach Mike D'Antoni, who was an assistant on the Olympic squad staff.
If D'Antoni was the one who gave them that idea, then that would be tampering. Same thing if Miami Heat owner Mickey Arison's son Nick, who was an intern on the 2006 World Championship the three all played on, was busy laying groundwork. Absent any evidence that either of those things occurred, you're just going to have to accept that three players just took control of the steering wheel."
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| 71 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 15:11
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It was always clear that Wade and James were good friends, and it was no secret that Wade was talking with James about joining him in Miami.
Honestly I don't think it is a big deal--friends talking to each other about playing on the same team. No big deal.
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| 72 | Great One
ID: 3265018
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 15:22
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Yeah, why would you not want to play (and travel, and train etc) with people you enjoy working with? I know even in the business world it makes it bearable. And at this point, they really don't care about a couple million more bucks. They won't even notice it.
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| 73 | weykool
ID: 351422416
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 16:00
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I dont think they should allow players to talk about joining forces unless it is while one player is taking a shower after the game.
To me this is one of those rules that is needed but shouldnt be enforced....kinda like office gambling.
Officially illegal but unless you open up a store front or advertise to the public to handle bets everyone turns a blind eye.
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| 74 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Mon, Jul 12, 2010, 16:55
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So looking at the fantasy implications for the Miami Big 3, it knocks each of them down a couple pegs in my book. My top 7 as of now would be CP3, Durant, LBJ, Dirk, Wade, Kobe, and Deron W. After that I'd be considering Gasol, Granger, Brook Lopez, and Josh Smith to round out the top 10. Bosh drops to late teens/early 20s I think after guys like Carmelo, G Wallace, and B Roy.
I expect Wade and LBJs minutes to go up a bit with Bosh staying about the same. I can see 40+ mins from the big 2 and 36-38 from Bosh. It would also be wise to let Wade and LBJ rest separately so that each can be the man for 8+ mins a game without sharing. Miami will most likely start Bosh at PF with J. Anthony or a FA center like Big Z starting. Bosh will play some C during the game with LBJ moving to the 4 to create post up opps at times. Teams will have to double so with Bosh's range this will really open up the game for them.
If Mike Miller does in fact sign, then he bodes well to be the 6th man and have Chalmers start at pg. For stretches of the game Wade will run the point and Miller will provide the firepower off the bench and stretch the floor. Haslem looks to re-sign with the Heat now, so that means they could fill out the roster with a few other role players and be set. Jason Williams would be smart to sign a 2 year deal at the vet's min to be the backup pg, and rookies like Pittman, Varnado and Butler plus 2nd year man Beverley will likely round out the roster. I don't see another big name vet coming until later in the season when teams start dumping players. They could use a defensive guy like Raja Bell who would also give them added long range shooting, but can they get him to sign as a FA for around vet min as well?
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| 75 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Wed, Jul 14, 2010, 15:33
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Great movement the last few days after the Lebron-athon was finally over. Dampier to Charlotte for Chandler, A. Jefferson to Utah, Felton signs with NY, Harrington to Denver, the botched Calderon to Charlotte trade, the maybe still on Turkoglu to Phoenix deal for Barbosa. whew!
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| 76 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Wed, Jul 14, 2010, 15:45
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Plus smaller deals like Fisher staying in LA, Childress to PHO, Ridnour to Minn, Livingston in Charlotte, Tony Allen to Memphis, Kleiza to TOR.
Lowry looks to get CLE deal matched to stay in Houston, Wesley Matthews might get matched to stay in Utah. Lots of rumors still abound like Shaq going to Hawks for Marvin Williams. And Matt Barnes is shopping a one our live broadcast called "Who Cares" so he can announce which championship caliber team he will join.
In totally insignificant news, the Landlord will start collecting rent in Denver and Adam Morrison is looking for another bench chair to occupy with the hopes of seeing court time. Think they should give him a little stand next to the bench to showcase his two championship rings!
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| 77 | Mike D
ID: 306441417
Wed, Jul 14, 2010, 18:44
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LMAO!!
"They can't take away those rings"!
Great analysis in post 74. I agree with most of it, as usual. I think Gasol may be high though, and I wonder why Amare slid under your radar. He's back, baby, and will have freedom to do whatever he wants. He's no Matt Barnes though. ;)
Love the Harrington move for real life Denver. Lowry has big bucks coming and I think he has a better chance to earn them in Cleveland so I hope Houston does not match. Matthews?? Insane dollars for him at this point but these types of moves are based on potential. So who knows.
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| 78 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Wed, Jul 14, 2010, 22:49
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77
I am wondering about the value guys like Z might have this year as his stock will be low but with the way increased min in south Beach...might be a nice low income player to round out the roster and especially at center.
Also Miller might be great hitting wide open 3's and Stack possibly going to heat? I heard T-Mac Wants to go but not sure they want him there. Does Shaq want to go there or does LBJ think too much star power?
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| 79 | Mike D
ID: 306441417
Wed, Jul 14, 2010, 23:50
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I don't think at this point in his career Z will see more than 24-26 minutes or so a game. I think those minutes will be productive and not unlike recent year averages. Last year was a bit of an exception.
But Bosh can slide to center, especially late in games. Haslem is a huge piece to this. He plays PF and C like Bosh. And then they will have another big or two for spot minutes (Anthony? Magloire?). Nutshell----could be like Z's seasons of 2006-2008.
Miller---after how terrible he was last year, even in Washington, I will believe it when I see it. He had lots of opportunities and didn't do much. Same with the year before in Minnesota.
Stack? Not much interest from a fantasy standpoint. T-Mac? Who is that (lol)? I thought Shaq might fit there. The web sources all are talking Atlanta. I think it is safe to say if Shaq surfaces it will be on a playoff type team.
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| 80 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 10:54
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I can't see Z averaging more than 8 and 8 and that would be a great season if he can do it with all the touches the Super Friends will need. Plus, it seems now Juwan Howard is headed to South Beach to back up Bosh, Haslem and Z plus the qualifying offer to J. Anthony is still there. Their frontcourt is looking solid, so need to figure out which veteran pgs and swing players they can sign now with JWill, Barnes and Stackhouse all on the radar. I don't think Shaq will end up in Miami, although that was my first thought. Dallas was where I expected him to go, but Atlanta may be the only playoff team actually looking at him now. Sad...
Harrington spurned Dallas to go to Denver, which means he is more interested in playing a big role there especially early in the season than 6th man type mins for a contender. I still think Denver is lacking what is needed to get through the 2nd rd in the West. Dallas still has a solid team and there is talk of having Marion, Terry and Chandler all on the 2nd unit which is a nice luxury.
MikeD, it's tough to figure out where I'd go after the top 7 so Gasol was thrown in there since he was in the 12-15 range and is consistent. Amare is still not a proven 1st rounder in my mind, and without the security of Father Nash will struggle at times. Felton is a push it quick type pg too though, so if Amare runs the court still he will get easy dunks. Of course, I got burned with him as a 1st rounder two years ago, so that may play into me dropping him to around 14-15.
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| 81 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 11:04
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So to throw some numbers out there for my Heat predictions, here we go. Should be fun to discuss.
DWade 39 mpg, 24ppg, 4.2 rpg, 5.6 apg
LBJ 40mpg, 25.2 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 7.1 apg
Bosh 36mpg, 17.5 ppg, 9.2 rpg, 2.4 apg
M. Miller 26 mpg, 10.4 ppg, 4.8rpg, 4.2 apg
Miller will be better as a 4th option then he was as a sidekick to Agent Gunslinger and Jamison, however he will not have a great fantasy season due to limited touches. He will still shoot over 50% and 40% respectivey and will likely get 2+ 3pg with all the space he should have, so 6th - 7th round is where I'd look for him.
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| 82 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 13:49
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Miller is the odd man out in that situation. Hell, anyone not named James, Wade, or Bosh is the odd man out.
Great move by Z to go down there--of the current crop, he's about the only new guy who knows how to team play after he was a go-to guy himself.
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| 83 | dpr
ID: 552411820
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 13:59
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Miller really is the only shooter though. Wade and James while both having good shots, have their game based on driving to the hoop. It seems that this should leave miller open for some open shots. While the ball wont be in his hands as much, he should face many open shots having his 3s and percentages go up.
In terms of guys going at the back of the first round I think you have to consider both Lee and Curry. They returned top 10 value last year though obviously come with their risks as they play in gsw/not as much track record/new system.
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| 84 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 14:36
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Lee and Curry are nice fantasy players, but the Don Nelson effect means you never know what will happen. Curry and Ellis with launch a bunch of shots without Maggette, Randolph, Azubuike and Morrow around, so Lee should have a great chance at leading the league in rebounding. Will he get enough low post touches though? 16 and 12 is what I expect this year which knocks him to late 2nd or early 3rd rounder for me.
Some "experts" have Curry ranked in 1st round and as high as #4. He certainly has potential to put up big numbers but that is a stretch. I have him in mid 2nd round, but would I really take him over proven guys like Carmelo, Lopez, or Gasol? I'd even consider Tyreke Evans, Nash and Ellis along with Curry all around the 17-20 spots.
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| 85 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 14:43
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The system is everything, as you point out skinneej. But Lee chipped in 3.5 assist/gm, and added high FG% to the mix. I think he goes mid 2nd round at the latest.
I think, given his lack of real defense, the GS run-and-gun system would make his numbers even better across the board.
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| 86 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 14:49
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Agreed, but Nelson's system doesn't usually award the big man. The last low post player to average more than 15 ppg under him was Al Harrington in 06-07 and he is considered more of a swing player like Maggette was last couple years. Lee will run the floor well, and get hustle points and rebs off 2nd chances, but he will not have the ball in his hand as much as he did in NY where he was the only option for most of the season. I think his assist go down some since Ellis and Curry will always have the ball in their hands. However, I expect him to go a little early in drafts so it will be interesting!
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| 87 | dpr
ID: 552411820
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 15:33
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What posts players have played in GS? Can't think of any who really should have been scorers. Even if his scoring goes down a bit, and therefore his effect on FG% it seems he should be able to retain the rest of his value to keep him in discussion for around the turn.
One thing benefitting both of these guys is that GS is too invested in them for them to be susceptible to Nelsons whims and falling out of favor. They are going to get there minutes. For Curry, once he was solified in the rotation he provided top of the first round value so while the risk seems to great to put him there, the value at the end of the round seems too great. You think he will regress substantially next year? I can't really see Evans matching Curry's value unless he significantly improves, and he jsut has too many holes as a fantasy guard (no 3 mainly to do that). Last year evans only really beat curry in points and rebounding by a little bit while Curry was significantly better at 3s and percentages. If you look at last 3 months, Curry even matches in those categories.
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| 88 | skinneej
Leader
ID: 040625911
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 16:16
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Yes, Curry's Post ASB numbers were phenomenal and top 10 worthy. That being said, I would still not take him over proven players until mid 2nd round at the earliest. But that is just me and I draft on risk-adverse players in the first several rounds. There are huge rewards potentially for managers grabbing him earlier than that, but to me there are risks to owning him.
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| 89 | Mike D
ID: 306441417
Thu, Jul 15, 2010, 18:31
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I guess 6th or 7th round might be okay for Miller, I just doubt I'll be the one taking him so he can stand around and watch the game (while on the court).
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| 90 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Thu, Jul 29, 2010, 17:47
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Dude wearing LeBron Miami Heat jersey to an Indians game gets booted.
Even the Yankees fans were booing the guy.
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| 91 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Wed, Aug 04, 2010, 19:18
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Shaq signs with the Celtics.
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| 92 | reebbertxx
Dude
ID: 561124720
Wed, Aug 04, 2010, 22:13
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Probably one of the last Shaq fans out there but I love this signing. How bad does Shaq want to stick it to Kobe,Wade, and Bron all at the same time. This will be an enjoyable season regardless of the outcome.
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| 93 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Thu, Aug 05, 2010, 08:40
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Amazing FA Season I can ever remember. The best teams Got BETTER and teams that barely made the playoffs got A LOT better (Mia, Chi) Mil, Hou, Atl, NY, GS I think all got better. Atl might be the same actually, but in the end the NBA has a furry of feeling going into the anticipated opening night.
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| 94 | Perm Dude
ID: 5510572522
Thu, Aug 12, 2010, 22:08
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Cavs were one of the best teams, and they got worse.
Meanwhile, LeBron gets booed after missing shots at Cedar Point.
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| 95 | Mike D
ID: 447451216
Fri, Aug 13, 2010, 00:00
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No one is safe in the video age.
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| 96 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Mon, Aug 16, 2010, 01:03
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It does nto give direct details to what was charged to whom...but as it reads...seems they were High! How can or will this affect MIA? Okay it does say arrested for Possession.
link
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| 97 | CJ
ID: 41513021
Fri, Aug 27, 2010, 15:07
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I guess we saw this one coming huh? I was interested in hearing NO name in possible places to go, but sounds like Paul is going to meet up with Melo somewhere.
Melo on the Move ! ! !
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