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0 Subject: The Gloves Come Off

Posted by: Boldwin
- [12107713] Thu, Nov 08, 2012, 05:04

Now that he doesn't have to worry about getting re-elected...

[Putin waiting patiently in the wings]
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144sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 15:13
Record corporate profits, and rather than invest part of those profits in employee wellness, they terminate people. THAT, is why I so despise corporate America.
145Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 15:30
#142: Wow--a boikin post that could have been written by Seattle Zen.
146boikin
      ID: 532592112
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 17:02
I am not sure how to take that, but the point I was trying to make is that CEO is not rocket science, yes there are special cases of CEO's that deserve the big money just like some professional athletes, but the problem is most of CEO's are more like minor league players whose skills are not much different from any other minor league player. If that all makes sense?
147Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 17:14
complete sense. And I certainly agree with you.
148Seattle Zen
      ID: 47630913
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 18:01
I am not sure how to take that

That's these board's Presidential Medal of Freedom! There is NO HIGHER HONOR!
149Khahan
      ID: 54138190
      Mon, Nov 19, 2012, 20:16
Cant say I disagree with anything from 142 onward. The problem is, even companies that realize CEO's are replaceable are all taking from the same pool of candidates. They're all the same after the same goals. Replacing one with a carbon copy of himself.
150biliruben
      ID: 21841115
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 11:38
Krugman Reminds us what the golden age of America was like:

Yet in the 1950s incomes in the top bracket faced a marginal tax rate of 91, that’s right, 91 percent, while taxes on corporate profits were twice as large, relative to national income, as in recent years. The best estimates suggest that circa 1960 the top 0.01 percent of Americans paid an effective federal tax rate of more than 70 percent, twice what they pay today.

Nor were high taxes the only burden wealthy businessmen had to bear. They also faced a labor force with a degree of bargaining power hard to imagine today. In 1955 roughly a third of American workers were union members. In the biggest companies, management and labor bargained as equals, so much so that it was common to talk about corporations serving an array of “stakeholders” as opposed to merely serving stockholders.

Squeezed between high taxes and empowered workers, executives were relatively impoverished by the standards of either earlier or later generations. In 1955 Fortune magazine published an essay, “How top executives live,” which emphasized how modest their lifestyles had become compared with days of yore. The vast mansions, armies of servants, and huge yachts of the 1920s were no more; by 1955 the typical executive, Fortune claimed, lived in a smallish suburban house, relied on part-time help and skippered his own relatively small boat

----

Strange to say, however, the oppressed executives Fortune portrayed in 1955 didn’t go Galt and deprive the nation of their talents. On the contrary, if Fortune is to be believed, they were working harder than ever. And the high-tax, strong-union decades after World War II were in fact marked by spectacular, widely shared economic growth: nothing before or since has matched the doubling of median family income between 1947 and 1973.
151Boldwin
      ID: 1010402018
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 19:40
Think the unions are on your side?

Judge orders mediation and Frank Hurt doesn't even bother showing up, sends the union's secretary-treasurer.

152sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 19:56
another blog opinion piece B? We KNOW, your sources are going to bash unions, Democrats, and anything left of AC. Thats a given. Try something new, like linking to a NEWS source, for news.
153Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 20:32
Even according to that slanted piece, the judge didn't "order" mediation. He "suggested" and "urged."
154Boldwin
      ID: 1010402018
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 22:43
What part if From the WSJ: don't you understand?
From the WSJ:

Hostess Brands Inc. said Tuesday night it would proceed with liquidation plans after mediation fails.

"I'm not too optimistic about this mediation," Frank Hurt, president of the Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco Workers and Grain Millers International Union, said when reached earlier Tuesday afternoon in Columbus, Ohio. He said he couldn't get to New York, where the session was taking place; instead, he said, the union's secretary-treasurer was attending.



Hostess Brands Inc. said Tuesday night it would proceed with liquidation plans after mediation fails.

Earlier Tuesday, the head of the bakers union whose strike precipitated Hostess liquidation plans didn't attend a last-ditch mediation session and wasn't hopeful about its prospects, he said.

"I'm not too optimistic about this mediation," Frank Hurt, president of the Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco Workers and Grain Millers International Union, said when reached earlier Tuesday afternoon in Columbus, Ohio. He said he couldn't get to New York, where the session was taking place; instead, he said, the union's secretary-treasurer was attending.

The mediation came at a judge's suggestion after the Twinkie maker said Friday that a week-long strike by the bakers left the company no choice but to seek a bankruptcy judge's approval for liquidation.

The judge, Robert Drain, urged mediation...

The judge indicated Monday that if mediation wasn't successful, Hostess could return to court Wednesday to pursue its liquidation plan.
Got that? Mediation ordered Monday. Mediation [without Frank Hurt] Tuesday. Liquidation plan finalized Wednesday.

And Frank Hurt takes the power he thinks he won, the credible threat he brings to the next company he tries to strongarm.
155Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 23:00
Mediation ordered Monday

Mediation was not "ordered." It was "urged" and "suggested."

Twice now you have said a basic untruth which undercuts your argument.
156sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 23:10
zerohedge.com. is NOT the WSJ
157Boldwin
      ID: 1010402018
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 23:34
Zero Hedge was quoting the WSJ verbatim.
158sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Tue, Nov 20, 2012, 23:47
As we said, if only people had a basic understanding of how bankruptcy truly worked, and what the real state of the economy was, then Hostess' workers may have had a chance and some amicable comrpomise would have been possible.

Then again, if people in America actually understood economics and simple finance, then the "Ohio outcome", and many others, would have likely been quite different.


No, they were not. It is an opinion piece, an editorial, with some WSJ quotes contained within. The piece itself, is a hack job.
159Boldwin
      ID: 411028215
      Wed, Nov 21, 2012, 06:32
The area in the blockquote was verbatim. Stop with the unwarranted slander both of me and of that author.
160sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Wed, Nov 21, 2012, 13:17
? Slander? Of you AND the author? It was a partisan hack job Boldwin. PD called it, in 153. Grow up dude.
161Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Wed, Nov 21, 2012, 15:00
The conservative chattering class is still unclear as to the concept: Chait dismantles Podhoretz' post election spin.

The astonishing turnabout in the evaluation of Obama’s campaign, from delusional nincompoops to the most terrifyingly efficient campaign apparatus in history, helps Podhoretz reach his desired conclusion, that Obama’s victory owed nothing at all to his policy platform.
162Boldwin
      ID: 2010382210
      Thu, Nov 22, 2012, 11:48
If only the damage could be contained in the vicinity of poity headed Obama-voting ivory tower dwellin' college teachin' libruls.
Pennsylvania's Community College of Allegheny County (CCAC) is slashing the hours of 400 adjunct instructors, support staff, and part-time instructors to dodge paying for Obamacare.
Most interesting are the quotes 'from our betters'. You know, those enlightened minds society needs to run things, where the rest of us are not so capable of making our own decisions. The kind of minds we will need making health decisions for us. The kinds of minds we need coming up with the next five year plan. The kind of visionary minds that will look ahead and help us avoid the pitfalls ahead we might have fallen into without their paternalistic authoritive visionary guidance. Tell us the 'smart growth' plan oh mighty visionaries...
"It's kind of a double whammy for us because we are facing a legal requirement [under the new law] to get health care and if the college is reducing our hours, we don't have the money to pay for it," said adjunct biology professor Adam Davis.
No, really? This never occurred to you before? You couldn't see this coming? I saw it four years ago. Only the majority of Americans saw it coming and opposed it.

Union representatives provide clever input.
The solution, says United Steelworkers representative Jeff Cech, is that adjunct professors should unionize in an attempt to thwart schools seeking similar cost-savings efforts from avoiding Obamacare.

"They may be complying with the letter of the law, but the letter of law and the spirit of the law are two different things," said Mr. Cech. "If they are doing it at CCAC, it can't be long before they do it other places."
There you have the solution. Make it illegal to structure your business to maximize profits. Comply with the spirit of the law, oh greedy capitalists. Bestow nirvana upon us, whether you can afford to do so or not. Ours is not the burden of coming up with the money. That's your job.

It can't be long before it happens elsewhere? Really quick on the uptake.
163sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Thu, Nov 22, 2012, 12:02
Allllll these thoughts about cutting hours...wont...matter. Have they not READ and consulted with legal?
166Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Thu, Nov 22, 2012, 13:56
Rather than throw them to the wolves (which is what the GOP would have happen) all those employees are eligible for credits toward getting their own insurance.

Here in the United States, we've always had laws to prevent companies from "maximizing profits." Surprised it took the rapid Right this long to notice.
168Khahan
      ID: 39432178
      Fri, Nov 23, 2012, 11:02
all those employees are eligible for credits toward getting their own insurance.

Good thing they are getting credits. Because with less hours and less pay there is less money to buy a product the government is telling us we must purchase.


169Boldwin
      ID: 71035232
      Fri, Nov 23, 2012, 11:11
The children of the French hippie communists of the 1968 generation have a message for their parents.

170Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Fri, Nov 23, 2012, 11:16
#168: Sure, but we're better off as a country when more people have insurance. They live longer and healthier, meaning that they work more and contribute more in taxes.

Plus, of course, the "side benefit" of people living longer, and healthier. Hard to get more pro-life than that.
171Khahan
      ID: 39432178
      Fri, Nov 23, 2012, 13:01
170 - that has yet to be seen if we're better off as a country. In my eyes, we're worse off as a country with less individual freedom and more government intrusion because of the way the healthcare plan was enacted.
172sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Fri, Nov 23, 2012, 13:08
Anything that enables more people to obtain diagnostic services BEFORE cancer advances to stage 4, is a good thing. No need to wait for anything to know that.
173Boldwin
      ID: 291029284
      Wed, Nov 28, 2012, 10:37
Past is prologue:
Almost two-thirds of the country’s million-pound earners disappeared from Britain after the introduction of the 50p top rate of tax, figures have disclosed.



Hey! No one baked any bread!

No goose dinner tonite. No goose dinner ever again.
174Boldwin
      ID: 521116123
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 19:43
In a move both Reid and Obama railed against in the past they propose to eliminate the filibuster. A proposal they had a cow over when Republicans considered it WRT approving court nominees. Worse they plan on breaking the rules, to break the rules.
"Make no mistake, what [Reid] is proposing is a Senate where the only rule is his whim, where the rest of us are bystanders, including the members of his own party," Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) said. "The Democrats really want to go down this road? They really think they’re going to be in the majority forever?"

Also under consideration by Sen. Reid - utilizing the so-called "nuclear option" which would call for just a simple majority, or 51 votes, to change Senate rules. Changing the rules usually requires two-thirds of the chamber, or 67 votes. As Sen. McConnell so aptly put it: Sen. Reid is advocating "breaking the rules to change the rules."

This raw power grab would be a mistake - the ramifications of which would be felt for generations to come.

Jay Sekulow
175sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 19:45
BS...this move was made necessary, by the GOPs exercising more filibusters in 2 years, than in the 50 years prior...COMBINED. the GOPs shameful behavior, has caused a need to alter the method by which the Senate functions. Dont like it? Then grow the hell up and act like an adult.
176Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 21:22
"Raw power grab" LOL! Letting the majority get their way--its practically unamerican!

Obama doesn't have a say in how the Senate changes their own rules, of course. And my reading is that the Democrats can change the Senate rules by majority whenever they want.

It is the GOP that has abused the rules by threatening filibusters at the drop of a hat.

Here's the thing: This will make very clear which party is proposing something, since it will actually become law. Right now the people have little idea of which policy proposals will work, since most of them are blocked from being made law and being tried out.

177sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 21:45
Unfortunately, this will only solve the Senatorial dilemma. The House, is still being led by spoiled 6 yr olds, who dont realize they LOST the election.
178Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 21:47
One problem at a time...

The Senate confirms many Administration appointments. This will get rid of the huge backlog of appointees that McConnell has been refusing to let come to the floor for an up or down confirmation vote.
179sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 21:51
true that
180sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 21:52
we can hope Ashley Judd runs and unseats McConnell
181Boldwin
      ID: 481111221
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 22:15
The House, is still being led by spoiled 6 yr olds, who dont realize they LOST the election.

Unless you were attempting to admit to massive voter fraud, which I can help you with, they all in point of fact won.
182sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 22:34
House Dem candidates nationally, pulled more votes cumulatively, than did Republican House candidates.

The GOP lost seats in the House AND in the Senate.

The GOP would have lost the House entirely, had the 2010 gerrymandering been less massive in its scope. (As it was a census year, the GOP is pretty much assured House control, through 2020.)

You can not demonstrate wide spread voter fraud UNLESS, you are referring to the massive effort by the GOP, to dissuade people from voting in the first place.

183Boldwin
      ID: 481111221
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 22:51
Seriously, you think a 'good' republican House member fresh off winning last month, should think to himself, 'well I lost so I should vote socialist.'
184Tree
      ID: 1910562515
      Sun, Dec 02, 2012, 23:02
Unless you were attempting to admit to massive voter fraud, which I can help you with, they all in point of fact won.

you won't even respond to when you claim someone went "underground", when in fact, they were at the polling stations.

so you can help with voter fraud? you can't even be even the least bit honest when confronting the truth to your lies.
185Boldwin
      ID: 281118321
      Mon, Dec 03, 2012, 22:18
Worth a read.
186Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Mon, Dec 03, 2012, 22:52
Dick Armey splits with Tea Party group.

And it doesn't sound like an amicable split by any means.
187Boldwin
      ID: 281118321
      Mon, Dec 03, 2012, 23:05
Reading Tom Delay's book recently, ['No Retreat/No Surrender'] Dick Armey came in for Delay's only harsh treatment of all the republican leadership team working with Newt. Delay feels Armey was unusually self-centered/ambitious even for that setting and could not work with others.

Odd since Armey is good at projecting a sensible reasonable persona. Too bad since republicans really need good communicators and Armey is well spoken.
188Boldwin
      ID: 501111510
      Wed, Dec 05, 2012, 18:36
this year, Merriam-Webster broke with precedent and chose two words together, or as he said "a pairing of a kind." The 2012 words of the year are socialism and capitalism, words "that trended together, that show that when one was looked up, so was the other,"
189Tree
      ID: 441143517
      Wed, Dec 05, 2012, 18:43
from the linked article:

"We saw a huge spike for 'socialism' on Election Day itself, but interest in both words was very high all year," says Peter Sokolowski, editor at large at Merriam-Webster. "Lookups of one word often led to lookups of the other."

makes you wonder exactly how many nimrods were tossing around that word long before election day.

190Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Wed, Dec 05, 2012, 19:12
As the GOP tracks down those Republicans who looked up the definitions, they will be systematically removed from the party rolls.
191sarge33rd
      ID: 12554167
      Wed, Dec 05, 2012, 19:46
One does have to wonder, how the anti-socialist GOP, justifies the vast defense spending that it does. Particularly when you realize, the military is a vast socialist complex. Free housing, free medical, subsidized groceries, subsidized big box shopping, subsidized air travel, uniforms provided, moves fully paid for, school system run by the organization, etc .
192Perm Dude
      ID: 201027169
      Wed, Dec 12, 2012, 22:08
Twinkies CEO admits the company raided employee pensions for executive salaries.

The unions fault, of course. Driving the executives to such crass displays of greed.
193Boldwin
      ID: 2811321220
      Wed, Dec 12, 2012, 23:49
France too.
194Tree
      ID: 111141314
      Thu, Dec 13, 2012, 15:04
Pay disparity between CEO and an employee of two decades...

195Boldwin
      ID: 14331254
      Thu, Apr 25, 2013, 10:30
Army labels Baptists and Catholics as hostile forces and blocks their access from military computers or otherwise censors them.
196Boldwin
      ID: 49250121
      Thu, Mar 05, 2015, 11:49
I forget where the discussion of bili's oil futures contract is so I'll resurrect this excellent thread to place this comment.

Algo traders went nuts the last time the oil inventory numbers spiked, driving the contract numbers down. The inventory just spiked again in a record way and this time the algos went nuts driving the contract numbers up!

I guess they figure the inventories last time represented desperate suppliers caught, and this time represent a belief insider knowledge expects large price increases.

Looks like you have at the very least a window to cash in big.

I'm at a loss to see what kind of a price hike they see coming that justifies storing oil at a minimum of $25gal/mo expense... a war maybe? I'll happily consider any other idea.
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