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Subject: "Conservative" Investments Posted by: biliruben - Leader [589301110] Mon, Jan 30, 2006, 17:37 This is a thread I'm starting for Treasonists, because he kindly didn't want to clutter Wilmer's thread, here. I have no idea what direction the price of gold will go, and I'm not an investment advisor. I do know that gold has not been a good long-term investment. The gold and silver index is the one up 200%, and the S&P 500 is actually negative. Gold, silver, oil, and commodities are all in a long-term bull market IMO. And the chart he links to: I'm not sure what you are basing your prognostications on, Treasonists, but if it's the chart, all I can say is: Past Results do not necessarily predict Future Performance. Example:  Where do you think the price of gold went next? | |||||||
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| 227 | Pancho Villa ID: 597172916 Mon, Nov 28, 2011, 19:12 |
Forget precious metals. Strategic materials are where it is at. Agreed. | ||||||
| 228 | weykool ID: 3910252813 Mon, Nov 28, 2011, 20:21 |
WK...are you seriously, suggesting that gold is a superior long term performer than the stock market? I never suggested any such thing. It all depends on the time frame. Over some periods of time gold has done better than stocks. Other times, stocks have done better than gold. Blindly picking a stock as you suggested in #205 is more than likely to not only have a crappy return on investment, but you might not even see a return OF your investment. In addition, just because something has done well historically, there is no guarantee it will do well in the future. My dad did very well when he bought real estate and would tell anyone who would listened that there was no way you could lose money. Of course in a post housing bubble we all know differently. | ||||||
| 229 | sarge33rd ID: 010232811 Mon, Nov 28, 2011, 20:44 | understood that "past performance is no guarantee of future performance". That is a given. However, what intrinsic value does gold have? Very little, except in jewelry. All things go up and down 9economically), but gold has proven itself to be a pretty flat performer with just a very few, tight, narrow windows of opportunity. Stocks on the other hand, being representative of companies which actually produce/provide goods/services; almost HAVE to be better bets. No, not guaranteed to be better but a far better BET to be better. | ||||||
| 230 | Perm Dude ID: 3210201915 Mon, Nov 28, 2011, 20:59 |
Actually, historically there are few stocks that perform well at all, sarge. Which is why people are told to diversify. | ||||||
| 231 | sarge33rd ID: 010232811 Mon, Nov 28, 2011, 21:27 | again, I refer to the above where I said explicitly "the stock MARKET". Indexes, Mutual funds (diversified by definition), etc etc. | ||||||
| 232 | Boldwin ID: 4917199 Fri, Oct 19, 2012, 10:17 | My suggestion to name your new investment..."Last Chance Gun Shack". | ||||||
| 233 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Thu, Apr 04, 2013, 14:51 | Please, please, please, right wingers: Buy as much gold as you can. Cash in your stocks and bonds if you have to. | ||||||
| 234 | Boldwin ID: 13330423 Fri, Apr 05, 2013, 02:35 | I always said, hard assets and high tech materials like chromium and rare earths and titanium are where it's at. Ask yourself what your third of the world can't do without in a crisis or world war. They can do quite nicely without gold. | ||||||
| 235 | biliruben ID: 59551120 Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 11:24 |
Krugman moving markets?  Putting the fear in the goldbugs. | ||||||
| 236 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 11:28 | Is that the graph for Bitcoins? :) | ||||||
| 237 | biliruben ID: 59551120 Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 11:39 |
That would be here. Ouch. I am not foolish enough to short bitcoins, however. | ||||||
| 238 | Mith ID: 4310402110 Fri, Apr 12, 2013, 12:28 |
And thereby hangs a tale. One of the central facts about modern America is that everything is political; on the right, in particular, people choose their views about everything, from environmental science to gun safety, to suit their political prejudices. And the remarkable recent rise of “goldbuggism,” in the teeth of all the evidence, shows that this politicization can influence investments as well as voting.Viva Paul Krugman! | ||||||
| 239 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 10:18 | Oh my. Blood in the water. | ||||||
| 240 | Boldwin ID: 1836156 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 14:40 |
I'd like to point out a rumor out there. 'They' say that right before they crash the system you will see metals crash. The reason, I believe, is that they would be cashing out, in order to be in position to buy up all the hard assets in the coming fire-sale, as the power elite insiders do every time there is a crash. If this prediction comes true it will make people who are trumpeting the fall in gold prices as a sign of a recovery, look very foolish. As usual, do the opposite of the masses. Don't get stuck holding gold. | ||||||
| 241 | Biliruben ID: 358252515 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 15:13 | Did your psychic or your astrologist tell you that? | ||||||
| 242 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 15:16 |
Gold is crashing because, like housing in the early 2000s to 2008, there is no fundamental reason for such a bloated price. Much of this can be traced to phony conservative hucksters like Glenn Beck, who daily urged his sheeple to buy gold, it will never go down, and if the world goes to hell in a hand basket, you'll be OK, because you've got gold! Here's Beck in 2010. "They are going to nudge the gold industry out of business," Beck said during his syndicated radio program Wednesday morning. "They are going to regulate it and regulate it and regulate it, until you won't be able to buy gold anymore. This is what I'm telling you -- they can't have people buying gold. They need to own all the gold. They're going to nudge us. Mark my words." Of course, Beck's fear tactic worked so well, that his(as well as Huckabee, Hannity, Savage and others)followers not only lapped up all the gold they could get their hands on, they failed to do the proper due diligence, because, after all, if you can't trust Glenn Beck, who can you trust? If you’ve ever listened to conservative talk radio, you’ve probably heard of Goldline, the precious metal seller endorsed by Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity and others. But critics allege that Goldline is misleading its consumers, much like the talkers they sponsor. The company’s business model was built on systemically swindling and scaring its mostly elderly clientele into purchasing overpriced gold coins, prosecutors in California alleged, leading the company to settle for $4.5 million in refunds to its customer. The city attorney in Santa Monica, where the company is based, brought 19 criminal fraud charges against the company that were later dropped, but a Los Angeles judge last year instructed the company to foot the bill for a court-appointed monitor, who was tasked with ensuring the company revealed its price markups and stopped misleading consumers. But now, the company’s former compliance officer is saying she was fired for complaining to her bosses that she was being prevented from speaking with the monitor, Courthouse News Service reported yesterday. Carol Taylor Gabrelow, who is suing Goldline in L.A. for wrongful termination, says her bosses were afraid she would spill the beans to the monitor about her company’s shady tactics. Her complaint alleges: “Goldline specifically targets vulnerable consumers with sales tactics designed to pressure those consumers into buying products that would often result in the consumer losing over one-third of his or her investment the instant the purchase is made meaning that, even when the price of the precious metals increases, because these consumers were deceived into purchasing coins with mark-ups exceeding 50 percent, it could be years, if ever, before the consumer recoups, much less makes any profit on, the investment.” link | ||||||
| 243 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 15:24 |
psychic, apparently. 
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| 244 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 15:26 |
Wonder no more. Also from the final link in #242: Beck and the other conservative talkers never split from Goldine, despite the legal issues. An ad for the company appears on his website today, which leads you to this endorsement: “Before I started turning you on to Goldline, I wanted to look them in the eye. This is a top notch organization that’s been in business since 1960.” “Goldline now is the only gold company I personally recommend to you,” Sean Hannity says. “My choice for buying gold is Goldline,” conservative radio host Mark Levin says. Whores. | ||||||
| 245 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 15:30 |
Indeed. Robbing stupid wingers isn't even sporting. It's like unloading with both barrels on the nesting quail. | ||||||
| 246 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 19:03 | So stop taxing us. | ||||||
| 247 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 19:31 |
If you stop driving, pooping, drinking water, heating your house, turning on your lights, going to parks, educating your children or expecting your house to be put out in case of fire, feel free to stop paying taxes. And don't you dare bitch about them Iraqi's sneaking thru Canada, thru the UP, capturing Baldwin, IL, and forcing you to build a Mosque with your bare hands. | ||||||
| 248 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 19:57 | The Tea Party: Moochers of the World Unite in Hate! | ||||||
| 249 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 20:22 | I fail to see what paying taxes has to do with the likes of Beck, Hannity, Levin and Savage lining their already heavily filled pockets by endorsing scams that take advantage of their gullible fans. | ||||||
| 250 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 20:46 | They still need to get in line behind the people who are really robbing us blind. You. I wish you were only selling us what we wanted, or at least selling us what we wanted, but no such. | ||||||
| 251 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 20:48 |
I am not sure either. I think he was suggesting taxing him was like shooting him with a shotgun. Makes as much sense as anything coming off his keyboard these last few years. Superstar quail. | ||||||
| 252 | biliruben ID: 21841115 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 20:52 |
You don't want roads and a sewer system? You sure seem like you like the standing army, which where much of your federal taxes go. You don't like Medicare, and will refuse to use it, right? I seem to remember you promising some such idiocy in the past. Not taking Social Security either I assume. Don't want it, right? | ||||||
| 253 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 21:04 |
Yeah, what I really don't want is the medical system destroyed at a huge cost to me and the loss of the country. What I really don't want to pay for is 2/3 of the staff at schools doing marxist make-work like inventing new PC no tolerance rules, marxist propaganda work etc. What I really don't want is to see Obama build his own private agenda armed forces stationed at home who consider constitutionalists the enemy target. What I really don't want is the government building Skynet and having computers and analysts sctrutinizing every last word, electronic emission, footstep [and urine sample for all I know] that I produce. Reading, writing, arithmetic and potholes, can be done a whale of a lot cheaper. | ||||||
| 254 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 21:07 | I take it back. I don't even need the first three. They do education so badly, I don't even want them involved in that. It can be done way better and cheaper in private hands and a tiny helping of vouchers. | ||||||
| 255 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 21:21 | And while we are at it, I'd prefer if the government didn't think up BS excuses to put 1/32 of the population in prison at a yearly cost of $50K per. | ||||||
| 256 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 21:26 | I should have guessed that it was me robbing Boldwin blind. What a delusional fellow. | ||||||
| 257 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 21:32 | silly fellow. If education was entirely in private hands there would be no vouchers at all because taxes wouldn't be being used for education. | ||||||
| 258 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 22:28 |
That doesn't follow. BTW I could also do with less Robert Bird Memorial multi-million dollar park outhouses, Multi-million dollar border stations at closed border crossings, Railroads no one wants to ride, 25 billion dollar unaccounted missing piles of cash, solar panel companies that don't work, perfectly good job building projects cancelled by regulations, skyrocketing energy bills to satisfy Obama and Algore, Joe Biden $600,000 per day junkets to Paris, Robert Bird Memorial multi-million dollar study centers, Robert Bird Center for Creative Boondoggles. If the government does it, history shows, it does it wrong. Stop encouraging it. | ||||||
| 259 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 22:32 | And quit removing perfectly working hydro-electric dams all across the country which is just a total waste of free energy and energy facilities already built. | ||||||
| 260 | Boldwin ID: 423541517 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 22:35 |
They can't even catch dogs right. They go to people's houses and take their pets over petty complaints, killing them to save them and depressing the family who loses a cherished member. Why would anyone want more government or trust the government to do anything right or give it any more to do than was absolutely necessary? | ||||||
| 261 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 22:43 | Sometimes it's necessary to stop hucksters from committing fraud against gullible and vulnerable people who are so misguided that they trust Glenn Beck to give them good investment advice. Somehow, in about 10 posts, you completely ignored that, while repeating a manifesto that is irrelevant to anyone but you. | ||||||
| 262 | Tree ID: 40328723 Mon, Apr 15, 2013, 22:50 |
i think Baldwin thought he was cutting a pro wrestling promo. | ||||||
| 263 | Pancho Villa ID: 59645318 Tue, Apr 16, 2013, 09:18 |
If the government does it, history shows, it does it wrong. And quit removing perfectly working hydro-electric dams all across the country You're so enraged and committed to spewing nonsense that you probably don't even realize the contradiction. The government built those dams, so, according to you, government did it wrong. So it makes sense to remove them. In many cases, it's going to take a whole lot of money, to which you're vehemently opposed, to keep these dams safe. The average age of the 84,000 dams in the country is 52 years old. The nation’s dams are aging and the number of high-hazard dams is on the rise. Many of these dams were built as low-hazard dams protecting undeveloped agricultural land. However, with an increasing population and greater development below dams, the overall number of high-hazard dams continues to increase, to nearly 14,000 in 2012. The number of deficient dams is estimated at more than 4,000, which includes 2,000 deficient high-hazard dams. The Association of State Dam Safety Officials estimates that it will require an investment of $21 billion to repair these aging, yet critical, high-hazard dams. What? You mean when a dam is built, it actually takes money to maintain, like all forms of infrastructure? So stop taxing us. Us? Such a juvenile thought process, thinking I'm taxing you and whoever your imaginary friends are that constitute us. | ||||||
| 264 | Boldwin ID: 63491612 Tue, Apr 16, 2013, 14:12 | Vampires imagine they are charming and appreciated by their victims. | ||||||
| 265 | bibA ID: 54522612 Tue, Apr 16, 2013, 16:20 |
263 - I was wondering just how he would intelligently respond, and show the world just how deluded your thinking was. 264 illustrates once and for all that defective dams need be left where they are! There is no such thing as a hazardous dam until such time as it fails, at which time it can clearly be shown that liberals were responsible in the first place for constructing them during the New Deal. He can't lose. Pure genius! | ||||||
| 266 | Boldwin ID: 453232117 Mon, Apr 22, 2013, 02:38 |
Flight out of paper gold and into physical gold. There is a lot of shaky gold out there. Holdings which have been leant out 10 times over by fractional lending, while there is still a shortage of actual gold. If you think you have gold...take physical possession in your own hands, your own vault, see it with your own eyes or sell it. | ||||||
| 267 | biliruben ID: 41431323 Tue, May 21, 2013, 01:23 | Yeah, I own a bit of physical gold. My long-held short at 1900 is really just a hedge on my Krugerands and Eagles. I didn't want to pay the vig to sell the coins, so my short works fine. | ||||||
| 268 | Seattle Zen ID: 3603123 Wed, May 22, 2013, 11:21 |
LOL! Hook 'em Horns! Endowment drops a cool $300 million, thanks, GOLD! | ||||||
| 269 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Wed, May 22, 2013, 11:57 |
From the article: But Utimco is holding tight to its stash of the metal and even is thinking about buying a bit more. The fund won't consider exiting from gold until central banks such as the U.S. Federal Reserve tighten the money supply, according to Mr. Zimmerman. He says monetary tightening at some point is necessary to reduce the likelihood of a burst of inflation, an economywide rise in price levels. These jokers do us a service, reminding us that many of the smart money managers are neither smart, nor managers. The banking and housing crises both came about because people like this were so sure of their positions that they felt comfortable spending other people's money to "prove" them. | ||||||
| 270 | Seattle Zen ID: 3603123 Mon, May 27, 2013, 16:00 |
Gold sucks. So everything that goes up in price is in a bubble? What if it does not go down? Are you saying it will go back to $250 per ounce? Or $35 per ounce. I'll take that bet via a donation to guru. If you say bubble at 500,600,700,800....1600,1700, and it never happens, you lose some credibility IMO. Where is B7? Haven't heard from him much lately. | ||||||
| 271 | Perm Dude ID: 201027169 Mon, May 27, 2013, 18:52 | No wi-fi in the bunker. | ||||||
| 272 | Frick ID: 432501512 Tue, Jun 25, 2013, 10:03 |
Gold mining stocks are taking a beating. Writing down billions in assets, indicates they aren't positive that gold prices are going to rebound anytime soon. Bloomberg | ||||||
| 273 | Frick ID: 432501512 Tue, Jul 02, 2013, 15:59 | Hmm, maybe I will buy some gold. The most accurate forecaster of gold prices over the last 2 years, predicts that gold will hit $1,000/oz in the next 3 months. | ||||||
| 274 | Pancho Villa ID: 40610217 Tue, Jul 02, 2013, 18:10 | Gold closed at $1,242 today. If you think it's going to to $1,000, why would you buy it thinking it will lose around 20% in the next 3 months? | ||||||
| 275 | Frick ID: 432501512 Wed, Jul 03, 2013, 08:31 |
The article that I got the $1,000 dollar prediction from spent more time talking about the floor for gold. They were estimating it around $1,180, since that is the world wide average cost to produce an ounce. Buy near the floor would be a decent buy, but my comment was really meant to be sarcastic. Which, is lost on the internet, my fault for not being clearer. Overall I don't think gold is bad as a very small part of a person's portfolio, but large chunks just don't make sense to me. I have a number of friends that have real gold in their possession as a hedge against a complete collapse of the US. My point to them is, who is going to want gold when the world is collapsing, food and useful items will be much more valuable. | ||||||
| 276 | biliruben ID: 59551120 Wed, Jul 03, 2013, 10:46 |
I don't understand the argument that the cost of mining should determine the floor. It will simply mean shuttering a bunch of mines when it drops to $600. | ||||||
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